OK you doubters try this.

Take a revolver that you have sighted in at a certain distance.

Then shoot it upside down.

NOTHING has changed, you are shooting the same gun, same ammo same recoil, same barrel time, same sight setting, same sight picture....


OH but wait... Since you are holding the gun different, the RECOIL MOMENTIUM will be different...

Tell me, where do the bullets hit???

Then shoot your handgun Gangsta style, ie sideways... Then tell me where you hit...


Also for you serious precision bolt rifle shooters, take a rifle that is perfectly sighted in on the bags at 100 yards.

Then shoot a group at 100 yards with the rifle 90 degrees to the left, then another group 90 degrees to the right...

True but when you change your hold in any way, the gun should again be sighted for that change.
It is why another person will shoot higher or lower with your gun because it is sighted for your hold, not his.
Now take the .44 with my 330 gr boolit, sighted an inch high at 50 yards with a scope. It will drop about 35" at 200. Going to the red dot, I put the bottom of the dot on a target, then estimate the center of the dot by how much the dot covers at 200. Not precise but close enough for a grenade.
Going to the .500 with a scope, 440 gr boolit at near the same velocity as the .44, it drops 20" at 200. That is with a 50 yard zero so If I sight it an inch high at 50, the drop would be around 18". That is the same as my .475 with a 420 gr boolit when sighted an inch high at 50.
Now my 45-70 with a 320 gr boolit going over 1600 fps only drops 16" at 200.
Again, not exactly precise but close. The 45-70 will drop about 26' at 500 yards but that can't be measured.
A .22 pistol sighted at 25 yards will have the bullet drop through the line of sight again at 80 yards and drop 53" at 200.
I have no idea where mid range height occurs with my big bore revolvers.
Drop figures can only be measured if the gun is always held exactly the same, rested the same and sighted in for your hold. Shooting off hand or any other way needs the sights adjusted again.
If I sight my .44 from bags, I need to change the setting for off hand deer hunting and there is no way around that.
Barrel rise only affects departure as does barrel time. Both are adjusted out with the sights. If you change holds at 50 you will get stringing that is magnified at long range.
Long range groups should be nice and round without vertical stringing all over the paper.
Any time a shot has more barrel rise that you feel and see, discount that shot. You have changed departure, and not made the gun shoot flatter. All you did was raise mid range height.
The reason for a negative lead from a moving platform is that by the time the bullet exits, you have passed the target.

quote:

Going to the red dot, I put the bottom of the dot on a target, then estimate the center of the dot by how much the dot covers at 200. Not precise but close enough for a grenade.

In the picture you posted of the first 5 shots at 200 for the 500 jrh, did you rest the dot on top of the can/thing (not sure what it is) that the tape measure starts in the middle of? If yes, the middle of the dot would be about 6 inches higher than the middle of the can/thing.

quote:

Posted 16 September 2011 17:34 Hide Post

quote:
Going to the red dot, I put the bottom of the dot on a target, then estimate the center of the dot by how much the dot covers at 200. Not precise but close enough for a grenade.



In the picture you posted of the first 5 shots at 200 for the 500 jrh, did you rest the dot on top of the can/thing (not sure what it is) that the tape measure starts in the middle of? If yes, the middle of the dot would be about 6 inches higher than the middle of the can/thing.

Posts: 103 | Location: CA | Registered: 05 February 2003

That was shot with the scope and a center hold. I do not have the red dot yet.
You can see the two higher shots and that was me and I called them because the rear bag loosened and I felt more rise.
It is hard to explain but each shot must feel the same. You really can tell the difference.
It is hard but if something does not feel right, just discount it, don't bash yourself. Those shots were just you, leave it go.
Gain better control, call shots and you can out shoot a Ransom rest all day. Yes you can, I don't trust the silly machine.

John Linebaugh at least used to claim that the .475 shot flatter and outpenetrated the .500. Maybe he has changed his way of thinking lately.

quote:

Originally posted by jstevens:
John Linebaugh at least used to claim that the .475 shot flatter and outpenetrated the .500. Maybe he has changed his way of thinking lately.

That used to be the case (penetration) but in recent years, the .500 Has been loaded with better bullets and has actually ended up on top at the Seminars. It's all academic.

Give me a choice between the .475 and .500 JRH, you will need a BIG stick to make me part with either.