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As I prepare for my next DG safari, I have found myself thinking that load development and zeroing, and confirmation of functioning, are the only reasons I practice. I use the same rifles on safari year after year, and by all objective standards, I use them to good effect. Once I have the right bullet at the right velocity, hitting point of aim in a clean and well-functioning rifle, I stop shooting. For me, that's usually no more than 10-20 shots on paper, including from the bench, and also standing, off of a rest for the non-trigger pulling hand. After that minimum bit of shooting, I have begun to ask myself, what good does it do to keep burning powder and throwing copper down range? Especially in this era of component shortages. After due consideration, my answer these days is that it does no good at all. Practice, beyond the degree stated above, at least for me, at this stage of my hunting life, is overrated to the point of being unnecessary. Thoughts? Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | ||
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I would have agreed with before last year, but no more. I was very busy at work and hadn't shot. Made one trip to the range before leaving on a hunt in Tanzania to sight in. Arrived jet lagged and shot terrible during the customary zero check. Not normal. Shot horribly hit and miss the entire trip. Also not normal. Going back next year and will be spending some range time beforehand. You can get too complacent after you've shot for a lot of years. I did last year. | |||
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Mike, What rifles do you use on all of your safaris? Do you now only hunt DG with one rifle or are using the same rifle for plains game too? I used 3 rifles for my North America hunting career a .270, .340 Wea and a .300 Wea. I knew all the rifles intimately and where they would shoot with their carefully selected loads. I didn’t fire more than 10-20 rounds per year with those rifles. Usually one or two range sessions with a 100yd target and a 500 yd target. Now I just started African hunting and I am starting with new rifles. Starting with new rifles, it kind of rekindled the old enjoyment of working up loads and getting familiar with the new rifles and building new memories . I am definitely of the mind set I will not go on a hunt without my own highly tested rifles and scopes. Having my own equipment adds a lot of enjoyment and are a intricate part of my hunts and experiences. 4WD | |||
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Mike, I fire no more than 3-5 shots from each of my two hunting rifles every year before our hunt. And I only do that to make sure they are sighted in properly. And I hardly ever shoot more than one round at the target on sighting day. Having said that, I do shoot all year round, various rifles. From my own experience, the biggest hurdle a hunter faces in the field is HIMSELF! I have watched friends, who are extremely good shots, make awful decisions in the field, and mess up their shots. I have a big screen TV in my workshop, and it plays various videos all day. Some are of our hunts. The other day a friend who was on the video was watching himself, and asked for my comments. They tracked buffalo, and found a good bull. His PH pointed that to him. He had his rifle on a sling on his shoulder, and was busy looking at the buffalo with his binoculars. The bull was clear. By the time he got his rifle ready, the bull was behind another animal. The rifle is on the shooting sticks, and he turned to his binoculars again. This continued for quite a bit. Several instances came that he could have shot, but he was never ready. I did not need to say anything, as another friend said "Saeed would have killed that bull 57 times while you were fidgeting with your silly binoculars!" Shooting off the bench is great fun, and to check the accuracy of the rifle. I have a camera mono pod which I have modified to be a rifle rest. It is very steady really, no worse than a two legged shooting stick. many people find it very hard to hit an 8 inch target at 100 yards with it very fast. | |||
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Absolutely agree with Saeed. Not necessary to shoot your hunting rifles a lot, but you do need to shoot. In my case, I hadn't picked up a rifle in five years. That's not good. This year I'll do some shooting. My light .30-06 rifle has the same scope as my main rifle. I'll shoot both, but I have a couple of ammo cans with .30-06 ammo, so plan on shooting a lot of that. | |||
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Not quite hunting related, all the same thing though. Back ten years ago I was shooting at least 10,000 rounds a year with my revolvers. Even the Snubby Smiths I seldom missed the 8" plates at 35 yards one handed. I was getting groups down at 100 yards with a .45 Colt Blackhawk too. Then I got sick and hadn't been out shooting in several years. Went a with a buddy to the same targets. My hits were 20% or less. Practice! Dad and I always went elk hunting. The two months before season we'd take the hunting rifles and shells to the prairie dog towns and shoot 20 or more times each on half a dozen trips out. That was mostly with our '06's but, also after he got one. His .375 H&H too. The summer before he went to Alaska I remember he shot 200 rounds with it at them. Nearly all 300 grain loads. Three animals up there were one shot kills. He didn't see a brownie. We always figured prairie dogs were lots better than paper as it also gave us practice judging range too. Mike don't make that mistake. IF you don't want to burn up hunting ammo and rifles. At least shoot something else to keep your shooting eye in form. George "Gun Control is NOT about Guns' "It's about Control!!" Join the NRA today!" LM: NRA, DAV, George L. Dwight | |||
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All of my bolt action DG rifles (except my Blasers) are Mausers or Mauser derivatives, i.e., CZ 550 Magnums or pre-64 or post-64 classic CRF Winchester Model 70s, so they all operate the same way. Even all of the safeties are side-swinging Winchester flag types. Regardless of whether any particular rifle is a 9.3, a .375, a .416, a .450 or a .500, they all operate and shoot exactly alike. I think if you blindfolded me and I shouldered one, I’d have a hard time telling you which one I was holding. There’s never a problem on my part with unfamiliarity or confusion. So, I use different rifles from year to year, but they’re all basically the same. This is a huge factor in my thinking. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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To me, playing with my rifle is part of the fun. The few times when it is cold weather here, and I have not shot for a few months, it has shown up on the hunt with shooting issues (and sometimes despite practice as well…) I’d agree it doesn’t necessarily need to be the full on heavy caliber, but something similar in form and similar ballistics at the expected ranges. | |||
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The Navy Seals shoot as much as 1000 rounds in a day when they are practicing. I think that says it all. Don't have to use the same rifle you're hunting with but you must shoot something. | |||
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My best performance shooting competitively was one fall after my wife and I had moved into a small town. I couldn’t shoot out my back door with a rifle/shotgun anymore and bought a HW97 field target air rifle. I would go to my father in laws shop he had two blocks away that bordered a farm field and grown up area and shot starlings, English sparrows, woodchucks, along with paper targets. Likely shot several thousand pellets that summer, much of it off hand. That fall shooting in combat rifle matches out to 500 yards, open sites, military issue m16a2, I performed better than I ever had. I attribute that solely to increased coordination between sight acquisition and trigger timing. For my hunting rifles, I do a load work up, dope distance/zero, load 50 rounds and set it aside. Most of my practice is with 22 rf and air rifle, mostly off hand at various targets of opportunity. Trigger time with ANY rifle will help immensely IMO, doesn’t need to be with the hunting rifle. Rifles get verified/zeroed every late summer before hunting season starts. Shoot straight, shoot often. Matt | |||
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Dry firing with your hunting rifles is fantastic for practice. Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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Shooting is a perishable skill. Now, to what effect the level of "perishing" will actually matter is arguable. If you can shoot 3 inch group off of standing sticks at 75 yards, does it matter that a person's skills degraded to a 6 inch group at 75 yards when the vitals on PG are 10 inches and what ~18 inches on a buffalo probably not. I find the practice of getting into and out of shooting position prone, sitting, and standing with and without sticks or support and then getting a steady hold and dryfiring to be a very good skill to practice over and over. Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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I agree 100% with Mark’s statement about dry firing. Let me give you an example:I shot High Power Rifle for the US Army Reserve Rifle Team from 1974 to 1982 and won a few matches and two State Championships. Being subsidized with 2 National Match M-14’s and unlimited Lake City Match ammo sure helped. When I got out of the Reserves in 1983, I stopped competing for 2 years and moved to Michigan. In 1985 I decided to shoot in the Michigan Highpower Matches in Ypsilanti MI. For two solid months I dry fired my M1A and won the match. Being a new Michigan resident, the members of the State Highpower Team all asked “Who is this guy”? They convinced me to shoot for their team and we finished 3rd, 2nd and 3rd at the National Matches at Camp Perry OH. I stopped shooting for the State Team when I got too busy with my civilian career but came back in 1990 and won the 600 yard match at the State Highpower Match and won the Governor’s Cup that same year. I sold my two National Match M1A’s in 2021 to help pay for my July 2022 Safari to Namibia. Jesus saves, but Moses invests | |||
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As I get older my muscle memory is declining in precision. At least in my case, I find sighting in my DG rifles and then field shooting (Plinking with a purpose.) with a 22RF or pellet rifle enhances the speed and accuracy of my shooting without the expense and shoulder pounding of significant shooting of the DG rifles. | |||
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I am like you Mike. 10-20 shots from my hunting rifles per year. It is like riding a bike. I used to shoot competitions in college and found that with more practice I became much better at off-hand shooting. Sitting and prone, I was the same whether I had been practicing or not. | |||
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I think some level of practice is wise. That's not overrated, just sensible. I probably do more than strictly necessary but I enjoy trigger time. Keeps me handloading and helps keep producers of reloading components in business. So, good all round. Hunting.... it's not everything, it's the only thing. | |||
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Don't discount the thousands and thousands of rounds you fired in the past. If you have a lot of experience in shooting, and lots of experience with that rifle, you don't need much practice any more. But you got to that point, because you practised a lot. | |||
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If I remember correctly, Allen Iverson had a funny interview about “practice” a few years ago. If someone could post it, I think it will bring a laugh…. | |||
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Sometimes, I am told, is that practice is like sex, the more you practice….well, the more you like it!  | |||
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We were short of ammo in Rhodesian Parks and my intro to a .458 was on the day I shot my first elephant .... my boss said "see if you can hit that jumbo turd" (about 20 yards away) .. open sights ... I did and that was it for the rest of my time with culls and ad hoc work! 1 shot and off we went. | |||
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Just for you, Ross. I looked it up. Allen Iverson of the Philadephia 76ers, who was famous for missing practice and provoking the ire of his coach, Larry Brown: "We sittin' here, and I'm supposed to be the franchise player, and we in here talkin' about practice. I mean, listen, we talkin' about practice. Not a game! Not a game! Not a game! We talkin' about practice. Not a game; not the game that I go out there and die for and play every game like it's my last, not the game, we talkin' about practice, man. I mean, how silly is that? We talkin' about practice. I know I'm supposed to be there, I know I'm supposed to lead by example, I know that. And I'm not shoving it aside like it don't mean anything. I know it's important. I do. I honestly do. But we talkin' about practice, man. What are we talkin' about? Practice? We talkin' about practice, man! We talkin' about practice! We talkin' about practice... We ain't talkin' about the game! We talkin' about practice, man!" The whole thing: We talkin' about practice, man. Totally agree. 100%.  Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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I don't really shoot my big bore rifles that much anymore, except to keep them zero'd. But I am always in my loading room with the safe open, handling all my guns. My "manipulation skills" with each of my hunting guns are literally second nature. And I always incorporate some dry-firing whenever I handle a gun. It has worked for me for decades. Like Mike, I think it's important to remain skilled in moving into and out of various shooting positions with your gun. Fortunately I live where I can go outside and practice this as well. 114-R10David | |||
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Before my two safaris I did a ton of practice shooting. I used cheap bullets in my safari rifles and got good at off hand shooting. I think on safari I shot quite well and I wouldn't do a thing different. | |||
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Years ago when I shot competition, I shot one or maybe two National Match courses a week for practice and some more offhand. The practice of law got in the way and my scores started going down, so I quit shooting in competition. Practice makes a big difference. | |||
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This would describe me. I practice 1 day a week and compete 2 days a week in Cowboy Action Shooting. Starting in August, I take a couple hunting rifles to practice and shoot them also. By the time hunting season comes, I am tuned in. Not only to hit the target, but to get the shot off quickly. | |||
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I played college football in the days of 4 hr practices. After the first hour or so, most of us lost interest in what we were doing. To me, short, planned, well executed sessions work better than long protracted torture sessions. For guns, mount the gun several times, dry fire, maybe 10 times day. Shoot a .22 for fun, check your rifle. Go hunt. All of the noise about the military sniper training is accurate. However, the military has the philosophy that “more is better”, no “more structured/planned practice is better”. Plus, in the military, the target can shoot back. It golf, I learned that 40 practice balls with a wedge and 8 iron, done slowly and with focus is better then just banging balls. | |||
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I agree totally..I dry for for the hell of it from time to time, but not for any particular reason..In my later years I shot a good bit to get used the recoil of big borew, when I didn't things went south on safari a couple of times until I convinced myself that this damn thing has never killed you before ala the 470 and 505.. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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I do believe the big bores need to be shot more than others as the ability to shoot them well fades over a summer or winter and you need a tune up on recoil at times, if you don't believe that your ego is a salvation I suspect  Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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And a man is 5-11 to 6-3, so all you need is to figure the windage and hold between his eyes!!  Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Hands down the best vehicle I've seen for getting 1st timers ready for Africa is encouraging them to come out to our regular Africa shoot "matches". Now the matches are sorta, kinda intended for DG shooting (.366 and up and with the farthest shot around 100 yards) but are still excellent for any plains game cartridge you care to use. Things start off with the farthest shot off of sticks, and with the floating targets arranged so that the middle and closest shots requires you to step away from the sticks, and swing the barrel in opposite directions for the subsequent shots. For the regulars, it's all about whose buying the morning coffee based on the slowest times. For the Newbs, it unfailingly gets them jazzed to start doing some focused dry firing and real world practice (i.e. NOT from a bench) on their own. | |||
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Mike, I agree with you and I have thought of making this exact some post for years. Back when in my early 20s I read a piece by JOC and he said that 20 rounds every week shot deliberately from field positions was what was needed to be considered a real riflemen. I figured that was good advice and I made sure to make it to the range and shoot 20 rounds each week from field positions. After a few years of this I had gotten to be a decent game shot. Then like got in the way and raising my daughter on my own I almost never made it to the range. But I always found that when I did get to the range I shot close to as well as I ever had, but there was a small bit noticeable drop off. But on game I shot as well as ever. In the past few years I have taken half a dozen or so animals each year, and I rarely need a second shot. But I always try to take my time and find a rest. I do dry fire once in a while, but from my experience I feel that practice is overrated. Jason "You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core." _______________________ Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt. Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure. -Jason Brown | |||
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I don’t practice for the best case scenario, but in case of the worst. If practice brings me home to my kids or keeps a PH or tracker from getting hurt, I’m gonna practice. A lot. To each his own. | |||
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Twenty rounds standing off of sticks today, ten .416 Rigby and ten .500 A-Square, mixed softs and solids, all in the ten ring of a 100 yard target at 50 yards. I am done practicing! Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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You must have masochistic tendencies. | |||
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Agree 100%. I use only two rifles. A BDL in 270 Win I bought forever ago, and my 500 Jeffery. Same loads year after year. I put a three shot group to check sight in each rifle (they are invariably dead on) then offhand at 50 yards with each rifle. If I'm / they are in the 1" black, then I'm done  Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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I have heard similar arguments given for people who never want to shower or bathe. Shooting is a skill, to be good at it takes practice, and lots of it. Of course competition accuracy standards are different from hitting a barn at 50 or 100 yards, but sight alignment and trigger are all the same. Pretty much the competition shooting season ends in October and starts up again March, as competition shooting tends to be an outdoor activity. The first couple of matches every year, I can tell my shooting skills have deteriorated, and my body is out of shape. The first prone matches are very physically tasking, and painful, getting into prone position, and getting up and down during the match. A Smallbore Prone National Champ suggested more practice to improve my iron sight groups. He shoots position several times a week! Besides that, his wind reading judgment is supernatural, and I am basically blown away by wind. No one ever talks about wind reading , wind judgment, or how much the wind moves bullets. And yet, the same types think it is ethical for them to shoot at game over 400 yards away. If the wind helps them miss, then it is ethical. Get these never practice guys out on the range and see if they can consistently hit paper at those 600, or 800 yard distances they claim to bag game, then their lack of shooting skills will be evident. | |||
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Competition shooting and hunting in the field are two totally different sports. I have watched extremely good competition shooters so bad in the field one would have imagined they never fired a gun before. I do shoot a lot - having an underground shooting range at home helps! I can shoot day or night without disturbing anyone. Shooting off the bench is never hurried. One aims, and slowly pulls the trigger. That luxury does not exists in the field. I yank the trigger as hard as I can in the field. And despite shooting a lot more animals than most, I honestly cannot remember the last time I missed an animal on safari. Shooting in the field is controlled flinching! You either got it, or you don’t!  | |||
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Competition shooting is an artificial environment as the cadence and timing is predictable, and repeatable. Such is not the case in the field, where a shooter who has trained for years to follow a cadence, and then, in the field the time is not there, and the shooter is out of his comfort zone. That does not mean that no shooting skills are better than some, and some skills are better than more skills. I talked with a guide who had taken highly skilled competition shooters to the field, and those guys muffed the shot. This guide films the customer, ostensibly for the customer’s “memories” but it turns out to be most helpful when figuring out why highly skilled marksman hit the mountain, instead of the animal. The guide reported a high percentage of shooters looking over their scope, just before pulling the trigger. These guys wanted to see the animal fall, and were looking over the scope, which of course meant, they missed their shot! And all of those who did this, denied they were doing it, until they were shown the video. And clearly, there they were moving their head, before breaking the trigger. Good follow through is very basic, and yet very important for consistent shooting. | |||
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My $.02, and this applies only to dangerous game at close ranges. Practice until you know your rifle and you know yourself. Mounting and safety control and trigger break should be 2nd nature. Like Saeed says, be able to put the crosshairs on the shoulder or chest or whatever is called for and pull the trigger quickly. Your nerve is more important than your MOA. Growing up shooting BB guns and 22s by the thousands as a kid is the best practice. I realize not everyone was afforded that opportunity. | |||
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Slam Fire, I am going to take exception to some of what you said. I am a competitive shooter (Long range prone, and across the course). I only shoot from a bench to get the rifle zeroed, then that's it, no more bench. The basics of good marksmanship are the same when shooting competition and hunting. The shortest range I shoot competition at is 200 yds offhand, 300 prone rapid, 600, 800, 900, and 1000 yards prone. I would never take a 200 yard offhand shot in the field, but would have a better chance than 95%of hunters to make a good shot. I would also never shoot at an animal past 500 and then only in ideal conditions. I'm pretty damn good at reading the wind on a range, but the mountains are a whole different story. Knowing and admitting your limitations is a good thing to do in the field. I also wonder about your story of your buddy, seems to cast a pretty wide net. | |||
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