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395 gr bullet in 454 Casul revolver
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Anyone used this bullet in the Casul .., How does it work and how well does it penetrate ???? What velocity do you get ????


.If it can,t be grown , its gotta be mined ....
 
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gumboot -- I have used 400 grain WFNs in my .454 SRH. They were running between 1,300 and 1,400 fps. Also have to say that they aren't as accurate as some of the lighter bullets that I have used in the 350 and 360 grain range. Oh, but they do penetrate like hell, as do the 350s and 360s.



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Oooh! "Bet that'll leave a mark" (in) or two (out)! shocker
 
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The hog in my signature picture fell to this load. It kills on both ends! Big Grin Oh, and it was a Bang-Flop.......



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

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I've checked with a buddy of mine who has shot 405s from his .454. You have to really push that weight bullet to stabilize it in the revolvers. You can take a good cast bullet in the 350 weight range, not have to drive it as hard and I don't believe you are going to find an animal in the lower 48 that will hold it.



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This too is what I have found. They are fine up close (25 yards or so), but stretch their legs a bit and watch the groups open up. There's just not enough case capacity to push them fast enough to stabilize them. The 360s and 350s (347s actually) are much more accurate in my SRH, and they don't abuse the shooter nearly as much.

If you want to run heavier bullets, I would suggest stepping up to a bigger caliber -- hell, you have a .480 -- load it with 400s and let it rip!



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

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Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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350s are as big as i will go in a 454.
 
Posts: 1404 | Location: munising MI USA | Registered: 29 March 2002Reply With Quote
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Originally posted by MS Hitman:
I've checked with a buddy of mine who has shot 405s from his .454. You have to really push that weight bullet to stabilize it in the revolvers. You can take a good cast bullet in the 350 weight range, not have to drive it as hard and I don't believe you are going to find an animal in the lower 48 that will hold it.


That is the problem with heavy bullets sometimes, getting the bullet to stabilize.

Dropping down some it weight will make a big difference in accuracy and ranges past 25 yards. And as MS Hitman said, you will not have a problem with anything with a 350 gr. bullet in the lower 48.


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Posts: 3142 | Location: Magnolia Delaware | Registered: 15 May 2004Reply With Quote
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there isn't a game animal in the world that will not take a 360 or a corbon 320 for that matter, let alone the lower 48. in fact, there's not an animal in the lower 48 that'll hold the best loads in a 41mag for that matter.
 
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...Thanks for the replies . ,I was thinking about the 350 with as wide a meplate as I can get .... It would be nice to get one with a .4

" meplate .... How fast do you guys push the 350 grainers ??...


.If it can,t be grown , its gotta be mined ....
 
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The loads that bfrshooter and I tested were between 23 and 26 grains of 296. The 23 grain load was the most accurate, so it won out. We have yet to chronograph it, but it is probably running something north of 1,300 fps -- not real fast, but for me, accuracy is the goal. bfrshooter has used the same bullet in his .45 Colt at 1,250 fps I believe, and it's hell on deer! We'll chronograph it and let you know.......



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

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Originally posted by gumboot458:
...Thanks for the replies . ,I was thinking about the 350 with as wide a meplate as I can get .... It would be nice to get one with a .4

" meplate .... How fast do you guys push the 350 grainers ??...


Work on the load and get the best accuracy you can, if you stick to load data for the bullet you will be fine as far as the volicity goes.

I have used a 325 gr. bullet with a wide meplate and got great accuracy with 25 gr. of H110 in my Ruger Super Redhawk.


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Posts: 3142 | Location: Magnolia Delaware | Registered: 15 May 2004Reply With Quote
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I have preached this forever but get nothing but static from a few. You must match a boolit to the twist along with the velocity that the cartridge is capable of. Too short of a boolit and it has to be shot very slow, too long and the stabilizing velocity can't be reached. That still leaves a wide range to work with but each boolit will need a velocity change to reach the best accuracy.
Even with the best boolit there is only a short powder amount change between just making noise and superior accuracy, 1/2 gr can spoil it.
I hate to see a guy grab a boolit and look for the highest velocity he can get short of sticking brass. The same holds for a guy shooting a super heavy boolit and wanting a light load for practice, doesn't work that way. You never get good at shooting because the combination is just not accurate enough to determine if it is your bad shooting or not.
 
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bfrshooter, I agree with you 100%. I develop loads for accuracy also, I also take into consideration the game I will be shooting.

The reason I have such a wide range of handguns is, I can just change guns if I need something bigger. I work on one load for each gun I have, and that is usually the load I stick with.

That is also the fun of rolling your own, you get to shoot a lot and find exactly what load best fits your gun.


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Posts: 3142 | Location: Magnolia Delaware | Registered: 15 May 2004Reply With Quote
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Would shooting the 395gr-405gr in a 28" single shot rifle give enough stabilization and cranking up of the velocity? I bought a Browning 1885 in .454 because I wanted a rifle using the same shells as my model 83 Freedom Arms


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Posts: 2973 | Location: South Texas | Registered: 15 January 2008Reply With Quote
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It could, depending on the twist rate. Does anyone here off hand know what the twist rate is of the Freedom in .454 Casull? You might find that the load works well in the rifle and doesn't work in the revolver......

I think the more important question is whether or not you need a bullet that heavy in .45 caliber. I am of the belief that you get to a point of diminishing returns, and I have found in my testing (take it for what it's worth -- or what you paid for it.... Big Grin) that a good 350 or 360 grain bullet will do the trick. I like heavy for caliber bullets, but more important is the nose profile of the bullet in determing how it penetrates.......



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

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Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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......Good Point Witworth ...,. I will be going thru Anchorage on my way home Tuesday , Lord willing ..and I will see if I can find some 350gr ish bullets ...If I get 1300 fps from them I will probably be quite happy ... . I have some H 110 so that is the powder I will load it with for the heavy weights and probably Unique for the 250 gr 45 Colt equiv loads ..... .. I,m really looking foward to getting home ... haven,t seen a polar bear yet but I hope I don,t .....Can,t pack a pistol on the Slope ...


.If it can,t be grown , its gotta be mined ....
 
Posts: 3445 | Location: Copper River Valley , Prudhoe Bay , and other interesting locales | Registered: 19 November 2006Reply With Quote
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gumboot -- we get over 1,300 easily with the 350s and they'll go faster, but they are accurate and that is the most important issue. H110 is good! Keep us posted!



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

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"Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time"
 
Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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. Well I,m home and I got it . Got some factory loads for it , 300 gr Hornady XTP and 335 gr Alaskan Ammunition 335 gr,FP/LD . which look the same as the 335 gr Cast Preformance WLN bullet ... The Hornadies say on the box that they go 1668 fps or something like that and I called the company who loads the Alaskan Ammo . .He said it is loaded to 1775 fps in a 6" revolver ...,

There is no question about it going off when the trigger is pressed ..

. I think a 335 gr bullet @ 1400 fps or so is called for .... couldn,t find any 350-360 gr bullets ...

It is manageable with the factory loads but no fun ... We,ll see ..

one thing I will say is it out penetrates any revolver I have shot to date ..includind a 500 S&W .


.If it can,t be grown , its gotta be mined ....
 
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Both Buffalo Bore and Double Tap have 360 grain loads forthe Casull -- if you want factory ammo. I think that Beartooth produces the 360 grain LFN that Double Tap uses........



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

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Originally posted by gumboot458:
. Well I,m home and I got it . Got some factory loads for it , 300 gr Hornady XTP and 335 gr Alaskan Ammunition 335 gr,FP/LD . which look the same as the 335 gr Cast Preformance WLN bullet ... The Hornadies say on the box that they go 1668 fps or something like that and I called the company who loads the Alaskan Ammo . .He said it is loaded to 1775 fps in a 6" revolver ...,

There is no question about it going off when the trigger is pressed ..

. I think a 335 gr bullet @ 1400 fps or so is called for .... couldn,t find any 350-360 gr bullets ...

It is manageable with the factory loads but no fun ... We,ll see ..

one thing I will say is it out penetrates any revolver I have shot to date ..includind a 500 S&W .


What 500 Mag loads did you shoot?


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Posts: 3142 | Location: Magnolia Delaware | Registered: 15 May 2004Reply With Quote
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.....The 500 S&W I shot had a variety of loads , the 440 factory cast penetrated well and my testing media was variable [stumps] but the 335 gr WLN factory load by Alaskan Ammunition @ about 1770 fps gives me over 2 feet of penetration in solid wood , and is a little esiser to manage than the 500 smith ...


I,m a pretty big fan of muzzle brakes on rifles but the 4" muzzle broke Smith kind of popped my ears ,and I had ear plugs in .....
Yes the Casull is pretty loud but possible because of the 7 1/2 " barrel it isn,t so hard on the ears ...


Perhaps other people have had different results with the 2 calibers and as I said my testing media is variable ..... I should invest in some buckets and do the RIP water test for definitive results ....

Really enjoyed your photo spread of your Maine hunt ., nice bear , and nice pistol ... what is the barrel length ?


.If it can,t be grown , its gotta be mined ....
 
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Originally posted by gumboot458:
.....The 500 S&W I shot had a variety of loads , the 440 factory cast penetrated well and my testing media was variable [stumps] but the 335 gr WLN factory load by Alaskan Ammunition @ about 1770 fps gives me over 2 feet of penetration in solid wood , and is a little esiser to manage than the 500 smith ...


I,m a pretty big fan of muzzle brakes on rifles but the 4" muzzle broke Smith kind of popped my ears ,and I had ear plugs in .....
Yes the Casull is pretty loud but possible because of the 7 1/2 " barrel it isn,t so hard on the ears ...


Perhaps other people have had different results with the 2 calibers and as I said my testing media is variable ..... I should invest in some buckets and do the RIP water test for definitive results ....

Really enjoyed your photo spread of your Maine hunt ., nice bear , and nice pistol ... what is the barrel length ?


Thanks gumboot458, we had a blast. It is a 6 inch barrel.


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Posts: 3142 | Location: Magnolia Delaware | Registered: 15 May 2004Reply With Quote
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I have found accuracy to be pretty decent with the 395 grainer in my 7.5" Ruger SRH .454 but as previously stated, the best results seem to occur with near max loads that approach 1400 fps. Recoil is pretty stiff at this level too. That said, I have had best results in the Ruger SRH with bullets weighing 260-360 grains. I generally like to use Hornady's 300 gr fp & 300 gr XTP for deer and pigs. I haven't yet taken any truly large game with the .454 but if I did use it for such game as elk, moose, and grizzly I would have great faith in the Cast Performance 360 gr. WLFN cast bullet at around 1450-1500 fps and would expect complete penetration in most cases.

I'm sure that the 395-405 gr. cast bullets will do a fine job if accuracy in your revolver is up to snuff. Personally, I doubt I'll ever seriously use any bullet in my .454 or .45 Colt revolvers that weighs over 360 grains for the many reasons you guys have stated but would be interested in trying heavier bullets in the .454 caliber Puma/Legacy Sports model 92 carbine that my loving wife will surely get me this Christmas!!!! Wink popcorn

To be honest, I lost all my reasons for pushing super heavy bullets out of my .454 when I purchased my S&W and BFR .500 Magnums. It is still my favorite "pure hunting revolver" though and the big 395 grainer in question will definately get the job done if the shooter does theirs. Penetration is superb! BOOM
 
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..... I talked to Mike at Cast Preformance Bullets today ,, He said the 395 stabilizes fine from a Casull .... as you say SR Shooter ...that it did in your SRH ... The 335 gr wln fp . bullet @ 1500 is pretty manageable , but with this new revolver I,m in the learning stages ... Eeker I got a wad of 255 fp plated bullets for blastin/ practice also ..... Biggest thing I think I need right now is a new glasses perscription ,, The front sight is too fuzzy ....I,m almost done making the holster for it and it isn,t a scoped pistol holster ...so new specs are on the menu . shocker .....I also ordered some 360 gr bullets today so I will see which ones the pistol and I like best I thot I saw a mold @ Midway U.S.A. , for a 405 gr .452 bullet .... hillbilly I measured the meplate on the C.P. 335 gr bullets and it is around .370 ..I would like to get a mold made up to drop a Kieth style bullet with a .43 dia. meplate and around 360 gr cast from Linotype ............


.If it can,t be grown , its gotta be mined ....
 
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Originally posted by gumboot458:
..... I talked to Mike at Cast Preformance Bullets today ,, He said the 395 stabilizes fine from a Casull ....


This is entirely twist dependent and not all Casulls are the same. That said, there is a point of diminishing returns and I am of the opinion that if you really "need" a 400 grain bullet, then you might as well step up in caliber and see some real gains. JMHO.



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

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Originally posted by gumboot458:
..... I talked to Mike at Cast Preformance Bullets today ,, He said the 395 stabilizes fine from a Casull .... as you say SR Shooter ...that it did in your SRH ... The 335 gr wln fp . bullet @ 1500 is pretty manageable , but with this new revolver I,m in the learning stages ... Eeker I got a wad of 255 fp plated bullets for blastin/ practice also ..... Biggest thing I think I need right now is a new glasses perscription ,, The front sight is too fuzzy ....I,m almost done making the holster for it and it isn,t a scoped pistol holster ...so new specs are on the menu . shocker .....I also ordered some 360 gr bullets today so I will see which ones the pistol and I like best I thot I saw a mold @ Midway U.S.A. , for a 405 gr .452 bullet .... hillbilly I measured the meplate on the C.P. 335 gr bullets and it is around .370 ..I would like to get a mold made up to drop a Kieth style bullet with a .43 dia. meplate and around 360 gr cast from Linotype ............


I don't think there is a magic number of bullet weight that works well in every gun. Also performance is not just weight related.

I like to shoot bullets that are accurate and have a good weight for the caliber.

If I had to chose bullet weights for optimum accuracy and killing power in my handguns, in my opinion, I would go with....
357 mag...140 to 160 grain bullet
41 mag...170 to 255 grain
44 mag...240 to 300 grain
45 LC/454...255 to 325 grain
475/480...350 to 440 grain
50 caliber (.500)...325 to 440 grain
50 caliber (.510)...350 to 435 grain


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Posts: 3142 | Location: Magnolia Delaware | Registered: 15 May 2004Reply With Quote
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Nose profile is ultimately more responsible for penetration than any other factor, but you need enough weight for momentum to carry. Really heavy weight bullets in and of themselves don't penetrate well without a good nose profile.



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

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Originally posted by Whitworth:
quote:
Originally posted by gumboot458:
..... I talked to Mike at Cast Preformance Bullets today ,, He said the 395 stabilizes fine from a Casull ....


This is entirely twist dependent and not all Casulls are the same. That said, there is a point of diminishing returns and I am of the opinion that if you really "need" a 400 grain bullet, then you might as well step up in caliber and see some real gains. JMHO.
.


O K . [ I haven,t checked Redhawk 1 ,s reply so I may need to revise this ] If the meplate does all the work , why not try to get it with the one gun ...... Since I won,t be running any of these thru carbines , they don,t need to be able to feed so they can be as big in the hose as the rifling allows ..


This could be " Much ado about nothing " on my part....


One thing I enjoy about this caliber is the flexibility of different loads .....

There is a thread going on on the Big Bore Forum about Sectional density causing penetration .... .
[ potential situation ] .Shoot a trophy Ak Yk moose behind the shoulder , he turns and runs away,,,, next shot needs to be able to penetrate 5-6 feet of moose to reach the heart .. Same gun ,next day packin moose meat, 100 lb plus loads on a back pack , exhausted . very aggressive old bear wants all it can get , don,t see it until its 20 ft away and comeing fast , need all the shock transmission possible combined with penetration .....

Only got one revolver ..


.If it can,t be grown , its gotta be mined ....
 
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Within normal handgun range, if I shoot an animal with a WFN or LFN bullet at 1400 fps, and my bullet weight is the same, lets say 350 gr. And the penetration of the WFN is not as much as the LFH, but I still pass through the animal, which I believe both will do.

What is the difference?

In normal handgun range, I think just about any bullet of sufficient weight, design and velocity will pass through most if not all North American game.
I am talking a hard cast bullet here, and hunting handguns.


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Originally posted by gumboot458:
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Originally posted by Whitworth:
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Originally posted by gumboot458:
..... I talked to Mike at Cast Preformance Bullets today ,, He said the 395 stabilizes fine from a Casull ....


This is entirely twist dependent and not all Casulls are the same. That said, there is a point of diminishing returns and I am of the opinion that if you really "need" a 400 grain bullet, then you might as well step up in caliber and see some real gains. JMHO.
.


O K . [ I haven,t checked Eedhawk 1 ,s reply so I may need to revise this ] If the meplate does all the work , why not try to get it with the one gun ....


I'm not following you, gumboot.

How do we define sufficient weight?



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Originally posted by Whitworth:


How do we define sufficient weight?



The bullet weight normally associated with the particular cartridge used. Is what I was referring to.

"Most" people that choose to handgun hunt have done there homework, and know what bullets work in there particular gun.
No magic number. Just an example, a 240 or 300 gr. hard cast bullet shot at a deer from 25 yards. Both at 1300 fps. (just to use a number). Both bullets will past through a deer with no problem.

Whitworth, I am sure you have shot enough hogs to know, a 240 or 300 gr. hard cast bullet fired from a 44 Mag at 1300 to 1400 fps, will be more than enough to pass through most hogs.


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Originally posted by gumboot458:
quote:
Originally posted by Whitworth:
quote:
Originally posted by gumboot458:
..... I talked to Mike at Cast Preformance Bullets today ,, He said the 395 stabilizes fine from a Casull ....


This is entirely twist dependent and not all Casulls are the same. That said, there is a point of diminishing returns and I am of the opinion that if you really "need" a 400 grain bullet, then you might as well step up in caliber and see some real gains. JMHO.
.


O K . [ I haven,t checked Redhawk 1 ,s reply so I may need to revise this ] If the meplate does all the work , why not try to get it with the one gun ...... Since I won,t be running any of these thru carbines , they don,t need to be able to feed so they can be as big in the hose as the rifling allows ..


This could be " Much ado about nothing " on my part....


One thing I enjoy about this caliber is the flexibility of different loads .....

There is a thread going on on the Big Bore Forum about Sectional density causing penetration .... .
[ potential situation ] .Shoot a trophy Ak Yk moose behind the shoulder , he turns and runs away,,,, next shot needs to be able to penetrate 5-6 feet of moose to reach the heart .. Same gun ,next day packin moose meat, 100 lb plus loads on a back pack , exhausted . very aggressive old bear wants all it can get , don,t see it until its 20 ft away and comeing fast , need all the shock transmission possible combined with penetration .....

Only got one revolver ..
.. I don,t know , mayby for the charge situation possible a 250gr XPB @ 1900 fps would be best ...,.


.If it can,t be grown , its gotta be mined ....
 
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Originally posted by Whitworth:


How do we define sufficient weight?



The bullet weight normally associated with the particular cartridge used. Is what I was referring to.

"Most" people that choose to handgun hunt have done there homework, and know what bullets work in there particular gun.
No magic number. Just an example, a 240 or 300 gr. hard cast bullet shot at a deer from 25 yards. Both at 1300 fps. (just to use a number). Both bullets will past through a deer with no problem.

Whitworth, I am sure you have shot enough hogs to know, a 240 or 300 gr. hard cast bullet fired from a 44 Mag at 1300 to 1400 fps, will be more than enough to pass through most hogs.


I think you are wrong about "most people" doing their homework. They are the folks that ran out and bought a .454 Casull when they were first introduced as a production chambering because they heard it was the baddest cartridge around. This same personality type ran out and bought .500 Smiths or whatever because of the marketing hype. I'm not talking about the hardcore guy who looks at a cartridge and actually wants to squeeze the maximum performance out of the cartridge, be it a .44 mag, .500 Smith, Casull, whatever. As you should be able to see, many people use jacketed hollow-points on game that shouldn't be shot with an expanding bullet. "Most people" (and I hate generalizing) don't want to bother with penetration testing or load development and they keep the factory ammo producers in business. So, I don't think that the average Joe necessarily takes it as far as some of us "geeks".



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

Semper Fidelis

"Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time"
 
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Originally posted by gumboot458:
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Originally posted by gumboot458:
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Originally posted by Whitworth:
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Originally posted by gumboot458:
..... I talked to Mike at Cast Preformance Bullets today ,, He said the 395 stabilizes fine from a Casull ....


This is entirely twist dependent and not all Casulls are the same. That said, there is a point of diminishing returns and I am of the opinion that if you really "need" a 400 grain bullet, then you might as well step up in caliber and see some real gains. JMHO.
.


O K . [ I haven,t checked Redhawk 1 ,s reply so I may need to revise this ] If the meplate does all the work , why not try to get it with the one gun ...... Since I won,t be running any of these thru carbines , they don,t need to be able to feed so they can be as big in the hose as the rifling allows ..


This could be " Much ado about nothing " on my part....


One thing I enjoy about this caliber is the flexibility of different loads .....

There is a thread going on on the Big Bore Forum about Sectional density causing penetration .... .
[ potential situation ] .Shoot a trophy Ak Yk moose behind the shoulder , he turns and runs away,,,, next shot needs to be able to penetrate 5-6 feet of moose to reach the heart .. Same gun ,next day packin moose meat, 100 lb plus loads on a back pack , exhausted . very aggressive old bear wants all it can get , don,t see it until its 20 ft away and comeing fast , need all the shock transmission possible combined with penetration .....

Only got one revolver ..
.. I don,t know , mayby for the charge situation possible a 250gr XPB @ 1900 fps would be best ...,.


Personally I would want big and heavy over light and fast, gumboot. I would never load my Casull with 250s, but that's just me.



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

Semper Fidelis

"Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time"
 
Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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. ., I know , but Why and can it be proven out with dead animals ..., Shoot , [ and I am in no way trying to step on anyones toes here] , but can it be proven that say the 475 Linebaugh kills or stops game faster than the Casull ., or even the 500 linebaugh ., .. Have you measured the meplate dia. on your 475 bullets , ???? What is it .. The Freedom Arms model 83 has pretty shallow rifleing so a semi wadcutter should be able to be made that has a pretty wide nose , like .43" in a 395 gr bullet @ 1350 fps it should be pretty near the equal of the bigger calibers ..... Sure would make for a versitile caliber ...


.If it can,t be grown , its gotta be mined ....
 
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gumboot458, dead is dead. I am more than sure a 250 gr. hard cast bullet will kill any animal out of a 454 Casull.

I know a lot of guys killing, deer, hogs and black bear with a 240 gr. bullet in there 44 Mags.

The 41 Mag is doing it with a 210 gr. bullet.

The only reason I use bigger bullets, and I am talking diameter, I like bigger holes in my animals. Not that I think they will kill quicker. If two animals were shot in the exact same place, with a 454 Casull shooting a 250 gr. bullet and a 500 Mag shooting a 370 gr. bullet, with a heart/lung shot, both would die.

If you want to use a 250 gr. bullet, I say go out and put them in a few animals, and see the performance for yourself. I am sure you will not be disappointed. Just stick with a good hard cast bullet.


If you're going to make a hole, make it a big one.
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Posts: 3142 | Location: Magnolia Delaware | Registered: 15 May 2004Reply With Quote
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Originally posted by gumboot458:
. ., I know , but Why and can it be proven out with dead animals ..., Shoot , [ and I am in no way trying to step on anyones toes here] , but can it be proven that say the 475 Linebaugh kills or stops game faster than the Casull ., or even the 500 linebaugh ., .. Have you measured the meplate dia. on your 475 bullets , ???? What is it .. The Freedom Arms model 83 has pretty shallow rifleing so a semi wadcutter should be able to be made that has a pretty wide nose , like .43" in a 395 gr bullet @ 1350 fps it should be pretty near the equal of the bigger calibers ..... Sure would make for a versitile caliber ...


The bullets I use in my .475 have a meplat that is 81% of the diameter. The .475 punches a bigger hole in an animal than a .45 or .44, causing more damage. I don't buy into the assertion that anyone hunts with a big, heavy behemoth like the .500 Smith because "they just like bigger holes". Come on, give me a break, it does more damage than a similarly loaded Casull and you know it. Plus, bigger holes bleed more. Why use a 360 grain bullet in a .454 over a 250? PENETRATION. Yes, a 250 might zip through an animal, but that same bullet might encounter heavy bone and it just might upset your theory. Or, what happens when the shot you have to take is a Texas heart shot and you need maximum penetration? Do you do a last minute swap of ammo, resight the weapon and hope the animal cooperates and waits for you? Big Grin

Of course there are exceptions to the rule like deer (or other small, soft animals) that are really no bigger than men and in many cases smaller and don't require a big hammer.



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

Semper Fidelis

"Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time"
 
Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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Originally posted by Whitworth:
I don't buy into the assertion that anyone hunts with a big, heavy behemoth like the .500 Smith because "they just like bigger holes". Come on, give me a break, it does more damage than a similarly loaded Casull and you know it. Plus, bigger holes bleed more. Why use a 360 grain bullet in a .454 over a 250? PENETRATION. Yes, a 250 might zip through an animal, but that same bullet might encounter heavy bone and it just might upset your theory. Or, what happens when the shot you have to take is a Texas heart shot and you need maximum penetration? Do you do a last minute swap of ammo, resight the weapon and hope the animal cooperates and waits for you? Big Grin



It is not a matter if you buy into it or not. I don't need more than a 370 or 440 gr. bullet in my 500 Mag to be a good penetrate or to kill anything on the North American continent. If you do some research, you will see, there are guys that have taken Cape buffalo with a 440 gr. bullet from a 500 Mag.

And yes myself and everyone else worth there salt know the larger the hole, the more damage, because it causes a "larger wound channel". I think we have discussed this in great detail before.

Texas heard shot, what good hunter would want to do a Texas heart shot? Any hunter worth a darn will wait for the perfect shot, no matter how big of a handgun he has. At least I do.

No matter what weight bullet you shoot, there comes a time, there is a point of diminishing returns. Wink


If you're going to make a hole, make it a big one.
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Posts: 3142 | Location: Magnolia Delaware | Registered: 15 May 2004Reply With Quote
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Originally posted by Redhawk1:
quote:
Originally posted by Whitworth:
I don't buy into the assertion that anyone hunts with a big, heavy behemoth like the .500 Smith because "they just like bigger holes". Come on, give me a break, it does more damage than a similarly loaded Casull and you know it. Plus, bigger holes bleed more. Why use a 360 grain bullet in a .454 over a 250? PENETRATION. Yes, a 250 might zip through an animal, but that same bullet might encounter heavy bone and it just might upset your theory. Or, what happens when the shot you have to take is a Texas heart shot and you need maximum penetration? Do you do a last minute swap of ammo, resight the weapon and hope the animal cooperates and waits for you? Big Grin



It is not a matter if you buy into it or not. I don't need more than a 370 or 440 gr. bullet in my 500 Mag to be a good penetrate or to kill anything on the North American continent. If you do some research, you will see, there are guys that have taken Cape buffalo with a 440 gr. bullet from a 500 Mag.

And yes myself and everyone else worth there salt know the larger the hole, the more damage, because it causes a "larger wound channel". I think we have discussed this in great detail before.

Texas heard shot, what good hunter would want to do a Texas heart shot? Any hunter worth a darn will wait for the perfect shot, no matter how big of a handgun he has. At least I do.

No matter what weight bullet you shoot, there comes a time, there is a point of diminishing returns. Wink


You are the embodiment of contradiction. One day it's 700 grain bullets in your .500, the next it's 370s. Then, you say -- and I quote: "Not that I think they will kill quicker" and then the following post you say: "And yes myself and everyone else worth there salt know the larger the hole, the more damage, because it causes a "larger wound channel". Which one is it? Do they or do they not kill more quickly?

No hunter worth a damn would take a Texas heart shot? Are you kidding me? If you have a caliber/bullet combination that will penetrate, and you have the experience enough to know where to place the shot, there is no reason in the world not to take it. But, you have to have confidence in your equipment and you abilities behind the trigger. Sometimes the Texas heart shot is the only thing available and I won't pass on it personally.



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

Semper Fidelis

"Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time"
 
Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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