The Accurate Reloading Forums
Bunch a loaded rounds won't chamber
24 March 2018, 06:33
Mike_DettorreBunch a loaded rounds won't chamber
I have a batch of 300 WSM reloads that won't chamber in my new rifle, there were reloaded for my other WSM rifle.
I am also assuming that when I sized them I did not set the sizing die down far enough enough relative for the new rifles chanber.
I also assuming the only thing I can do is pull the bullets reclaim the powder and bullets and remove the decapping pin, set the expander ball shallow and resize them.
Your suggestions?
Mike
What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
24 March 2018, 06:47
ted thornRemove the expander and decaping pin and size them loaded
________________________________________________
Maker of The Frankenstud Sling Keeper
Proudly made in the USA
Acepting all forms of payment
24 March 2018, 06:48
postoakPerhaps the bullets are seated out too far? Just a few thousands of an inch will prevent chambering.
But, assuming you didn't set the shoulder back far enough, then you'll need to do as you say.
Why not buy a Hornady Headspace Comparator kit so you can know exactly how much you are setting the shoulder back?
Hornady Headspace comparator24 March 2018, 06:49
Snellstromquote:
I also assuming the only thing I can do is pull the bullets reclaim the powder and bullets and remove the decapping pin, set the expander ball shallow and resize them.
That's probably the smartest way.
If it were me I would do Teds method
Remove the expander and decaping pin and size them loaded
24 March 2018, 06:57
Mike_DettorreI already check COAL and its not that.
Ted/Dave - I didn't there was enough room up inside the resizing die for the bullet.
I will give it a try.
Thanks,
Mike What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
24 March 2018, 07:04
Saeedquote:
Originally posted by ted thorn:
Remove the expander and decaping pin and size them loaded
Might not work with some rifles.
24 March 2018, 07:11
Mike_DettorreSaeed,
What are the factors that would drive working vs. not working?
Mike What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
24 March 2018, 07:23
eagle27Choppered in on Tahr hunt with my nephew and his friend a couple of years ago and the friend found in the middles of the Alps some of his 300WM cartridges would not chamber. They had been loaded by his mate.
He couldn't understand why they would not chamber, I took one look and could see the shoulders had bulged slightly. I suspect his reloader mate had over crimped on the rounds loaded with the cannelured 165gr Hornady SST projectiles.
Might not be your problem but worth mentioning.
24 March 2018, 07:31
Mike_DettorreI would add that the bolt goes all the way forward and will start its rotation it just either won't completely close or is very hard to close.
Mike What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
24 March 2018, 08:06
postoakI wouldn't do it myself (size a loaded round). If you do, at least buy a body die.
Have you got a collet type bullet puller?
I'd pull one bullet, dump the powder and see if the case will chamber.
24 March 2018, 08:15
Mike_DettorreWhat's a body die?
I have an inertia puller.
Mike What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
24 March 2018, 08:19
Fjoldquote:
Originally posted by eagle27:
Choppered in on Tahr hunt with my nephew and his friend a couple of years ago and the friend found in the middles of the Alps some of his 300WM cartridges would not chamber. They had been loaded by his mate.
He couldn't understand why they would not chamber, I took one look and could see the shoulders had bulged slightly. I suspect his reloader mate had over crimped on the rounds loaded with the cannelured 165gr Hornady SST projectiles.
Might not be your problem but worth mentioning.
This is very common. A lot of people let their brass get a little long or adjust their seating die to low. It causes the mouth of the case to contact the step at the end of the die and buckle the body of the case just behind the shoulder.
Frank
"I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money."
- Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953
NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite
24 March 2018, 08:28
postoakA body die has no decapping pin and doesn't size down the neck.
Redding Body DieThe inertia type puller is good for a few rounds but if you have very many at all you need to get a collet type puller.
RCBS Collet Bullet PullerSize them loaded? That is a misguided idea; that won't work. I minced my words here.
Tell me how you will put a loaded round into a sizing die that is small enough to squeeze the neck down to below bullet diameter? If you do that, your bullets will be reduced in diameter by several thousandths. Then, your ammo might chamber but your bullets will bounce down the bore.
Pull all the bullets, dump the powder and start over, except for priming.
Make sure your brass fits your chamber before bullets are seated.
Yes, check for bulgess caused by crimping, shoulder and neck.
24 March 2018, 09:05
B L O'Connorquote:
Originally posted by Fjold:
This is very common. A lot of people let their brass get a little long or adjust their seating die to low. It causes the mouth of the case to contact the step at the end of the die and buckle the body of the case just behind the shoulder.
I've seen exactly this on brass which was resized by a neck sizing die adjusted too low. There's a slight bulge at or just behind the shoulder.
quote:
Originally posted by dpcd:
Pull all the bullets, dump the powder and start over, except for priming.
Make sure your brass fits your chamber before bullets are seated.
Yes, check for bulgess caused by crimping, shoulder and neck.
Yup! Don't gamble. Pull, dump and start over. If you had used a neck sizing die, you'll (obviously) need to FL size now. Remove the decapping pin for resizing. Make sure to check case length is within specs.
24 March 2018, 09:15
Mike_DettorreJust an FYI, it was a new rifle. Rounds were loaded for a different 300 WSM that I don't shoot anymore, hence the problem.
Mike What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
24 March 2018, 10:38
sambarman338quote:
Originally posted by dpcd:
Size them loaded? That is a misguided idea; that won't work. I minced my words here.
Tell me how you will put a loaded round into a sizing die that is small enough to squeeze the neck down to below bullet diameter? If you do that, your bullets will be reduced in diameter by several thousandths. Then, your ammo might chamber but your bullets will bounce down the bore.
Pull all the bullets, dump the powder and start over, except for priming.
Make sure your brass fits your chamber before bullets are seated.
Yes, check for bulgess caused by crimping, shoulder and neck.
Your logic seems to make sense but I have reshaped loaded 338WM cartridges, bulged by crimping, enough to fit the chamber. Can't remember now whether I went the whole distance but it was enough to work and I doubt whether bullet swaging was part of it.
I had a .45-70 bulge from the same cause the other day but couldn't see the whole round fitting back in the die, so I pulled the bullet first. (My new bullet puller is an electric-flex stripper gripping the bullet protruding from the top of the press. It marks the projectile less than multigrips
)
One thing that must not be forgotten is, of course,
lube the case before resizing.
24 March 2018, 18:42
p dog shooterquote:
Originally posted by ted thorn:
Remove the expander and decaping pin and size them loaded
I have done this a long time ago with limited success.
I don't do it any more I pull bullets from any loaded round that need to be resized again.
What do you do if you stick a loaded round in your die.
You can do it I don't any more.
24 March 2018, 18:54
jeffeossoMike,
suggest PoC of 1
24 March 2018, 19:01
Mike_DettorreJeffe,
Not sure I understand the shorthand.
Mike What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
24 March 2018, 19:20
ted thornMike
Give me a call when you get time.
________________________________________________
Maker of The Frankenstud Sling Keeper
Proudly made in the USA
Acepting all forms of payment
Inserting a loaded cartridge into a sizing die for the purpose of ironing out a budged crimp (valid procedure) is a lot different than completely inserting the whole cartridge in an attempt to move the shoulder back. That definitely can't be done. I should say, whilst it can be done, you are effectively sizing your bullets down at the same time; a bad thing; it will be very difficult and runs the risk of sticking it in the die, as suggested above.
I know you guys all are not new hand loaders.
24 March 2018, 19:31
AnotherAZWriterquote:
Originally posted by eagle27:
He couldn't understand why they would not chamber, I took one look and could see the shoulders had bulged slightly. I suspect his reloader mate had over crimped on the rounds loaded with the cannelured 165gr Hornady SST projectiles.
Might not be your problem but worth mentioning.
Exactly what I was thinking Eagle
24 March 2018, 21:18
B L O'ConnorMike, in re-reading your original post, you said you have a "batch of 300 WSM reloads that won't chamber in my new rifle, there were reloaded for my other WSM rifle."
Were those cases sized with a neck-sizing die or a FL die?
If a neck sizing die, you're probably dealing with chambers of two slightly different sizes, the older rifle having the larger chamber. (Brass shot in my LRPV .223 will fit in the chamber of my Stevens .223 after neck sizing, but brass shot in the Stevens require FL sizing before I can shoot them in my LRPV.)
If you'd FL sized that brass, you may well have a bulged case (too much resizing), or you may not have adjusted your die far enough down to reduce the dimensions of the brass for your new chamber (too little resizing).
Just my guess.
But I still think you ought to pull the bullets, collect the powder and FL size the cases (without decapper pin).
24 March 2018, 21:38
Mike_DettorreBL O'C,
Full length resized hence why I think I didn't adjust down far enough...
Plus I just attempted to insert a fired empty case from the first rifle into the second rifle and it won't go in.
Mike What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
24 March 2018, 22:41
ted thornquote:
Originally posted by dpcd:
Inserting a loaded cartridge into a sizing die for the purpose of ironing out a budged crimp (valid procedure) is a lot different than completely inserting the whole cartridge in an attempt to move the shoulder back. That definitely can't be done. I should say, whilst it can be done, you are effectively sizing your bullets down at the same time; a bad thing; it will be very difficult and runs the risk of sticking it in the die, as suggested above.
I know you guys all are not new hand loaders.
Snellstrom and tedthorn know Mike and our comment was tongue in cheek.....put there just to stir up a couple guys who like that sort of thing.......it worked but it was intended for a couple other members nonetheless
Sorry to those who were collateral damage
________________________________________________
Maker of The Frankenstud Sling Keeper
Proudly made in the USA
Acepting all forms of payment
Chambers vary among rifles. Not just in headspace but in diameter as well. Sometimes you have to use a small base die to reduce the head diameter enough to chamber brass fired in a larger chamber. I just had that issue with my new 6mm Dasher.
Brass can be challenging to find at times for the Dasher, so the smith gave me 50 rounds that had been fired in another rifle. Though the chambers for both rifles were cut with the same reamer my rifle had a tighter chamber. Even with shoulders pushed back the correct amount, the bolt on my rifle wouldn’t close on the brass fired in the other rifle. So I resized them with a 308 Win small base body die and they now fit in the chamber.
The smith also gave me 50 rounds that had been fired in my rifle. As I was searching for a load with this brass I wound up shooting a couple loads that were too hot. 33.0 grains of RL-15 is a very common load with 107 Matchkings and 33.6 is often considered the max. 33 grains is what I settled on, but I also tested loads at 33.3 and 33.6. With a tight custom BR action, pressure signs often don’t show up until you reload the brass. The 33.3 and 33.6 grain load brass had loose primer pockets and the bolt was difficult to close on those rounds after resizing. I tried the small base body die but it didn’t work with these.
So a small base die works great with brass fired in a larger chamber with normal loads, but if the brass has been hot loaded and overexpanded to the point where it loses its elasticity, the small base die may not work. Of course the moral is don’t make hot loads, but even when carefully and slowly working up
sometimes it happens....and we ruin brass that is hard to find and a fuss to make.
Anyway, my first LR BR match with this rifle, and my first match in 11 years, is tomorrow. I will make sure every piece of brass chambers easily before seating bullets. I don’t check loaded rounds because there is no safety on a BR rifle, but in a hunting rifle I will chamber every round that I take into the field.
You are acting like high schools girls if your intent was to create drama. Sounded like much of the nonsense I hear.
25 March 2018, 00:50
ted thornquote:
Originally posted by dpcd:
You are acting like high schools girls if your intent was to create drama. Sounded like much of the nonsense I hear.
You'r judgment won't cause me any lost sleep....you can bet your ass on that.
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25 March 2018, 05:19
Saeedquote:
Originally posted by Mike_Dettorre:
Saeed,
What are the factors that would drive working vs. not working?
If it is not the same rifle the originals were fired in.
Sometimes this sort of problem is not caused by the resizing die, but by the seating die.
Take a factory round, or a reloaded round that will chamber, and measure round the neck, at the case mouth, and see if they measure the same.
25 March 2018, 07:09
jeffeossoquote:
Originally posted by Mike_Dettorre:
Jeffe,
Not sure I understand the shorthand.
proof of concept .. find one that certainly doesn't work, tear it down, resize, and see..
btw, resizing loaded ammo is a darwin award waiting to happen
25 March 2018, 07:23
Mike_Dettorrejust an update...pulled a bullet
tried to chamber case, of course it failed as I knew it was not an overall length issue based on previous measurements.
took out the decapping rod, and kept turning the sizing die down a 1/4 of a turn at a time, re-trying after each 1/4 turn. After a few attempts, voila chambered case.
Mike What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
25 March 2018, 07:30
B L O'ConnorThanks for the info. I'm very happy that you now have a handle on your problem, and that you've shared that with us.
BL
29 March 2018, 00:10
eagle27About how many 1/4 turns did you have to turn your die down, from what you have said it sounds like a few and a 1/4 turn is quite a bit on the coarse die threads? When loading again for your other WSM rifle you will need to re-adjust your die otherwise your cases for that rifles chamber will be a little short and case life may suffer.
I don't know that you will get away with sizing all your cases for the shortest chamber. Of course they would work just like factory ammo does (fits all chambers mostly) but case life suffers when reloading.
Just a thought.
29 March 2018, 00:43
Mike_DettorreI think it was 3 which is about 54/1000.
Mike What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
30 March 2018, 02:56
bartsche
Mike ,are You saying you brought the shoulder back .054"?? That's a lot!.
roger
Old age is a high price to pay for maturity!!! Some never pay and some pay and never reap the reward. Wisdom comes with age! Sometimes age comes alone..
30 March 2018, 03:11
Mike_DettorreWell, I think so...
These were cases that were a combination of new and or fired in another rifle. I moved in the last couple of years so somethings go jumbled around from the reloading room.
If I did the math right 1 in 14 means each turn is approx .714 and 3/4 of a turn is .535.
But I know jack sh*t about that machining and metal stuff. I do know that brass is "springy" stuff so my understand is just because the die went down .54 doesn't mean the brass ended up .54 smaller.
Mike What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
30 March 2018, 03:53
JGRaiderGlad you got that figured out Mike. I had a RCBS die once (7mag FWIW) that had me stumped. Turns out every time I would FL size, on the "up stroke" the expander ball would actually pull the shoulders slightly forward causing some brass to not chamber. Like you, I screwed the die in slightly, problem solved. I neck size only now with a Lee collet die, using specific brass for specific rifle.
30 March 2018, 04:24
224VALManquote:
Originally posted by Mike_Dettorre:
I have a batch of 300 WSM reloads that won't chamber in my new rifle, there were reloaded for my other WSM rifle.
I am also assuming that when I sized them I did not set the sizing die down far enough enough relative for the new rifles chanber.
I also assuming the only thing I can do is pull the bullets reclaim the powder and bullets and remove the decapping pin, set the expander ball shallow and resize them.
Your suggestions?
I adjust my Sizing Dies to the OEM Instructions. I check EVERY piece of sized brass in a case gauge/ cartridge gauge before I install the primers. Eliminates headaches down the road with the finished loads. As some have mentioned here a Hornady Case Comparator can help with adjusting the sizing die.
https://www.lymanproducts.com/...eadspace-gauges.html
Some Days You Are the Windshield and Some Days You Are the Bug.
30 March 2018, 05:16
bartsche[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mike_Dettorre:
Well, I think so...
These were cases that were a combination of new and or fired in another rifle. I moved at in the last couple of years so somethings go jumbled around from the reloading room.
If I did the math right 1 in 14 means each turn is approx .714 and 3/4 of a turn is .535.
OK One full turn= .071" 3/4 of that =.0536"which is as you originally stated.
What I think happened was you moved the die down until it touched the shoulder and that could have been the die moving down perhaps .049" the shoulder was than moved back perhaps .003" to '006". No two rifles of the same caliber are going to have head spacing .050" difference. I could be wrong but if I am I'm going to spend less time on this forum and more time fishing.
roger
Old age is a high price to pay for maturity!!! Some never pay and some pay and never reap the reward. Wisdom comes with age! Sometimes age comes alone..