Hello gentlemen,

I am considering the purchase of a progressive reloading press. I don't have any current experience with them. I would appreciate hearing your recommendations.

Thank you.

its a question of what you are going to be reloading.

i have a dillion Sqaure deal b and a NEW hornady LNL Autoprogressive

i would EXCLUDE any non-auto indexing (rotating) presses, .. in fact, after working with a friend's dillion 550, I did just that.

in other words, for FEATURE comparison, you must compare the dillion 650 (more turret holes, auto indexing, case feeders and such) to the hornady LnL AP .. lots of blue press fanatics want to compare the 550, but that's NOT accurate ... you can't compare a manual index press to an auto .. especially if that auto can hold more dies.

in MY opinion, the hornady is nearly perfect, it needs an improved primer system. That flaw means you MUST STOP IMMEDIATELY if there is ONE grain of loose powder. ONE ... it can lock the primer pistion, bend a 'wire" cam, and ruin your day .. its only 8 bucks to replace that cam, but if you don't have it ON HAND, its annoying. Get yourself plenty of lock n load bushings ... I have done up to 500 AR on mine.

just what to do pistols?
if dillion makes the dies, its HARD to beat the dillion SDB . remember, the lee products have two levels of stuff, (or did???) and the hornady single caliber does NOT compare to the SDB

Oh, as for die changes, the hornady is BY FAR the best ... press down + 1/8 turn ...

I LIKE the hornady powder thrower, ALOT ..

just my opinions

Thanks for the feedback jeffeosso. I'm planning both rifle and pistol ammo. Probably .204, and .222 along with 9mm to start with. However, I'd like to be able to expand.

1. Does the Redding Pro Series dies work well in progressive presses?

2. Can one press meet my needs are should I plan on more than one progressive press?

3. Does cost equate to quality regarding progressive presses?

4. If you were buying for yourself what would you do?

as much as jeff likes the hornady i like the dillon 650. you can use any dies and load most any caliber. the only things about a progressive press is that it takes a bit of time to set it up to change calibers. usually if i have less than say 100 rds to load i'll just go back to my co-ax. the other thing is that any progressive you have to watch carefully just what you're doing on each stroke. one mishap and it balls up the whole sequence, causing frequent 4 letter vocabulary use. so it isn't a thing that yu sit back and watch tv with one eye and load with the other.

Butch,
on the changing calibers .. other than powder settings, I can change from 223 to 45LC, or 45LC to 308, or 223 to 500 ACcrel in LESS than 2 mins .. and if they share a shellplate, far less than a minute .. perhaps 10 seconds per die ... in and out.

I have both hornady and dillon gear, and have tried both .. and i DIDN'T buy the dillion 550 or 650, after using the 550 and then getting the hornady ..

its a vote with your dollars, thing, and everyone gets to make the choice

Good points. If I do buy the progressive press I want to make a commitment to applying myself to using it.

Quite honestly I don't know enough about them to make an informed decision so am looking for your input. I am a VERY SERIOUS handloader however.

Sounds like the Hornady and Dillion are the leading candidates. Not sure about Lee?

I want to make the best technical decision first, then consider the commercial side.

I have been using the Dillon 650 for several years now. I have had zero problems with this machine. I did get the video Dillon sells for the 650, that helped setting up the machine easier than using the manual. If you have a problem with a Dillon, they fix it. I do not have any experience with the Hornady machine.

Do you have to use Dillion dies with the Dillion machines? This isn't clear to me after reviewing Dillion's website.

Is RCBS a player in auto-indexing machines?

the 650 can use anyone's dies.. its a GREAT machine, seriously .. no flies on it.

you can't make a bad decision with getitng a 650, really ...

the hornady priming system, with its loose powder issue is important ... but that's the same with my Dillon Sqaure deal .. loose powder is BAD

if money wasn't an issue, though, most guys would buy the dillon 650 .. However, I didn't, just my quirkiness ..

ONLY comparing auto-indexing presses

square deal b - with a set of dies (note, its $100 to change dies)
$350

midway, sinclair have hornady's in stock .. no dies
399

650 without dies -
$529

rcbs auto progressive
450 ...

hornady shell plates are 30 bucks

You haven't said much about the RCBS Auto progressive. Should I read anything into that?

Is there a difference in ease of changing reloading set-ups between the 650 and LNL AP?

Is there an advantage in accersories between the 650 and LNL AP? I can't quite figure out the case feeding options.

Diilon550--mine only has about 400k rds loaded on it(bought used off comp shooter).Screw auto indexing--I load all handgun calibers fast...or I load .308 loads that will group 1.5 at 200yds all day long-1 at a time..And if/when YOU break something,Dillon stands 100% behind their product-instantly-not wks,mnths later...But to each his own..

So much has been written about these two brands that a Search will provide you more information than this posting will.

Does the Dillion XL 650 have the same or similar "loose powder" issue that the LNL AP and Dillion Square Deal"B" experience?

Bully--

I went thru that search a couple years ago and ended up getting the Hornady LNL. Here's why:

1. The Dillon powder measure and adjustment system was pathetic, and extremely frustrating to get set up--and not repeatable. Your nut/bolt adjustments had to be redone each time from scratch (not just checked) to get to the load you wanted, unless you had a dedicated measure for each caliber or load. I put the micrometer rifle metering insert into the Hornady measure and it is consistant and repeatable. For specific, individual loads, I can preset a LNL metering insert and set it for that load, keep it with the dies, etc. To be short, very setup and change friendly.

2. 5 stations beats 4 every time, even if you don't use them all. You can also chose to seat bullets in whichever station is easiest to reach...

3. Auto indexing goes a long way to prevent worry about double-charging cases. (Auto indexing is not always a plus for seating bullets in very long cases....)

4. The LNL die seating system is excellent for changes, and also for setup and everyday ops. For rifle cases, I almost never use the thing as a full progressive--I deprime, resize and then insert a separate trim step, or prime, powder drop, seat, and maybe crimp. Basically, the cases I need to trim or check I don't do fully progressively. Hornady makes this easy because I can pull individual dies out without changing their adjustment in any way.

5. Hornady shellplates are cartridge family friendly. For example, the many cases sharing a case head with the 30-06 use that shellplate, same for the one for all belted magnums....vs the Dillon system of separate pins and plates for each. Pull up the shellplate list from the Hornady site and you'll see what I mean.

My observations on the Dillon are based on working with a friend who has one. Like many things, once set up for a particular pistol load it does work quite well when you get in the groove.

Be advised it took me longer to set up the Hornady press and get comfortable with it than I expected. For example, 20 years of reloading on a turret press had built bad habits--like I didn't need to have all operations adjusted to work together at exactly the same time. I am probably just a slow learner.

Good luck with it,

Cheers,

Dan

I like manual indexing (turret presses). I have a Dillon 450B that has easily 500,000 rounds through it, a 550 that is new. The 550 is much more automated with the automatic primer feeder and powder drop. A 650 is probably next.

The serious IPSC and IDPA shooters (who shoot tens of thousands of rounds a year) nearly all use Dillons. Get a 650 if you want really fast, but a 550 is fast enough and is somewhat easier to change calibers on. If you need the 1050, you won't need to ask us for advice

If you want to reload rifle cartridges on a progressive, the LNL AP has a couple of advantages over the Dillon 650.

Dies are easily, independently interchangeable on the LNL AP, so you can change from FL to neck sizing, etc. With the Dillon tool head, you either have to unscrew the die from the tool head (loosing the setting on a dillon die), or dedicate a whole new tool head and dies.

If you want to put a universal depriming die in the first station, you can remove the rest of the dies, and run the press in full, auto-index mode, without having to empty the primer magazine. The 650 dispenses another primer even if it is not used; the LNL AP and 550 do not. So you can easily use the LNL AP as an auto-index progressive, as a turret press (one cartridge at a time on the press), or as a single stage press with auto-eject (one die installed in the press).

The Hornady LNL AP powder measure is better suited to extruded rifle powders than the Dillon PM.

The Hornady LNL AP PM works in any station, allowing more than one operation before dumping powder, without having to take two passes through the press (e.g. shoulder bump then neck size). The Dillon PM works only in the 2nd station.

The smoother half-step shell plate advancement of the LNL AP results in less spilled powder then the all-at-once shell plate advancement on the Dillon. The LNL AP advances half a step on the way up, and another half step on the way down.

Andy

IMHO you shouldn't even think about a progressive press other than Dillon.

I have a RCBS progressive, it was junk and parts are now unobtainable - complete waste of money.

I've worn out too much Lee stuff to trust the on anything high volumn.

I'll respect some of the opinions about the Hornady LNL, I haven't used one. The price seems right but I wonder if 10 years from now when 1 grain of powder breaks something will I still be able to buy that widget?

With the Dillon 1 grain of powder won't break anything! Also they WILL have the parts to fix it 10 years from now or they might just replace the thing altogether. Thier service is superb! If you have ANY question or problem you just call them and they get it handled. They aren't cheap but if you are a serious reloader it's an ivestment that you will be glad you made.

You can use any dies with the Dillon 550 and 650's BUT their dies are optimized for use in a progressive machine and are worth buying.

Their primer pocket swager is also without peer - simply the best by far.

Their case trimmer is way fast if you need to trim a BUNCH of case. Not cheap but awesome if you have 10,000rds of 223 or the like to work through.

The big differences between the 550 and 650 is that the 650 auto-indexes, i.e. it moves the shells around automatically. Also the 650 has an extra station for a powder check die. The 650 is setup to use with a case feeder - don't buy one without it. They now make a case feeder for the 550 but if you really want a case feeder you probably should go ahead and step up to the 650.

So in summary I've wasted money on progressives that weren't up to the task. Buy a Dillon 550 or 650 and don't waste money on lesser equipment.......................DJ

You haven't actually stated how many rounds to intend to reload. Unless you intend to reload many 100's to 1000's at a time then you don't really need a progressive even though you may want one.

Progressive's have a steep learning curve and all the quirks each of the brands have go away once the tricks and fixes are learned and unconsciously applied.

Despite the ease of changeover on some of the high end presses, volume users and I include myself, tend to have several progressive presses each set up for a differet cartridge just so when the opportunity presents itself you simply go a crank out some more ammunition.

I have gone with Hornady and am happy.

For quantities less than these volumes or for infrequent use I am very happy with the Lee Classic turret press, the big one not to be confused with the older turret model.

This will turn out ammunition at between 100 and 200 rounds an hour much more stress free than a progressive. The setup of the Lee press allows the case to be easily inspected at each stage and I have more confidence in the ammunition it produces than the progressives.

I have a Dillon 650 progressive with all the bells and whistles and love it dearly. Setup time between calibers is a bit lengthy but it kicks out huge volumes of pistol reloads for me.

Last year I purchased a Lock-N-Load progressive from Hornady and took advantage of their special that sent me back 1000 jacketed bullets on my proof of purchase. Net cost to me was about 100.00 for the base presss after I discounted the 225.00 worth of bullets. I like this press too and use it for lower volume loading...maybe 200-400 in an evening.

the L-N-L special is still on thru 12/31/09 so you might think about that.

have fun and read the reloading manuals and abide by their guidance religously!

Thanks guys. Great information After reading your input I plan to buy two best quality machines and set them up for what I load and not change out for different cartridges. I grind out volume loads on my Co-Ax and Harrell and now realize this isn't so bad after all. I would like to increase production on a couple of cartridges but not at the sake of ammo quality or annoying equipment problems. My take away is that progressive machines are not a panacea.

You are absolutely right. There are problems with any press. I have a 550 and it was the new “hot” press when I bought it. I recommend the 650 for people who are starting out as it does have the station for powder check. You will love the customer service from Dillon. I dropped a powder measure and cracked the plastic reservoir. I called Dillon and ordered a new one, told them I dropped the powder measure and when it came there was no charge.
The major difference in progressive verses single stage is time. I can load 50 pistol or rifle rounds in less than 12 min. That is rifle rounds that don’t need filler aka 470 NE 500NE ect. I probley could go faster but am to anal about looking in each case and doing everything carefully. I can’t tell any difference in accuracy from a single stage press when loading rifle or pistol.
Bill

I went with the hornady LNL AP and really love it and they gave me 1000 bullets! that cut the price about in half! and I think that offer is still available!

2 weeks ago, my Hornady Pro-7 (lnl's predecessor) gave up the ghost. Actually, it's the priming system (NB : the weak link of the system) that gave up and went beyond adjustment. I immediately bought a Dillon XL 650 + case feeder and all the caliber conversions I needed. I'm living on a cloud, since. Never met a machine so fast, so smooth and so reliable. I have only one regret, I should have bought the Dillon earlier

2 weeks from the death of your Pro-7 to having your 650 up and running is absolutley amazing! WOW!!

The bullet deal is still available 1000 for the lnl press, and 100 for the dies i think.

I looked at that bullet deal special offer by Hornady. Sweet deal. I imagine the LnL is selling like hot cakes.

Couple more questions if you have time to answer,

I reviewed the Dillon web and see they recommend a Spare Parts Package purchase when you buy a 650. Are both the LnL AP and the XL650 prone to break parts?

Is one worse than the other in regards to replacing parts?

Thanks.

The only reason you need the parts kit for the Dillon is that you don't want to wait for a free replacement to come. They pretty much will replace anything you break at no charge.
These are high volumn machines and I guess there are a few parts that can wear down or maybe are easier to break when you screw up (this has been the case in everything I've broken). I bought the spare parts kit but save for a couple bone-head moves on my part I wouldn't have ever needed it...............................DJ

Thank you DJ.

Dillon lists a carbide sizing die for the .223 and .308. Is a rifle carbide sizing die worth the extra cost? Does anyone else sell carbide rifle sizing dies?

Dillon and Hornady are in a class by themselves.
RCBS is trying hard to catch up.

Lee is not even a contender.

longshot