Well, I've gone and done it now. I was loading up some big bore practice cartridges over the weekend, as I have a trophy bull hunt in only five months. One of them was apparantly a little under lubed, and got a bit stuck in the sizing die. As I pulled up on the handle to get it out, I felt a "snap" in my shoulder, and it felt like a knife went through the joint.
My MRI shows a subluxed biceps tendon, and some small tears of the supraspinatous muscle. I'm to see the ortho guy tomorrow for recommendations. He's shoulder fellowship trained. I'm guessing there is a shoulder scope in my immediate future.
Any of you big bore shooters been through this?
Any idea when I'll be able to shoot the big stuff again?

I had a large cyst removed from the rotator cuff, which required a much larger incision than a scope. I thought it would be a long recovery. But I was back on the big bores in just over a month.

I had the surgery 12/12/07. I had a bone spur, rotator cuff issues and the muscle that attaches to the bicep hanging on by a thread. In July 08, I was duck hunting in Argentina firing 200 rounds a day for 6 day. Not a hint of trouble. I was firing a 416 before too long after the surgery.

My advice would be to get it in as good physical condition pre-surgery and take the physical therapy very seriously.

I had rotator cuff repair surgery performed 12-17-09. Per the surgeon it was "an extensive tear of the rotator cuff"; I now have 5 metal clamps holding things in place.

Had a plains game hunt in April 2010 THAT INCLUDED THE USE OF A .58 CALIBER PEDERSOLI BLACKPOWDER DOUBLE RIFLE. Now I've never shot anything bigger than a .375 H&H but I think the recoil from the 58 is comparable to big bores.

Post surgery went like this: 1 month of shoulder movement by mechanical means (not using my own muscles to insure the proper healing of the repair), 2 months of physical therapy - flexibility & strength. Ready to go after that (that doesn't mean arm wrestling the PH or bench pressing your own weight).

Purchased & used a good strap on shoulder recoil pad; put Limbsaver brand recoil pads on all rifles. All on a 66 year old shoulder.

Go easy; let it heal, slowly increase your strength & flexibility.

Good hunting in 5 months.

Physical Therapy is the key ! I had a tear in the rotator cuff, bicepular tendon and a frozen shoulder to boot. Was as painful as the surgeon described but I was shooting in 4 months.
I owe that to doing as much PT as they would allow, sometimes 5 sessions a day.
Best of Luck !

I hate to be the negative voice but I will say that it is going to depend on the severity of the injury.

About 20 years ago I dislocated my shoulder during a high-school wrestling match. At the time I was in outstanding shape as I had just finished four months of daily football practice. And I was still young(14 or 15).

My arm had limited strength/movement for the next few days. I have no doubt that there was some tearing in my rotator cuff.

For whatever reason, maybe because the shoulder popped back in by itself, my doctor did not send me for any tests. He said that the strength would come back in time.

Well, long story short, two decades later I still have pain in my shoulder anytime I put any real strain on it, including shooting heavy recoiling rifles, too much weight lifting, or even doing mild stretching that goes anywhere near full normal range of motion.

From my own experience I would take it real easy. I might even think of shooting from the other side just in case your shoulder is not ready for the hunt.

I've had the RC repaired through a scope on both shoulders and the recovery was quick. Do your PT exercises 100%. I shoot a .600 and 4-bore several days each week. I had a good surgeon and all went fine.
Good luck,
Cal

quote:

Originally posted by Marty:
Well, I've gone and done it now. I was loading up some big bore practice cartridges over the weekend, as I have a trophy bull hunt in only five months. One of them was apparantly a little under lubed, and got a bit stuck in the sizing die. As I pulled up on the handle to get it out, I felt a "snap" in my shoulder, and it felt like a knife went through the joint.
My MRI shows a subluxed biceps tendon, and some small tears of the supraspinatous muscle. I'm to see the ortho guy tomorrow for recommendations. He's shoulder fellowship trained. I'm guessing there is a shoulder scope in my immediate future.
Any of you big bore shooters been through this?
Any idea when I'll be able to shoot the big stuff again?

In terms of a subluxed biceps tendon I'm not sure if they would put something over to hold it in the bicipital grove???? They may just slip it back in and let it be with the understanding that it may happen from time to time. I'll be interested to see what they say about the biceps tendon. As for the supraspinatous tear I doubt they'll worry about a few small tears in the muscle. I'd get prepared for some PT. A minor tear to a muscle should heel fairly well given the vascular nature of muscle. I would imagine you'll be fine. Your supraspinatus is an external rotator of the humerus and abductor of the shoulder. It shouldn't play a major factor in shooting or managing recoil. As for the bicipital tendon it could cause soreness if the butt slips towards the arm. Make sure to keep the butt farther over.

Brett

one thing that will help is a past recoil shield

Marty,
as a orthopedic nurse I can tell you only one thing ever injury is different and everything depends on the amount of damage and what has to be done to fix it there are no standard answerers. IT's going to hurt and your going to think it's taking forever to get well SORRY

+1 ; Mine shoulder surgery was a 3 year recovery however it was a extensive 4 hour job. Hope you fare better. Good luck!

EZ

quote:

Originally posted by ddrhook:
Marty,
as a orthopedic nurse I can tell you only one thing ever injury is different and everything depends on the amount of damage and what has to be done to fix it there are no standard answerers. IT's going to hurt and your going to think it's taking forever to get well SORRY

Marty,
I had surgery to repair my rotator cuff in my right shoulder at the end of November 2007. I had to have some splicing done to replace some cartlidge that had worn away. I was back shooting my Palma rifle in February of 2008. The secret was in the rehab. It wasn't easy, let me repeat, it wasn't easy. I went through a lot of it with tears in my eyes. But I worked hard at it and worked through the pain to achieve the results that I knew I had to have. All the time I was working hard at recovering the use of my shoulder I noticed people around me working with a halfassed attitude toward at recovery. I managed to get 100% use of my shoulder back while I doubt that the others working at rehab got anywhere near the results that I did just because of their work ethic. You can get it back, but you have to work at it and work hard at it!

quote:

Originally posted by ddrhook:
ever injury is different and everything depends on the amount of damage

Well said. And if I can add although there are averages everyone's body reacts/heals differently.

Brett

i had AC 5 surgery a year ago .. back to shooting in 4 months, big stuff in 6

Just do not screw things up. You will not want to go through the process twice.
If you are getting scoped that is one thing. If you have 2- 7" incisions with 10 pieces of hardware that is something else.
Like someone said, they are not all the same.
They cannot always assert the damage with X rays and such. They will able to tell you more after the work is done.
Good luck with it; Really!
Get a GOOD surgeon.

EZ

Thanks, everyone.
I saw the surgeon today. I will have the offending joint scoped on Monday. He says he will be able to do it all through the scope.
The bad news is that there is apparantly some involvement of the subscapularis muscle. He won't know until he's in there if it will require repair or not. If it does, that will make rehab much harder, as that muscle is involved in pretty much all shoulder movement.
He says that rehab will be about six months, and I have a big hunt in just over five. It will be a motivator.
This surgeon has done a shoulder fellowship, and pretty much is the go to guy for shoulders the other orthopods have problems with in this town. He says shooting the big bores may still hurt, but won't mess anything up. I sure am glad I loaded up a bunch of low velocity practice rounds for the 416 Rigby and 470 nitro .

PS
the younger you are the faster the healing process. thats another reason I hate getting old

I had rotator cuff surgery done @ 55 and it took 5 months before I could shoot . It hurt for over a year. I did the therapy and it helps.

Two frozen shoulders later, I'm shooting big bores again. Most recent treatment started in February and ended in late May.

If you can possibly do so, use a really effective muzzle brake and the recoil won't be an issue. Range of motion might, and strength could be, but the recoil will be extremely manageable. The one MUST in this solution will be to wear hearing protection, as will your PH and tracker.

For my money, that's the direction I would take. Then the possibility or reinjuring from recoil is removed. I've fired 30/378 Wby with the factory muzzle brake and it's nothing less than amazing. My wife's 375 H&H has a brake on it, and she wore electronic earmuffs when shooting her cape buffalo. Worked like a charm.

I shoot a 470 double and can't use a muzzle brake on that one. I do have them on my 338 and 35 Ackley, and always wear muffs when shooting those two. But if I were in your shoes, I'd go with nothing heavier than a 375 H&H, with a brake on it.

Hope this helps some.

Thanks, one and all.
I had the shoulder scoped yesterday, and repairs were not as extensive as feared. He did repair the subscapularis, but it was not a full thickness tear, so rehab will be shorter. I don't really understand the anatomy, but the surgeon said that the problem with the subscapularis is what allowed the biceps tendon to sublux in the first place, so he left the biceps tendon alone. An acromial bone spur was removed, as well.
I start with the physical terorist tomorrow morning.

PT isn't fun but it is a necessity.

I thought I'd update you nice folks that offered information and support.
I will be six weeks out tomorrow. I have nearly all my range of motion back, and PT says the rest will come. I see him twice a week, and exercise daily.
I just came in from shooting. With the help of an Evo-shield and reduced velocity practice loads, I fired the 470 offhand eight times. The first couple weren't too well placed, can we say "flinch?" All went well, but I think I'm a few weeks away from hunting loads! I still have four months to my hunt, I'm optimistic.
Usually in folks past fifty they excise the AC joint as part of the rebuild, but my orthopod said that my propensity to shoot big rifles caused him to not excise the distal clavicle so as to give more stability.
Thanks, all!

Good luck! Keep strengthening!!!

Brett

Marty,, I have been reading this report with a great deal of interest,, probably more than most. I have had my right shoulder, I am right handed going down hill rapidly,, I put off the orthopedic visit untill after I did a water buffalo hunt this summer,, I shot a 416 rigby over 70 times on a herd reduction hunt without any increase in symptoms but finally, I listened to my old aching body and got the MRI to see what might be the problem,, pretty much knew before the mri but a full thickness tear along the distal supraspinatus tendon as it inserts on the greater tuberosity means a scope is scheduled for me as well. I have some entrapement as well due to type II acromiom which they will grind down as well. Good news is there is only minimal bones spur formation and arthritic issues.. still 6 weeks immobilized and then as they say the real work begins. He allowed me to wait till after bow season is over so I only miss half of the season in Texas,, also I had an Illinois, pike county hunt scheduled and it is a non refundable hunt as well so I will hunt then get cut.. The doc thinks I am a bit nutts but he isn't a hunter. He asked if it hurts when I shoot, I said,, only when I pull the bow back,,haha but believe it or not, from a tree blind, with the bow pointing down,, there really is not much pain,, it is when I have to do overhead tasks where I am limited. I have a bow hunt on the books in Namibia,, 9 months after my surgery,,, I told my wife that was so I would have something to focus on doing all the PT and rehab. You guys cross your fingers for me,, those that have been there,,,you know what I got in store for me.

Best of luck, Drwes. I just walked in the door from PT myself.
The full thickness supraspinatous tear is kind of a bugger to rehab, they tell me, but you will be able to do it. It will get very old, however, being immobilized that long. Some things we take for granted, like being able to floss your teeth and comb your hair.
Maybe at some point in rehab drawing your bow might serve as part of the exercise program?
I'll keep my fingers crossed for you that your surgeon will be able to do a lesser procedure once he sees what he is dealing with

Wait until you try and tuck your shirt in...

Rich
DRSS

I have tried to do several things one armed lately just for practice,,, pull up pants, tuck in shirt like you said Rich and button up pants for gosh sakes is almost impossible. I can still argue on line with Rich over non important stuff left handed,,haha and bathroom duties have a higher level of difficulty!

At 46 I had an extensive repair, 6" scar, acromimum spur removed 4 screws. I could bench press over 300 lbs prior to surgery, afterwards I could not do the bar. Everyone is correct that going to rehab and doing what you are insturcted is critical. A year later it was stonger than ever. Then we tore the left bicep completely completely loose from the forearm. Man it is touch to get old.

I broke the greater tuberosity off by right humerus in March. I had a good deal of discomfort with my superspinatus muscle though June, but I was shooting my .375 and 45/70 by that point. It will sure cure you of "chicken winging"!

Physical therapy helped tremendously.

Picking stuff up with my right arm was much more of a problem, and I still feel pain when throwing overhand.

Good luck and fast healing!

OK you guys,, the ones who have had the surgery, Tommorrow will be 3 weeks since the surgery. The surgeon told me it was going to be really bad and really painful, I thought sure, all surgery is bad, I had 5 cartlidge repairs and an ACL repair on a knee in 2007. That was a piece of cake compared to the shoulder, the first 48 hours after the nerve block wore off was "crazy pain". I have 3 more weeks in this brace and doing the mild PT and passive stuff the doctor reccomended. What no one mentioned is the fact that you can not sleep! I have been "napping" in a recliner but unable to lay flat without being in pain. The fatigue from not sleeping was a real drain physically and mentally. I can prop a bunch of pillows up and almost lay down now and it is a huge help being able to semi lie down and rest. I am sure physicall therapy will be a bear but I am ready to get to work on it, my arm is about half the size it was before surgery, my bicept like vanished over night. The arm is starting to gain strength back but slowly. I have to be ready in july for another Africa trip. Getting old and worn down stinks. And Rich if you are out there,, you were right,, toilet duties opposite handed are tuff!

spent 6 mos in recliner sleeping , yes it sucks and was the worst pain imaginable. but the PT and rehab works . It does get better.

Getting on is not for sissies.

Shoulders take a long time to heal, you forget how much you use your shoulder until it is incapacitated and especially if it is your dominant arm too! As guys have said, make sure you do physio to keep the shoulder from getting too stiff but avoid movements that cause lingering aching pain early on. I think because the shoulder is such a complicated joint with many muscles, it will take a long time to regain strength again with certain muscles and movements and to stress them too early on will probably not help the healing process(basically if something hurts badly, don't do it). It took me a long time before I could sleep on my injured shoulder side. You can't rush shoulders, they will take a while to get back to normal.

drwes, I do feel your pain, I remember the first night of my injury there was no sleep whatsoever, and I remember the next morning my bed looked like someone had poured a bucket of water over it from all the sweat (copious ammounts of painkillers did not touch the pain at all that night)! Waking up after my first op the morphine was nice, but wore of far too quickly! Just be careful going up stairs with your arm in a sling...I stumbled rushing up some stairs about a week after my first op and naturally thrust both arms out to brace the fall....I can't remember what language came out of my mouth and would rather not like to know!

It took 3 months to sleep well,6 months till I could go back to shooting big guns and 13 months till I could say it was a good deal and was worth doing. 2 years later the other side is starting to hurt. DO THE THERAPY.

Sorry you've had such a lot of trouble. It will get better, of course, but it gets old. You'll do the therapy, and next year will be better.
I'm 4 1/2 months out, and fired full tilt 470 loads last week with only a shearling jacket for protection. Only a teeny bit sore after. Have faith, it'll come.

I had RC surgery in October. I do my physical therapy regularly but I am not even close to being able to shoot again. I am getting better but slowly. Maybe it's because I'm so old (73).
In a few months I'll try shooting skeet with my Model 42. The 375 H&H will have to wait for a few more months.