I've always cleaned my rifles from the muzzle end. Even the Heavy bbls. I use coated rods w/ soft brass guides. I've even held a patch slightly in the muzzle just to keep it free of the rod.

When through cleaning I wipe the chamber and throat area w/ cotton patches to remove all residue.

Contrary to what most believe and preach, I believe this to be just as good (and Better)as cleaning from the rear for many reasons. You don't have to worry about the rod and jag dragging against the muzzle when it exits and is drawn back in, You don't have to remove the bolt if your just doing a quick cleaning inbetween groups, and depending upon your range guidelines, it's just plain easier(at our range Muzzle must be up when the line is cold) etc, etc, etc.

Anyone else still do it the Old Fashioned Way?

Reloader

It seems to me that as long as the cleaning rod doesn't contact the rifling, it wouldn't make any difference. You would be able to use a shorter rod as well.

My M1's and M1A types with a guide, muzzle end for obivous reasons....still use the breach end for bolts actions, easier for me.

yes...
jeffe

Hey guys don't you know, according to these new day intellectuals, that you are doing that all wrong! I mean to them cleaning from the muzzle is like drinking rat poison. I mean us 60 years olds don't know a damn thing about anything to them. I clean from the muzzle all the time and guess what, over the years I haven't damaged a thing inside any rife yet! According to some of the new age golden boys out there that is an impossibility! I mean you must have damaged at least one rifle in your life time from cleaning from the muzzle an dnot using all the new age tech.

Hey Blob, could it be that you HAVE indeed damaged your rifles, but you're such a lousy shot anyway that you couldn't tell the diference?

(Just kidding!)

Well, I certainly clean my ML rifles from the muzzle! I use an old .348 Winchester case with the head cut off for a guide. I would NOT clean any rifle from the muzzle if the breech is accessible for inserting the cleaning rod.

Of course, M1's, M14's, etc., and lever actions must be cleaned from the muzzle unless you want to remove the breech bolt every time you clean a LA.

I do this with my lever guns only. Often I use just a Bore Snake unless I've shot quite a bit, then I use a muzzle guide so that I can give it a real cleaning with a rod.

I guess I clean my rifles from the muzzle end cause I use wipeout!!! (But then I push it out from the chamber side)

Gentlemen ----- If you shoot a rifle that is not a bolt action and cannot clean from the breach, be extremely careful, the crown is the accuracy of the barrel and if you dent, chip or mar it in any way you will be looking for a new barrel, unless you can accept 6 inch groups. If you clean once a week or once in 10 years, the same is true. If you shoot a bolt action and can clean from the breach, that is the method you should use to minumize harm to the crown. It is that simple with no if's, and's or
but's about it. It doesn't matter what rod or method you use, cleaning from the crown end will do the barrel harm someday. Only the barrel that is cleaned once in a lifetime may survive cleaning from the crown end without harm if the cleaner is extremely careful doing the job. Yep --- many an M-1 has been cleaned from the crown end, and many have been recrowned or rebarreled many times. Good shooting.

quote:

It doesn't matter what rod or method you use, cleaning from the crown end will do the barrel harm someday. Only the barrel that is cleaned once in a lifetime may survive cleaning from the crown end without harm if the cleaner is extremely careful doing the job.

With all due respect, I think you are full of prunes. Using a bore guide PROPERLY will preclude damage to the crown, period. End of story.

quote:

Originally posted by Doubless:
[With all due respect, I think you are full of prunes. Using a bore guide PROPERLY will preclude damage to the crown, period. End of story.

The Otis cleaning system (a glorified pull thru) allowes cleaning from the chamber end.
The manual makes the point that a lot of gunk can end up in the throat,chamber, locking lug area, mag. etc. Though one AR poster uses an empty chambered case to block most gunk flung of a bore brush.
JL.

Doubtless ----- If you are sticking a bore guide in the muzzle end of your barrel you will affect the crown of your barrel someday, and it doesn't have to be a bore guide anything stuck in the crown will do it. I cringe each and every time I use a bore sight device, and I will not let anyone else do that job for me, beleave me that initial little chore can destroy for good the accuracy of a barrel for it's lifetime. I use many bore guides and they all are used from the breach end. There are bore guides that are used from the muzzle end, 95% are home made and will do damage someday, even those designed professionaly will do damage someday, if used to any extent. This is not new information for shooters that shoot extensively. Real simple fact, clean from the breach end if at all possible.

I clean my rigs from the breech end, but I guess it's more out of convenience than anything; it's just 'feels' better to me to have what seems like better control of the rod and rifle.

I can see that you would have to be careful not to get solvent in the chamber/action if cleaning from the muzzle, but as long as it is cleaned up thoroughly, shouldn't be any problem; angle of rifle should be the determining factor of amount of seepage.

I use a graphite rod (or two) when cleaning and only brass or aluminum bodied tips/jags/brushes, so I really have no concerns about these items damaging any part of the rifling/chamber/crown, no matter how they are used.

Now, if I was silly and bought a stainless steel rod and steel tips, I would have to be much more careful about barrel damage. I've never understood the idea or benefits of running a steel rod or one of the stainless steel "Vornado" brushes up and down the barrel.

irwin

The crown is very sensitive is all I will say...some guns like Sav.99s and Win 94s have to be cleaned from the crown, so I don't clean them often and only then with wipe out..the fewer passes the better...

To clean a bolt gun from the bore is simply not smart...but to each his own.

I clean my barrels form both directions.
Always have and always will,more so from the bore though.I think a guy damaging the bore or the crown with a cleaning rod is doing it very sloppy or using a piece of rusty rebar as a cleaning rod.

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
The crown is very sensitive is all I will say...some guns like Sav.99s and Win 94s have to be cleaned from the crown,.

Before I bought a Otis kit, I used to carefully insert a rod from the muzzle into a M.94, insert a jag & rag & cleaner into the open action, carefully screw the rod into the jag, and pull thru to the muzzle. And that way I could get a very tight patch thru to dry out.
John.

This is close to topic if off...when going onto and off of small arms ranges in the Army, the safetycrats developed this strange desire to make DAMN SURE that each individual rifleman had a clear weapon by having the Safety Officer ram a cleaning rod down the barrel, from the muzzle, contact the bolt, and strike it with the end of the rod to make it jump free of the bolt stop and close. It makes me want to puke when I see this, thinking of the damage to crowns and bolt faces that we are causing ourselves. Some of the brass across the Army have tried to stop this, not because of the damage it causes to the weapon, but some safety accidentally left a rod section in one rifle, which caused the barrel to blow up on the first round. It would be just as good to visually inspect the chamber, and if REALLY necessary to inspect the barrel, shotgun the action and look down it from the breech. We are too silly.

Marines, go ahead and bash away, we deserve it on this one...

quote:

Originally posted by Reloader:
I've always cleaned my rifles from the muzzle end. Even the Heavy bbls. I use coated rods w/ soft brass guides. I've even held a patch slightly in the muzzle just to keep it free of the rod.

When through cleaning I wipe the chamber and throat area w/ cotton patches to remove all residue.

Contrary to what most believe and preach, I believe this to be just as good (and Better)as cleaning from the rear for many reasons. You don't have to worry about the rod and jag dragging against the muzzle when it exits and is drawn back in, You don't have to remove the bolt if your just doing a quick cleaning inbetween groups, and depending upon your range guidelines, it's just plain easier(at our range Muzzle must be up when the line is cold) etc, etc, etc.

Anyone else still do it the Old Fashioned Way?

Reloader

Yes.

Sorry, never, not even lever guns.

quote:

I clean my barrels form both directions.
Always have and always will,more so from the bore though.I think a guy damaging the bore or the crown with a cleaning rod is doing it very sloppy or using a piece of rusty rebar as a cleaning rod.

My sentiments exactly.

If you are going to "drag" the rod against the crown or "chip" the crown w/ a tool, you have absolutely no business cleaning a rifle in the first place.

Cleaning from the muzzle is no more damaging than cleaning from the breech as long as proper techniques are used. In all reality damage from rods and tools occurs no matter which end you clean from.

Good Luck!

Reloader

Let me add to my above two post the following information that may shed light on the my point of view. I am not what they call a bolt action prude who disdains all rifle actions except the bolt. I have owned BAR's and Browning and Marlin lever actions. I shot many a M-1 and had a buddy who shot extensively at the military type shoots. I still have a lever action, my original hunting rifle a 30-30 Marlin Model 336. I cleaned them all from the muzzle with great care. I always hated the job and one reason I hated it was getting rid of the gunk and keeping it out of the magazine area. Over the years I killed much game with my BAR's and the Browning BLR. I still never enjoyed cleaning them, therefore didn't do it as often as I needed to. I shoot Bolt actions mostly now and do it extensively like most people golf or whatever they do with their leasure time. I hunt game all over North America and have one trip to Africa under my belt. I shoot extensively to obtain the best accuracy possible with my rifles. All that shooting has taught me that in order to have that accuracy I have to keep the barrels clean and I need to protect that crown, otherwise the accuracy falls off considerably. Some barrels need cleaning every 25-30 shots, come need it only every 100 shots, each has it's own personality. You can never be to careful when cleaning, and I still don't like the chore but it is a necessary evil if you shoot extensively. Different bullets and powder inpart fouling to the barrel and each is a story in itself. Bottom line, know your rifle and how much it needs to be cleaned, clean from the breach end if at all possible, protect that crown, and your rifle will treat you as nice as you can shoot it. Good shooting.