Thought it might be fun to load some Blue Dot in my CZ 527 221 FireBall.

I have 40,45 and 50 gr bullets. Any load data would be appreciated!

Thanks

Look for Seafire's load determination method here or search the web for Calhoun BD loads in the 223 and follow the method there.

You will be between 10 and 14 gr of Blue Dot

I have used Blue Dot in a .223 and a .22 Hornet and it works well in both, so I would see no reason that it won't do equally well in your Fireball, which sits roughly halfway between the two in case capacity. As the previous post indicates, around 10 grains sounds like a good starting point, but I would be cautious jumping up as high as 14 grains without carefully monitering pressures and velocities as you work up.

In my opinion, Blue Dot is not appropriate for attempting to match "factory" ballistics in centerfire rifles, but rather to create accurate and consistent medium-powered loads that are easy on the barrel, the ears, and the pocketbook.

In a fireball, I'd recommend starting out at about 8 grains... and I would consider max to be in about the 12 grains range, maybe even less....for velocity, I'd consider bullet weights from 50 on down... the Speer 50 grain TNT or the 50 GR Ballistic Tip would be my first two choices......I do feel 14 grains would be too hot for that smaller case...( Sorry Clark)

The 40 grain Ballistic Tip, the 40 grain Sierra HP would also be two of my first choices....Calhoon's 37, 42 and 46 grain HPs would also be good choices...

The 35 grain V max, isn't that long of a bullet, and I have tried them in a 223, and they sucked for any range to them....

I keep thinking about building a Fireball, but when I do, I convince myself, that a shortened 223, can be duplicated with a lighter 223 load....in fact, fireball data in my 223s, have given the same results...

keep us posted....

Thanks guys. I will give this a try and let you know.

Seafire,
Yeah, 14 gr is real hot, but I still think he will wind up between 10 and 14 gr, maybe at the bottom end
And I can't tell you how happy I am that you got me started loading .223 with Blue Dot


I load .223s with Blue Dot so I won't have to buy a .221.

The .221 adantage is:
1) less powder
2) less noise
3) your friends don't have one.

The .223 advantage [for me] is that:
1) 10,000 pieces of .223 brass are in my basement
2) 4 rifles in .223 I already have
3) Forster, Wilson, RCBS, and Lee dies I already have in .223
4) I have a custom .250" neck .223 reamer.
5) If I ever needed more power than the .221, the .223 could do it, but that has not happened yet.

quote:

Originally posted by tnekkcc:
(sic)
The .221 adantage is:
1) less powder
2) less noise
3) your friends don't have one.

(sic)

Are points 1 and 2 really valid when loading the 223 with blue dot?

I've wanted a 22 hornet for years, but see no need for one when a 223 becomes a hornet with blue dot, and I don't have to deel with 22 hornet brass issues.

What I really need is a few more 223's

Yes,
The same bullet going the same veloicty will take less powder and make less noise with the .221, becuase of the increased expansion ratio and thus increased efficiency and less muzzle pressure and sourced gas.

Paul,

I have found that a lot of load data for a 221 Fireball, when used in a rifle in 223, will yield the same results over the chronograph....

quote:

Originally posted by seafire/B17G:
Paul,

I have found that a lot of load data for a 221 Fireball, when used in a rifle in 223, will yield the same results over the chronograph....

Quite understandable when you consider there is only so much energy that can be transfered. What's this Clark thing?roger

quote:

What's this Clark thing?roger

I am not sure, you have to consult with Tnekkcc for the answer to that question....

quote:

Originally posted by seafire/B17G:
Paul,

I have found that a lot of load data for a 221 Fireball, when used in a rifle in 223, will yield the same results over the chronograph....

and I suppose one can assume the same would hold true for the 222 case?...I have 221 and 223 and have a 222 enroute.....

Rembo,

PM me and I will be happy to forward you load data on Blue Dot for the 223... the 222 will be awfully close.. just have to start a little lower than max and just work up..

I think you will like the results..

cheers
seafire

Seafire, I'll take some of that .223 data if you don't mind. Blue Dot sounds interesting for the 223

I found out about Blue Dot from Seafire in 2004, and loaded up a few hundred of .223 in 60 gr, 13 gr:
13 gr 2500 fps [usable]
14 gr 2600 fps
15 gr 2700 fps

Lately I have been loading 33 gr, 15 gr:
15 gr 3650 fps [usable]
18 gr 4100~4200 fps [half show pressure sign]

I just shot 50 rounds of 46 gr, 15 gr, and 3/50 had pressure sign


What does it all mean?
For the lightest bullet in 223, 33 gr., takes 15 gr Blue Dot.
For the heaviest bullet in .223, 60 gr., takes 13 gr of Blue Dot.
Bullets in between are going to take loads somewhere between 13 gr and 15 gr.

bump to top

tried Blue Dot in my CZ 527 chambered in 221 Fireball

here's my chrony results

50 grain Speer TnT, CCI 400 primer

4.0 - 1274 fps
4.5 - 1347 fps
5.0 - 1467 fps
5.5 - 1633 fps
6.0 - 1770 fps
6.5 - 1880 fps
7.0 - 1981 fps
7.5 - 2031 fps
8.0 - 2148 fps
8.5 - 2255 fps

Didnt really pay much attention to accuracy as I was just trying to work up the velocity. Seems like it will shoot around 1.25" groups at 100

BTT again after a search for specific info . . .

quote:

Originally posted by todbartell:
Didnt really pay much attention to accuracy as I was just trying to work up the velocity.

What velocity were you "searching" for?

I've been debating a K-Hornet vs Fireball barrel purchase. Can't load up the K-Hornet much above the "regular" Hornet, but you can load down the Fireball. Suppose you can load down the 223 or 222 also, but that's not my style.

I'll be loading down the Fireball once I get it. Mostly for headshots on small edible game under 75 yds, but have the flexibility to stretch it out a bit more.

Never liked Hornet brass much.

I used to have a bookmark to a treatise on reduced loads using flake powder. Author was using a lot of Unique and W231 IIRC. Need to dredge that one up.

I think I can go below book loads with 4895 and RL7 to find my happy place.