Hello Gentlemen! I 'm new to the forums but have been lurking as a "guest" for a few weeks. Also I will be new to Africa, having never been there before.

1st off I'd like to say that I really like what I see here... I've already picked up on a lot of great advice just by lurking!

That being said, I spend most of my days currently afield hunting birds of one type or the other, especially waterfowl... I haven't done more than "meat" hunt deer in the last 10 years... but the bug of Africa has been more on my mind the last couple of years. I am in the process of trying to book my 1st Safari. I recently went to the local San Antonio SCI winter rendevous and had the opportunity to speak with several PHs & Outfitters. I am thinking of a safari with Thormahlen & Cochran in RSA. On the menu would be Kudu, Nyala, Eland, Limpopo Bushbuck, Impala, Warthog, Wildebeast, & Zebra.

The questions I have are:
1. Does 10 days seem reasonable to have a decent chance of taking all those animals? I can add a couple of days for about 450 a day. Would that be a good idea to have a chance to take better animals?
2. It would probably be 2009 or 2010 before I could schedule, due to already having scheduled wing shooting trips for 2008 & 2009... so should I go ahead and book (small deposit of $1000 or so to do this) or should I wait until it gets closer to the date I plan to go?
3. Has anyone hunted with Thormahlen & Cochran before? I had a chance to speak with Peter Thormahlen at the show and was impressed with him and his outfit.
4. Price being asked for the package with me, observer and trophy fees for the animals mentioned is a little under $14 K... does this seems pretty reasonable for the animals mentioned?
5. Hardware... I would plan on taking a 30.06 as my primary and a .375 H&H as a back-up/Eland gun. I also have a .300 WBY which I have killed quite a few deer with... but can have sticky extraction especially with 220 grain WBY ammo. Which rifles should I practice with and take? How often should I practice?

Thanks in advance for all of your insight!

T&C seems to have a decent reputation. They are on the higher priced side of South African hunting but there is nothing wrong with that. Hunt with them if you liked them and hunt as many days as you can. The more the better your trip will be.

There are several PH's and agents who post here and also have good hunting venues on offer. So give people here a check as well. This because, as you say, you have gotten a lot of good advice here.

I personally know of a very good property where you could hunt all of your listed trophies and more.

The sooner you make your deposit insures your selected hunting dates are preserved.

I'm a new member also and I have to agree these guys & gals are great. An incrediable amount of knowledge and experience.
I've only taken one trip, my first, to SA for planes game. I got bite so bad after that it's always been DG.
With limited knowledge, I'd say 10 days is plenty for that menu. The price seems high to OK (I haven't done a hunt like that in a long time though).
If you shoot the 375 good then yes take it for Eland (375 H&H and Africa just go together) the 06 will do the dirty work on everything else. I will say I've shot everything, but a Nyala, on your list with a 375.

Welcome to the forum Andrew. Being a birdman myself, don't overlook upland and waterfowl hunting in South Africa. It is fantastic! I'll post a pic of an Egyptian Goose and female Cape Shelduck. To answer your questions;
1. 10 days should be enough time in a game rich area. However, you realize "hunting is hunting." Sometimes you get the Bear, other times the Bear gets you. Extra days wouldn't hurt but 8 animals shouldn't be a problem unless your trophy hunting.
2. I agree 100% with Ann. If you have specific dates, book as early as possible to ensure those dates are on the books. It will also help spread out the cost of your hunt.
3. Heard of, yes. Information, very little.
4. Price for those animals and 10 days is average. You could get the cost trimmed a little if you check around. One of our 10 day, 11 nights packages for one Hunter and 8 animals runs $5,850.00; add an Observer for $950. This isn't a cull or "representative hunt." Your allowed to take the largest trophy you can harvest.
5. Your '06 with a well constructed bullet will take an Eland. If you shoot accurately out to 300 yards, take it as your primary gun. If you feel the need to take the .375, and you shoot it well out to 250-300 yards, take it if it gives you more confindence. What kills big antelope are well placed shots with well made bullets. Practice makes perfect.
I hope you post a few reports and pics in the bird hunting forum. I look forward to reading about your hunts. We're into the Snow Geese right now. Pics are in the Bird Hunting forum.
Good hunting,
David Keith

Welcome. I have not hunted RSA, but those prices seem high to me.

I have hunted Namibia and you can do a lot of PG hunting there in wide open conservancies for less than that kind of money.

Your '06 or your .375 will be fine, I think. If your Wby. sticks, leave it at home or better, sell it. A .338 Win. Mag. is the perfect African PG rifle, IMHO.

Practice and don't stop practicing until you are justifiably and rightly confident.

Book now wherever you decide to go.

Andrew,

Please also consider hunting in the Eastern Cape Province with my friend, Owen Smith [Jimbah Safaris]. All his hunts are booked through Jeff Martinell in Pennsylvania.

I feel certain that they would provide an unforgetable hunt for all the animals you desire and maybe even at some savings as well.

In addition, you would be much more convenient to the Garden Route and Cape Town should you wish to do a little touring too, which I always recommend.

Please feel free to contact me by PM for more info!

Hunt On!

Les

Welcome to Andrew M by Andrew McLaren.
Welcome also to Alaska Hunter by Andrew McLaren.
Welcome to all new members and lurkers.

I quite agree that T&C have a good reputation. But so have quite a few others!

You got some good advice from a few posters. To help your planning a bit go to the Planning section on my web page. Enjoy the epreparation and anticipation.

In good hunting.

Andrew McLaren

Andrew M!

I have hunted PG with T&C twice. I found them to be very well organized and Peter will give his all to show you a great hunt. I suspect he will take you to the Mapumalanga area for the animals you seek. His areas there are above excellent in my opinion. Check out his web site to see the quality of animals he takes. He is a little above average in cost but he does produce excellent trophies. I suggest booking for the max number of days you can afford. That way you can be more selective on trophy size. There are 60" kudu on his concessions.

Your 30-06 will take all the animals on your list. Use a 200 grain premium bullet on the eland and place it in the lungs or heart just as you would a white tail on your home grounds and you will have one dead eland.

If you want more info on Peter, PM me.

465H&H

Andrew,

Welcome to the Board. I join those who suggest you should check out other outfitters.

Namibia will give you six of those eight on your list (no nyala or limpopo bushbuck) and it's much cheaper than the RSA. Apologies if any Namibians have added these to their properties as exotics.

Now, on adding days. Eight really good animals in 10 days risks to turn into supermarket trophy hunting, or, worse, to put you under pressure to shoot from a vehicle which is not really hunting unless you are disabled and can't walk. Besides, you'll want to spend more time in the bush once you're there, and maybe even take an afternoon for birds. Go for 12.

Regards, Tim

Thank all of you Gentlemen AND Lady for the replys!

David,

Those are beatiful birds... Look a bit like American Wigeon on steroids with those white wing patches! I have thought about the wing shooting, but most times I brought it up to the PH's I met at the SA SCI show they looked at me like I was a bit crazy. I will definately keep that in mind.

I am not trophy hunting, but I did not want to feel rushed to shoot an animal if that makes any sense. As Tim said above I did not want to feel like I was "super market hunting".

Shooting to 300 yards... Off a rest at the range, no problems... I don't think I've ever shot a deer past 180 in a hunting situation. I just never had to take a shot that far. I have killed a few coyotes and a skunk out to 300 & beyond but... I'll have to start practicing to that range off sticks... The .375 shoots well (actually feels like it kicks less and has a better trigger than my .300 WBY) but I'll need to upgrade the scope for 250+ yards... that 1 to 4 power scope is marginal to me for anything outside 150 yards. I'll do that & get some practice just cause.

I will post some pictures and reports on the wing shooting forum... I did't even realize there was one. We had an excellent year, especially on the ducks. I was able to put several out of state friends on some nice "wall birds".

I will check out your packages and may send you a PM if you do not mind!

Thanks!



Les,

I will check out Owen's information and may send you a PM if you do not mind!

Thanks!



Andrew,

The information on your website is excellent!

Thanks!



465 H&H

I have perused Peter's website in detail and went thru his photo book at the SCI Rendevous and it was very impressive. His clients have taken alot of quality animals AND recently. I will send you a PM because I have a couple of questions regarding hunting method.

Thanks!


Tim,

That is exactly my concern!

Thanks again all for your time!

quote:

Those are beatiful birds... Look a bit like American Wigeon on steroids with those white wing patches! I have thought about the wing shooting, but most times I brought it up to the PH's I met at the SA SCI show they looked at me like I was a bit crazy.

Andrew: Bird hunting will only perk up a PH's ear if he's into feathered game. I know several that had rather dump a duck or goose than shoot another Impala. It's not their typical income hunt, so most avoid it with the exception of the casual Guinea or Francolin. I have a few PH's however that will allow one to book just a bird hunt (upland/waterfowl). Some will go for any left over days of bird shooting after your big game hunt. No problem to arrange either: in Africa, Argentina or the US.
As for shooting ranges, you'll up your odd's if you can shoot well out to 300 yards. Especially on Kudu, Eland, Zebra & Wildebeast. Not that it isn't possible to get close. However, many times your quarry will get bumped by small fry you never see or hear in the bush. PH's will carry shooting sticks; from commercial to home made. If you prefer a certain type, pack them with you. I like the tri-pod style that allows a sitting or standing positions just by extending or retracting the legs. Today you can buy a Quad-pod. Now that's a steady rest! If you can practice, go for accuracy and speed. It is common to take a quicker than normal shot at African game in the bush. Having another person over your shoulder giving you shooting instructions will be a new experience. Be prepared. Call me anytime. I'll be glad to answer your questions. I look forward to your bird report....and PICS!
Good hunting,
David

Andrew,

Disclaimer first - I haven't been to Africa yet and can't talk from experience, so please take this with as big a grain (or shaker) of salt as necessary.

I've seen several articles in Shooting Sportsman and Double Gun Journal about bird hunting in (I believe) South Africa for both upland and waterfowl. If I remember right the articles also talked about combos with plains game. I can't speak the quality of either the fur or feathered hunting experience, but if your really like bird hunting, I think you would be cheating yourself if you didn't at least check into the possibility of putting together a hunt that would offer good hunting for both plains game and some bird hunting you won't be able to do anywhere else in the world. I would point you to the issues of the magazines I read the articles in, but unfortunately they are packed away in a box somewhere in the garage right now.

One thing I have gleaned as I've read through the posts and advice on this site is that one of the biggest things you can do to ensure the hunt you book satisfies your goals is to let your outfitter/booking agent know what you are looking for and not settle for something that won't meet your goals. South Africa (or at least Southern Africa) seems to offer the entire spectrum of possible experience from cull hunting to premium trophies - high fenced to low fenced to wilderness experience or anything in between. If you can figure out what you want, I think you can find someone who will be able to make it happen.

Good Luck in your "shopping."

Sounds to me like you can afford the price quoted and they enjoy a good rep so go and enjoy. Please bear in mind that nobody who is into hunting makes just one trip to Africa so don't try to take every animal there. To capture more of the essence of the place will imo replace any urgency to take large numbers on any one trip. Do yourself a favor and book a Kruger tour on one end of your trip or the other. Take your wife or child , Africa shared with someone you care for increases the enchantment.