Hi Folk,

does anyone know a reason why I should not clean the lube off my sized brass by rolling it about in acetone? It works great and flashes dry very quickly but I've never heard mention of it's use before.

In fact I clean just about everything in my gun room with the stuff. Maybe I just like the smell

I can imagine acetone would get rid of lube in pretty quick order. It is pretty poisonous stuff, though, so make darn sure the area in which you use it is VERY well ventilated. In fact, only use it outside!!

- mike

very very very bad idea...
change lubes, don't use acetone for ANYTHING except meal prep for soldering or bluing.

quote:

does anyone know a reason why I should not clean the lube off my sized brass by rolling it about in acetone?

Acetone has the solvency and fast drying qualities you mention so it will certerainly remove oil based case lubes very well.

Potential problems are that it will damage skin by removing oils too! It will soften/remove oil and lacquer based finishes on your guns, bench and tools as well. The fumes in concentration are poisonus and easily combustible too.

Let me suggest you consider using mineral spirits ("oderless" paint thinner) or denatured alcohol instead. They're almost as effective, even if a bit slower to evaporate, but MUCH less flammible, less toxic and less expensive to use. (I use alcohol. I have a line from my garage air compressor at the bench and use an air gun to dry cases inside and out, NOW!)

Or, even better, maybe consider tossing your greasy lube pad and just use a wax type case lube, Imperial or Unique. Apply it with your finger tips as you pick up each case then wipe off the excess with a paper towel lightly wetted with alcohol.

Unique is great, no need to wash. Just wipe or roll with an towel.

I keep a spray can of Birchwood Casey Gunscrubber handy, and wipe the Imperial and graphite off cases after sizing them. It a degreaser that isn't harmful like Acetone.

instead of the gunscrubber try brake cleaner - same stuff - much cheaper

quote:

Originally posted by butchloc:
instead of the gunscrubber try brake cleaner - same stuff - much cheaper

NOT better than acetone

guys, really, all light organics are BAD NEWS, especially those designed to be solvents.

all, repeat, ALL, hydrocarbon sovents are bad news .. some worse than others .. naptha - BAD, acetone, very bad, MEK, you are kidding right?

try to change your process to not need so much solvents.

if you MUST, just must, wipe off cases, use windex or a dry cloth.

switch lube, use lanolin, leave it on ...

Also remember that with acetone, you need to worry about combustion. The used towels, cloths or whatever have to be properly handled. I would not use acetone anywhere near primers that were stored!! Sound like a Ka-boom waiting to happen.

If Windex still has ammonia in it, I wouldn't use it on my brass. I also would not leave my cases lubed, especially when firing them in my break-open Encores and Contenders. The lubed case will not grip the walls of the chamber and will exert MUCH greater backthrust on the breechface.

I tumble mine clean in corn cob media. Doesn't take long and no chemicals are involved.

Well I will certainly echo what Jeffeoso said, Acetone in particular is bad juju for you, and your stuff. It is WAY overkill for cleaning lube off of cases. There are a bunch of 'green' solvents, like simple green, or Windexes without ammonia...as others have suggested, I simply use Imperial Wax, and it wipes off with just a dry towel. I know it isn't as simple as using a pad for a large number of cases to many folks, but I am almost as fast with it after having used it for several years.

I've used a lot of Acetone in golf related endeavors, it is bad stuff, wish I hadn't used so much for reasons I won't go into, but it ain't good for humans!

Remove case lube with a paper towel. Period. There's no lube inside the case. If there is you're doing it wrong.

Exterior lube is "lube" -- You use it in your dies. It won't damage your firearms. Wipe off the excess and know your cases are "lubed."

And the brass doesn't need to be polished like a belt buckle for the IG either.

I personally wouldn't worry about acetone at all with some care. I'm far more concerned with lead exposure durring processing cases. Just use in a well ventilated area. My biggest concern would be the fire risk as it is extremely volatile and combustible. It is my understanding that it is one of the safer organic solvents (by the way, whisky is one of those scary organic solvents). MEK and carbon tetrachloride (which I don't think is even available through normal retail stores) are the real bad ones. Years ago in organic chem classes, I was always told that whatever was dissolved in the acetone was likely more dangerous to you as the acetone would carry it right into your skin. In any case we all would agree to do your best to keep it off you and it is best to mess with it outdoors away from sources of combustion. It sure will take residue/oil off things in a hurry.

Wes

Mineral spirits.

I used to chase the mosquito fogging trucks in the old days. That mist of DDT was cool on those muggy evenings. We used Chlordane in our vegetable gardens. We used 55 gal. barrels of carbon tet and triclour to degrease the parts we made in the early 60s-70s.
I'm probably dead and don't know it.
Butch

I didn’t like using acetone any more than I have too even though I go through 10-15 gallons of it a year. You may want to give denatured alcohol a try. It’s a pretty good degreaser, it’s not nearly as hard on your skin, and doesn’t melt your protective gloves as fast as acetone does. Mineral spirit leaves behind it’s own oily residue.

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
I used to chase the mosquito fogging trucks in the old days. That mist of DDT was cool on those muggy evenings. We used Chlordane in our vegetable gardens. We used 55 gal. barrels of carbon tet and triclour to degrease the parts we made in the early 60s-70s.
I'm probably dead and don't know it.
Butch

Maybe not dead, but it has definitely affected your mind!!

Just kidding!

quote:

Originally posted by mho:
I can imagine acetone would get rid of lube in pretty quick order. It is pretty poisonous stuff, though, so make darn sure the area in which you use it is VERY well ventilated. In fact, only use it outside!!

- mike

Actually Acetone is the same health risk as Ethanol it's a "1" in the blue segment of the Health/fire diamond (Look up "NFPA 704")

Methanol OTOH rates a "3" in the health section
Bad shit.



as I pointed out to me by one of the engineers who stopped and took the time to "lecture me" on the dangers of Acetone (this back in the mid-80's when I was working at Allied Chemical)
I replied that Acetone isn't NEARLY as toxic as you seem to think it is... after all, Acetone is one of the fatigue poisons that is actually produced by the human body...

I CHOSE to use acetone to do the cleaning job I was doing because I refused to work with the solvent that had originally been suggested "MEK"
(Methyl Ethyl Ketone) which has that distinct "I'm gonna kill you" aroma)
MEK while "Bad shit" rates only a "1" ecause it evaporates and disperses methanol is readily absorbed and is toxic in several ways.

Frankly THE danger of acetone is it's obscenely low flash point. (-17'C)

As for toxic, yes it is, which is why for things like "Nail Polish remover" it has been replaced by another compound that works as well
has a higher flashpoint and is less toxic, but perversely smells the same so people generally don't know that the mfg's switched solvents on them.... Ethyl Acetate (Flashpoint -4'C)

Though Ethyl Acetate rates a 4 on the fire diamond compared to Acetone's 3 this is due to it's higher vapor pressure, it evaporates faster, but it also disperses faster and has narrower explosion limits.

What we know as "Mineral Spirits" is more technically described as "Deodorized Low volotility high flashpoint Kerosene", ain't that a mouthful?

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
if you MUST, just must, wipe off cases, use windex or a dry cloth.

switch lube, use lanolin, leave it on ...

Windex contains ammonia.

ammonia is probably the worst thing to get near brass cases.

Frankly I personally soap and water wash the lube off my cases

I want them CLEAN

And I use waterbased lube in the first place...

enough dealing with the "Chicken little" alarmist posts above...

Ok, the OP wanted a "good reason", here are several

1)It isn't necissary.
2)Soap and water is less risky
3)Acetone IS toxic, just not AS toxic as some of the uneducated weenie posters above seem to think it is, and there are common chemicals that are far MORE toxic



AD

The real problem is Imperial Wax. How do you get rid of the greasy feel? You need a solvent to clean it off.

IF you must use a solvent do so with an exhaust ventilation system or outdoors.

using solvents in an enclosed space where you subject yourself to breathing the fumes is simple stupidity.

Unless you are trying to wean yourself off sniffing glue
and this is an alternative to going cold turkey?



AD

I use Dillon spray lube and just retumble my cases after sizing.

quote:

Well I will certainly echo what Jeffeoso said, Acetone in particular is bad juju for you, and your stuff.

Actually folks, having worked in an environment that had so much acetone and other organic solvents in it (including MEK) that it made one's eyes water at times for ten years and only one fellow actually died from it (even then it was suspected that he actually died from aids but that I do not believe). The worst it is going to do is remove the lube from your cases - why would you want to do that? Bone dry cases are bad ju-ju! (For the cases that is). It is best used as a ladies nail varnish remover - which it is/was.

By the way, if you want to rust your gun the best way is to clean it with acetone. It removes all the protective oils. It caused sunburn in the same way - it removes the protective oils from the surface of your skin.

quote:

The real problem is Imperial Wax. How do you get rid of the greasy feel? You need a solvent to clean it off.

I believe one should want that greasy feel. (But then, maybe it's the years of exposure to acetone kicking in! )

PS. I am not recommending inhaling acetone fumes nor any other organic solvent fumes - bad ju-ju!

Wow, info-overload! Thanks Folk....

I appreciate all the concern for my personal health & safety shown here, but to be honest my question was motivated more by my concern for my brass than my "arse" But I shall certainly take heed of the sage advice offered.

A few points though. Here in SA we are not nearly as spoiled for choice in terms of all the wonderful commercial products available to the American. By example, I just found out this morning that the only known supplier (occasionally) of sizing wax in SA has at last just got some in. I have been waiting more than 6 months for this!
As to things like "de-natured" alcohol, I think our government slaps a huge tax on the stuff because our population tends to apply it as "natured" alcohol Certainly ethanol is an issue in that regard....
I live on the fringe of a mining town and drink borehole water rumoured to contain generous amounts of heavy metal pollution and not just a little radioactivity too
The dust when the wind blows contains much of the same....
Our "official" murder rate is 50 a day!
We have some of the most dangerous roads, with the worst drivers....

So, will my brass stand up to repeated cleaning with acetone. (Remember, it only has to last a few years because that is probably my life expectancy given that I'm using the stuff anyway )

To answer your specific question. Acetone will NOT damage your cases and is a very effective degreaser both of lube and the oils in your hide. It evaporates quickly leaving no residue unlike mineral spirits.

Allan D. has got it right. The main risk with acetone (provided you use it with adequate ventilation, read outdoors) is its flammability. MEK is even more suitable but tends to be higher in cost and harder to find.

Brake cleaner, at least down under is perchloroethylene, often used as a drycleaning fluid, is also suitable and is not flammable but possibly a bit more toxic and also possibly a human carcinogen.

If I lived in the US I would try isopropyl alcohol because apparently it is really cheap there, pretty safe and a good solvent for case lube given that commercial spray lubes are usually just lanolin in isopropyl alcohol.

However in Oz, isopropyl is very expensive and relatively hard to get in quantity, much more so than acetone and I am assuming that is the case for you as well.

I used acetone for years for exactly the same reason as you until I was able to get my hands on a reasonable supply of perchloroethylene.

Gloves and ventilation are the order of the day.

quote:

Originally posted by MickinColo:
The real problem is Imperial Wax. How do you get rid of the greasy feel? You need a solvent to clean it off.

+1

Birchwood Casey Gun Scrubber sprayed on a cloth works. Maybe I'm dead too , but I keep using it, and cases are clean as a result...LMAO

quote:

Originally posted by MickinColo:
The real problem is Imperial Wax. How do you get rid of the greasy feel? You need a solvent to clean it off.

use kiwi "neutral" polish .. and a dry towel

DMB, Birchwood Casey gun scrubber is trichloroethylene which has almost identical properties to the brake cleaner I am using, perchloroethylene also known as tetrachloroethylene only the brake cleaner is MUCH cheaper. I wouldn't be surprised if the brake cleaner in the US was exactly the same chemical as BC gun scrubber and it would be worth your while to check. Trichloroethylene also known as Trilene was widely used some decades ago as an anaesthetic agent (used as a vapour) because of its effect on the central nervous system.

In high concentrations there are obvious risks as with anything but used sensibly these products are remarkably safe.

The lack of flammability is a huge advantage over acetone or even MEK provided of course you can get them at a reasonable price.

quote:

Originally posted by Stephen Palos:
I live on the fringe of a mining town and drink borehole water rumoured to contain generous amounts of heavy metal pollution and not just a little radioactivity too
The dust when the wind blows contains much of the same....
Our "official" murder rate is 50 a day!
We have some of the most dangerous roads, with the worst drivers....

Hey, Stephen, it sounds like you are on a pretty serious health trip there

- mike

I minor point that has been overlooked - all of these chemicals are absorbed through the skin! This can result in headaches and intoxication. The solvents can also cause dermatitus.

But more importantly, it dries the cases too much! A folm of oil or wax on the case is desireable for avoiding case elongation and case head separation. It's about the case binding in the chamber in the forward position. If the pressure is low enough that is no problem but at higher pressure and with Lee Enfield type actions the cases get damaged!

Gee guys,
90% isopropyl alcohol (IPA) is available cheap at you local discount store as rubbing alcohol.
It removes case lube and dries quickly.

If you have really nasty case use soap and water then rinse in hot water.

Then rinse in the alcohol to remove the water and get a quick dry.

WESR,
actually MEK and Carbon Tetrachloride are availabe in any Sherwin-Williams Paint store and just about any Ace, True Value or Do=it=Best with a paint department. Not that I would use them to clean as they are worse than acetone.
As an aside, I tried goof off the other day on a paper towel to clean up some cases and it worked surprisingly well.

I put my cases in the dishwasher in order to clean the lube off.

Don't you guys ever watch TV?

" ... is tough on grease and the only thing left on your dishes is the shine ... "

I wipe them down with a clean cloth,then toss them in the tumbler for a while.It appears that I don't need to add polish to get them new shiny.Good Luck

Doesn't tumbling work harden the brass?
Butch

The only way to completely remove sizing lube is with a solvent. This is why it should be completely removed:

quote:

Originally posted by JLarsson:
The lubed case will not grip the walls of the chamber and will exert MUCH greater backthrust on the breechface.

It's no joke. The British standardized their rifle cartridges on measured bolt thrust, rather than chamber pressure. Lubrication increased measured bolt thrust 25% - in other words, it made a proof load out of a normal load. It's a fact that clean, degreased chambers and clean, dry cartridges minimize bolt thrust. Especially in weak or springy actions (like the double rifles I shoot a lot, lever actions, weaker bolt actions, etc.), that's the way to go.

This:

quote:

all, repeat, ALL, hydrocarbon sovents are bad news .. some worse than others .. naptha - BAD, acetone, very bad, MEK, you are kidding right?

...is why it doesn't make sense to use a sizing lube that isn't water soluble. I use plain old RCBS lube, and rinse 'em off in the sink. Anything else isn't worth the headache. As mentioned above, dishwasher works too.
------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

quote:

I believe one should want that greasy feel. But then, maybe it's the years of exposure to acetone kicking in!

LOL.

THE DISH WASHER SOUNDS GOOD.
BUT WITH JUST BOILING THE CASES IN WATER WITHOUT SOAP WILL DO THE JOB.
SOAP WILL LEAVE A FILM OF SOAP ON THEM

quote:

Originally posted by Stephen Palos:
Wow, info-overload! Thanks Folk....

I appreciate all the concern for my personal health & safety shown here, but to be honest my question was motivated more by my concern for my brass than my "arse" But I shall certainly take heed of the sage advice offered.

A few points though. Here in SA we are not nearly as spoiled for choice in terms of all the wonderful commercial products available to the American. By example, I just found out this morning that the only known supplier (occasionally) of sizing wax in SA has at last just got some in. I have been waiting more than 6 months for this!
As to things like "de-natured" alcohol, I think our government slaps a huge tax on the stuff because our population tends to apply it as "natured" alcohol Certainly ethanol is an issue in that regard....
I live on the fringe of a mining town and drink borehole water rumoured to contain generous amounts of heavy metal pollution and not just a little radioactivity too
The dust when the wind blows contains much of the same....
Our "official" murder rate is 50 a day!
We have some of the most dangerous roads, with the worst drivers....

So, will my brass stand up to repeated cleaning with acetone. (Remember, it only has to last a few years because that is probably my life expectancy given that I'm using the stuff anyway )

I don't see were acetone will hurt your brass.

Don’t boil them in your drinking water though, that stuff could damage them.

Stephen Palos
one of us


Posted 29 September 2009 13:31
Hi Folk,

does anyone know a reason why I should not clean the lube off my sized brass by rolling it about in acetone? It works great and flashes dry very quickly but I've never heard mention of it's use before.

In fact I clean just about everything in my gun room with the stuff. Maybe I just like the smell Eeker


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I hunt because I am human. Hunting is the expression of my humanity...
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Posts: 256 | Location: Randfontein, South Africa | Registered: 07 January 2008

I see no reason what so ever in any problems using acetone for cleaning purposes , of brass or any

metals in which you wish to remove oil or wax contaminates. Simply follow three rules when using highly

volatile solvents . Rule one Adequate ventilation , rule two NO OPEN FLAME or SPARK !. Rule three use

tongs and avoid dipping your hands in the solvent . Solvents of this nature will de fat your skin and

prolonged exposures can render oil ducts with in the epidermal structures useless ( How Well I know !

) Also can invade blood stream and wreak havoc on organs Kidneys ,Liver in particular known as ketone

in blood . A form of Cirrhosis of the Liver can also occur with prolonged exposure usage !.


A ketone test checks for ketones in your blood or urine. Ketones are substances that are made when the body breaks down fat for energy. Normally, your body gets the energy it needs from carbohydrate in your diet. However, stored fat is broken down and ketones are made if your diet does not contain enough carbohydrate to supply the body with sugar (glucose) for energy or if your body cannot use blood sugar (glucose) properly.

Newer home blood sugar meters can also measure ketones. Home urine tests to measure ketones are available.
Why It Is Done

A blood test is the most accurate method of measuring ketones. It is recommended for all people with diabetes whenever symptoms of illness are present, such as nausea, vomiting, or abdominal pain. These symptoms are similar to symptoms of high blood sugar and may mean you have diabetic ketoacidosis, a potentially life-threatening condition.

A urine test is the most commonly used method of measuring ketones. But it is less accurate than a blood test. It may be done to:


This was not meant to scare anyone just inform them . I have used abused so many aromatics over the years and still am alive as well as in reasonably good health for a man twice my age ! ( I'm kidding on that ! ) Use common sense put acetone in a small metal bowl place your spent cases in pick up with tongs and place on a terry towel cotton rag whatever and wipe them off . You'll be just fine , as you're not washing your hands in the stuff so skin absorption is extremely unlikely . If you have any cuts and you feel a burning sensation , STOP !. Because that will get into the blood stream not to mention Hurt like the devil like salt on an open wound !.

I used hot thinner SR V 17 ( NASTY STUFF ) for 20 years wiping a rag soaked in it , On my hands arms legs even my face ONCE , Talk about BURN Shit Howdy Burn baby Burn !. Once was the key there !.
Lacquer thinner Xylene Toloul Acetone MEK and combination's for 40 years and NO Abnormal Ketone levels. I just had blood work last month . While working composites it's an occupational hazard hard to avoid. We used to use triple 1 trichloroethylene also nasty crap .