Does anyone here have a good match for IMR 4350 that is not a tube powder? I would like to use a powder that meters better. I load for several different rifle calibers and use 4350 for most so something with a similar burn rate etc would be nice.

Can't think of any with similar burn rate. Most will be the extruded type. The next best would be H4831SC for metering.

Not sure which Winchester powder is similar to the 4350, but it may be 748 and I thought it was a ball powder. BUT, you need to double check that.

I have found that the Reloder powders meter very well, and Re19 would be the closest I think.

Ramshot Hunter is a bit slower, it is an excellent ball powder.

http://www.ramshot.com/powders/

H-414 and Win 760 are in the Ballpark.....I agree with the Ramshot too....not bad...

I'm not sure of number of cases you are loading you didn't say. When I load with extruded powders I'll put them through my RCBS thrower about a half a grain light then use my trickler to quickly bring them up to weight. Works well for me and in some cases those extrided powders are the most accurate hands down.

4350sc
jeffe

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
H-414 and Win 760 are in the Ballpark.....I agree with the Ramshot too....not bad...

Good recommendation, Vapodog! Some years ago (like 40 years ago or more) the NRA reported that H-414 was the "ideal" powder for the .30-'06...just a tad slower than IMR 4350 and a bit faster than H-4831. As Winchester 760 and Hodgdon 414 are different lots of the same basic powder, both should work about equally well.

For anyone not as expereienced as you are though, they should remember that they may not burn exactly at the same rate in a different case. Oh, and with ball powder, always try a load or two with Mag primers to see if the additional "lighting" is a benefit or hindrance in their application. .

Can't imagine that the Vita Vouri series 160 or 560 wouldn't be a pleasant surprise to you.

Depending on what weight bullets your planning on loading 760 and H380 have given my some good accuracy loads.

I agree with the H 414 recommendation. I think that today's version is just a hair faster burning than today's IMR 4350. I've had excellent results with H 414 in the 30-06 with 165 to 180 grain bullets (best powder for 150 gr bullets in the 30-06 is IMR 4064 in my opinion) and in the 7x57 with bullets from 140 to 162 grains.

Velocities with H 414 in the '06 may be 25 to 50 f.p.s. less than what you can get with IMR 4350, but that isn't enough to care about. Accuracy is very good with either powder.

In my Ruger 7x57, velocities with H 414 are tops -- greater than what most loading manuals give for a given bullet weight.

H 414 also works well for me in a 257 Roberts with 100 grain bullets. I haven't tried it in a 270 Winchester or a .308 Winchester. I tried H 414 in a 375 H&H and decided that I got much better results in that cartridge with H 4350.

H414 / W760.

Re19 is a bit slower, but meters better than 4350...

Maybe this can be of use.

If anyone has suggestions for additions or corrections, e-mail or PM me.

quote:

Originally posted by LE270:
Velocities with H 414 in the '06 may be 25 to 50 f.p.s. less than what you can get with IMR 4350, but that isn't enough to care about. Accuracy is very good with either powder.

H414 is a great powder for the -06, but I've found just the opposite in regards to velocity with H414 clocking 50-100 FPS more than most other powders. I can push 150s to 3100 FPS and 165s to 2900 with no pressure excursions at all.
It has given a stellar performance in my 22-250 also whereas H380 maxed out on pressure before achieving expected velocities.
N160 is a great one too, I use it with Berger's 185 grain bullet for varmints. It is accurate and flat devistating.

I use IMR 4350 on calibers from 22-250 to 300 Win Mag and it is very accurate. I have tried W760 and Varget even though it is still a tube powder smaller though but not real happy with the accuracy in the larger calibers with either. I think I will try the H 414. With the cost of powder today I cant afford to make to many mistakes and I hate to start over trying to develop new loads some of them cost more than the gun to figure out but that is why we reload I guess. Will the H 414 work for the small and large alike?

I've used Win 760 grain for grain to IMR 4350. You can also try using the short cut H 4350 which is meant to meter better.

quote:

Originally posted by buckshot:

H414 is a great powder for the -06, but I've found just the opposite in regards to velocity with H414 clocking 50-100 FPS more than most other powders.

I admit that I have not tested this extensively, but my impression from what I have done with it is that, with the exception of the 30-06 itself, H-414 tends to work best in cases that are smaller than the 30-06. It works very well in the 57 mm case for at least the 7x57 and smaller, such as the .257 Roberts, 6mm Remington, etc. I have not tested it in an 8x57 or larger caliber on the 57 mm case.

H-414 works very well in the 22-250, especially with heavier bullets, e.g. 55 gr and up. I have not tried it in the .250 Savage or .300 Savage, but my guess is that it would work very well in those too.

I think it is not an optimum powder for the calibers smaller than .30 on the '06 case, e.g. .270, 25-06, etc. I have not tried it in larger calibers on the '06 case, such as the 8mm-06, 338-06, and .35 Whelen. It works well in the .308 Winchester, especially with heavier bullets, and in some other calibers based on the '08 case. I tried it in the .375 H&H and decided that there are better powders for that cartridge. I do not think it is optimum for the larger belted magnums and similar cartridges.

quote:

Originally posted by Doc:

Not sure which Winchester powder is similar to the 4350, but it may be 748 and I thought it was a ball powder.

No, that would be Winchester 760. Winchester 748 is closer to, but NOT the same as, Hodgdon BL-C(2). All these are indeed ball powders, so they will meter very well.

Good point LE270. I haven't tried H414 in all those cases you mentioned either, except for the Roberts. In the Roberts it worked well, but I went with a load straight out of Ken Waters "Pet Loads", and just couldn't be bothered to experiment further. It will be one of the powders I grab when I get my 6m/m put back together tho...

Gerard,

Thanks for the link.
That may be the best thing since sliced bread.

quote:

Originally posted by LE270:

I do not think it is optimum for the larger belted magnums and similar cartridges.

I have to modify that somewhat, based on the velocity figures in the Hodgdon loading manual. (These figures may not be trustworthy; I find that velocity figures in loading manuals often differ from my actual results.)

Hodgdon's figures show that H-414 often gives highest velocity with light bullets, such as 120 grain bullets in the 7mm Rem Mag, in the large magnum cartridges. Conversely, H-414 gives the best results with heavy bullets in smaller cases, such as 180 grain and heavier bullets in the .308 and .300 Savage. Hodgdon's figures also suggest that H-414 may be an optimum powder for the .303 British, the .30-40 Krag, the 8x57, and other medium-caliber medium-cased cartridges.

Depending on what rifles your loading for , If you call the "middle cartridges based on the 30-06" cases and everything is smaller in case size , you might try 2230 Accurate Arms . This stuff goes through a measure like water . I like 760 Winchester , H380 is still another winner with lots of data too boot . But always remember gun are to each thier own . I have one rifle in particular that 4350 is what it likes to eat so thats what I feed it . Good Luck .

H-414 is a powder I can't live without! It's the best powder for the 30-06, and excellent in the .270 with 130gr bullets, use a CCI-250 magnume primer with it.

depending on the caliber you use,reloader powders work well too and burn cleaner than ball

I agree with Jeffeosso and 308Sako on this one.

The best results I've had from a similar buring powder that gives much better metering than IMR-4350 has been with H-4350sc and either VV N-160 or 560.

I like RL-19 and VV 160 for both the 270 and 30-06
Found them to meter nicely trhough the RCBS powder measure and a Lyman 1200 electronic setup.
VV seems a bit cleaner but that is quite sublective as neither one seems to be especially "dirty".