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Good Day Saeed. I am the outfitter involved in the situation in question. As every story in life there are 2 sides to it. You have my website address and therefore my e-mail address as well. Everybody just go rampage and nobody even tried to contact me for my side...is that fair? I had the clients in Zimbabwe when they together with my PH were arrested. I drove up from South-Africa and met all the people involved. I was questioned by the Zimbabwe police, Parks, Crime intelligence and a few more. Phasa who I am a member off also got involved. I also notified the US embassy at the time. I have nothing to hide but I hope you and everybody on the forum will understand the road I am taken as it appears here (on this forum) that I am guilty and criticized without even being charged. Phasa is also conducting a investigation on my request. A representitive from their office (PHASA) already intervied my client and his wife the day after our return to South-Africa. I read the report that was given to you by "ilitshe-zim" and there are definitely a few points that is not correct and based on pure speculation. These points will be shown out to PHASA for their report. I am filing my report to PHASA on Monday/Thuesday together with the report of my PH. At this stage I am getting crusified by people who base their opinions just on the facts from one side. I will gladly post my report when PHASA completed their inquiry. I do hope you understand as this matter is just as serious to me as to you. Thank you Koos Thank you Koos | |||
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| Administrator |
Hello Koos, Thank you for posting this information here. As you have mentioned, there always two sides to the story. The report was posted directly by the poster you have mentioned - just you are posting this - all posts here are "live" posts, and are not moderated before hand. AR is an open forum, and we always welcome the posts that are of concern to us as hunters. | |||
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Thank you Sir. I do understand how the forum works and thank you for posting my reply. Koos | |||
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| One of Us |
Hi Louis - Hope the ele situation is not affecting you too severely in Zim. Hope to see you (and Spike) at SCI in '15. Have a great season. Tom Orsato | |||
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One of Us |
PHASA has been so diligent and conscientious in addressing the widely reported problems of South African outfitters hunting in the Zim National Parks, I am sure their investigation in this instance will be objective, thorough and above reproach. Sort of like the investigation our beloved President ordered today in the abuses at the VA hospitals. Mike | |||
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| One of Us |
I have no clue who anyone is that is involved in this matter. It is kind of hard to mis-identify a PH without a full license. That tells me all I need to know. I agree with Mike about PHASA. | |||
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One of Us |
It is alleged they were hunting PAC elephant. If true I thought it was illegal for a tourist hunter to kill a PAC animal in Zim. I have emailed PHASA in the past and never received any kind of response. Maybe it got lost in the web. | |||
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| One of Us |
I am convinced that PHASA exists more to protect and advance the interests of its members than to do much of anything else. Here are their "Aims & Objectives" from their website. I am not sure they ever read past the first one. Aims & Objectives: - to promote and safeguard the interests and good name of PHASA and its members; - to promote and safeguard the hunting profession in South Africa; - to promote and participate in the conservation of Africa’s natural resources; - to promote and facilitate sustainable hunting as a conservation tool; - to promote and facilitate the empowerment of all South Africans wishing to participate in the hunting profession, conservation and related activities; - to engage with the national and provincial Governments of the Republic of South Africa and other countries, in all matters affecting professional hunting, conservation and related activities; - to collaborate with and assist, wherever possible and to the extent reasonably feasible, all officers of organisations and authorities tasked with the conservation of natural resources; - to co-operate with other persons and organisations in Africa and elsewhere having objects similar to those of this Association; - to promote and market South Africa as a leading international hunting destination; - to co-operate with those (wherever situated) who by business or other circumstances are connected with hunting and to provide opportunities for discussion between them and members of the Association on matters of common interest; - to promote adherence to its Code of Conduct by all PHASA members and to sanction members who contravene its Code of Conduct or act contrary to these Aims and Objects or other provisions of the Constitution of the Association; - to render assistance to and serve the needs of members of the Association; - to render assistance to and serve the needs, wherever possible and to the extent reasonably feasible, of the clientele of PHASA members; - to regulate or prohibit, as the case may be, the publication in the Republic of South Africa or elsewhere by members of advertisements, interviews or press releases, that may be contrary to the objects of the Association; and - to develop fellowship and cooperation among professional hunters. Here is their Code of Conduct: Each member of PHASA shall commit himself, upon acceptance of membership, to this Code of Conduct whereby he: - shall promote and observe the Aims and Objects of PHASA, the provisions of the PHASA Constitution and its By-laws; - shall obey the laws of any country in which he operates at any time in professional hunting or related activities; - shall conduct himself in a manner which will reflect honesty, integrity and morality and shall not allow material gain to supersede such principles; - shall respect the natural resources of the country in which he hunts; - shall respect the rights and interests of property owners and local communities; - shall not misrepresent himself to clients or mislead clients in any way; - shall take every reasonable step to ensure that his clients receive the services contracted for, and to ensure their safety, comfort and satisfaction; and - shall not act in any manner that brings the good name of PHASA and it’s members into disrepute. Pretty hard to square No. 4 above with hunting in National Parks. Can anyone point to an instance of any PHASA member being sanctioned for activities in Zim? Mike | |||
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If past experience is anything to go by, PHASA does absolutely ZERO to investigate any wrongdoing from crooked so called PH from South Africa. | |||
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And why does PHASA need to investigate anything? Is there any reason to believe that the Zim investigation was flawed or biased? What would be the motivation for Zim authorities to cook something up? Is PHASA going to Zim to interview the other parties involved or basing their "investigation" on the statement of the PH, the client and the girlfriend? The whole idea of a PHASA "investigation" sounds like BS to me. Mike | |||
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Hi Koos, Next time do a little more research on who the PH will be etc and this might have been avoided all together. I bet you it was a great deal? There is a long list of good PHs and reputable operators in Zim - Use them next time! Cheers Thierry | |||
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+1 Thierry. martinpieterssafaris@gmail.com www.martinpieterssafaris.com " hunt as if it's your last one you'll ever be on" | |||
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100% Thierry you put it in a nut shell!!!!!!!! | |||
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Koos, Sorry, but your "side" does little to dispel the notion that this was a half baked attempt at some skullduggery. Your version does nothing to convince me that your situation was forthright and proper. Sometimes it is best to remain quiet. Jeff | |||
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one of us |
"B" restrictions and no TR2. All greek to me.  Can some of the folks in the caveat emptor crowd share their Zim checklist of documents/permits/licenses/etc they check prior to their Zim hunts? Or their checklist to vet a 'reputable' PH/Booking agent/outfitter? Hunting: Exercising dominion over creation at 2800 fps. | |||
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Is it really that hard? How do you check out a doctor, an auto repair shop, a restaurant, etc.? You look for references and see what the references have to say. You look for "red flags", e.g., a doctor from Colorado trained in the Caribbean who did his residency in Peru . . . or perhaps a South African hunting outfit that purports to hunt in Zim. You ask the outfitter for some names of hunters that have hunted with them, in this case that hunted with them in Zim. A little common sense generally works. I do not inspect paperwork, licenses, etc. of the outfitter prior to a hunt. Just like when I pick a restaurant I do not ask to inspect the kitchen, or see their food service permit. I establish that the outfit or restaurant is reputable (see above) and rely on that fact. Seems pretty darn simple to me. I think these folks went looking for a bargain. In return they got burned. That is largely their fault not anyone else's. Mike | |||
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I really am a nobody so you can take my opinions for what they are worth... I have been to Africa once with my wife for a plains game hunt in SA. Typical first time American with a companion hunting in an amazing environment and I was in awe of everything. I have several close friends who have been many times. It is conceivable that a client could book a trip/hunt and get into a lot of trouble even after checking references. Reading the details above it appears the driver of the vehicle (a SA PH?) stated that they had done this hunt several times before! Perhaps the American hunter did call and speak to the previous clients who did the exact same thing and did not get caught? I do not understand what B restrictions and no TR2 means and would not think to ask a PH at or prior to the hunt what restrictions his license would have that may affect the hunt. Honestly I do not know anyone even remotely associated with this event/crime. It just gives me great concern to imagine myself and wife sitting in a Zim Jail for any amount of time!!! I would like to enjoy a proper Buf hunt someday but for certain will choose the PH and operation very very carefully!!! | |||
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I have no dog in this fight, and really don't care, but are we reading the same posts? I was simply pointing out the incompleteness in many of the posters assessments. | |||
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| Administrator |
You mentioned a "well known" Zimbabwean PH, we did not see who he is, may you can enlighten us? | |||
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I see what you are saying. I interpreted that statement, perhaps wrongly, that the guy without the full license was a local. | |||
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OK Saeed, Where is Kariba? Zimbabwe, no? Where did the person we are discussing reside? Kariba, no? Was the person we are discussing a PH? According to the post he was. What are we talking about? And what is the aversion to identifying a Zimbabwean ph as the potential base perpetrator of this crime? | |||
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I think he was, the way I read it was an American couple booked with a South African operator (who had an employee driving the cruiser)who contracted with a local Zimbabwean PH (potentially without a full license, but a ph none the less), to perform the hunt that turned out to be illegal? Maybe I misinterpreted the post? | |||
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One of Us |
A good report Louis. Fellas the ZPHA have a great man in Louis Muller. I've know him for years and hunted with the family for 26 years. Pro Safaris run by the Mullers is a first class outfit. | |||
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| one of us |
Checking references doesn't always work. I booked with an outfitter recommended by a trusted PH who I know well, checked the hunt report and saw glowing reports, met with the proposed PH at SCI, got a positive reference re the PH from another respected Zim PH, and still had a 10 day 2X2 buffalo hunt turn into a nine day 2X1 buffalo hunt. Nine months later I am still waiting for the refund agreed to by the outfitter. I'll do a hunt report later, but my point here is that doing "due diligence" doesn't always guarantee that your hunt will go well. It's easy to say that the clients deserve what they got because they should have known better. They may have checked up on the outfitter and found nothing but glowing reports. | |||
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Checking out references is a good start, as is doing your homework on the area. A PH can only be as good as the area allows him to be. And it's true that after doing all of that, clients can still be burned. Correct. And sometimes a good outfitter in a good area can just simply have a disastrous chain of events and hunt. BUT African hunting associations are formed to ensure a collective forward progressing industry that ensures a long term secure industry. Associations are not the police BUT they can deal with complaints on their members and ensure a collective set of business and hunting ethics. So in this case, since the Zim PH is not a member, there is no disciplinary action apart from ZPHGA engaging Parks to pull his license. So I can not stress enough that once you have booked your hunt, to insist that your PH is a member of the country's hunting association. This will ensure that if something goes wrong, there are consequences. Further this will ensure that more PH's join the association and in turn will give the association a better voices with local authorities in ensuring a better structured industry. It's a win win for everyone including the wildlife. | |||
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Other than Bobby Mugabe? | |||
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Each person must make their own decision. I chose to support the good people and outfits that are struggling to make a go of it in Zim despite the political situation. There are many good PHs and outfitters that you can hunt with in Zim with every confidence that your experience will be enjoyable and not involve the difficulties the group this thread is about experienced. Mike | |||
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| One of Us |
It would also be good to always know who the (indigenous) partners are of the operator you are hunting with. | |||
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I have heard the whole story from my partner Wayne Dietrechsen/Jimba as we hold Sijarira Forrest Area & Malindi Station on Kariba next to Chete (please no slams or BS about the mistake small Ele incident we have not had one bad report since I purchased half of Jimba and we have had 150 plus clients). The report posted by ilitshe_zim is 100% as reported to ZPWMA, local police and the Ele anti poaching mobile team . I know this makes Zim operators look bad to the un-indoctrinated but this should not be a reflection on ALL Ph's in any way. While everyone makes mistakes this is an obvious attempt to take a cheap Ele and pocket the extra funds. The real victim is the client, I know many of you here have no sympathy for the unknowing but lets be realistic not everyone has made their way to the internet. I have clients each year that are older and don't use online services in any way some even don't use cell phones. As far as Koos PH and the Zim PH being lost BS!! I have been past the Alan Lowe tree with Jannie Myer Jr. from Lowveld and there is no way even a very lost tourist could be there, only someone who had intimate knowledge of the area could find their way in!! Lastly let us not condemn ALL the South Africans, my partner Wayne would for a very long time not allow any South African to be on our property or to hunt themselves but since I have come on board we have been allowing them to book hunts on a limited undiscounted basis. Many Americans seem to bond for life with the first PH they go with and don't have a real idea of who or what they may be only that they went to Africa, were well taken care of and returned safely!! Just an FYI --NO OTHER company could be more concerned about Ele hunting violations in Zim, we have 15 trophy hunters this season and my company TheSafariConnection.com is one of SCI's "40" suing USFWS for their despicable and illegal ban on sport hunting Ele's!! SAFARISEAN | |||
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One of Us |
What "Alan Lowe tree" are you speaking of? Are you referencing the baobab with the plaque where he was killed? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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Yes very near the old Mana railroad track fencing line. Bronze plaque mounted high to keep it there and safe from theft!! I have pics if you would like to see it and if you know it then you fully understand how well this guy knew the area and there is no way he was "lost" or turned around.. SAFARISEAN | |||
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The tree is actually in the Chewore South concession...but yes I know what you mean. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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Good Day Saeed As promised here is my reply. At first I did not know in which way to adress this on your forum but here goes: Please ask members to be careful in what they post as this is being used in civil court procedures to follow and might contribute to the situation. This court case was held on 9 June 2014 The accused Mr. Mukoki was not found guilty of any misconduct. The hunting permit was the main question in court.Zim Parks was the complainant in this case. To Louis from ZPHGA: Thank you for a professional report and not taking sides in this matter but keeping it as it should be. Please remember if the devil joins ZPHGA or PHASA he would not be a saint tomorrow as you will see later in this post. To ilitsshe-zim: 1. 4 Days before the court case in Kariba I had head surgery. 2. On 8 May I still drove up to Kariba for the court case drinking pain medicine about every 4 hours I still made the 900 mile drive one way to be at court 3. Where were you? 4. You made all the accusations on this forum that will definitely have an affect on my business. 5.As I mentioned in my previous post here not all is true that you mentioned. 6. You shined in your absence . I was with when the state prosecuter and investigating officer tried o call you. No excuses from your side. Not from you ,your wife or the Zim hunting authorities, who you are a member off. You certainly knew about the date as you were there when the date was set. 7. Your ignorance and absence certainly proof something. 8. The next questions arises: Where you afraid for court? Where you afraid your lies might be exposed.You lied and blew your report up on this forum for reasons only you will know. 9. You never mentioned in your report here on this forum that you knew Mukoki from the past. According to him you failed him twice on his exams but gave his back-up a license every time. On the third time he was examined by someone else and passed. 10. Was this event personal for you?(question) 11. Was it racial or political motivated from your side?(question) 12. Did you decide not to attend because the investigating officers told you I did nothing wrong and they can not prosecute me? That is what was told to me. To Members who posted here: 1.I am hunting with many clients from the USA. I learned them to be very carefull in what they say and always are up to facts before they speak. 2. Some of you commented on me and my bussiness on this forum based on one persons "facts". He did not even come to court for his accusations and statements to be tested. 3. To say this was a cheap deal is so far from the truth as the South from the West. This hunt consisted out of the next animals:2 cape buffalo, 1 leopard, 1 mid sized Lion male, 1 Sable, Supposed to non trophy non exportable Elephant and some plains. If you can equal this then maybe you can call this a cheap hunt and making a quick buck. The $6000.00 was just a part of the payment and NOT the deal.Just my lodging was another $3000.00. 4.This whole hunt was supposed to be conducted in Zim (with quota and a licensed operator) but due to the Operator in Zim going back on his deal and changing his prices a week before the hunt everything else was moved to South-Africa. 5.Mike70560: How can you warn people against me and my company on a international speaking base if all you have is a blown up report with lies from someone who is not willing to attend the court case which he was responsible for? (Your reply definitely forms part of the upcoming actions) 6.Late-Bloomer: If I was a swindler I most certainly wouldn`t run my business on around 70% returning client base. Please be carefull in your response as this forum forms part of the upcoming case against the ilitshe-zim. Thank you Koos | |||
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| One of Us |
 I've only read this far and I'm already excited about the imminent return of Douglas Chester, esq!____________________________________________ "Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life." Terry Pratchett. | |||
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| One of Us |
To say this was a cheap deal is so far from the truth as the South from the West. This hunt consisted out of the next animals:2 cape buffalo, 1 leopard, 1 mid sized Lion male, 1 Sable, Supposed to non trophy non exportable Elephant and some plains. If you can equal this then maybe you can call this a cheap hunt and making a quick buck. The $6000.00 was just a part of the payment and NOT the deal.Just my lodging was another $3000.00. So $9,000 for 2 Cape buffalo, 1 leopard, 1 mid sized lion, and one sable in addition to the elephant? How do you know it was going to be a "mid sized" lion? Is it in a pen somewhere? ____________________________________________ "Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life." Terry Pratchett. | |||
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Who is ilitsshe-Zim ? Not sure what to make of all of this. | |||
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As far as Mike is concerned, this whole situation REEKS. Why wouldn't he warn against your business? Jeff | |||
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Personally, I read Mike's comment as a general comment rather than one specifically about this company. All safari clients need to beware when buying a safari. | |||
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| One of Us |
I find this pretty interesting. If Koos plans to use my statement in "upcoming actions" against ilitshe-zim he may notice my post was made prior to ilitshe-zim's post. If Koos plans to use my generic statement in "upcoming actions" against me he may need to edit out some of it especially the part about being involved with the Outdoor Channel and that making a favorable impression on first time clients. I also cannot find in the thread where I warned people against using Koos. I guess time will tell. | |||
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| One of Us |
I did not see it either. I don't know what to think. Koos portrays his self as pure as the driven snow. On the other hand, I have been to Africa a bunch of times. I have never had an incident like the one described. I have a really hard time thinking that something like this would happen with a reputable company. I know nothing about the company in question . I don't know what to think. | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting 5 hunters arrested in Zimbabwe
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