Hey all...

Need a hand figuring out some powder
Dad used 15-20 years ago in my 30-30
reloads.

I have about 15 20-round boxes I am pulling down
to load up more consistently....

Definately IMR powder of some sort.
Cylindrical stick powder
Length = 0.085" average
Dia = 0.038" average.

33.4g used with 150g round nose
slugs. Don't know velocity.

I have measured both my IMR 4064 and 4895....
It is not either of those powders.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

IMR 3031 was always a popular powder for the 30WCF, have you compaired your to it?

TruckJohn
My suggestion would be to shoot a few five shot groups with the loads as they are. If they shoot minute of deer (I assume this is what the 30-30's are loaded for)I would not bother trying to twesk them.

But if you must(many of us are insufferable tinkerers)keep this powder sepreate. Weight a reasonable sample of the power charges. Average the weights. Tune the load to this average weight.

Trying to guess what powder you have is at best a poor idea. There are too many powders that are too similar to risk your eyes/hands/life on.

muck

I'd have to bet on IMR3031, too.

That seems just a tad hot if it is 3031. I don't have any 4320 to measure but the load seems more suitable if it were that.??? roger

I was talking to Dad again, and the only other hint he remembered was that he used the same powder for his 30-06 as well.

These weren't super hot loads -- they don't flatten primers or kick back nearly as hard as Factory Winchester 170g PowerPoints.

Apparently, he didn't share my zeal for trial and error.

Best regards

John

3031 is really long grained, and meters awful. It's the longest grained powder I've used in anything. 4320 is exactly the opposite, small grains and meters perfectly.

Could be anything. Could be a Dupont/IMR powder that is no longer in their lineup?

Your Dad must have thought he had the "golden" load to make up that much. You say you are "pulling down" the loads cause they don't shoot good??

Are you able to save the bullets to your satisfaction??

I have an idea you may try. Can you move the bullet enough to break it loose from the case a few thousandths of an inch and then slide it back and re-crimp it. Then try shooting again. The reason I'm saying this is that I've experienced where in older stored ammo the bullet likes to take a sort of "set" to the brass causing inconsistant release pressure.
It might be worth a try. Give it a shot with a couple of rounds and see if they don't shoot better.

I've been having some pressure spikes on a 30-378 with stored ammo and think this bullet "bonding" has something to do with it.
I take some ofthe older ammo and try and reseat the bullet a little deeper and I'm amazed at how much pressure it can take to "pop" them loose.

quote:

Originally posted by TruckJohn:
Hey all...

Need a hand figuring out some powder
Dad used 15-20 years ago in my 30-30
reloads.

I have about 15 20-round boxes I am pulling down
to load up more consistently....

Definately IMR powder of some sort.
Cylindrical stick powder
Length = 0.085" average
Dia = 0.038" average.

33.4g used with 150g round nose
slugs. Don't know velocity.

I have measured both my IMR 4064 and 4895....
It is not either of those powders.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

I'm guessing 4064

Beats me, then. If he was using it in the .30-06 I'd have guessed 4064 too, but you say that's not it. Not many powders work well in both of those cases, but maybe he just loaded up some 30-30's with the powder he used for all his 30-06 loads. Maybe 4350? That would make for a very mild load in a 30-30! Better to call it a mystery than guess, though.

quote:

Originally posted by TruckJohn:
Hey all...

Need a hand figuring out some powder
Dad used 15-20 years ago in my 30-30
reloads.

I have about 15 20-round boxes I am pulling down
to load up more consistently....

Definately IMR powder of some sort.
Cylindrical stick powder
Length = 0.085" average
Dia = 0.038" average.

33.4g used with 150g round nose
slugs. Don't know velocity.

I have measured both my IMR 4064 and 4895....
It is not either of those powders.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

Probably IMR 3031-a "ubiquitous" .30/30 powder......

I'll bet on IMR-3031 as well. it's still one of the best for a 30-30, although it's a bitch running throuh a powder measure. That 33.4 gr. is only .4 gr. above max in the Lyman #43 edtion loading manual circa 1964.
Paul B.

I'll guess it's 4350. An article in the old NRA reloading book (1981) gives these dimensions for the IMR canister line:

  
3031  .029 .083
4064  .031 .083
4350  .038 .083
4831  .038 .083

The other IMR powders are either too short or too narrow to fit your measurements.

4350 is commonly used in the .30-06 and it would certainly make for a mild load in the .30-30. IMR suggested one could use a compressed charge of 38.5 gn of 4350 with 150 gn bullets in the .30-30, so if it is 4350, you've got a rather reduced load, esp. so for such a slow powder. This old data also suggested a compressed load of 35.5 gn of 3031 gave the best performance -- an extra 300 fps.

quote:

Originally posted by asdf:
I'll guess it's 4350. An article in the old NRA reloading book (1981) gives these dimensions for the IMR canister line:

  
3031  .029 .083
4064  .031 .083
4350  .038 .083
4831  .038 .083

The other IMR powders are either too short or too narrow to fit your measurements.

4350 is commonly used in the .30-06 and it would certainly make for a mild load in the .30-30. IMR suggested one could use a compressed charge of 38.5 gn of 4350 with 150 gn bullets in the .30-30, so if it is 4350, you've got a rather reduced load, esp. so for such a slow powder. This old data also suggested a compressed load of 35.5 gn of 3031 gave the best performance -- an extra 300 fps.

Ding ding ding.....I think we got a winner here.

Dump the stuff and reload the 30-30 with H-4895 or IMR-4064 or RL-15
You'll have a better load for your 30-30

According to Quick load....if it is indeed 4350 it would be doing a whopping 1981 fps at 27,000 psi.....almost 100% fill though.

I bet 4350 is the right one.
It would make sense...

I am pulling them down because they sat out in our humid Florida garage for 15 years after they were loaded.... The primers sometimes don't go bang, sometimes go BANG, and sometimes go .........*bang*.
which really causes trouble with groups. I definately can't use them for hunting either... so may as well pull them down and try to do something with them.

I mic'ed bullets after trying collet pulling -- mashed them too much. Inertia pulling is much louder, much slower, but doesn't damage the bullets.

Thanks

John

IMR-POWDER GRANULATIONS AND COMPOSITIONS
Powder Dia. Perf. Lgth. Web Coating Density (.65xdie) (.93xcut) (%) (g/cc)
4198 .027 .007 .085 .010 6 DNT .85
3031 .030 .007 .030 .0015 8 DNT .89
4064 .032 .007 .085 .0128 9 DNT .90
4320 .034 .007 .042 .014 8 DNT .92
4350 .039 .008 .085 .016 5 DNT .925
4676 .034 .007 .058 .013 7 DNT .90
4895 .033 .007 .058 .013 6 DNT .90
4831 .039 .008 .085 .016 8 DNT .90


That's my old list fom Ed Harris, but I just took out some 3031 and measured it and it is .085" long and varies in dia from .029" to .030".

H322 is a mystery powder. I tried every "popular" powder for my marlin 30TK with very unexciting results. Then I read an article in the reloader magazine about 30/30 and read good stuff about H322. I tried it and every group I shoot is now 2" with a 1.75X scout scope! Sierra also lists 30/30 loads with H322 in their manual. The two loads I use are: 150 grain Sierra roundnose w/ 30.5 grains (I sometimes use 31.5) and 170 Nosler Partition roundnose with 29.5 grains. BTW if anybody needs an aluminim weaver mount (used) for a Marlin it is FFTA.