The Accurate Reloading Forums
How important are clean cases to you?
28 September 2018, 00:09
customboltHow important are clean cases to you?
Has anyone out there compared the accuracy of reloads using cleaned/fired cases to uncleaned/fired cases? You know, same load, bullet, etc. All experiences appreciated as usual.
CB
Life itself is a gift. Live it up if you can.
28 September 2018, 00:25
ZekeShikarI have not conducted anything resembling quality testing of dirty v clean case loads.
With that said, every other little thing has been tested (by me within my little world) and right down to the amount of bullet grip (neck tension) will affect accuracy and consistency at distance.
Out to the paltry range of 300 yards on deer size game, anything goes but for smaller targets at farther ranges, pay attention to detail.
Well okay, I just commented and didn't really add anything.
Zeke
28 September 2018, 00:26
30.06kingFor my hunting loads, clean cases not important but clean primer pockets are after a few shots. Haven't done deliberate comparisons, only observation.
Hunting.... it's not everything, it's the only thing.
28 September 2018, 01:31
p dog shooterAs long as they fit and feed.
28 September 2018, 02:14
graybirdI've never compared the differences between "clean" and "dirt" brass regarding accuracy, I have had an issue once when I was using walnut media as a cleaning agent. The issue was a small amount of dust collected on the inside wall of the FL size. Eventually, it started scratching the brass. Soon after that, I switched over to stainless steel pins and wet cleaning and haven't looked back.
Good luck!
Graybird
"Make no mistake, it's not revenge he's after ... it's the reckoning."
28 September 2018, 02:39
impala#03I believe clean cases are easier to inspect. Clean cases feed much better than uncleaned cases. Probably not much difference in accuracy.
28 September 2018, 03:59
bartsche
The best repeatable rifle I ever owned never saw clean cases by today's standards. All the cases used in it were made from .250-3000 cases. At that time It was called a .22 Varminter.
I still have the RCBS dies with that nomenclature stamped on them.
roger
Old age is a high price to pay for maturity!!! Some never pay and some pay and never reap the reward. Wisdom comes with age! Sometimes age comes alone..
28 September 2018, 04:16
TexKDI havent done any comparisons to clean vs less cleaned for accuracy or function.
I personally like my cases clean both inside and out, and they are loaded that way. So that might have some bearing on the outcome of the test.
28 September 2018, 04:51
Jerry LilesDo you mean polished or cleaned of dirt and grime?
Polished look nice but its most important to clean the cases of dirt, dust, soot, and corrosion and clean the primer pockets of built up deposits.
I use a tumbler to insure the cases are clean before sizing and again after to remove sizing lube. Neither take long unless you want polished.
Cleaning before sizing can save the dies from excess wear. Cleaning after removes lube. Perhaps not so important with wax type lubes but sticky oil or grease like lubes should be removed to prevent crud from sticking to it, prevent contaminating powder and primers, and to keep lube from getting in the chamber.
For small batches you could just wipe the case with a rag but large batches just do best with a tumbler.
My two cents
28 September 2018, 06:55
customboltGood to hear from the more experienced re-loaders out there. Thanks gents. I didn't expect a difference. Now I'm certain.
Life itself is a gift. Live it up if you can.
28 September 2018, 07:02
sambarman338While I imagine clean cases are important, I make do with shaking them around in Shellite (what you call white gas, I think).
As one who took up reloading largely to save money, I resent having to spend ever more on aids like tumblers. I recently gave in and spent a couple of hundred on a Redding case trimmer - and what a PITA that has been.
28 September 2018, 07:11
LuckyduckerI have considered the cleaning of brass cases more important for preserving sizing dies than for accuracy of ammo.
Dennis
Life member NRA
28 September 2018, 07:20
Jeff millsI have shot load to load comparison to find this very thing out a long time ago.
The dirty brass loads shot exactly the same.
Fired 100 rounds of each at two separate targets over three trips to the range.
But, eventually that brass will need serious cleaning. At least with some #4000 steel wool.
Harbor Freight has a tumbler for $50 bucks. Clean brass makes inspecting for cracks alot easier, and it makes the final product something to be more proud of. They won't need cleaned that often, but sooner or later it will be something that has to be done
28 September 2018, 22:36
AnotherAZWriterquote:
Originally posted by Luckyducker:
I have considered the cleaning of brass cases more important for preserving sizing dies than for accuracy of ammo.
Me too.
02 October 2018, 12:08
georgeldBerry's has a shaker for $50 with a warranty you;ll never get at H/F.
George
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02 October 2018, 19:01
dpcdMr Liles said it; Clean, or polished? Big difference. No difference in shooting but dirty (meaning covered with dirt, grit, carbon,etc) cases will scratch your dies. Unless you use carbide. Polished cases just look pretty.
So, yes you must clean them but no, you don't have to polish them. But what is the easiest way to clean? Polish them in a tumbler. So we are back to the beginning.
02 October 2018, 20:51
LamarI wonder what happens to all that black stuff inside the cases.
does it just build up in there?
does it blow down the barrel?
it can't just self regulate it's gotta be doing something.
we clean it out of our barrels cause it builds up there and causes problems, so why not in the case too?
03 October 2018, 04:39
dpcdIt burns itself out with each shot. If it didn't, then we could never have any hope for any kind of uniform case capacity. Barrels do that too so some extent. But the reason we clean out the barrels is that bullets don't ride on the cases.
Black powder; no.
03 October 2018, 05:52
Jerry LilesClean doesn't mean polished. Clean doesn't mean pretty. Clean means the case is CLEAN of dirt, sand, grit, corrosion, etc. It means the case won't damage your dies, or get stuck in the chamber,or spit some gras doux down the barrel and damage the rifling.
The case should also be inspected and a clean case is easier to examine. Some rifle cases need to have the length checked and perhaps the neck trimmed. Also easier with a clean case.
I like clean underwear, clean dishes and silverware, a clean rifle, and clean ammunition.
03 October 2018, 06:38
JJBquote:
Originally posted by Luckyducker:
I have considered the cleaning of brass cases more important for preserving sizing dies than for accuracy of ammo.
03 October 2018, 13:40
Wstrnhuntrquote:
Originally posted by Jerry Liles:
Clean doesn't mean polished. Clean doesn't mean pretty. Clean means the case is CLEAN of dirt, sand, grit, corrosion, etc.
It also means the case should be free of oils and lubricants. As the pressure expands the case outward against the chamber walls it is intended to create a seal against the gasses and more or less "grip" the chamber walls temporarily. Lubricant on the case on the other hand can contribute to bolt thrust. Clean brass is good!
04 October 2018, 01:05
roughoneI like clean cases for my dies, and polished cases when I invariably drop them while hunting. It makes them easier to find.
(You can't fix stupid)
Falls of Rough Ky University
Our victory cry is FORK U!
06 October 2018, 07:44
rodellEveryone knows shiny cases produce better accuracy and superior velocity.
06 October 2018, 08:17
B L O'ConnorI care only about getting any and all grit off of and out of my cases (as in from crappy scavenged military brass).
I used to go for sparkling clean, but even then my main goal was only to protect my dies. The bling appearance was a concession only to cosmetics.
Now, my requirements are achieved by placing my cases in a bit of vinegar and a few drops of dish soap, leave them to sit for a few minutes, agitate it all, and rinse bigly with H2O.
I like bling, but I don’t strive for it. I want brass that is grit free and isn’t going to scratch my dies. Period.
07 October 2018, 00:04
AnotherAZWriterquote:
Originally posted by dpcd:
It burns itself out with each shot. If it didn't, then we could never have any hope for any kind of uniform case capacity.
Any shooter who weighs cases knows this to be true. For example, I am loading today and have two different lots of Nosler brass; one is 10 gr heavier (.338 Lapua) than the other lot, but within lots they are amazingly close. I documented the original weight when new and their weight is consistent from firing to firing, ie, they don't "gain" weight from powder residual.
10 October 2018, 00:58
MyNameIsEarlquote:
Originally posted by JJB:
quote:
Originally posted by Luckyducker:
I have considered the cleaning of brass cases more important for preserving sizing dies than for accuracy of ammo.
Totally agree! While I clean primer pockets and chamfer, that is when I inspect my cases for cracks etc.
13 October 2018, 08:07
lawndartComing from a career in medicine, I of course have displayed a great deal of OCD directed case cleaning activity in the last thirty five years.
It is important, psychologically, for me to always load bright and shiny brass.
Clean enough brass is important for many reasons listed above.
Bright and shiny, however, is not necessary for excellent results. Bench rest shooters have long proven that.
13 October 2018, 20:52
mike_elmerI have a tumbler with Rouge infused media. But I haven't used it for almost a year now. I have switched to Citric Acid in warm water, shaken and left sit with cases in it for about 10-15 mins, rinse, and lay out on a towel on my oil furnace to dry overnight. Makes for nice clean cases, and doesn't get much easier that that. Clean inside and out, not as shiny as tumbled, but also not as dusty, and rouge dust is not trapped inside the cases.
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14 October 2018, 02:54
jeffeossolet's just say that there's a difference between mirror bright and corroded ...
14 October 2018, 06:32
Mike_DettorreI haven't done anything to "polish" brass in probably 10 years.
I just make sure cases are not dirty.
MikeLegistine actu quod scripsi?
Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.
What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
