Any recomendations or pros and cons of using canteens versus Camelbak type systems?

Thanks for your input?

JIm

I have a couple camelbaks I find my self useing canteens or just plan water bottles more.

Why personal preferance

The advantage of a Camel Back is that you can take a sip of water when ever you want/need it.

So you stay hydrated, and never get real thirsty.

You use less water in the long run.

Camelback: Water is always available, whenever you want. Half full camel back is completely silent while walking/hunting/stalking.

Canteen: When you want water, you have to stop, take off the pack, dig out the canteen, etc. Half full canteen is noisy while walking/hunting/stalking.

No comparison IMO. Camelback!

Camelback with a small water filter and you are good to go. I don't want to have anything sloushing around on my belt or in my pack period. The water actually stays pretty cool in a Camelback, not so with a bottle or canteen.

Larry Sellers

Cold weather. No, really cold weather. Hose from Camelback froze, now it's no better than a canteen and in some ways worse. Steel canteen, froze, built fire, melted ice in canteen, made tea. Stuffed it with snow and refilled it with warm water, put it deep into my pack and still had liquid water hours later. Build another fire and make tea in the canteen.

Backpack trips: Hummm, never did figure out how to fill a Camelback from a water sorce less than 1 inch deep... Also, what about the nasty bugs, carry an extra filter to clean it up before you put it into the Camelback? Steel canteen, actually two of them, fill one with water, pour water through hankie into the other one, boil and drink or just put the UV thing in for a bit and call it good.

Camelbacks work great for fishing, weather's warm, truck is only a half hour away with a cooler full of goodies or the 120 qt cooler in the boat will have anything your heart may desire at arms reach. Never tried them for hot weather hunting but I could see that they would be nice in many instances.

I too have had my Camel Back hose freeze in cold weather.

I always carry a metal canteen in cold weather, it is from WWII made in 1944.

Even in warm weather, when wearing a Camel Back I carry a canteen, and a Katydn water filter and purification pills.

I have never liked a Camelback. Sure, you can take a sip of water, but taking a break once every few hours is plenty of time to take a drink.

Camelbacks can also break, leaving a mess in your pack. They are a pain to fill using a filter (a screw on liter bottle works perfectly with most filters).

Newer Camelbacks fill direct from filter to bladder. Mine has an insulated hose to keep it cool and help from freezing up. I usually am not out that much if it's really, really, really cold as some have mentioned. Maybe just melt ice cubes if it's that cold, then you don't have to carry anything.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:
I have never liked a Camelback. Sure, you can take a sip of water, but taking a break once every few hours is plenty of time to take a drink.

Camelbacks can also break, leaving a mess in your pack. They are a pain to fill using a filter (a screw on liter bottle works perfectly with most filters).

My filter has an attachment that screws into the camelback lid. Easy to fill. Have another made by Coleman that completely opens at the top then folds over and locks. No problem at all filling either from a shallow water source.

Taking breaks every once in a while to dig out the canteen is fine but taking small sips after each strenuous section of climbing or hiking between breaks helps to stay better hydrated. Frequent sips also helps prevent the hose from freezing. If it gets really cold, just stuff the hose into the pack instead of leaving it hanging out.

Always more than one way to skin a cat. Just as long as the skin comes off!

I use the MSR Dromedary as it is coupable with the water filter as well - using it for more then 10 years now and works flawless and great!

Plus the MSR Dromedary water bag is tougher then most of the bags...!

Klaus

Even on extended pack trips I stop long enough for breaks that the pack come off when I want a drink. I use water bottles.
I have 2 bladders but the first few sips are always so pizz-warm that I waste about half the water. On cold weather hunts around here the "straw" freezes even though it's insulated.
I have enough camp/hunting gear banging around in my pack that a little sloshing water isn't a problem for me. I'll take 1 plastic and 1 metal every time I go.
Zeke

One word of caution with Camelbacks. Get the ones with the military-style valve and the insulated hose. The little yellow lever that acts as the valve on regular Camelbacks can get jerked out by brush after which your Camelback empties all over you. Been there and done that twice. In really remote areas I carry a pair of Nalgene bottles because they are fool-proof. For local hunting I carry a Camelback.

For backpack hunting the Camelback is nice. If you aren't going to have a pack on your back using a camelback instead of a bottle or canteen just gets in the way of shouldering the rifle.

As this was posted in the backpack hunting forum I assume the former and then generally I favour the Camelback. Canteens are a pain with a pack and a hip belt etc.

Has anyone ever gotten really sick from one? A friend of mine was on a short trip in the mountains in January, and spent most of the night outside the tent with it coming out both ways (sorry!). This was when Camelbacks were relatively new.

After that, I decided it was much easier to keep a canteen (nalgene) cleaner than a Camelback.

How do you address this with your Camelback?

friar

Pros. camelbacks are excellent for stalking due to limited body movement while trying to stay hydrated. Make sure you get the insulated type, typically neoprene material.

Cons. It is a lot harder to regulate water consumption when you can't see what you have available. Having to take the pack off just to check the water content can get to be a pain. Hopefully with no surprises.
I have used the old military 2 quart canteen flexible rubber type that fits inside an insulated pouch. It works great as you consume the water before putting it away gently squeeze the air out and seal the cap. Guaranteed no sloshing noise will be made. The water is not the best tasting, you can always add flavoring.
My favorite solution is to look at the water issue as a system. By having a redundant system there is less chance of having problems. First I have a squeeze plastic bottle filter type for replenishing water while on the move. It stays in my pack and only for emergency or when needed. If there is a lot of running water in your hunt area it will save you carrying a lot of weight. Make sure you get the type that takes out viruses. It can be slow in the amount of water being filtered and the storage area is small. If going for an extended stay in the woods I take a water filter pump type. It is faster and easier to use but heavier. Also again make sure it takes viruses out. I have a long hose for it that lets me fill all water container types.
Secondly get a large metal cup that you can use on the fire to warm/heat or purify water with. If your filter bottle fits inside it making it compact it's even better.
Thirdly I use an insulated camelback type by taking advantage of its virtues.
In below freezing weather I take a metal canteen that i can use to heat on the fire seal and use inside my sleeping bag for heat and in the morning I have warm water that I can drink without freezing my throat and robbing body core temperature. The warm water is quicker to use to get my usual oatmeal/coffee breakfast going. I leave shores to mid day.
Charles

I spent 12 days last summer backpacking at Philmont. I used a 1 liter nalgene for my powder drink mix and a three liter Camelbak. All backcoutry water sources should be considered contaminated and therefore either filtered or chemically treated. I used MicroPur tablets in my Camelbak at every fill up. This killed off any bacteria that might have started growing in the Camelbak.
I also can tell you that those of us using the Camelbaks stayed hydrated better than those just relying on bottles. Most of the kids had the bottles in the side pockets of their packs and they couldn't get them out while wearing the pack. After the trip I used the Camelbak cleaning kit's brush and cleaning tabs. The brush goes through the tube and cleans out any junk in the tube. Before going on a trip I disinfect and rinse the bag just to make sure it is clean to start. If I need to fill from a puddle or small spring seep I use a pump filter to fill the bag.

Good advice Chris. Been in the Philmont back country twice, and know of what you speak!

quote:

I have used the old military 2 quart canteen flexible rubber type that fits inside an insulated pouch. It works great as you consume the water before putting it away gently squeeze the air out and seal the cap. Guaranteed no sloshing noise will be made. The water is not the best tasting, you can always add flavoring.

I was going to post about the above type of water bottle and then read what I quoted.

I find them excellent and always carry it hunting. The fact that you can remove the "slosh" by squeezing the air out is important.

My water tastes fine but new one's need working on.

I have always hammered into troops the need to drink, drink and drink, especially at night before sleeping as the body gets a chance to re hydrate above capacity so you at least start off in the morning full of fluids but I can see where people who only use canteens on the back not being in the habit of drinking.

.

I like the canteens better. The bladder in my camel back gave the water a plastic taste and the bladder would tear pretty easy.

An easy way to keep water from freezing in the Camelbak tube is to just blow into it when you are finished taking a sip. This will empty the tube of water and then it won't freeze. The bag is kept warm enough with body heat and it doesn't significantly change the ability for the next drink.

I work on wildfires and as a biologist in the forest....I have been supplied Camelbaks over and over and HATE them.....PERSONAL PREFERENCE...I like a good stainless water bottle that I can dent and bang and just drink a good gulp of water and not have in some bladder on my back between me and my pack-stuff. I have to carry between 40-45 pounds and do not want my water against my hot back for 11 12 13 miles a day.

Oh and sucking water from a bite tube just bites or sucks none the less!



P.S. It was 109 hear last week...freezing is not my worry. Winter gets down in the teens, but not a worry.

I've never used a camelback although I do have one. The quiet part is the only thing I realy want. Camelbacks just seem to have too many things that can go wrong, while a water bottle skips merrily past these problems. I've heard of some guys putting those stainless steel pot scrubbers into water bottles to eliminate sloshing and that seems like a decent idea to me.

Just yesterday I was looking at a "kit" that allows a person to put a hose into a water bottle. It comes with a few caps to fit different bottles and includes a one way valve that allows you to suck on the tube wihout creating a vacum in the bottle. Seems like a good compromise to me and allows one to carry a few water bottles if required.

Take a look at a product called Gegerrig hydration pack (or some thing similar). www.geigerrig.com

I like this product a lot. It is super easy to fill, super easy to clean and offers an easy way of filtrating your water before you drink it. The water blader is nearly indestructible unless you cut it or stab it.

I've preferred those Spanish 'bota' wine skins over noisy canteens. Being slung over your shoulder, they are easier to drink from than backpack bladders and you're more likely to notice when they need refilling. I always add a leather bit to the sling, making them more comfortable to carry. The big opening of Nalgenes are good for filling through filters from streams but once you've drunk half, their water sloshes, too.

The trouble with botas is the plastic liners develop slow leaks after a while. This does keep them and you cool, however, acting like a canvas water bag against your side.

Absolutely LOVE my Camelbak but
1) they are more difficult to fill
2) you can't manage your water like you can w/a bottle
3) the hose can and will freeze, even w/the insulation
4) they're tougher to clean

Camelbak keeps me better hydrated but there are drawbacks.

Regards,
Scott

My three litre Osprey bladder mounts inside my lightweight internal frame pack and works perfectly. Hardly hard to fill, you take it to the lake/sream and dunk it in. Then you put in the magic wand (steropen) that kills all bad things and you're good to go. As for the hose freezing, well don't hang it outside the pack. Anything that hangs off you is a pain. Affects balance, can be noisy and is not 21st century tech.

I've just had another bladder leak in my pack, drenching everything around it, and am fed up with them. At least botas are outside where the damage is limited.

Does anyone know of a strong container that collapses to stop the water sloshing?

You could try another way - here I never carry water. Except in one or two areas where visitors have introduced Giardia you can drink from any stream, and I can go for at least 5 hours without a drink - its simply mind over matter, no discomfort involved (well maybe a bit learning it but that was over 30 years ago and I forget).

I've used basically just a large Gatorade or Powerade bottle for years. You get to drink the stuff to start and then have a light, virtually indestructable water bottle for your hunt. When it's over, just recycle it. The advantage over a camelback I've found is where you are doing a lot of climbing in country where there is good water sources. You don't have to always be carrying that extra 2 lbs of water and can stop and fill it when necessary. Also, they are more hygenic than bladders and much less can go wrong.

Good thoughts there, Tentman and EB.

I'm pretty sure our hunting ancestors did not survive for two or three million years sucking on a tube every 10 minutes. They drank when they found a stream and went thirsty until they came to the next one.

Matter of fact, a coroner recently found that a hiker in Tasmania died because he drank too much water - it can make your brain swell, it seems.

I have used disposable bottles, too; preferring small ones, drinking half and squishing the container to stop the slop, then going on to another bottle when the first is empty.

One of the AR guys has told me that the two-quart US GI water bottle is collapsible, so I might give that a go.

Well, I got a camelback and ended up not using it on my OZ trip. I used 3 plastic water bottles and brought along my steripen. Basically I'd start the morning with 3 litres of water in my pack and once I was down to 2 litres I'd keep my eyes uponed for some cleanish water then fillup the empty bottles and treat with the steripen. At night I'd use the leftover water for a hair wash then start over again the next day.

I notice that folks who live in hot climates don't sweat like us northerners. I'd never be able to hike any distance without drinking. In a hot climate if I'm hiking hard it's nothing at all for me to drink 8 litres of water every 24 hours so the idea of just "toughing it out" would probably be fatal for me, I wish I could do that though.

quote:

Originally posted by calgarychef1:
Well, I got a camelback and ended up not using it on my OZ trip. I used 3 plastic water bottles and brought along my steripen. Basically I'd start the morning with 3 litres of water in my pack and once I was down to 2 litres I'd keep my eyes uponed for some cleanish water then fillup the empty bottles and treat with the steripen. At night I'd use the leftover water for a hair wash then start over again the next day.

I notice that folks who live in hot climates don't sweat like us northerners. I'd never be able to hike any distance without drinking. In a hot climate if I'm hiking hard it's nothing at all for me to drink 8 litres of water every 24 hours so the idea of just "toughing it out" would probably be fatal for me, I wish I could do that though.

That three-bottle trick is a neat idea but eight litres is a power of water, maybe into the realm of that brain-swollen hiker I mentioned. The doctor consulted in that story thought two or three litres a day should be plenty. Even walking all day in the 35C heat of Mozambique, I can't recall needing much more than that, even with tea, coffee and the evening drinkies considered.

I'd like to read that article by the doctor. I know there have been deaths from folks drinking too much water but the stuff I've heard about is drinking large amounts of water FAST. I remember a radio program that had a contest for drinking a gallon of water and some chick died trying to win it. I also k ow that kids try to get high from drinking water fast.

I can say this during the daytime on this particular trip I peed a grand total of 3 times and I figure I expelled about 1.5 to maximum 2 litres of urine. So where did the rest go, I sweated it out plain and simple. On a couple of the days I had a bathroom scale available and at the end of the day even after about 10 pounds of water I weighed the same.

Some of us can really sweat and others are better water misers and don't need to drink as much. It's dangerous to suggest to people not to drink in a hot environment. In fact come to think of it the Aussies I was with suggest to their employees to drink a minimum of a litre an hour while they are working in the field.

Well, calgarychef1, I googled something like hiker died from too much water and got a great heap of links saying yes, you can have a dangerous amount, as well as the news story I was looking for. I copied and pasted a few but then accidentally hit the reply button again and wiped them out.

Yes, the speed you drink it is a factor but I think the leaching of electrolytes is part of the problem, too. So, maybe you should add Gatoraid-type powders to your water, to be sure.

To link this with your last paragraph, could I say (as an old shop steward), on occasions perhaps we should take what the boss says with a grain of salt?

A grain of salt indeed . And good advise to boot. I drink one litre of Gatorade per day, ya gotta be careful with that stuff, too much and you'll swell up like a balloon. Like everything moderation is the key.

Yes, I hear some of that stuff can be hard your teeth, so at least rinse your mouth well afterwards. A guy I hunted with once seemed to drink nothing during the day, even on a three-hour walk in to the hut with heavy packs. Yet every night he would go to bed with a hydration bladder full of something like that. I don't know when he slept, 'cause I could hear him sucking on it at all hours. I know that he suffered a lot from cramps, so hopefully it helped a bit.

Aluminum or nalgene canteen/bottle! NO COLD WEATHER ISSUES, no cleaning issues, no filling issues, cheap and indestructable.

I finally got some of those 2-quart GI bottles and am quite happy with them. Squeeze the air out and they are reasonably quiet, though they make weird noises if you forget.

Strangely, American stores would not send me the bottles (the government must be hoping the Taliban will die of thirst) so finished up getting them from thebushcraftstore.co.uk

I mention the name only because one bottle had a slow leak and the shop sent me another one free, without me having to return the crook one.

It's good having the water bottle outside of my daypack because, if there is a leak, only I will get wet, not all my stuff.

cambelbak's do not meet my requirement of being bomb proof..