I just started loading a few months ago, reloaded about 1000 hand gun rounds with out a hitch at all. Just reloaded 20 rounds for my Remington model 7400 30-06 and the bullet wouldnt even chamber it would stick out almost a 1/4 in. I came home from the range measured and measured again everything is perfect thinking maybe its my gun but i hope thats not it. I have shoot probably 1000 rounds out of this rifle and never even had it jamb up, now this. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated thanks ..

Small base sizing dies are sometimes required for reloading for both pump and semi-auto rifles what type of dies were you using

If the 30-06 round sticks out of the chamber 1/4" are you sure the rifle is a 30-06 and not a .308W? Please don't be insulted but it's a mistake I have seen before.

Also, if the rifle is an '06, are you really FL sizing the cases. With quality dies adjusted correctly I've not seen any rifle that need SB dies in over 40+ years of reloading. Simple check is to see if the sized but not yet loaded cases will chamber and the bolt will close. If not then your FL die should be screwed in the press so the shell holder bumps solidly against the base of the FL die with a sized case in it without the ram camming over.

If the sized cases chamber before loading but not after ward then obviously something is wrong there. Are you crimping the bullets? If so you may be buckling the case at the shoulder or if not you could be doing the same if the seating die is screw in too far and the case mouth hits the crimp part of the die. This will buckle the shoulder if there is not crimp groove for the case mouth to roll into. Get back to us after those checks.

Larry Gibson

did you (over)crimp?

I was thinking neck sizing brass from another rifle. Wasn;t specified whether the brass was from this one rifle only. Overcrimp sounds very possible too.

It can be a few different things, take a sharpie marker and color the entire case and bullet and then chamber it, or try to anyway har har, and then look to see where the marker has rubbed off on either the case or the bullet and that should guide you to where the problem is.

quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy8:
. . . Just reloaded 20 rounds for my Remington model 7400 30-06 and the bullet wouldnt even chamber it would stick out almost a 1/4 in. ..

Lost me here, the bullet is sticking out a quarter inch out of what? Do they fit in the magazine? Or you mean when you try and chamber a loaded round, it's a 1/4" short of the bolt fully closing? That is what I'd guess is the scenario, so would say it is not sized enough to fit the chamber, bullet seated too long and hitting rifling, or a crimp is affecting the neck.

After reloading rounds, I always chamber them at home just to "make sure" they fit Waidmannsheil, Dom.

Over crimping, setting the shoulder back during resizing, wrong dia bullet, to long of neck causing a bulge when setting the bullet are all things that could cause it.

Ive got a 300 win. Browning auto that likes some crimp. Its an RCBS small base die. I just keep screwing down the die till theyll go. It dont effect the accuracy. It shoots .5 in. groups with 180s. Do the same thing with my auto pistols. Its not brain surgery.

quote:

Originally posted by gunner350:
Small base sizing dies are sometimes required for reloading for both pump and semi-auto rifles what type of dies were you using

thats an easy way to avoid problems-- use small base dies.

I had an original pre-war M70 "National Match" .30-06 (Marksman-style stock, standard barrel) which would feed and chamber ammo perfectly when using GI 172,173, 174 grain bullets. BUT, it acted just like you are describing when I tried to feed it ammo loaded with 168 grain Sierra match bullets seated to the same OAL.

In that rifle's case, it was the combination of the way the throat was cut and the way the ogive was shaped on the Sierra bullets. They simply were too fat to go all the way into the throat when the bullets were seated to the the same OAL length so...the bolt simply would NOT close. Rather than alter an original M-70 NM rifle, I traded it for something I would enjoy just as much but could use without alteration. It was easier than loading and keeping seperate two different lengths of cartridges.

(I doubt it is the problem with your rifle, but one never can tell until they check EVERYTHING.)

Best of luck finding a cure.

If you are using a bulky powder--Imr 4350 or 4831---at close to max charge, your bullets may be "growing" due to a compressed charge. I learned this first hand w/ the 06 Imr 4831 and TBBC 180s. They grew just enough to where they would chamber, but if I did not shoot the round and tried to unload the rifle, the bullet would stick in the throat.

Thanks for everyones input so far i am going to try some things tonight and see if i can get some answers on my own with your suggestions. Just for some specs i resized all of my federal casing and resized with my lee fl sizing die, used winchester lrg rifle primers and charged with alliant reloader 19 , and used 150 gr. hornady sp bullets. I did try when i got home if the casing alone resized with no bullet would chamber and it did the exact same thing it did with the bullet. The rounds fit great in the mag but as soon as it injects into chamber action never closes all the way and then to open the chamber i had to literally hit it with a hammer and a rag to open it back up to remove the round. Thank you all again for the ideas i am very thankful for a site like this to help people like myself out ...

Oh one other thing i did use my lee factory crimp die and crimp into the cannelure lightly not much at all definitly not enought to push the shoulder back.

Lots of good advice, but you need to start a system of elimination to find your specific problem.

I recommend:

1. Measure the cartridge overall length of several of your loaded rounds. Is it less than the recommended OAL of the particular bullet used (in the loading manual. If it is more (which I doubt because the 7400 is clip fed and does not tolerate "long" rounds) you can try re-seating several bullets deeper and see if they chamber.

2. Run your fingers along the case right at where the shoulder begins. Can you feel or see a slight "bulge"? If so then you have probably over-crimped (seating die set too far down). The pressure of apply the crimp has shoved the entire bullet/neck down into the case creating the bulge. There is no "fix" for this. You can pull the bullets and salvage the bullets and powder, but the cases are ruined.

3. If there is no bulge, then pull several bullets and measure your overall case length. Does it exceed 2.494 inches. If so then it is possible that your loaded rounds are jamming into the throat of your chamber. If you have a 1/4 inch chambering problem -- this is unlikely but it could be possible. If so, then you need to pull your bullets, empty your powder, and trim your cases to under 2.494 then re-fill the powder and reseat the bullets.

4. If none of the above problems exist, then pull some of your bullets anyway and empty the powder and see if the cases will chamber without the bullets in them. If they can not be chambered, then you can take the depriming pin out of your full length die spindel and try screwing the die tighter to set back the shoulder. (Normal procedure is to raise your ram all the way to the top, then screw the resizing die in until it just touches the top of the shell-holder. Lower the ram and give the die 1/8th more turn.) If after resizing the case with this setting, and it still does not fit, then you go to SD dies. (Or you can save some money and just run a bastard file or grinding-stone over the top of your shell-holder to reduce its height a couple thousands of an inch and allow the case to enter the resizing die more fully.)

Lastly, if you have some factory 06 rounds still laying around and you have some rounds that were fired in your rifle but not resized (from the same manufacture/lot) you can also try measuring the case head (just in front of the web) of the unfired and fired round to see if you might have an excessive case head expansion problem.

But before doing all this, find an experience rifle reloader near you and work with him, having him watch your reloading procedures.

Hope this helps

Barstooler

quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy8:
Thanks for everyones input so far i am going to try some things tonight and see if i can get some answers on my own with your suggestions. Just for some specs i resized all of my federal casing and resized with my lee fl sizing die, used winchester lrg rifle primers and charged with alliant reloader 19 , and used 150 gr. hornady sp bullets. I did try when i got home if the casing alone resized with no bullet would chamber and it did the exact same thing it did with the bullet. The rounds fit great in the mag but as soon as it injects into chamber action never closes all the way and then to open the chamber i had to literally hit it with a hammer and a rag to open it back up to remove the round. Thank you all again for the ideas i am very thankful for a site like this to help people like myself out ...

Have you tried using a magic marker over the entire bullet and brass yet? It will show you exactly where the hang up is. Otherwise we can guess that you have a tight chamber and need some small base dies, or the bullet you have is too long or has to abrupt an ogive, or that you are buckling the case neck slightly, or the case shoulder is too far forward and needs the die tightened down more, or maybe a little ground off the shellholder.

In short, it can be a lot of things and you can make stab-in-the-dark guesses or you can take a round and color it with something and in a few seconds actually see where it is binding. Or at that point if you see the marks on the case but still can't figure it out you can at least post some close ups of the shell and most likely someone here can explain what is happening.

quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy8:
Thanks for everyones input so far i am going to try some things tonight and see if i can get some answers on my own with your suggestions. Just for some specs i resized all of my federal casing and resized with my lee fl sizing die, used winchester lrg rifle primers and charged with alliant reloader 19 , and used 150 gr. hornady sp bullets. I did try when i got home if the casing alone resized with no bullet would chamber and it did the exact same thing it did with the bullet. The rounds fit great in the mag but as soon as it injects into chamber action never closes all the way and then to open the chamber i had to literally hit it with a hammer and a rag to open it back up to remove the round. Thank you all again for the ideas i am very thankful for a site like this to help people like myself out ...

I think you've found the problem. Small base dies for your particular rifle.

Jeremy, This deal has me thinking because my browning wouldnt feed at one time either. Something I went to was protected point bullets not lead. Lead was dragging up the feed ramp. It would feed better with a fast burning powder. I shot 4064. Not the best powder in a 300 mag. The thing that finally fixed mine was I sent my small base die back to rcbs. They sent me a new one. It wasnt pushing the shoulders back enough. So it might be your die. Good luck, Doug

quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy8:
........... I did try when i got home if the casing alone resized with no bullet would chamber and it did the exact same thing it did with the bullet. The rounds fit great in the mag but as soon as it injects into chamber action never closes all the way and then to open the chamber i had to literally hit it with a hammer and a rag to open it back up to remove the round. Thank you all again for the ideas i am very thankful for a site like this to help people like myself out ...

The problem then is the case is not getting sized enough or it is longer now and needs to be trimed. What is the length of the case after sizing? It may need to be trimmed.

If the case is not too long then perhaps you are not sizing the case enough. Does the shell holder hit the base of the full length die when sizing without the ram camming over? If not then screw the die in until the shell holder bumps solidly against the die when the case is sized. Do that and try chambering the empy sized case (it may still need triming).

Larry Gibson

ok tonight i sharpied the whole bullet casing and bullet and gently put into the chamber so it had no feed marks and closed the chamber full speed .. whammm stuck like a muther f"er finally got the bullet out and the body of the casing was rubbed all the way around all the way from the shoulder to about 1/4 in from the base about where the chamber doest shut completly and also around the bullet just above the crimp. I am going to mess with the dies a little tonight and pick up some factory ammo tommorow and see what happens with that. man i was so pumped with my success loading up about 300 38 and 357 rounds hell that was cake this is tought with the big rifle rounds haha . thanks for everyones imput i am sure i will find the problem soon.

i think you could fast track this to a solution with one thing. PICS! there are guys here that could probably figure this out for you, and relieve your frustration in mere seconds, literally, if they could see a pic or two.

OFF TOPIC..if deleted, so be it and i apologize.
BARSTOOLER...... u say ur BEVERAGE O CHOICE is Jermiah Weed. what is that? i have used FORTY CREEK for a few years but getting tired of it and CROWN. thanks

you ain't sizing the case enough.

Your not sizing the case enought.....

In my experience with both the Rem 760 and the 7400 you must use a small base sizing die otherwise the cases will not chamber.

Not sure why Remington makes these chambers small but they been doing it for decades on the pumps and semi's.

That aint all bad. A tight chamber shoots more accurate.

quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy8:
ok tonight i sharpied the whole bullet casing and bullet and gently put into the chamber so it had no feed marks and closed the chamber full speed .. whammm stuck like a muther f"er finally got the bullet out and the body of the casing was rubbed all the way around all the way from the shoulder to about 1/4 in from the base about where the chamber doest shut completly and also around the bullet just above the crimp. I am going to mess with the dies a little tonight and pick up some factory ammo tommorow and see what happens with that. man i was so pumped with my success loading up about 300 38 and 357 rounds hell that was cake this is tought with the big rifle rounds haha . thanks for everyones imput i am sure i will find the problem soon.

Obviously the case is not being sized enough. When sizing does the shell holder bump solidly against the bottom of the die without the ram camming over? If not screw the die in fartehr until the shell holder bumbs solidly against the die bottem and try a case sized then.

If that doesn't cure the problem then a new die is needed. I suggest the RCBS X-die as then you'll not have to trim and case life will be much longer.

Larry Gibson

First off i would like to appologize for wasting everyones time!! I am officially flat out ignorent, I markered up a whole bullet like i said and it has just baffled me with all the marks on it . So i was just down strairs and whiped out the instructions and my book i noticed one huge problem ?? I WAS USING THE FREAKIN COLLET NECK DIE NOT THE FULL LENGTH DIE !! God i feel like an idiot , dont have a clue why i didnt notice that last week. But i stuck the fl die in the press lubed 3 casings and sized them threw them in the chamber smooth as silk, gunna make some rounds toight to shoot in the morning this time hopefully with no hook ups. Once again thank you everyone for all the ideals and suggestions i guess common sense was the missing piece in this puzzle. lol

Jeremy,

Hey don't worry about making mistakes, everyone does that. What you do need to be complimented on is that you figured out what your problem was!

it's called experience.
this lesson was cheap.
you'll remember it while you pull all those rounds down and most likely everytime you get the die set out.

Don't sweat it, I've pulled a bullet or two lol!

A mind can be a terrible thing to lose.....anyone seen mine

As they say **it happens!!!


Larry Gibson

Jeremy, At least you admitted it. Alot of peoples egos are so big they cant admit making a mistake.

Mid burning rate powders work best in the Rem. autos . IMR 4064 and 4895 are good ones , the slower powders tend to batter the action more than needed .

quote:

Originally posted by medic883:
Don't sweat it, I've pulled a bullet or two lol!

+1

I've even manged to make a ballacks of pulling the bullets on the rounds I ballacksed up in the first place!

quote:

Originally posted by john c.:
OFF TOPIC..if deleted, so be it and i apologize.
BARSTOOLER...... u say ur BEVERAGE O CHOICE is Jermiah Weed. what is that? i have used FORTY CREEK for a few years but getting tired of it and CROWN. thanks

http://www.jeremiahweed.com/

http://www.check-six.com/lib/Drinks/JeremiahWeed.htm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bqx2wIQtKo

Bourbon Liquour. Keep it in the freezer, pour it cold and enjoy.

Barstooler

quote:

Originally posted by Jeremy8:
ok tonight i sharpied the whole bullet casing and bullet and gently put into the chamber so it had no feed marks and closed the chamber full speed .. whammm stuck like a muther f"er finally got the bullet out and the body of the casing was rubbed all the way around all the way from the shoulder to about 1/4 in from the base about where the chamber doest shut completly and also around the bullet just above the crimp. I am going to mess with the dies a little tonight and pick up some factory ammo tommorow and see what happens with that. man i was so pumped with my success loading up about 300 38 and 357 rounds hell that was cake this is tought with the big rifle rounds haha . thanks for everyones imput i am sure i will find the problem soon.

I can tell you right now its the Lee dies, Lee makes their dies with the most minimum head space, had to send my Lee 06 dies back to them so they could trim the bottom of the resizing dies a few thousands so my brass would fit like a factory cartridge would fit, loaded some shells for my bro in law and he told me some of them wont chamber in his 7400, I did somewhere along the lines buy some extra Redding 06 dies for another reason, but really dont need them anymore since my Lee dies have been adjusted properly. I do not believe in buying small base dies for auto or pump guns, never had any issues loading for them myself. Call Lee and tell them your problem, they'll be glad to help. You may need new dies, though.

Keep a set of lee dies over Redding or RCBS I don't think so.

One thing about lee dies they make great decoy weights.

quote:

Originally posted by Hunt-ducks:
Keep a set of lee dies over Redding or RCBS I don't think so.

One thing about lee dies they make great decoy weights.

When they allow me to shoot my model 70 like this, damn right Ill keep them.





Oh btw, that .843" group was shot at 300yds.

Small base dies allow the head area to be squeezed down a couple of thousandths without moving the shoulder more than needed ! Every now and then I find a semi or pump chamber that requires the use of small base dies . Probably the last ones cut with a reamer that's going out of spec. , so they are a little tight . If I buy dies to load a semi exclusively , they'll be small base , might not be needed but won't hurt a thing !