Folks,

I'd like to ask your help in fleshing out an evolving fantasy of mine. I spent the first half of my life living and hunting on the Big Island of Hawaii. There were then and there are now loads of pigs, goats, and sheep to hunt 365 days a year. I took a lot of animals during that time.

I moved to Wyoming for a job and stayed for the hunting. But dropping the hammer two or three times a year to fill the freezer with elk and antelope do not compare favorably of late with my memories of pig hunting.

I work with a couple of fellows from Texas and boy do they love their home state. That said, each of them describe hell as "about 15° cooler than Texas". I've been spending way too much time looking over Jeffeosso's "pics of DECENT hogs" and I'm starting to wonder if Texas might hold a spot for the next chapter of my life. I've never vacationed much, opting instead to live where the best hunting is not far from my backdoor.

As I look over Jeffeosso's thread I see Bob in TX with some shots of pigs in lush green terrain. Bobby Tomek, of Shiner, Texas, is shooting hogs, day or night, with whatever flavor of TC suits his fancy. Dustoffer, I don't know where you live now, but looking at your posted pictures, I'd be missing that place too. Jeff Sullivan certainly isn't hurting for things to do for fun either by the looks of his picture layouts.

I've never been any further east or south than Denver and Texas is a big place. I see pictures of hogs killed in northern Texas, in western Texas, in Texas Hill country. I really like the greener and wetter stuff but the one picture from Dustoffer showing all those pigs and a few deer near a feeder is keeping me up at night... even though the country is considerably drier.

There are no "deals" on land in northwestern Wyoming. In fact even during these times property prices in my area make ME sick to my stomach. About half the folks who write about hog hunting in Texas consider them vermin and the other half charge to let people hunt. Are there any deals on places to live in Texas where there are just boatloads of pigs? The odds of me actually being able to pull off a move are considerably less favorable than those facing the Cardinals in the Super Bowl... but a guy can dream can't he?

Chime in if you have the time. Thank you!

Matt

BTW Go Cardinals!!

Matt-

Texas is a great place, no doubt. But you mentioned something significant to consider: the heat -- and, in my locale, humidity. I've lived here all my life and still can't get comfortable during the long summer. And right now, we are in the midst of an extreme drought.

The only good thing about the drought is that the fire ants have been stymied somewhat. They are perhaps the worst part of Texas living.

For the greatest in game variety, the far southwestern portion of the state may be king. You have mule deer, whitetail, antelope, javelina, hogs, predators including fox, coyotes, bobcats and cougar along with an assortment of smaller critters, including jackrabbits. A little north into the trans-Pecos region will also add prairie dogs to the equation. There are hogs there, though not in the numbers you'll find closer to the southern, coastal and eastern regions.

If you prefer the wide open spaces, western Texas, the Panhandle and Palo Duro regions feature incredible scenery. The Davis Mountains are as pictureque a setting as you'll ever find, and where the rimrocks spill off into the Rio Grande, you'll find some of the most rugged and remote terrain as you will anywhere in the world.

In the Hill Country, in addition to liberal limits on whitetail,you'll also find quite a few free-ranging exotics, particularly axis deer. And if a rugged hunt is on your horizon, chasing aoudad in the mountains of West Texas will tax every bit of your physical endurance and ability.

Back to whitetails: management practices around the state are getting better, and even the Hill Country, where sheer numbers have always been a prime allure, truly nice bucks are getting more and more common. But the overall numbers continue to remain impressive, and Llano County is still regarded as the whitetail capital of the world.

Texas really has a ton to offer -- if you can put up with the heat, humidity and fire ants.

If you do decide to make the move, let me go ahead and say "Welcome to Texas!'

One other thing: Even though most of the state consists of privately-owned land, plenty of public hunting awaits those who choose to take advantage of it. A $40 APH permit gives you year-round access to more than a million acres, and the state also has a drawing system for a number of species.

Below is a deer I took on a drawing hunt near San Angelo in December of 2007. Below that are 2 bucks taken by a friend of mine and one of his buddies during another public hunt in 2007 at the Chaparral Wildlife Management Area in South Texas. So even on these type of hunts, nice results await those willing to be patient and work a bit for the deer.

The 2 Chaparral deer were solid 140 and 150-class bucks.

I believe Texas has no state income tax, you might think that is a draw. If you find yourself in Northeast Texas you will have to come hunt with me occassionly, so chose wisely.

I believe ,i would love to live there ,i have some of my best friend in USA and its my plan in the future to buy a small property to hunt and stay with my american friends ,Texas its a great state ,i would love to hunt with you in the future ,its in my plans to go with billinthewild to hunt free range nilgai and hogs.Juan

Bobby,

Thanks for taking the time to pass on Texas info and pictures of those beautiful deer. I've never hunted whitetails and those were shooters for sure. That heat/humidity sounds formidable. I lived at 700 feet above sea level in Hawaii on the wet side of the island and rarely saw the mercury hit 80 [cool 50's at night]. Here in Jackson it was 19 below 0 four days ago so it's kind of hard for me to grasp the kind of heat you and others are trying to describe to me.

Larry, Juan it would truly be a pleasure to meet and tell stories. The only thing that comes close the enjoyment of the hunt is sharing time with other hunters.

Bobby, up here in what lately passes for the land of almost endless winter, I'm dreaming of seeing tons of pigs and turkeys. Then being able to hunt out the back door or after a short drive. Some of those pictures of grassy hills with trees looks awfully close to heaven to me.

Thanks All.
Matt

Matt-

One positive for Texas is that in many areas, you really don't need lots of land to hunt. Some smaller farms and cattle operations are loaded with game.

I don't know if you are into fishing, but there's plenty to be had here in Texas, including some excellent saltwater angling.

If you are tired of those winters, then a move to Texas should definitely be on your horizon.

Here are a couple shots showing some of the greenery in years when there is ample rainfall.

you might consider that texas has 6 distinct regions, with differing climates. and they can all overlap!.
piney woods, hill country, costal pains, south texas, and desert .. only the desert is managable in terms of humidity...

fire ants, skeeters, sand fleas, scorpions, and every native venomous snake in north america.. if you get here, you'll have to learn (you won't remember) EVERYTHING has at least claws, thorns, stingers, teeth, spines, and poison .. sometimes a couple at time

ever seen "fiberglass plant" and nettles, and poison ivy wrapping poison oak, strangling a mesquite tree, on a fireant hill, chasing rattle snakes and getting eaten by skeeters?

the heat will sap you ... and then the "cold" will make you feel silly... heck, 40degs aint cold.. except in houston, where it's 25mph wind and 100% humidity.

Girls are nice, fellas are friendly, grandparents will feed you tea and cornbread till you can't walk anymore..

Just do a web search for real estate agents in Texas and get busy.
PM if you are interested in a turnkey deal around Rocksprings, Texas on 53 acres, across the road from me!

hnts4fun--

My picture of the herd of swine and the two deer you picked out in the background was taken on our lease in LaSalle County, about 75 miles south of San Antonio.

Many of the ranches in the county are leased, and I would guess 30-40% are behind high fence. On a good lease, expect to pay $3,000 and up per gun per season.

Bobby, Jeffeosso, RVL III, Dustoffer...thanks for your replies. I have been hitting the real estate sites and have enjoyed boning up on what's out there. As Jeffeosso pointed out Texas is a big place with 6 different climate zones and lots of things that crawl, bite, and sting. Where, in that great state, are pigs a problem as opposed to a cash crop? RVL III is 50 acres with food plots/feeders and water enough land to keep pigs coming in? Thanks again for your input,

Matt

You'll need to do some research.. 20 years ago, rock springs was $250 an acre, list, and in the middle of NO WHERE.. if you are retired, might be okay... without water, or a well, no ammount of land can support nearly anything.. and that's cactus+rattlesnake+illegal immigrants cutting through the property kind of country

If you want to hunt pigs, MY preference is east of i35, the wetter the better .. the "quadrant" of the state, east of 35, north of i10 is where I do most of my hunting .. i don't hunt whitetail, so I don't care about whitetail racks.. i hunt pigs, and exotics when i get a chance.

50 acres in Ace, or Plum Creek, or Waller country would probably be enough, especially if close to a national forrest, to hunt on.

Hmm, ace and dodge and plum creek may not be on any maps...

The problem with land in east texas is water.. can be too much, and feet high, from time to time, and then there's hurricanes...

Jeffeosso...

Pigs, pigs, pigs, and more pigs is what I'm dreaming of. I'm 25 years removed from being able to hunt them anytime I wanted. I didn't always get one but I sure had fun trying.

Dustoffer, thanks for the LaSalle County locale. Our long cold winters, Google Earth, and info posted on this thread, mean I'm going to be researching a bit.

Bobby, those are truly beautiful deer!

Thanks.
Matt

It really depends, like most things, on how much you have to spend. As far as rural lands go, basically Central Texas anywhere in a very large circle around Austin/San Antonio and anywhere that can even be stretched to call "hill country" will be fairly expensive per acre, ESPECIALLY if you take into account it's agricultural value, that is what it can raise. Most of that area is limited either by soil type or rainfall or both. It is really attractive and in good times goes up faster i price than other areas. In these bad times, it may get cheaper, but so far has not really cracked. There are still some semi-reasonably priced areas, such as Leon County with careful shopping and patience. But that is really East of the area I'm talking about.

Basically anywhere S of San Antonio will be expensive, especially based on it's agricultural value. The answer is simple, (and I'm painting with a very broad brush here, I'm not trying to sell anything nor am I in the real estate business except as an owner/investor) BIG DEER. The golden triangle lands START at $1500 an acres and UP, way up for land that won't raise a cow on 40 acres or more. Personally, I think a good golden triangle tract is a great investment AT THE RIGHT PRICE because it is DEER COUNTRY and in Texas, as far as I can see, that will ALWAYS bring big money. Again, it should come down, more places are hitting the market as the credit crunch/oil collapse take effect but so far I'm not seeing any real deflation in asking prices. However, if you've got cash and are patient, a deal can almost certainly be found and that is true for all of Texas.

Deep SW and far West Texas is beautiful but basically desert. Land can be found quite cheap and that's what it's worth. There are some BIG tracts on the Pecos River now in Val Verde county that have come down in price and could be bought reasonably if you have a million or more available. Excellent deer and quail country but has a serious cactus problem. No hogs at this time as far as I know and it is desert type land which spells HOT in the summer.

Again, using a very broad brush, that leaves 4 areas of Texas, the Panhandle (cold but has some promise for hogs and deer in counties on the Red River, buy river frontage if at all possible), the long strip running across the top of Texas next to the Red River (again, on the western edge of this area you can have some big deer and hogs on the river and the land is still reasonable). This land is basically what I call population pushed in price by it's proximity to the DFW area. Anything close to DFW is mostly priced out of what I'd call good value but that's always in the eye of the beholder and how deep your pockets are....

Next is SE Texas, around Houston and running up the Eastern border.....some great hunting land in here, but in the last few years prices have risen quite a bit. One good thing about this whole region is that it grows good high quality marketable timber (which is in the tank now, but patience is the watch word on timber). Closer to Houston, check out Liberty County. Further N, look at Shelby (big oil play now so you probably won't get minerals), San Augustine, and Nacogdoches counties. San Augustine, the county seat of SA county, is a piss ant town and always has been but there are some good timber land there and it is next to Toledo Bend Lake. I know, family goes back there to 1830s. Land in this broad area will be priced from about $1000 an acre to $2500 or so. Just as an example, I have some land in Shelby County, that under normal timber pricing conditions (which we aren't in now, it is down roughly 50% from normal and about 75% from it's higher levels) that will easily cut $4000 an acre in pine timber but it is top quality, big site index land.

Finally we get to the area with which I am currently most familiar with land values, NE Texas. There are some great hunting ranches here, but due to an influx of Floridians and the pop push from DFW land prices have risen substantially (a real rough factor of 4x would be about right in the 10 years) in the last few years. At the high about a year or so back, what I'd call common farm/recreational land was pushing $1500 to $2000 an acre in BIG tracts. Smaller tracts (less than 200 acres) tend to be higher. Asking prices are still high but selling prices are getting cheaper. I just heard of a high quality tract in the 2000 acre size selling for $1250 an acre. This is Post Oak Savanna and is not prime timber country, generally speaking, but it does have plenty of hogs and deer and ducks, no quail. For hunting be sure to get something with live water on it, the Red River is a great hunting lane. At the time I put my places together up here, this was the cheapest what I call "rainfall" land (47 in/yr locally) in Texas, that is no longer true and I'd call it fully valued in relation to other areas.

Not having a clue what you have to spend or what your real "buttons" are when it comes to what you want in land, all in all, especially if you want a smaller place, if it was my money, I'd strongly consider the East Texas Piney Woods. Many of the farms there are smaller and therefore more affordable and you have the timber kicker, which WILL pay for the land if you can buy it right, long term. If you want to narrow your "wants" and available money down some more, I can probably get more specific.

I want to stress this is a VERY GENERAL ramble on Texas land and there are many exceptions to these observations but I keep up with it pretty well as I'm always looking to buy or sell land as an investment.

Gatogordo,

Thanks for your thoughtful and informative response. I don't even know what my real buttons are. I've only lived in Hawaii and Jackson and those places picked me more than the other way around.

I was quite surprised at the number of million dollar plus properties I'd found in different parts of Texas; but your explanation as to the forces driving those prices put things into perspective.

Right now I'm looking out my window at a bluebird sunny day that's so clear I can just about touch the peaks of the southern Teton mountain range. It's also 7 degrees above 0 with 5 feet of snow outside. The upside is there were mule deer tracks in my driveway a few days ago, and a couple of moose cruising the neighborhood before that. With 3 solid months of winter yet to go, I'm in the day dreaming mode for sure. Thank you for an excellent overview and I look forward to picking your brain some more in the future.

Matt

I live SW of Rocksprings off the Nueces River. Land prices here are still relatively reasonable, around $2000/acre for smaller parcels, and less for larger ones. Finding a lease close by isn't easy, though. However, my little 8 acre property has produced consistently on axis deer, and the 70 acres that I live on (parent's place) puts us on hogs from the porch from time to time.

Troy

Troy,

What...no moose from the porch? Thanks for the info. Wyoming is high altitude desert in most places and I've had a blast prowling around out there. I like what you say about hunting the relatively smaller places and the pig off the porch story. Works for me.

Thanks.
Matt

hnts4fun,

You might find this website VERY useful:

Lands of Texas

It's a listing service for land in Texas. There are currently over 15,000 listings on the website and you can search by county or by region. Hope this helps.....and I hope you move to our great state and enjoy some of the best hunting in the world.

FYI.....region 14 is definitely where you want to focus if you want the widest variety of game in one area. Region 14 consists of the following counties: Medina, Uvalde, Kinney, Bandera, Real, Kerr, Edwards, Kimble, Sutton, Menard, Schleicher, Crockett, and Val Verde.

quote:

Originally posted by Eland Slayer:
FYI.....region 14 is definitely where you want to focus if you want the widest variety of game in one area. Region 14 consists of the following counties: Medina, Uvalde, Kinney, Bandera, Real, Kerr, Edwards, Kimble, Sutton, Menard, Schleicher, Crockett, and Val Verde.

That area is great pig hunting I can find you a nice place there if you want I hunt in kinney county now and love it.

Matt,
You have a PM.

Robert, I sent a PM your way. Eland Slayer, I'm grateful for the search link, it's much easier and more effective than what I've been doing. I know I have to sort out "which Texas" I'm best suited to but Crusher, ES, and Robert...you have given specific counties the thumbs up as hunters and I sure appreciate your input.

Take care all while I dig into the research end of things!

Matt

quote:

Originally posted by hnts4fun:
Gatogordo,

Thanks for your thoughtful and informative response. I don't even know what my real buttons are. I've only lived in Hawaii and Jackson and those places picked me more than the other way around.

I was quite surprised at the number of million dollar plus properties I'd found in different parts of Texas; but your explanation as to the forces driving those prices put things into perspective.

Right now I'm looking out my window at a bluebird sunny day that's so clear I can just about touch the peaks of the southern Teton mountain range. It's also 7 degrees above 0 with 5 feet of snow outside. The upside is there were mule deer tracks in my driveway a few days ago, and a couple of moose cruising the neighborhood before that. With 3 solid months of winter yet to go, I'm in the day dreaming mode for sure. Thank you for an excellent overview and I look forward to picking your brain some more in the future.

Matt

Howzit Bruddah Matt,

I just caught wind of your story as it came to the top...

Bruddah you're living my dream!

I'm born and raised Hawaii like most of my family! I love it and wouldn't think of living anywhere else in the world!

Buttttt....

Times is getting real tough here in Hawaii just trying to raise a family of four...Just like any other place in the USA it tough right now but IMHO even more so as we are so ISOLATED from the rest of the continental USA...

I'm proud to be HAWAIIAN and I'm proud to be able to still survive here!!!

SURVIVE is the KEY!!!

I am going to be 48 yrs old in a few more months and I've never left my island home except to Africa with my 19 yr old son 6 months ago!

And you know what!?!?!?

I am LATE in discovering there's a BIG whole wide world out there!!!

For me living in WYOMING would be a dream come true! Why???

Cause its SOMEPLACE different and home will always be home, I can always come back if after I spread my wings and find myself unhappy I can always come back home!!!

I say go for it as whatevers in your HEART....Whether there or there its all GOOD...

I have a very good HAOLE buddy in Wyoming and he says its still booming there in terms of jobs and the economy and CNN News backed that up several weeks ago!

Yes, its TOUGH to accept change but keep your ATTITUDE in the right place and keep your heart upon ALMIGHTY GOD and HE shall direct your paths!!!

I wish you only the BEST whether WYOMING or TEXAS...find your destiny in HIM...

Live the DREAM bruddah I'll be praying for you!!!

If I was single I would go for it, but with a family I have to take things really SLOW...

However, I'm not giving up on my dreams and one day that climate and that beautiful country you're in will see me face to face...GOD willing!!!

Aloha!

Bruddah Ro

Aloha Roland!

I've been following your posts for a couple of years now and you are truly amazing. I've been hunting since I was seven years old and can't think of a whole lot that I'd rather do. You, on the other hand, picked up the ball a few years back and man you've never stopped running. It's been fun reading about your rifle selection, Big Island hunts, and then Africa! You and your son are making up for lost time in the hunting venue for sure.

25 winters under my belt and they just seem to be getting colder and longer, probably just my imagination. The thought of Texas during a few of the winter months might be just the ticket. By the way, the African bug is gnawing away at me as well. SBT, a frequent poster on AR, and I have worked together for over 20 years in Jackson. He's headed to Africa this fall on his fourth trip... this time for elephant. I've spent hundreds of hours with his pictures and it looks like a blast. At this point in time, I just can't get used to the idea of spending so much money to go somewhere for a couple of weeks; when I can go somewhere and hunt every day. I've been fortunate enough to live in some pretty cool hunting areas but we'll just have to see how this plays out.

Take care and breathe some of that warm sweet scented Hawaiian air for me, as it is 10 below zero here in downtown Jackson. Keep the adventures going Roland... for you and your kids... it's a great ride.

Matt

PS you have a PM

PM sent Matt...

And thanks for all you shared!!!

Now I understand where you're coming from and your LIFE has even been waaay bigger than my dream!!!

...a BIG SHAKA to you my brother!!!

I salute you and I'm super PROUD to hear what you've been able to accomplish thus far!!!

...can't wait to see the rest to come in the future!

God Bless and A HUI HOU...stay in touch please!