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I have two Palma contour 308 rifles.One with a Krieger and the other with a Lothar Walther barrel.I shoot one one week and the other the week after.I was shooting with the LW for two years before I got the Krieger.Both were shot under the same conditions and they get very hot. The Krieger has almost stopped shooting-its groups are too large.The LW still shoots well.This is not the first Krieger I had that did not last long. Here is an offhand group that I shot yesterday with the LW at 60yds with open sights. [URL=  ]60yds/offhand/open sights.[/URL] | ||
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Your shotgun is hitting a little high and right George! | |||
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I don't get why you would burn up a custom barrel shooting at 60 yards. I practice once a week shooting standing at 100, but I use a .223 Rem 700 with a factory bbl. | |||
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I've burned three factory 308 barrels.They burn really quick-those and soft or butter steel custom barrels-good for nothing.Only ones that last for my kind of shooting are very heavy Palma, preferably LW.I shoot them once in a while at 100 and 200 too. | |||
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I don't get it either. What level of accuracy are you looking for from a 60 yard offhand shot "pattern" and why do you want to keep shooting when the barrel is so hot? This sounds like a torture test. You obviously know the metal is becoming malleable and will erode quickly no matter the maker! Far be it for me to tell you how to enjoy your shooting sport but.... | |||
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I use light loads-below starting loads for the 308-or else they would burn out quicker. | |||
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Yes - "or else they would burn out quicker" but why are you continue to shoot when you know the barrel is hot? There is no field or competition application that drives shooting with a hot barrel. What is your objective? Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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If I were you I would bend my knees a little and take a half step to the left and you should be right on target !    Hip | |||
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Such inspirational questions. | |||
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If you are shooting 60 yards, might I be so bold as to recommend cast bullets and a skiff of powder. Will certainly be easier on the barrel, powder supply, wallet and shooter. Don't limit your challenges . . . Challenge your limits | |||
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I willl soon be shooting cast in my 308 Krieger barrel. | |||
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1krieger uses a MUCH SOFTER steel than L. W. ASK ME HOW I KNOW  Doug Humbarger NRA Life member Tonkin Gulf Yacht Club 72'73. Yankee Station Try to look unimportant. Your enemy might be low on ammo. | |||
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If I post a picture of the target I shot with the Krieger you would see the group about the size of the whole target. | |||
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I just received two 30 cal Hammer Forged blanks from Lothar Walther...I'm interested to see how those stand up to abuse, so will be chambering one to 30-338 Lapua Improved. Shoot straight, shoot often. Matt | |||
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I thought LW did only button rifling. | |||
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After so many years of following the shooting scene I had never heard much discussed of barrel steel hardness.My smith Jan was the first to bring this to my attention and I saw it for myself.At least one custom manufacturer's barrels I know are much softer than Krieger. | |||
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So did I, but I recently saw them listed on their website and ordered two. Took 5 weeks but these unturned 31" blanks are definitely hammer forged...a very nice pattern beat into them the entire length. Bores show the residual honing process used before the forging in a fine crosshatch. Very good looking bores. Shoot straight, shoot often. Matt | |||
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Frequent, high-volume position practice ("really hot") would steer me into something chrome-lined or nitrocarburized - hammer forged or not. | |||
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It's not that bad.I have the LW for about 5yrs and got it hot every time I shot.Furthermore, if I were to shoot cast once it stops shooting copper jacketed, who knows how much longer it can go.The problem is with soft steel barrels.I now take three rifles to the range-a 308,458 WM with cast bullets and a 22LR.The next time around I might look into Chrome-lined or nitrocarburized.I met a fellow at the range that claims he shot a few thousand of rds out of a 338 Lapua and his Sako still shoots one inch groups at 300yds.I can see the need for a special or super barrel for rapid fire shooting. | |||
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I have over 18k through a 11.5" 5.56 barrel. Most of it was 100-120 rounds full auto before cool-down. Out of academic interest shot it for group at 100 yds last year. Irons. 10 went into 5". May not sound so hot, but figure no better than 3.5" for the same M-855 ammo through a new-ish example. Carburized is very good, but if you want to beat on something chrome-lined is best. | |||
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I only use Lothar Walther barrels these days, IMO they are the very best and everyone Ive had and that's many, shot exceptionally well, they are ultra popular locally..a bit more expense but you get what you pay for.. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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