The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Guns, Politics, Gunsmithing & Reloading Optics Leupold "No Warranty" ScopeGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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| One of Us |
There is a 3X Leupold scope from the custom shop for sale on ebay. The box is labeled made for D'Arcy Echols. The curious part is the side of the adjustment housing has stamped "No Warranty" and "NFS". Has anyone ever seen this on a Leupold and I wonder if Leupold would in fact refuse to service the scope. NFS to me means not for sale so it might have originally been a show sample. I have nevere seen this before. | ||
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Flea bay has a lot of bogus (counterfeit)scopes for sale.Just realize it is buyer beware situation ,because Fleabay has had this brought to their attention and do not seem to care. | |||
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I'm not at all sure on the NFS scope, perhaps it was made as a prototype for testing by Echols. However, the guy has another more or less identical FX 3X scope that is almost certainly real. First, his location is not "smelly". Second, his sales records (feedback) does not include a bunch of NIB Leupies. Third, he has a 14 day money back guarantee which will be backed up by ebay if he does not pay your money back. Fourth, Leupold did make that scope for a short time in the same time period as the invoice he shows. Finally, the serial #s are clearly visible, I'd call Leupold and ask. If I wanted a 3x, I'd buy the second one without hesitation and check it out when I got it. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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EBAY seems very buyer friendly. The seller may state that you pay return shipping, but if there is a problem, that aint so. EBAY will resolve the issue and it usually ends up you keep the product unless seller provides a mailer. | |||
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Since I buy something on Ebay every once in awhile I would like to know more about this. Where does this information come from. What types of scopes are being counterfeited? Who is doing it? Have you personally experienced this yourself? | |||
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Here's one on here, CFs in many areas are common on Ebay. Usually they do little or nothing about it. I've quit bothering to report CF coins for that reason. http://forums.accuratereloadin...1421043/m/4371004212 xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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Zeiss and Leupold.A friend bought a VX2 2x7 Leupold that is counterfeit.The Wi.DOJ is pursuing the matter. | |||
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A 2-7X counterfeit would certainly be possible, but the counterfeits (more accurately "knock offs") are usually advertised as something like 6-32X or the like, intended to appeal to novices with a price 1/3 that of a genuine Leupold. | |||
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A knock off is a copy of a product with a different brand name on it, often sounding similar. For example a 2nd rate copy of a Leupold® Vari-X III marked "Leopard Vex III". Knocking off is legal as long as it doesn't violate patents and trademarks. A counterfeit is a copy made to look exactly, or nearly exactly, like a product and branded with the original product maker's mark. For example, a copy of a Leupold® Vari-X III marked "Leupold® Vari-X III". In other words it is created so as to fool the purchaser into believing it is the genuine article. Counterfeiting products is illegal.
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It's purely a matter of semantics, but from what I've seen of these scopes they more closely fall into the "knock off" category. They look nothing like a genuine Leupold, and the word "Leupold" written on them doesn't even copy the Leupold logo. To class them as "counterfeits" is a bit like calling the small yellow piece of paper with "$10" printed on it which comes in a Monopoly set a counterfeit Ten-Dollar bill. Most of these scopes don't even use the "gold ring" associated with Leupold, which, by the way, many Leupold competitors do use. It is the misrepresentation (or usually inference) that they are actually Leupolds where the violation of the law occurs. A "counterfeit" on the other hand, is an item which attempts to appear so much like the original that it can be mistaken for the original by an unsuspecting buyer; the representation of a dissimilar item as the genuine article does not make it "counterfeit" any more than calling a cat a "dog" makes the cat a counterfeit dog. As I say, it is a matter of semantics, and we have no real disagreement (unless you insist on finding one where none exists). And although attempted counterfeit Leupolds may exist, the scopes I've thus far seen misrepresented as "Leupolds" haven't been anywhere close enough in appearance or specifications to qualify as a counterfeit. But maybe I just haven't run across the counterfeit Leupolds. | |||
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Ah! I see you posted the Leupold warning from its website from some time back. It is true that Leupold refers to these scopes as "counterfeits", and I have no quarrel with their use of that term in this context. They could have just as appropriately called them "knock offs", which would convey the same information and warning. It is because these scopes are hardly even poor efforts to copy the appearance of a genuine Leupold, and that the closest connection to a Leupold scope is the word "Leupold" printed on them that I feel they are more appropriately described as "knock offs", but that's simply my interpretation of the subtleties of the two terms. After all, the word "counterfeit" is a very old and very well established formal word in the English language, while the term "knock off" is closer to slang, so a precise and universal definition of the latter is not necessarily described other than by its common usages, which can vary with dialects and customs. | |||
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Stonecreek, not trying to pull this off topic but I must tell you that it is not a matter of semantics. They are two different words meaning two different things. Anyone in manufacturing, wholesale, or retail knows the difference. Knock offs are legal and every top dollar designer dress, purse or pair of shoes gets knocked off by almost everybody in the business. But make a Coach purse that uses the Coach name and logo, even if the design is unlike any Coach purse ever made, and you have crossed the line into counterfeiting. Seiko has been knocking off Rolex for years but the watches say Seiko. On the other hand, it is easy to find street vendors in Thailand who will sell you as many counterfeit Rolex® watches using Seiko digital movements but marked Rolex® as you want to buy. We used to call them "Lowlex" watches. Once a friend bought one for $35 and a guy working in a USA jewelry store offered him $2500 for it! The feds regularly roll up counterfeit goods and counterfeiters. Scopes marked Leupold® that are not Leupold® are counterfeits, illegal to manufacture in the USA, illegal to import, and illegal to sell. A good quality Leupold knock off by Pentax, Nikon, or Bushnell might be a decent scope for the money. A Leupold counterfeit is contraband and junk. . | |||
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Firstly, a digital watch does NOT have hands!, ...so it can't look even remotely like a Rolex. The really cheap imitation Rolex units would have a quartz movement, and despite 'looking like' a rolex would still stand out like glowing red dogs balls....and for a very simple obvious reason. The guy in the Jewellery shop must have been a complete & utter ding-dong not to notice the screaming obvious. In fact, anyone who could notice the difference dont really know shit about watches. Any jewellery shop assessor with even half a brain of product knowledge would tell instantly that watch was not a Rolex, and at the same time a poor attempt copy. In the case of the very good Rolex copies[ie; non-quartz automatics] where one may not easily tell from the outside, one would then use due diligence to take off the back cover and view the internals before handing over $000s to buy it. Once you take the back cover off, a non-genuine rolex calibre/movement is very easy to spot. The higher quality replica watches actually are not that bad for the money[typically $250], since they still do often include a genuine HQ swiss ETA 2824 automatic calibre....its just not an in-house Rolex 3135 calibre. ETA base movements are used by a long list of globally respected watch companies, like TagHeuer,Longines,Glashutte,Hublot,Omega, Brietling, Panerai, are just to name a few. | |||
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The seller contacted Leupold and was told scopes so marked were provided free to gun writers and other prominent people in the industry. Whether Leupold would repair it free in the event of a problem is unclear. | |||
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Like I said, if you want the scope, but the other identical scope he has for the same price that is DEFINITELY under Leupold's warranty. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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I prefer a heavy duplex is the reason I simply don't "buy the other one". | |||
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Well, for another $24 bucks, $399, you can buy one NIB with the reticle of your choice from Leupold. Or....you can lose .5 magnification and buy a basically identical scope in 2.5x with a heavy duplex from BearBasin for $270. Not that my opinion counts for much since I am not a dangerous game hunter, but I would prefer 2.5x instead of 3x for a true DG scope. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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Well, Grenadier, I see you are an adherent of the Donald Trump school of diplomacy. I posted: "As I say,it is a matter of semantics, and we have no real disagreement (unless you insist on finding one where none exists)." However, it seems you insist. So, here are the definitions of the two terms in question, stated ver batim from Dictionary.com: knockoff or knock-off noun 1.an act or instance of knocking off. 2.an unlicensed copy of something, especially fashion clothing, intended to be sold at a lower price than the original. counterfeit noun 3. an imitation intended to be passed off fraudulently or deceptively as genuine; forgery. If the "Leupolds" were to be "passed off as genuine", then the sellers would be looking for genuine Leupold prices and they would be appropriately termed counterfeit. Since they were offered for sale "at a lower price than the original", then the "Leupolds" would be knock-offs. Does a guy trying to pass a counterfeit $100 bill say to his mark "Here's a $100 bill, but I'll take two twenties for it"? Of course not, because it is a counterfeit, not a knock-off, so he asks $100 in value for exchange for it. Understand? The hucksters trying to sell ersatz (go look it up) Leupolds never try to get the full price of a real Leupold for them, because they are knock-offs. So I was mistaken to call it a matter of semantics. It is a matter of definition, and though it pains me to reveal it, you are in the wrong, sir. | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Guns, Politics, Gunsmithing & Reloading Optics Leupold "No Warranty" Scope
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