i havnt been able to find a 5,000 ft lb load for the 375 h&h .is it posssible or even safe ? i figure best way is to detonate a 300 grain bullet at 2800-2900 fps would this be likley in 26" barrel .i dont see the point in the uber rums or 378 base weatherby . i bought a 375 h&h cartidge just to have plan to get a abolt with a sure fire in 2011.i like the way it works you can see the energy ripple through the body and compleey destroy you target . seen this on mountain goats.

Why?

Foot lbs is just a number...

why risk blowing up a rifle, especially when it is in your hands?

and especially a 375 H & H.. there is a lot of powder there to potentially really do some damage to the peripheral surroundings..like your head...

i think thats why i asked lol .

quote:

Originally posted by tk10ga:
i havnt been able to find a 5,000 ft lb load for the 375 h&h .is it posssible or even safe ? i figure best way is to detonate a 300 grain bullet at 2800-2900 fps would this be likley in 26" barrel .i dont see the point in the uber rums or 378 base weatherby . i bought a 375 h&h cartidge just to have plan to get a abolt with a sure fire in 2011.i like the way it works you can see the energy ripple through the body and compleey destroy you target . seen this on mountain goats.

I would say one of the reasons for the RUM's or weatherbys etc other than flatter trajectories, more speed etc is to achieve that 5,000 ft lbs without the rifle sending you to the E.R. or a grave yard

quote:

I would say one of the reasons for the RUM's or weatherbys etc other than flatter trajectories, more speed etc is to achieve that 5,000 ft lbs without the rifle sending you to the E.R. or a grave yard

My .375 RUM
270 gr TSX @ 3043 fps = 5553 fp
300 gr TSX @ 2830 fps = 5334 fp
Both shoot 3 shot MOA @ 200 yds

I've run it up there in the past but I also have a 30" barrel, and this one seems to run a bit quick as it is. 270gr TSX over a good load of Ramshot Hunter put me just over 2900 and about 5100. Ialso ran a load using N550 that was almost identical. This particular rifle has always run a bit fast even for the longer barrel. Any more I run a 300 Hornady a a more sedate 4700 ft lbs, and the rifle groups outstanding with it as well.

I figure if I really want a bigger hammer I want more frontal area to go with it as well.

375 hh? no
under SANE pressure? no
with a hunting length barrel? no
5000 fps? no
5000 ft/lbs? no

in available 375 bullets
5000 ft/lb is
350 at 2535 (not achievable with an HH)
or
300 gr at 2740 (not achievable with an HH)

however, "traditionally" the HH is a 300gr at 2500, and that 4100+ ftlbs has been proven enough for nearly a century.

if you want faster, buy a faster base cartridge

if you want 5000, get at least a 458 winmag..

mostanything you know about mediums is backwards in bigbores .. ME means nothing, other than some way to kinda explain to non-bigbore shooters .. ME impresses those that think a bigbore can "blow" a critter off its feet ..
velocity isn't all its cracked up to be .. most anything past 2300 results in failed bullets in bigbores ... which can result in your death, as things-one-shoots-with-big-bores thend to fight back, and lasting 3-5 seconds longer can mean bad news.

have you shot your 375 as yet?

quote:

Originally posted by seafire/B17G:
why risk blowing up a rifle, especially when it is in your hands? ...

I'm surprised the "Aleged Scam Artist" didn't just make-up a Blue Dot Load for you as he did Red C which caused Red C.'s rifle to Ka-Boom. One of his infamous Blue Dot Loads might even get it to 250,000(psi).

I believe 2750 fps and 5000 ft.# plus could be easily achieved with the 375 H&H with a 300 gr. bullet and done safely with a modern first-rate bolt action rifle. The big bore magnums tend to be under loaded, likely because of early onset "shooter fatigue" (aka., too much kick). This is certainly the case for the 375 H&H AI, where I'm getting 2925 fps with 300 gr. SBTs and safely with long primer pocket life.

I'd suggest trying W760, Re19, VV550, or N204. A 26" barrel would help keep the PSI down. Saeed suggests that 2750 would be about ideal for maximal penetration and buffalo stopping power for the 300 TSX or Walterhog bullets.

Regards, AIU

I have hit 5200 fpe in the 375 Ruger with the 260 Accubond and 5000 fpe with the 270 TSX

RL17

quote:

a 5,000 ft lb load for the 375 h&h .is it posssible or even safe ?

Ya need 2932 FPS and a 300 grain bullet.....

Lets just say this.....for anything I'd want to hunt using this load, I'd much prefer a .378 WBY......something that will do it at reasonable pressure.

quote:

Originally posted by tk10ga:
i havnt been able to find a 5,000 ft lb load for the 375 h&h .is it posssible or even safe ? i figure best way is to detonate a 300 grain bullet at 2800-2900 fps would this be likley in 26" barrel .i dont see the point in the uber rums or 378 base weatherby . i bought a 375 h&h cartidge just to have plan to get a abolt with a sure fire in 2011.i like the way it works you can see the energy ripple through the body and compleey destroy you target . seen this on mountain goats.

Umm, am I reading this correctly that you bought a single cartridge? And now you are wondering how come nobody in the last hundred years has been able to do this (achieve 5,000 ME) frequently or safely?

As mentioned by others, I think you might be better off with getting a different cartridge, especially if you don't have the gun just yet.

Also, at 5K ME you won't be seeing much of the bullet impact. A lot of the sun and stars though!

quote:

Originally posted by tk10ga:
i like the way it works you can see the energy ripple through the body and compleey destroy you target . seen this on mountain goats.

hmm, i didn't read this part of the load...

if i had, i would have known


this guy is the goods, boys...

good old


you have NEVER seen a rifle "compleey destroy" a mountain goat..

not once

To get higher energy readings use lighter bullets. Energy is 1/2 Mass X velocity squared so speed contributes more than weight.

The Barnes 210 grain TSX pushed to 3300 fps would make 5,000 ft lbs but I don't know if the H&H can get that velocity.

I got a nice Mauser in 375H&H IMP. It does that, and I haven't had any feeding issues yet.

Rich

I believe old Roy's 375 Wby mag advertised 5000 ft/lbs?

I have an old German one, but I don't shoot it really. I just stick with my Win 70 in "plain old" H&H. It works just fine.

Apparently you can buy it at the store. 5000 ft.# muzzle energy AMMO is available at Midway USA for the 375 H&H. Guess it can be done.

"DoubleTap Ammunition 375 H&H Magnum 235 Grain Jacketed Soft Point Box of 20.

Known for their high velocity 10mm ammunition, all Double Tap ammunition is loaded for high performance through any firearm. This ammunition is new-production, non-corrosive in boxer-primed, reloadable brass cases.

Advertised Technical Information:

Muzzle Velocity: 3100 fps
Muzzle Energy: 5014 ft. lbs."

Regards, AIU

Heck 5000 is no big deal I can do that with an 06 based case. OK I cheated a little I changed the caliber to .411. I do find it amazing that a 06 based case in a 24" barrel can move a 300 & 350gr bullet fast enough to reach 5000. If I make a habit out of it I do need to find a bullet that will handle 2700fps+ because the 300gr .411 Hornadys become a gray mist on impact.

I wonder how the 235gr in the Double tap would hold up? I sure believe a 270 or 300 at 4950 would work a heck of a lot better than 235s.

Ramrod340, that's hard to believe. What was the load? 375 H&H must pushed hard to get 5000 ft#. AIU

With a 22-250, 40gn Vmax, 40gns Bullseye and a 2000" barrel, I can easily make 5k ftlbs - According to quickload anyway. Might need a tougher action though...

quote:

Originally posted by Ackley Improved User:
Ramrod340, that's hard to believe. What was the load? 375 H&H must pushed hard to get 5000 ft#. AIU

I suspect Ramrod has misplaced a decimal point somewhere....His posts normally are stone solid...

FWIW....I'll just say it.....the .375 H&H can't break 5,000 ft-lb energy in any manner without damaging an action!

First, I figure you’re likely skeptical, but there are already published loads for 375 H&H that are very close to 5000 ft#.

For example, in the Barnes Manual 3, using 84.5 grs. of W760 with a 270 XLC and 24” barrel, the published velocity is 2867, which is over 4900 ft#. Getting 2890 will provide 5000 ft#, and we need to pick up only 23 fps, which IMO is doable (you don’t have to use XLC bullets).

Second, with the right gun, barrel, and loading technique, with a 375 H&H, you should be able to get 2740 fps with a 300 gr. Bullet or 2890 fps with a 270 gr. bullet.

Finally, folks who publish reloading manuals and sell ammunition tend to be quite conservative because of liablility/legal issues.

Regards, AIU

quote:

Ramrod340, that's hard to believe. What was the load? 375 H&H must pushed hard to get 5000 ft#. AIU

Nope didn't drop a decimal point. As I said my 400PDK not a 375. My rifle was originally throated for some 416 bullets I drew down to .410 the cannelure left them at 3.38" .Their shape had very little taper. Also I'm using 06 cylinder brass left at 2.65". A 108-110% load of IMR 4895 will push the fp Hornday 300 close to 2750 with no pressure sign. That is 5000+ I normally load it at 2650 with RL15 and a couple cases are on their 7th or 8th loading. The 300s in the cannelure are 3.24 so they get a running start.

With a 350gr I used speer 350gr 416s and drew them down. Again around 110% case load density of IMR 4895 is just over 2530 wich will calculate right at 5000. This left marks on the head. I'm shooting it around 2450 with the 350s.

Didn't mean to take the 375 a different direction. Just adding a little humor.

If I wanted to kill something that fights back it would be with a 400gr at around 2250 pressure calculated at around 57,000 and ONLY 4483#.

Thanks Ram for the return - interesting stuff.

Has anyone tried this new powder - SUPERFORMANCE - in big bore cartridges? Sounds interesting. Hornady is marketing 375 H&H ammo with "4700 ft#" of energy.

"Hornady Dangerous Game SUPERFORMANCE Ammunition 375 H&H Magnum 270 Grain Spire Point Recoil Proof Box of 20

SUPERFORMANCE ammunition is loaded with proprietary propellants that increase the velocity ratings up to 200 feet per second compared to other popular brands. Because there is no increase in pressure, regardless of the caliber, there is no increase in felt recoil but there IS an increase in efficiency and high speed performance. From sub-zero arctic temperatures to almost unbearable desert heat, SUPERFORMANCE ammunition can withstand any hunting habitat.

The Spire Point - Recoil Proof bullet is simply Hornady's InterLock Spire Point bullet with the unique ring that ensure the core and jacket remain locked together during expansion. The InterLock retains more mass, energy and momentum after impact and transfers that energy to the target. The exposed lead tip is flush with the jacket. The fact that it's Recoil Proof helps large calibers and also assists with premature mushrooming.

Ballistics Information:


Muzzle Velocity: 2800 fps

Muzzle Energy: 4699 ft. lbs."

ummmmmmmmmmmmmmm, can you say "Pipe Bomb?"

This is a video that begs for production.

Rich

Here's another Double Tap 375 H&H commercial offering close to 5000 ft#:

"Double Tap ammunition is made using high quality components and every cartridge is hand inspected for flaws before leaving the factory. The AccuBond is a bonded core bullet that features copper-alloy jacket with its special lead-alloy core. The result is a bullet that flies true, penetrates deep, retains its weight and won't cause extensive barrel fouling, plus it retains 60-70% of its weight. The white polymer tip helps protect against deformation while initiating expansion upon impact. This ammunition is new production, non-corrosive, in boxer primed, reloadable brass cases.

Technical Information

Caliber: 375 H&H Magnum
Bullet Weight: 260 Grains
Bullet Style: Nosler AccuBond Spitzer
Case Type: Brass

Ballistics Information:

Muzzle Velocity: 2900 fps
Muzzle Energy: 4857 ft. lbs."

PS: Quick Load indicates that 5000# is doable with the 375 H&H easily with a 24" barrel and 65,000 PSI max.

Some more detail regarding that Double Tap 375 H&H load.

".375 H&H Magnum 235gr. Barnes TSX Lead Free 20rds. $59.95

A 235gr. Barnes Triple Shock X bullet moving at 3100fps will handle all of your needs from deer to Moose. Flat shooting and amazing bullet performance!

Exterior Ballistics: 200yd. zero
100yds - 1.3" high 2899fps / 4344ft/lbs
200yds - zeroed 2707fps / 3822ft/lbs
300yds - 6.1" low 2523fps / 3321ft/lbs
400yds - 17.6" low 2347fps / 2874ft/lbs
500yds - 35.5" low 2180fps / 2478ft/lbs

Caliber : .375 H&H Magnum

Bullet : 235gr Barnes TSX

Ballistics : 3100fps - 5014 ft./lbs. - 24.0" bbl. Winchester Model 70"

And all this with a relatively "stiff" TSX bullet.

Regards, AIU

quote:

Ballistics : 3100fps - 5014 ft./lbs. - 24.0" bbl. Winchester Model 70"

That is interesting. To get ANY powder in QL to give me 3100 fps with that bullet in a 24" barrel I had to push the pressure to 72,000.

Interesting powder they must be using.

It's quite easy to get a .375 H&H to produce 5,000 f.p.e., or even 6,000 f.p.e. or more !!

Just load some ammo the way we reputedly used to do for out NVA and VC friends. I.e., take a standard cartridge case and fill it with C-4. Seat a bullet in the case. When you chamber the assembled round and pull the trigger,Voila!! LOTS of energy created and released.

Only drawbacks are that 1)the energy is released right in front of your face and between your hands and, 2) the rifle automatically disassembles.

I guess I am missing the point; why is it necessary with this cartridge? Plenty of bigger ones will do so at much lower operating pressures. Perhaps best to keep these rifles operating in the seams they were designed for originally.

I get 2,800 fps with a 300gr bullet from my 26" barreled Rem 798 re-chambered to .375 Wby which is a bit more than 5,200 ft-lbs energy. Not possible to do this safely in an H&H chamber, you need to re-chamber to .375 Weatherby or .375 AI and a 26" barrel also helps.

Ramrod, my version of Quick Load calculates the following:

Cartridge : .375 H.& H. Mag.
Bullet : .375, 300, Nosler AccuBond
Cartridge O.A.L. : 3.650 inch
Barrel Length : 24.0 inch
Maximum Pressure : 65000 psi

Norma MRP 115.3% fill/ 83.8 grs./ 2753 fps/ 65000 /ME ~5050

I've reloaded this cartridge, and I can get 83.8 grs under a 300 gr. Accubond.

Also, if you set the OAL = 3.7" (which will fit in my magazine) and switch to 300 gr Swift A-frames, even more loads producing over 2740 fps will appear. Remember, many 375s have considerable freebore. 3.7" OAL also works for MRP and 235 gr. TSX in QL - all just theory!!

Regards, AIU

quote:

Norma MRP 115.3%

I think I had max load at 110% can't remember. Rerunning with the 235 looking for 3100 Even allowing 115% I'm still over 72,000 for a calcualted 3100. The top 3 loads are around 108& Then about 5 at 115%.

Ramrod,

With QL, settings for OAL, weighting factor, and allowing compression (115% or more over fill) markedly influence results. Over fill allows use of the slow burners like MRP, which works very well in my 375 AI. For example, 95 grs of MRP behind a 300 gr. SBT gets 2935 fps with a 26" barrel = actual measurement (Oehler). And, I have no freebore by design. QL predicts 2915 fps. My case life is great.

Regards, AIU

PS. What's the H2O capacity and OAL of your 400 PDK?

quote:

PS. What's the H2O capacity and OAL of your 400 PDK?

AIU as to QL I know you can override the % fill. I normally set it at 110 for my 380&400PDKs. I know you can approach or reach 115%. One of these days I'm going to really fill my 340 and see what it does.

As to the 400PDK the brass was 06 Cylinder brass with 35Whelen headstamp. The case is left at 2.65". With .410 400gr Hornady DGX the OAL is 3.34" in the cannelure. With the 300gr FP Hornady the OAL is 3.24 or 3.25" can't remember and don't have one handy to measure.

Twice fired, trimed and resized cases volume is 87.5grs of water.

Check out these loads!! Barnes doesn't seem to have any trouble getting the 375 H&H very close and well over 5000 ft#, even up to 5270 ft#. HOLY SHIT!! Their BANDED SOLID smokes - beware DG.

From the Barnes Reloading Manual #4

375 H&H, 24” Barrel

A. 235 gr. TSX

-VN540 83 gr. – 3062 fps/ME=4892 ft#

B. 270 gr. TSX

-VN540 78.5 gr. – 2836 fps/ME=4822 ft#

C. 270 gr. BND SLD

-AA2460 80 gr. – 2885 fps/ME=4990 ft#
-VN540 83.5 gr. – 2965 fps/ME=5270 ft#
-RL 15 80 gr. – 2918 fps/ME=5105 ft#

D. 300 gr. BND SLD

-VN540 80 gr. – 2803 fps/ME=5233 ft#
-RL15 76.5 gr. – 2735 fps/ME=4975 ft#

Regards, AIU

Ramrod, I think you've created a 375 H&H out of '06 brass - impressive. Regards, AIU

quote:

I think you've created a 375 H&H out of '06 brass

except it is .411 not .375.

Now it little brother is a .375 version left at 2.65 and 83.5gr capacity. It will send a 260Accubond downstream at over 2700. Between the two I sold my 375H&H.

Back to the original question. I sure wouldn't get hung up on 5000#

Ramrod, I'm speaking figuratively ("375 H&H") - I know it is not .375. You could make money converting '06's and the like to your 400 PDK. Many would like to hunt DG in Africa, have an '06, but don't want to invest in a 375 just for one trip. How much would you want to convert an '06 to the 400 PDK and supply reloads or dies for reloading? Regards, AIU