BARNES...BARNES,they are as lightning never stikes at the same spot twice.I use 180 grs X bullet in a .30-378 WBY,the groups were no less than 2.5 inches{100 yards}.Cleaning/fouling or fouling/cleaning;they are too difficult to make them to shoot right.BUSA DAVE;concerning the .30-378 WBY;what kind of bullets do you use;I have gave up the 180 grs bullets...
Funny this should come up, just getting ready to get a load for Barnes. For what it is worth they suggest you have to have a clean bore to start with, and suggest their cleaner. Also, a chemical bonded bullet uses pure copper, according to Norma and they have come out with a bonded bullet that is bonded by soldering.
Posts: 188 | Location: New Brunswick, Canada | Registered: 25 May 2001
Well, my experience of the Barnes X is limited, but it seemed to shoot a lot better seated really deep OR jammed hard into the lands than when trying to keep 'em where you'd keep anything else... Accuracy was still piss-poor, but not X-files poor (first try w/ a .308 left many bullets not accounted for, firing at a 11"x16" @ 100 meters...)
And no, I have never seen a bullet that shot as bad. And yes, at 100 yards, I've shot better with a pistol, off-hand - we tried.
Interesting to see that so many folks dislike the X-bullet because of bad accuracy. Maybe the mail reason for that is the lenght of the bullet. The solid copper makes the bullet remarkably longer than a usual jacketed lead bullet at the same weight.
I shoot my old 8x60 with 180 grains bullet - the standard for the caliber is 196 or 226 grains. Perhaps bad accuracy is because of too long and thus unstable bullets?
Another reason may be the finish of the barrel. Mine is so smooth that I hardly get any fooling at all - the swab comes of without any traces of copper at all. My other rifles need a lot harder wok in the care.
Interesting thread, this!
Fritz
Posts: 846 | Location: Sweden | Registered: 19 April 2001
Fritz, I think the lack of stabalization is part of the problem.
I used to shoot quite a few of them, and never had a big problem getting them below 1.5" in my big game rifles. Usually had to go "over" a little, but never a problem go get them to do what they are supposed to do. Of course, all my guns are half inch wonders with other bullets, just like all the other posters' (yeah, right).
As a matter of fact, they are within about .2" of what a matchking does in my 280. But, they are .8" over what a 154gr. Interlock does in my 7mag. Of course that still puts five in 1.25".
All that said, they are never the most accurate in any of my rifles. Wouldn't expect them to, either. FWIW, Dutch.
Posts: 4564 | Location: Idaho Falls, ID, USA | Registered: 21 September 2000
So far I have never owned a rifle that would shoot a Barnes X with any powder tried no matter how I cleaned the barrel, etc. Maybe there is some way to get them to shoot but as far as I am concerned it just isn't worth the effort.
Posts: 400 | Location: Murfreesboro,TN,USA | Registered: 16 January 2002
I bought some Remington Bronze Points once, a long time ago. They shot a steady and oh so pretty 5 inch group with any powder or charge I used.
I have had nothing but good groups with Barnes X. I am sitting here trying to put a time frame to when I started using them. It has been awhile. I'm happy with them.
Posts: 631 | Location: North Dakota | Registered: 14 March 2002
Barnes 140gr x boattails shoot 3" grouos out of my 7mmstw.The flatbase 140 x shoots 1" and the 140 gr ballistic tip 1/2".Each of my rifles has it's preferences for worst bullet but they all shoot the best groups with ballistic tips.
Posts: 3104 | Location: alberta,canada | Registered: 28 January 2002
In most of my rifles the Barnes X bullets are extremely poor performers...or maybe I just haven't played with em long enough? In any case why bother if I can get the Nolser partition to shoot sub-moa in just a few loads? FWIW, I've found the Barnes bronze solids exceptionally accurate in my .338 and .375..
Posts: 457 | Location: Kentucky | Registered: 25 February 2002
As a Utahn I gotta stand up for Barnes(their factory is about an hour away from me). I shoot only the 400 grain Barnes-Xs and Solids in my 416Rem model 70 and they work great! The gun will group less than an inch (not that you need this in a big bore) and they expand wonderfully with absolutely minimal loss of weight.
JMHO,
JohnTheGreek
Posts: 4697 | Location: North Africa and North America | Registered: 05 July 2001
300 Wby: 155gr Sierra Match (worst-5" groups), Nosler ballistic tips- also poor performers(3" groups), any Sierra match king in this cartridge (interestingly, Sierra MK are the best bullet in my 6.5x55). 180 gr Win. Silver tips are the best in my 300.
460 Wby: 600gr Barnes O- these are fun to shoot, but they group about 2-3x the size of any other bullet.
With a clean barrel,off the lands & at 300y the Barns,with a little load work have done quite well for me(6.5x55,7mag,375&50BMG).The price is usualy right as someone is always looking to get rid of them.Seams funny to me that people will sight them in at 100y to find a hunting load for 500.Try backing off a few yards @ 100 they havnt gone to sleep yet. To stay on topic my 243&708 hate Barns and refuse to group miute of deer no matter what=CJ
I've shot them out of a 243 & they shot fine for hunting. Groups hovered around an inch.
A few things need to be remembered here. First, they are NOT a match bullet, don't expect match accuracy. What they ARE is a very sturdy HUNTING bullet, and for that they work fine.
Second, as pointed out above, they are longer than a convential lead core bullet. Step down a notch in weight from your normal load, and you'll probably find they shoot better. If you normally shoot a 180 out of your -06, try a 150 Barnes. After all, your 180 will end up weighing less than 150 after hitting an animal, whereas the Barnes will stay have it's starting weight at the end.
The only Barnes X's I've tried are .375" 210's, and they shot into 1.5" @ 150 yards from a Ruger No. 1 .375 H&H (3-shot groups). Have never had any problems with Barnes Originals. The worst performance I ever had from commercial bullets was with Hornady 180 grain Spire Points in a .30/.338 Mag. They never would shoot in this rifle. But they worked OK in a .308 Norma Springfield with the same powder charges!!
I have shot X bullets in five different Weatherby calibers (257 through 340) and all have grouped great, with the exception of the 7mm which wouldn't group anything else either. Guess I don't try hard enough to find a problem with them. I believe they are great killers too.
Posts: 323 | Location: Keithville, La. USA | Registered: 14 February 2002
THey also qualify for the worst customer service. Several years ago, I ran into a batch of .25 cal., 85 grain X bullets that refused to open up when driven at 3000 fps MV. They asked me to send the bullets, which I did. After 7-8 months of not hearing from them, I called to inquire and see what the verdict was. They had my paperwork but could not find the bullets -- said they'd get back with me in a day or two as the person formerly tending this was no longer employed there. That's been 4 years ago, and I never heard back from them.
As customer service, that absolutely stinks.
Posts: 9458 | Location: Shiner TX USA | Registered: 19 March 2002
According to 15 whitetail bucks, Barnes bullets were the worst thing that ever happened them.
My 3 rifles shoot them well with "ball" type powders and magnum primers. One will do consistent cloverleafs.
BTW, I have a Barnes Bullet Disposal Area here set up on my property. Anyone wishing to dump 120 grain .284 dia. or 130 or 140 grain .308 diameter XBT's please let me know.
15 years ago when I tried the old Barnes X bullet I used the Sierra reloading manual and couldnt get a group worth beans. When CA got the lead ban thing we revisited Barnes using their manual. I can show you sub 1/2 in. groups in everything from .223 to .300 WSM. We did find that seating depth is the difference between a good group and a great group. 3-5/1000 off lands seems to work best. Also, if you have questions call Ty at Barnes. FYI- Why are MRX off the market???? Thats all I need to know
Posts: 11 | Location: Central California | Registered: 05 April 2010
Incidently I found a box of the original X in 7mm 150gr. I don't know if I ever loaded a single one. I did ok with XLC's seated a little deeper than usual. The only ones I use now are 100gr .257 TSX for the Roberts and some in .224 from 45 to 53gr. They do great out of my .22-250.
Geez, guys! Since I first posted this subject in 2002 I've had a grandson born and grow up enough to have killed four whitetail bucks and gotten two honest-to-gosh doubles on flying doves. Incidentally, all of his bucks have been killed with Noslers. But he has knocked off some 250 yard prairie dogs with Hornadys. My second grandson is still in the Daisy stage. And since 2002 I'm retired and wasting my own time rather than my employer's time sitting at a computer and pontificating about guns and shooting.
Posts: 13286 | Location: Henly, TX, USA | Registered: 04 April 2001
I use Barnes ttsx's in my 6.8 & 30-378 and both guns shoot them well enough, under an inch consistently at 100 yards. The 6.8 just fit the clip and the 30-378 is .030 off the rifling. I just wish Barnes would sell them in quantity for a fair price.
I use nosler partitions for most everything else, they always kill what I hit with them. Those noslers work well in my 338s.
Posts: 521 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 12 April 2010
Originally posted by filmit: and since this post started, Barnes has come out with some amazingly accurate hunting bullets.
This may be true.
Barnes effectively admitted to the accuracy and fouling problems of its original monometal bullets so thoroughly dissed by so many posters by redesigning their bullet to incorporate the driving bands. Since I don't hunt in a "no lead" area I've had no reason to test the banded Barnes product in my own guns, but I do understand that the banding has largely alleviated many of the accuracy and fouling complaints.
The reputed failure of the monometals to reliably expand is another subject that this thread was never intended to address.
Posts: 13286 | Location: Henly, TX, USA | Registered: 04 April 2001
The absolute worst shooting jacketed bullet ammo I have ever tried is the 150 grain .270 Winchester loaded by Hirtenberger and formerly sold under the Musgrave label in South Africa. In my three different .270s, that stuff shot absolute cylinder-bore patterns...cylinder bore with spreader wads, that is!
I don't know who makes their bullets, but I will never knowingly buy a single additional round of Hirtenberger ammo, for fear of encountering such bullets again.
\----------
As to Barnes, I never had good accuracy with their copper-tubing-jacketed Barnes "Originals" back in the 1950s and '60s, BUT their original Barnes-X bullets have been tremendous performers in my rifles. Contrary to my expectations when I first hesitantly tried them, they have never copper-fouled ANY of my rifle bores, and have been VERY accurate.
They do so well in my hunting rifles that when our local gun store sold them out to re-stock with the newer Barnes TSX designs, I bought all their remaining stock of the plain old "X" bullets in the many different bore diameters which I shoot. Cost me only $12-$15 per box depending on the weight and bore size and I consider it one of the better buys I have ever made.
Posts: 9685 | Location: Cave Creek 85331, USA | Registered: 17 August 2001
My .338 Win Mag with its Krieger cut rifling delivers the old 225 gr Barnes X to 2" at 300 yards.
The 300 gr TSX shoot an MOA in my M70 SS Classic .375 H&H.
My CZ .416 Rigby loves the 350 gr Barnes X, shooting clover leaves at 100 when propelled at 2700 fps.
The projectiles I have had the most difficulty with are the Hornady interlocks in .277 and .338. Just don't shoot worth a toot. The 6,8 mm 120 gr SST works well.
Mike
-------------- DRSS, Womper's Club, NRA Life Member/Charter Member NRA Golden Eagles ... Knifemaker, http://www.mstarling.com
I bought a 1,000 WW 55gr. FMJ w/ cannelure for my AR. They shoot horrible, worse than those junk Armscor bullets. I had to go to Hornady bullets which shoot sub-moa in my 16" AR.
velocity is like a new car, always losing value. BC is like diamonds, holding value forever.
But he has knocked off some 250 yard prairie dogs with Hornadys. My second grandson is still in the Daisy stage. And since 2002 I'm retired and wasting my own time rather than my employer's time sitting at a computer and pontificating about guns and shooting.
