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I keep reading some heated threads on this board about failures with Ballistic Tips. While I have many friends who use them successfully I do believe that where there is smoke there must be some fire. I've killed a LOT of deer with a 243 and Nosler Partitions over the years. I've had complete success and NEVER lost a deer. I've used them since around 1970. I am moving to a new caliber this year and am thinking about trying ballistic tips. Their accuracy intrigues me. I don't want to start another heated thread here: rather the question simply is if you've ever had any type of trouble with partitions. I'm thinking that maybe I shouldn't fix what ain't broke. Thanks, knobmtn | ||
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wish there was an accubond in 6mm  | |||
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Quote: Never ever ever... | |||
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At close range we want the bullet to exit without blowing up. At long range we want the bullet to still expand and still penetrate. Premium bullets were made to do both. But when the ratio of the bullet increases in mass to the game the chance of bullet failure diminish. Thus if your new cartridge is a .358 Win I would not use premium bullets on deer. If it's say a 7mm-08 AI and the bullets are light at maybe 120 grs then they may not leave a blood trail with all hits. Here is yet another post on the conumdrum. http://www.accuratereloading.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=761328&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=21&fpart=1&vc=1 It comes down to confidence. If one were burned just a little then he should go the "failsafe" route. | |||
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As of now, the Nosler partition is my only hunting bullet for everything. It just works, everytime. I have heard guys complain about the bullet "penciling" thur the animal. I think this is a misdiagnosis because of the sometimes caliber size exit hole. The nose has actually blown off inside the animal & the shank makes the caliber size hole. I will agree w/ Savage on bullet diameter though, as you up the dia. & mass & keep the vel. down, the need for a bullet like the NP is lessened, but for all you small caliber boys, think hard about using the BTs.  | |||
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Thinking back on a .224" wildcat that I made up for all purposes. It was to do what the 243 Win does but shoot .224 varmint bullets and use the low aspect ratio case design of the new PPC's. The cartridge was a shortened 6.5 RM necked to .224" that headspaced on the shoulder in a 26" barrel twisted 1-9. I found a guy in Utah who made up a special run of 88 gr "partition" bullets. They grouped quite well and I was all fired up. So I soaked some newspapers in water and shot my new invention into the test media at about 50 yds. The bullet made a nice wound channel and the expanded bullet was recovered. A friend was there shooting a Ruger 270 with his 140 Interlock handloads. I asked him to shoot into my media in another spot for a comparison. His bullet made a wound channel that must have been twice as large in volume. The penetration was greater as well. That did it for my invention. I could never use it on deer after what I saw. The barrel is burned out now at targets and varmints. Everything is relative. | |||
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Quote: What caliber are you moving to? You want some intrigueing accuracy with a bullet as tough as the partition or more so? Get some triple shocks. I've had excellent success with partitions, btips, and the Barnes TSX. Good luck. I'll be trying the Accubond on game this year.  | |||
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I guess there is a difference between failure and poor performance. On deer sized game hit in the ribs I have gotten small exit holes, poor blood trails and extended tracking sessions using patritions. The best partition I have used is the 180 grain 30 caliber version but in smaller calibers I prefer bullets that expand to larger diameters and push a larger frontal area thru game making it not necessary to involve bone for a quick kill. | |||
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RickT300: Yikes! On your experience with the Nosler Partitions. Your experiences are the exact opposite of what I have experienced over the last 35+ years on Mule Deer, Black Bear, Antelope, Whitetailed Deer and Mt. Goats! I have used Nosler Partitions in 24, 25, 27, 7mm and 30 caliber and never have I had to follow a long blood trail or observe a slow kill! And like you I much prefer the lowish heart/lung shot with these bullets! Hmm.. your experiences are puzzling to me! Some of the calibers I have killed medium sized Big Game with using Nosler Partitions are 243 Win., 6mm Remington, 240 Weatherby, 6mm Ackley Improved, 257 Roberts, 25/06, 270 Win., 7mm Express (same as the 280 Rem.), 280 Remington, 7mm Rem. Mag., 308 Win., 30/06 and 300 Win Mag.! I always recommend Nosler Partitions to my friends when they inquire about reloading for Big Game Hunting or buying quality factory loaded ammo! I guess these different impressions are what makes the world go around? Hold into the wind VarmintGuy | |||
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Many experts recommend a 'highly frangible' round on deer sized game. I have shot more deer than is typical on a season to season basis than a lot of folks, due to crop depredation permits. I can state emphatically that Ballistic Tips are highly frangible and cause tremendous wound channels and kill effectively. I have had many not penetrate completely through and animal and therefore have very poor to nonexistant blood trails, fortunately all but one have expired within close proximity to where they stood when shot(60 yards or less). However; the one and only whitetail that I ever pulled a trigger on and did not recover was in fact with an Ballistic Tip. I have also shot many animals with partitions and have in fact had complete pass throughs (without bone impact) and had very difficult trailing sessions, poor blood trails etc. as mentioned before in this thread, but also recovered all of these deer as also mentioned before. I have not shot quite as many deer with the fail safe (30 or so), but have experienced the same pass through issue. I have never had the pass through without a serious wound channel with a ballistic tip,--easy tracking-- and I think it is an excellent hunting round. As a final thought though, I have been loading and shooting accubonds this summer and am looking forward to shooting these on game this fall..... have some of the Win. CT accubond factory ammo as well and am looking forward to being able to buy Combined Technology coated accubonds--Good Hunting--Don. | |||
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I have seen alot of Nosler partition failures. The results were just as Rickt300 explained it, a SMALL hole in and a SMALL hole out when hit though the ribs/lungs. These were long, long, long trailing jobs aided by tracking dogs (If it were not for the dogs we would have lost some of the animals). IMO thats TERRIBLE bullet performance. The tough bullets are probably just the ticket for you guys that shoot for the shoulder bone but, what happens when you miss that tiny bone and hit nothing but meat. Well, I want a bullet that will expand and get the job done quickly, a NBT.  Good Luck and Happy Trailing! Reloader | |||
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My experience has been that the Nosler Partition's front section is just as explosive as any other non-premium bullet with dramatic trama at the point of entry. I've never seen anything resembling bullet failure from a Nosler Partition. | |||
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Not to pizz in anyones cherrioes but it seems to me that there are a lot of "bullet failures" that come to light in the middle of an autopsy of said critter. Now I know sometimes they don't work the way we want but failure to me means the bullet bounced off (never heard of that on a partition) or didn't reach the vitals (that is subjective to shot placement - I don't expect a bullet to reach the heart on a THS with a NBT) Just a point - no need for this to turn into a bullet flame war - just realize that a true failure (regardless of mfg) seems to be more of ararity than we wouldlike to think. | |||
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eldeguello: Even with the opinions expressed on this board I couldn't remember anyone complaining about a partition failure. The only time that I came close to it, myself, was one shot on a running deer at 200 yds. The shot got too far back and went between the ribs and simply punched a small hole clear through. I've always cut up my deer and normally a fair number of others so I get a good post mortem on what different bullets and caliber do. That particular deer went around 200 yds but I did find it. That was with the old Partitions back in the 70's that appeared to have machined jackets. My solution was to go to 85 or 95 gr Partitions for more velocity. It seems to have worked. But the real problem was poor shot placement. I have been thinking about the Accubonds. Thanks for the input there. knobmtn | |||
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Doc: The caliber that I'm changing to is a 7-08AI. After a lifetime of 243's and Partitions I keep thinking that maybe with the larger bullet I can give the Ballistic Tips a try. But, again, if it ain't broke,,,,,, like POP said in his advice. It could be a mistake. Thanks,,,knobmtn | |||
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7mm08+140grNBT=Venison!  | |||
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Sluggo: My experiences agree with yours on the explosive qualities of the front half of the partitions. For a while I was driving the 243 85's at a chronographed 3150 and the 95's at 3050 out of a different rifle. The trauma for the first 4 to 10 inches of rhe wound channel was severe but I always had an exit from the base of the bullet. Every deer I shot for years with those 2 bullets was a one shot kill and most were down at the shot. knobmtn | |||
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I to have been using the Nosler Partitions since the early 1970's and have had two occasions which one could mistakenly call "failures." Both were my fault, not Noslers. First was during my experimentation phase with small calibers; the 6 x 47 pushing an 85 grain partition too slow. Shot a large Doe whitetail at about 120 yards perfect broadside presentation and drilled a quarter sized hole through and through. She ran 30 yards. When field dressing her I was amazed at the utter lack of internal damage! The hole was so small throught the lungs. It was one of the worst drags ever, and I deserved it. Next was using the 180 grain partition in the .308 Win. In my opinion this was either a hard lot of bullets, or too much bullet for the "little" round. Shot a Moose frontal head shot missing the skull/brain by approximately 1/2 inch, and killed the Moose 1o hours later at 400 plus yards. Had the same effect as the aforementioned Doe. In all I have probably taken or seen taken 300 head of 'big-game." A very large majority has been with Noslers and mostly partitions. By matching the bullet to the caliber, and the animal(shot presented) Nosler bullets have never let me or my companions down. | |||
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Quote: knobmtn, Here is a link to a previous thread about Nosler Partitions in .375 cal. In it is a post about poor bullet performance on a hunt in Zimbabwe from my 375 H&H. This was from the early production .375 Partitions, so maybe they are tougher now. Nosler Thread Many people would not call this bullet failure since the animal died, but it could have been lost if not for an exceptional tracking job. I currently use Partitions in some other calibers, but I am still "gunshy" about the 375's from that experience. I had more bullets that did not make it through several varieties of plains game than exit holes (several did not even make it to the offside shoulder). This was not what I wanted from a performance standpoint, so I switched to Swift A-Frames on later hunts with excellent performance. I will probably get toasted again for daring to report my experience, but those were the results I had. Jim | |||
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I have used Nosler Partitions in 6.5 and 7mm for years. I have taken numerous big game animals and have been very impressed with the performance of NPs. They are my favorite game bullet. I'm not looking to find the perfect bullet, I've found it. NOSLER PARTITIONS. | |||
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Dare to even whisper that the magnificent perfect partition may fail as it's very existence depends on it's perfect performance every time. We should all take a deep breath and admit that no bullet will always perform perfectly under all conditions. As to this exit hole worship many here seem to have, if the exit hole is small and does not contribute to bleeding then I would rather have the energy used making the exit used to destroy vital tissue. The partition does not always exit on elk as elk can provide enough mass to stop any bullet when hit from a bad angle and some people are far more inclined to take shots at bad angles with the fabled partition than other good bullets. It all boils down to those who prefer to bust bone versus those who would rather put their bullets directly into heart and lung tissue. This does not make one bullet better than another just more suitable to ones own shooting/hunting style. | |||
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I have taken many deer in the Midwest with BT bullets with good success, but I must say the only deer I lost was also with a BT. This was a very close shot standing facing semi broadside but more towards me with a front shoulder shot. After I pulled the trigger and the deer ran off a cloud of hair came floating down all around were the buck stood. There was hair all around and the dear ran off, with only very very small trace of blood in the fine snow. I used a .280 cal. 150 gr. bullet just over 3000 fps. Darnest thing I ever saw. | |||
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Quote: rickt300, I can understand a quartering shot on a larger animal not exiting (or a shot through heavy bone), but a 375 bullet through the lungs that does not exit the offside of an IMPALA as one 260 grain Partition on that same hunt performed makes me more than a little nervous  . When the same bullet on a kudu from a rear quartering shot clips a couple of ribs going in, flattens the rear part of the shank, and only penetrates 6 or 8 inches into the lungs, I get downright skittish . I won't even go into why a 300 grain Partition on the same hunt led to an adrenaline filled followup on a leopard (and no, it was not from a too heavily constructed bullet for use on leopard). I am sure that other people have had excellent performance from them, even on cape buffalo as has been reported by several posters here, but the particular batch that I had was far softer and produced far less penetration than I anticipated from a 375. Once again, I want to emphasize that I only had the early production .375 Partitions, and later runs may be tougher. Certainly, as you stated, no bullet will always perform perfectly in all situations. I chose to switch to a different .375 bullet based on my personal experience from that hunt. Since knobmth asked for any instances of trouble with Partitions I was passing along that experience. As the old saying goes, your results may vary .Jim | |||
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| <eldeguello> |
My experience with Nosler Partition bullets is the same as Varmintguy's. While I agree that a recovered Nosler Partiton shows a relatively smaller "mushroom" cross-section than some other designs, the front core is usually completely gone, having in effect "blown up" into a shower of secondary fragments that act more like a load of shot from a shotgun at close range, devastating the contents of the chest cavity. I have quite often poured just a bloody soup out of the front half of an animal, consisting of pieces of lung, heart, and blood vessels after a Nosler Partition has passed through and on out the other side. This includes several pretty good-sized black bears I shot with a .270 Win. and Nosler 150-grain Partition bullets. | ||
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Eldeguello: I did not know there was a faction out there that doubts the reliability of the Nosler Partitions in the small and medium calibers! Contaries extraordinaire! I have not had much to do with the larger caliber (375 and up) Noslers but I have seen 375's at the range that shot Nosler Partitions real well! I do know that the 375 H&H and Nosler Partitions were and are real popular among the big Bear shooters of Alaska! Back to the medium and smaller size Nosler Partitions. I have NEVER heard from ANYONE I know (and trust their judgement) of a Nosler Partition "failing"! Of course if the bullet does fail then the intended target would not be recovered in order to pin down the blame on bullet failure and not poor shot placement! A bit of a Catch 22 there! Having that in mind I have seen many marginally hit Big Game Animals where the Noslers performed well enough to bring them to bag! I have a desk top full of recovered Nosler Partitions and again you must recover the game to recover the bullet! I simply hold no creedence what so ever in anyones contention that the Nosler Partitions (in all of the smaller calibers, 24 - 338) is not an EXCELLENT and unusually accurate Game Hunting bullet! I highly recommend their use after using them on all manner of Big Game for decades now! Long live the Nosler Partition! Hold into the wind VarmintGuy | |||
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I never said the the partition does not perform well most of the time. I have had poor performance several times using them. My 300 Win mag would not shoot the 200 grain version well enough to suit me after trying 3 powders and 4 boxes of them I gave up (expensive) and used the other bullet of the same weight that gave excellent accuracy the Speer 200 grain spitzer. Another foray I tried to use the 100 grain partition in my 6mm remington on feral hogs weighing 300 pounds plus. The bullets worked fine on neck shots just like any other bullet but the huge hog I hit in the shoulder at 50 yards left never to be found. Exactly the performance the 100 grain Hornady provided. This rifle was rebarrelled to 308 soon after as I believe partition or not the 6mm was not enough gun. The most troubling failure was a bull elk hit directly in the shoulder just under the shoulder blade with a 180 grain partition from my 30-06 at 100 yards. This bullet dumped a lot of energy into this shoulder, lost the front core and jacket material turning into a semi wadcutter 30 caliber which I found under the hide behind the far shoulder after making a 1 inch hole through the lungs. The rest of the herd took off with him. He went over a ridge, across a wide creek and made it to the top of the next ridge before laying down. When I caught up to him an hour later he still had his head up, a neck shot finished him off. Poor performance or failure? Had I been using a Speer bullet I would have not shot for his shoulder and I doubt he would have gone 100 yards much less over obstacles for two miles. | |||
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I use them a lot in 6.5 mm and .308 and very much like them. Another nice detail is that the POI is mostly very close or identical if you shoot the same weight Ballistic Tips on the range to save some money. | |||
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Quote: Well with that caliber, I'd recommend the 150 NBT. Here's what I think, you really really want to try something new to satisfy your curiosity. Get some NBT's in 150 grain, load them up to good accuracy, get a doe tag, and shoot!! Make your own judgement and tell us all how it went. I have killed at least 4-5 does in Alabama and Missouri with a 7 mag using this bullet and never ever had a problem. The closest was about 8 yards and the farthest was around 150. Guess what? Those backstraps were mighty tasty. I spoke with a guy on the phone in northern Minnesota 2 days ago. He is good friends with the guy that just left Nosler (who has been there for years). Retired I guess? He said that the Ballistic Tip bullet went through 9 different design changes over the years. Therefore, I can only assume that the bullets I bought even back in 1992 were 'the latest.' I just don't have a problem with the B-Tips. | |||
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Quote:Hey Rick, That is indeed thought provoking. I fully understand the conundrum and have heard lots of folks argue their prefered side with gusto. As for me, I do like Exits, but agree that if they aren't leaving a blood trail, then they are not providing what I want. Have had that problem a good bit on Exits using 243Wins that Knobmtn mentioned to begin the thread. To mention the obvious, the smaller the bullet caliber, the easier it is for the Exit hole to become plugged with various innards. I know places where the Deer is likely to remain in your sight even if it travels 100yds and other places they can go 3 yds and be completely hidden. But, in either situation, we would all opt for a quick, clean, 1-shot kill if we had our choice. Quote: That says it as clearly as it can be said. I agree completely. I've NEVER witnessed a bullet Failure, but I've seen a lot of poor placement for the choice of bullet being used. And I've witnessed (and had to track) Game where the WRONG bullet was used for the game and cartridge. In either situation, it is not Bullet Failure. Rather, it is Shooter Failure to improperly understand where to place a specific Bullet Design. Or simply selecting the incorrect Bullet Design for a specific cartridge to begin with. Bullet Failure to me would be "the inability of a specific Bullet to perform as expected within it's Design Envelope for Impact Velocity and Impact Medium." --- Hey Knobmtn, If you decide to go with the current crop of 120gr or 140gr B-Tips in your 7mm-08AI, and keep them in the forward 1/3 of the game, you will do fine. To help muddy the water a bit, the last three or four boxes of 140gr Partitions I've bought have been more accurate in my 7mmRemMag than the 140gr B-Tips. And I can get less Pressure with the Partitions using the same Load. In fact, those 140gr Partitions and B-Tips almost kill as well as the 145gr Hot-Cor Speers in it. Still go to the 130gr Hot-Cor as the Preference Bullet in " my " regular old 7mm-08, but lots and lots of Bullets from many manufacturers work well in it. Do you suppose that extra 100fps of the "AI" would change those results? | |||
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Hot Core: Quote: "Still go to the 130gr Hot-Cor as the Preference Bullet in " my " regular old 7mm-08, but lots and lots of Bullets from many manufacturers work well in it. Do you suppose that extra 100fps of the "AI" would change those results?" Actually, I was hoping you would give me your opinion on that very issue. Keep in mind that I've always kept my shots in the front third of the deer. knobmtn | |||
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Hey Knobmtn, Looks like you have an excellent thread going about the Partitions. No doubt at all that they are absolutely first class, Premium bullets. They provide a bit of initial expansion to transfer a good bit of energy and then convert themselves into deep penetrators which typically means Exits. Unless a person goes with a bullet that expands; none at all(FMJs), only a tiny amount(way too heavy or something like a FailSafe), or so fragile that it self destructs(Varmint bullets), I believe they would have a difficult time actually finding a "Bad Bullet" to use on Deer. And even those would work (where legal) and when placed so their Design works to the shooter's advantage. I like to pick a bullet that I have total confidence in and go with it for a couple of dozen kills. No need to start off a new cartridge/rifle with a bullet where I have any doubts at all about how it will perform. Once I get a string of kills with it, I like to try a slightly different Design and see if it performs as I expected it to. That way I feel comfortable when I recommend it to other Hunters. --- There was a guy on another Board years ago that mentioned having a Partition Failure. I was very curious about it because I knew him to be very honest in his posting. He said there was nothing between where he was and the Game at all, no grass stems, small limbs or anything he could see. But, apparently the first Partition acted similar to a Varmint Bullet when it made Impact. His second shot dropped the small Deer, which is the only way he knew what happened to the first bullet. I still find it "difficult to believe" due to all the excellent performance I've had and witnessed by others over the years. But, they are Man-Made which by definition means they sure aren't perfect. Maybe a bad one did get in his cartridge, or maybe somehow a Varmint Bullet fell into that box of bullets. Beats me. That said, it would be totally impossible for me to have any more confidence in how a bullet will perform after Impact on Game than I have with a Nosler Partition. But, I still use other Bullets because I like the way they are Designed to work too. And for the vast majority of the Deer Hunting I do and the shots I'm willing to take, I prefer those other Bullets over a Partition. On the other side of that argument, that has kept me from taking a few shots because I was not using a Partition at the time. Best of luck to you this Season. | |||
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If the animal died, the bullets did not fail. | |||
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Quote: Yes, and I have found the same to be true with the Sierra equivalent-weight bullets also. I can usually work up a load with the Sierra, and have an identical load using the Nosler Partition of that weight hit the same POI and produce very similar velocities. Not invariably, but usually. This gives me a lower-cost zeroing and practice load, and I switch to the Nosler when hunting. | ||
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| <allen day> |
I agree with that statement. For whitetails, LOTS of bullets work well. If I had a dedicated whitetail rifle for Texas/Southern deer, I'd feel good about Sierra Game Kings, Hornady Inter-Locts, Nosler BTs, Speer Hot Cores, etc., but probably Hornady's because I've used 'em extensively, and trust them. But to the main question, I have never seen a Nosler Partition "fail" for any reason, and I've probably taken more game of all sizes with the Partition than anything else. There is some notion that premium bullets like the NP or Fail-Safe don't work as well (smaller frontal area, etc.) or light big game as more conventional bullets and I used to buy into this myself. But one year I did almost all my hunting with a .300 Win. Mag. and 180 gr. Fail-Safes, including a very long Tanzania safari. So when it was time to head to Texas for our annual whitetail hunt, I took the that same .300 Win. with the same 180 gr. FS ammo. I found that the FSs dropped deer just as fast as the Hornady's, etc., I'd been using in lighter rifles, and without fuss or obstacle. Later, I switched back to Nosler Partitions in a new and differrent .300 Win. rifle, and found that they also dropped deer just as well as anything else I'd used. No drawbacks, and no failures. Since I keep a big supply of loaded ammo with 180 gr. Nosler Partitions on hand for my set of .300 Winchester rifles, I simply grab a rifle, a couple of boxes of ammo, and go hunting. This year I'll take the same .300 Win. Mag. and 180 gr. NP handloads to Africa for plainsgame up to 2,000 lbs. in size, then in November to Texas for whitetails, and here in Oregon for elk. Based on extensive previous experience on this same basic selection of animals, the one bullet/one load will do for all of it. I have found that premium bullets like the Partition don't necessarily kill whitetails or pronghorn any better than more conventional bullets do, but they work just one heck of a lot better and more reliably on all larger game animals. So I tend to ignore the conventional bullets, and load premiums for everything -- from whitetails on up. I see no reason not to. This "blood-trail" hocus pocus can be very misleading. I can't tell you how many elk I've shot and have seen shot with various rifles and bullets up through .375 H&H. Even with the biggest rifles and bullets that go clear through, you can't count on a blood trail or at least much of the blood trail, and due to the movement of the animal, the hide tends to stretch over exit holes from even .338s and .375s. My feeling is, why follow a blood or any other trail? Use a well-constructed, premium bullet; bust 'em through the shoulders or spine, and drop 'em where they stand. Even on lung shots, a premium bullet like the NP or F-S will wreck the lungs and keep on going........ AD | ||
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Allen, EXACTLY!  | |||
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Rickt300: The most troubling failure connected to that Nosler 180 gr. being used on that Elk in the manner it was, was the FAILURE of the shooter! Under no circumstance whatsoever should you have shot that fine creature directly in the SHOULDER at 100 yards! The failure you described - I will repeat was not in any way connected to the bullet! It was the failure of the shooter (YOU!) to not have shot that creature in the heart/lung area (avoiding the shoulder at all costs)! If you had not failed in your thought process (decision making process) and instead had put that bullet in the proper spot, that Elk would not have gone 150 yards having been struck with that fine bullet. In overall perspective though you have proven what I have suspected during the course of this thread - the Nosler Partitions are not failing! Its the shooters that are failing! Do yourself a favor and place your bullets in the heart/lung area of the Elk and I GUARANTEE you won't be tracking wounded game for 2 miles! Any Elk on the surface of this Earth could not travel 2 miles having been shot CORRECTLY with a Nosler 180 gr. 30 caliber Partition! Don't let me make it sound like you are a bad Hunter! You just made a bad, VERY BAD decision in that instance! And don't be influenced by any number of nimrods who will defend your poor decision to shoot that Elk in the shoulder! That shot will, on occassion, fail with ANY bullet! And that shot will destroy much edible meat! That is inarguable! Simply strike the Elk in the heart/lung area and about 100 yards later relish your harvest! And, you will have harvested a creature in the proper way having "drained" a high percentage of the animals blood into the chest cavity and out of the steaks and roasts! Never shoot an Elk, Moose, Mt. Goat, Mule Deer, Caribou, Whitetailed Deer, Antelope or any medium sized game you want to eat in the shoulders! It is unnecessary and wastes meat and allows more adrenaline soaked blood to settle in edible portions of the game! Shoot said animals with a properly constructed bullet in the heart/lungs (just once!) and you will not be tracking said game very far! This will occur in excess of 99% of the time in my experience! And YES this goes for the tricky wicket of shooting Mt. Goats on ledges also. I know, I have done it several times! Use a quickly expanding bullet and use good judgement in when and where to shoot the Goats and you will have a fine and rare trophy for yourself. And lots of fine meat to eat also! Please reconsider your declaration of the fine Nosler bullet as having failed. In my extensive experience and judgement and recollection of same - YOU failed - not the bullet! And dittoes for you Allen Day "BUSTING" non dangerous Big Game through the shoulder shows an immaturity and disrespect for the Game that is nearly unforgivable! Strike said game in the heart/lung area and there will be no need what so ever to be "busting" anything! The game will expire to the point of falling down (if not already down!) in 6 seconds and you won't have wasted a lot of fine meat and the meat that is harvested WILL taste better! Try this proper harvesting method for a few years and get back to me. I know you will thank me then! Hold into the wind VarmintGuy | |||
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I don't think I said the bullet failed, just performed poorly. On the other hand the only reason I would buy a "premium " bullet would be to execute tough shots like penetrating shoulders. I was holding on his shoulder because he was moving slowly and hit him there because he stopped just as I fired. I far prefer to use softer bullets and take neck and behind the shoulder shots myself. | |||
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SorryHuntcar, but that statement is so overused. If the animal dies after 5 miles of tracking w/ a giant surface wound that eventually bleeds him out, yeh it dies but I would say the bullet failed. Same could be said for using a "hard" bullet that "penciles" thru. Bullet perf. is the bullet & matching the bullet to the game animal & the hunting conditions.  | |||
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Varmint Guy, I here ya, I will always take a behind the shoulder shot, on an elk size animal especially. I do know why some outfitters for whatever reason say to put one in the shoulder first on an Elk. I saw two good shooters take this advise with Partitions and one of the Elk was not recovered, the other went about a mile. | |||
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