I have tried the premiums on game such as the Swift Aframe and didn't really care for them. I am convinced that for 99% of you big game hunting the Hornandy will serve you fine.

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www.rifleshooter.com

quote:

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Originally posted by Don Krakenberger:
Has anyone tried cutting one apart and figuring it out??

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If you go to their website, you can see cutaway views there.

What makes the SST so good is that they took a proven performer (the Interlock) and simply topped it with a polymer tip. So simple and obvious, it's brilliant.

Also, once you see the price of the Hornady's, you'll likely start to resent Nosler a bit. Oh, the price per box is close, but Nosler only gives you 50 bullets, vice Hornady's 100.

RSY

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JD

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

Last year I took my .375 H&H to South Africa on a game ranch hunt. I used the Hornady 300 grain Interlock round nose loaded to about 2480 fps (chronographed). I took two Impala, a Warthog and a very nice Gemsbok (about 450 lb). Just last August I went on a two day meat hunt at a ranch here in Texas. I took an Eland yearling bull (about 350 lb) and two feral hogs. Again, the ol' .375 H&H with the Hornady 300 gr RN did the job.
IMHO, and admittedly with my very limited experience, the .375, 300 gr RN Hornady will not give the penetration that the super premiums will. For this reason, I try to watch the angle of my shots and refuse to take an extreme rear angle shot on heavier game (like the Gemsbok). But for all around use, I find the Hornady is a good choice. With a frontal shot, it penetrated about 36 inches of my Warthog, front to back, when I shot it from about 15 yards. Classic mushroom and it held together well.

-BOB

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NRA Life member

"Anyone have the real story??"

Chalk it up to low expectations.

Sorry, couldn't resist.

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"A strong body makes a strong mind. As to the species of exercise, I advise
the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness,
enterprise and independence to the mind. Games played with the ball and
others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character
on the mind. Let your gun therefore be the constant companion of your walks."
Thomas Jefferson

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Frank

Sometimes we are our own worst enemies though because we use the word PREMIUM to describe bullets that have been slightly improved and marketing research would say that we are likewise willing to pay PREMIUM dollars for what is actually a product improvement not warranting the price differences we are seeing at the counter.

These discussions about bullets are important to me because they tell me that shooters still have a good sense of what true good value is.

Considering all this, I am not very comfortable with what I see happening in the bullet world today. The bullets are being improved as well they should be, but bullet manufacturers are pushing the pricing envelope and are spending alot of money on marketing with a end goal of getting us to accept that higher prices for bullet improvements is not only reasonable, but to be expected. Additionally, the prices for these improvements is, I believe, being based more on what YOU are willing to PAY according to your thinking, rather than what it would cost to simply improve their products and then passing along only those costs warranted by the improvements. Actually most of the product improvement costs are not that great as far as what any additionaly cost would and should be as far as product improvements are concerned.

You may note....that none of the major bullet manufacturers have gone broke over the years. None of them have merged to lower costs to stay competitive. You do not see them being influenced to any great degree by pressures that have forced manufacturers of other products to constantly examine their cost structures such that they improve their products AND keep their product prices competitively low. Again, this is my opinion....but having owned one bullet company and partnered in another, and this is the view I am left with.

It is the American way and I accept that but I also believe that when I see prices spiraling up as they seem to be, in the name of PREMIUM products, that it is also the American way that new manufacturers WILL start to emerge with good common sense bullet products with improvements over the older designs.....at good common sense prices

Anybody want to start a bullet company?

Kind regards all, and thank be that we have forums like this where once in awhile shooters such as I, can shoot our mouths off. Once in awhile it feels good, especially if we think someone actually listens, even though they may not exactly agree.

Paul Prochko

The forum respondents were discussing Hornady bullets, their quality and price increases for product improvements. No mention of bargain basement bullets.

You singled out Nosler and I would also add the manufacturer of the "combined technology" bullets in the black box, which I priced at $28.00 per box per 50 today.

Actually Don, our US made hunting bullets are rather low tech. For high tech bullets check out those designed by and for the military.

What some of the bullet companies are doing is trying to garner greater market share with more "premium" and "high tech" marketing hoopla and that is costing us all more. They are attempting to convince the shooting public that minor bullet improvements are worth "premium" prices! The reason some of us are sensitive to that is we spend huge amount on bullets every year and paying for marketing hype is not our idea of a good time. Between my highpower and Silhouette competition alone I spent over $700.00 last year for bullets, not to mention my general shooting and hunting. I expect good value for the dollar and in some cases we are seeing more hype than solid value for the shooting dollar.

The bullet companies have fared rather well compared to industry in general in this country and no one, not I nor anyone else is suggesting that they should live as starving companies. I don't know where you got that idea.

You mentioned Gerard of GS Custom bullets. I am not sure why in this contex, but I would point out the following:

Gerard is manufacturing a bullet patterned after a design more common to military applications. He is manufacturing to extremely close tolerances and necessarily using equipment (due to the driving bands) not capable of the volume obtainable from typical bullet manufacturing equipment. Considering all this he is really holding the line on cost and his bullets are a bargain !! If you doubt that, check out the price of bullets (of similar type manufacturer) from Lost River Bullet Technologies.

more later.....

Paul Prochko

We have taken antelope deer and elk and we never ever had a failure. Some of these shots were very close including the 180 BT 308 out of a Norma mag and the 270 gr out of my 378 WBY MAG both at very close range at huge elk.

The only bullet out of the ones listed that I was not entirely satisfied with its performance is the 162 Bt 7mm at 3000 fps+ mv. This bullet has taken deer antelope and elk and works great at long range, but at closer range I prefer something stouter. In my humble opinion the 154 Sp will do better.

Cutrrently in my whole arsenal I use Hornadies for every single gun save two. 180gr Sciroccos in my 300 Ultra, and 270 Failsafe and Barnes XLC in my 378 Wby MAG.

Bottom line...great workin man's bullet!

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"If she won't shoot MOA or better... out she goes!"

[This message has been edited by POP (edited 11-25-2001).]

There is one slight downside to them, though. The geometry of the nose is more nearly conical than most other brands. That shifts weight slightly farther back, and, in my guns, makes for a shorter COL before the bullet contacts the lands. In my Browning '06, I have to use .1" shorter COL. So the net is that you have two factors making for slightly less case capacity, and slightly lower muzzle velocities.

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Shane Marquardt

That said,
I shot a really big Badger here in Utah with a 150 gr Hornady something cheap off the shelf bullet (30-06 gun) went in the front part of the neck above the chest and right out clean about 1" from his asshole. (Insert jokes here) I was about 100yds away.
Next I had a 130 gr Hornady cheap bullet I shot a coyote in the neck about 75 yds. I must have hit it right in the neck bones because I detached the head off it's body,I kid you not, found it about 10 feet away
So there..

Dane V

I have been using Hornady Spire Points and Speer Grand Slams recently, and both of these bullets are giving me about 85% weight retained. The bullets don't look as perfect as do the premiums I have recovered (which usually retain about 95% and look like magazine photos).

Accuracy is also good from my hunting rifles.

I guess I would label them as "good enough". Remember the Chinese proverb that the excellent is the enemy of the good.

IIRC the secant ogive design used on the Spire Point gives a shorter bullet shank in contact with the bore, and a bit more muzzle velocity from lower bore friction.

jim

jim

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"if you are to busy to
hunt, you are too busy."

I like Hornady's Light Magnum performance
in my 6.5x55 Ruger M77. But like you I have
found an inordinate number of cracked cases
after firing. They start at the base of the
neck and extend down onto the shoulder of
the cartridge. Given the relatively modest
pressures that the Light Magnum is generating
in the Swede, I don't believe that the cracks
are the result of a pressure problem. These
are new cartridges fired right out of the
box. I have not encountered similar problems
with cases from Remington or Winchester that
I have fired with some pretty stiff reloads.
This is a manufacturing problem.

Regards, Royce

I read somewhere,(think it was in rifle shooter), that Hornady uses 5% antimony lead in the SST. That coupled with the interlock and cannelure limits expansion and aids in weight retention.

Paul, I disagree to the point of bullet companies charging more that they should to cover advancements in bullet design. R&D departments can gobble up huge amounts of money before a new design hits the market. How would we know about the new bullets if they don't advertise? The exception to this is of course Nozler. They quit selling ballistic bombs by the 100, went to boxes of 50, but kept the price the same.

I quit using the ballistic bombs last year after numerous fragmentation failures in medium sized whitetail. Went with the then new 139 SST for my .280 and my son's 7-08. The kid got a 140# doe at about 150 yds. with a muzzle vel. of 2850. It sounded like you hit it with a 2x6 board in the chest. Damage inside the chest cavity was incredible, entrance and exit wounds were about the same size.

This year I got the new 300 WSM. I started right off with the 165 SST, tried some 180 SST's but settled on the 165's. No luck with testing them on game this year, no shots yet. On targets they are quite accurate. A few groups under an inch but the load I settled on shoots one inch consistently at 3125 fps. Going out tomorrow for a late "T" zone hunt, may still get a shot.

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if you run, you just die tired