quote:

Originally posted by kutenay:
Good point and I don't doubt your word, I also do not care for higher velocity rifles in any "normal" magnum caliber. I guess my major concern is that too many guys get a powerhouse pistol, shoot it a few times and then consider themselves both armed and ready for whackin' ornery Grizzlies. I think that this is a good way of getting hurt or dead and thus do not use or recommend handguns, although I have done.

If you have, you were breaking the law. There is no handgun hunting in any way, shape or form in BC....

Dennis

Dennis I live in BC and work as a prospector and have been issued a permit to carry (ATC)handguns in all remote areas of BC for the protection of my life and the lives of others.

I carry 10mm semi-auto's in the winter month's or if I'm jumping in and out of the truck all day. The rest of the year I carry a 6" 629 44mag and when I head into grizzly country I carry a Ruger SRH in 454 Casull.

You'd be surprised how many people in Canada legally carry handguns for protection.

We are not hunting with our handguns but many of us have shot and killed animals with them.

Myself I never go into the bush without at least one handgun with me at all times.

quote:

CATBOAT - The guide replies, "So it won't hurt you so much when the bear rams that pistol up your ass."

Catboat, if I've seen that "joke" once on the various hunting sites, I've seen it at least one hundred times.

First time I ever heard it was in 1956. I was a freshman in college in '55/'56. I lived in a boarding house that had mostly Korean War veterans at college on the G.I Bill.

I became good friends with one of the vets, who was several years older than I. He had been a U.S. Paratrooper, serving/jumping in Korea with the 187th Reg. Combat Team, Abn. Also wounded there.

During the summer of 1956, he and one of his buddies went to Alaska "to prospect" for gold. Actually found enough to suppliment his G.I Bill for the '56/'57 school year.

As I was even then, very interested in firearms and hunting, I asked him what firearms he'd taken to Alaska? He took his Winchester .30-06 and his Colt's Govt. Model .45.

I asked if he'd had to use them on bears, etc.? He said no, but an old sourdough up there had looked at his .45 and told him he should file off the front sight because........

Well, you know the rest.

Anyway, "joke's" been around quite a while.

L.W.

quote:

CATBOAT - "At least I'm glad I kept the story consistent from 50 years ago-I feel I'm doing my part for mankind. Recycling."

Yep, sounds like a plan to me.

Of course, with that story having been told so many times over these many years, perhaps it is possible that those Alaska bears have evolved to the point where they now have a thumb and forefinger alongside those big claws, thereby increasing their dexterity when it comes to taking handguns away from hunters and .......

Well, you know the rest.

L.W.

quote:

Originally posted by moki:
Dennis I live in BC and work as a prospector and have been issued a permit to carry (ATC)handguns in all remote areas of BC for the protection of my life and the lives of others.

I carry 10mm semi-auto's in the winter month's or if I'm jumping in and out of the truck all day. The rest of the year I carry a 6" 629 44mag and when I head into grizzly country I carry a Ruger SRH in 454 Casull.

You'd be surprised how many people in Canada legally carry handguns for protection.

We are not hunting with our handguns but many of us have shot and killed animals with them.

Myself I never go into the bush without at least one handgun with me at all times.

Ahhhhh...Prospector! OK then, my apologies!

I lived in BC for 24 yrs and know what kind of hassle it is to own a handgun! As to handgun hunting? Forget it for the most part except in cases like your's....

Dennis

(P.G. Wlms Lk Kamloops Valemount.... )

I carry a 4 or 6" Smith 44 mag with 300 gr hard cast bullets and hope I never need to use it. I would fire from whatever position I was currently in. Once in Wyoming, I had a Grizzly within 50 yards as he trailed a wounded elk. I was in a sitting position against a large rock with a 270 winchester rifle amd my 44 mag Smith. I calculated that I could probably get one maybe two shots off (with the 270) before he could be on me. Luckily, he got a whif of me and decided to high tail it. It's interesting the thoughts that go through your mind in situations as this. Arm chair quaterbacking is useless unless you have been there done that.

You don't have enough experience with either Bears or big bore handguns. Save yourself having to haul a gun on the trail. Learn more about bears, bison and elk. Bison do for more folks in the Yellowstone than bears. You will enjoy your trip more if you arm yourself with solid information. Shooting any animal, with any gun is an iffy proposition at best. It sounds like you are going in a group. The more the better. It's beautiful country and after the first day or two you will forget about your bear-itis. There is more B.S. thrown about bears than almost any other subject. Get good solid info. Have a great time.

SakoAV

Shooting any animal with a firearm is a iffy propositon at it best. Sorry what I've shot hundreds of animals with all kinds of firearms.

Iffy right when I shoot them I expect them to die nothing iffy about it. Place a bullet in the proper place the critter is going to die done it many a times.

Using a firearm is reasonable and proper and they work. Like anything else nothing is a 100% but they still beat a fist,rock, sharp stick, falling over playing dead and kissing your ass good bye.

Bear protection while hiking... a Marlin 45/70 Guide Gun with heavy hard cast bullets (Garretts), and carried in your hand rather than the pack. The gun and loads are up to the task, its easier to hit the target with, and it is always ready for action at a moments notice. Forget the handgun, the lever gun is more reliable for a stopping gun. Thats right, stopping the bruin is much more important than killing it. You will have time to finish it off later, when the shaking stops.

While hiking the rifle is fine, but what if you are fishing, chopping wood or some other task and the rifle is leaning against a tree somewhere?

quote:

Originally posted by bfrshooter:
While hiking the rifle is fine, but what if you are fishing, chopping wood or some other task and the rifle is leaning against a tree somewhere?

Exacctly!!! The poster that thinks that a 45-70 is supperior in stopping ability to a 475 or 500 properlyl loaded, apparently has never seen the handgun rounds properly deployed

jwp:

I never stated that the 45/70 was superior in stopping power to a big bore handgun, only that it would be easier to hit a target, perhaps multiple times under very difficult situations. I am primarily a handgun hunter and have a number of very powerful handguns, including the 500 Linebaugh so I am certainly no stranger to what their capabilities are. Its not what the gun can do, so long as the power is there, its what the person pointing it can do with it that matters. I know most people can get off several shots more accurately with the 45/70 levergun than they will with a big bore handgun, even more so under a panic situation. In reality, few peopls have or can handle the really big bore handguns so lets look at what they probably do have... a max loaded 44 mag which has less energy than a 30-30, go figure.

The question was Handguns and Grizzies.
It is up to each individual to become proficient with thier choice of weapon.True most people are not as profecient with a handgun as they are with a rifle,but most can learn to be,if they spend the time and practice to do so

I agree that one needs to practice with their choice of weapon, thats all part of preparing for the outing. You are right, the question was about handguns. I would not consider anything less than a 44 mag. with heavy hard cast bullets loaded as hot as possible and do everything possible to avoid having to use it. Prevention is the best medicine.

quote:

Originally posted by Woodrow S:
I agree that one needs to practice with their choice of weapon, thats all part of preparing for the outing. You are right, the question was about handguns. I would not consider anything less than a 44 mag. with heavy hard cast bullets loaded as hot as possible and do everything possible to avoid having to use it. Prevention is the best medicine.

I totally agree...

I live 60 miles North of the park and go there a lot and the ranch I work on has lots of bears.A friend of mine killed a Grizz sow,w/cubs 2 years ago with a .41 in Tom Miner basin.I carry a 629 5inch barrel 300gr HC bulets.Among my friends they carry mostly 41,s and 44,s with a few 10mm,s.I have seen a lot of bears even w/cubs treed by cowdogs but wouldnt want to count on the average dog w/regards

I agree that prevention is the best medicine.

I carry a taurus titanium tracker .41 mag with federal 250 gr castcore ammo. When I don't mind the weight a taurus raging bull 454 with 340 grain hardcast handloads at 1350fps.

RMILLER I see taurus has come out with a 6inch titanium 41 mag tracker now. I handled it at the NRA convention the added vel over the 4 in should help. But my 4 in is a joy to carry.

I was talking with a guy from B.C. yesterday and he said that a bunch of guys are carrying some 1911s in 45-08 loaded with a 200 SWC at 1300 fps. He says they put in a 22 lb spring to handle the load. The cases are made from cut down 308s that have been inside reamed to .452 down to the web so it has a much stronger case for the unsuported case section.
I guess they load with Longshot.
He says the load has been used on Black bears and Grizzlys with good sucess.

FWIW

quote:

Originally posted by Lar45:
I was talking with a guy from B.C. yesterday and he said that a bunch of guys are carrying some 1911s in 45-08 loaded with a 200 SWC at 1300 fps. He says they put in a 22 lb spring to handle the load. The cases are made from cut down 308s that have been inside reamed to .452 down to the web so it has a much stronger case for the unsuported case section.
I guess they load with Longshot.

45 Super Cases would be much more simple, and still maintain case strenght
He says the load has been used on Black bears and Grizzlys with good sucess.

FWIW

45 Super cases would the easiest way to acomplise the task of stronger cases

I have a bunch of TZZ military 45 acp cases that are really strong. I sent him up a double handfull to try in his gun. He is sending me 2 to measure and look at as they are paying $1 each to have them made. I guess they are reamed out down to the web so they have a much stronger web over the unsuported chamber area.
I made an opps with the TZZ cases one day and got a 230 LRN going 1300 fps with 700X. The cases were perfect after shooting in an unsuported chamber. No bulges or anything.
So if they are getting a 200 SWC up to 1300 with Longshot(a slower powder) then I think the TZZ cases should have no problem.
What is the water capacity of a 45 super case?