quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

Taxidermy is from a pure financial perspective the worst use of ones hunting dollars.

On a delightful hunt in Alaska one of the packer's mentioned his father buys and sells used taxidermy. His dad had just bought all of taxidermy at a Colorado Cabelas location for $39 a mount - he had to buy 100 plus mounts. He had to go collect all the taxidermy at the store as they were bringing in new stuff. The many truckloads of taxidermy used costs significantly less than all the taxidermy I have done to date (2 buff table mounts, impala and waterbuck shoulders, zebra and wildbeeste rug).

I don't even know why I am going thru the pain of mounting the lion.

To date only two people have ever asked me to see taxidermy. 99% of non hunters don't care about trophy rooms or taxidermy.

For the two people who asked (friend's parents) I told them next time they are in Orlando we will go to Larry Shores house and they can see all the taxidermy they want. Larry was very kind to accommodate.

Mike

Definitely the most foolish financial move I have ever made was taxidermy. I don't have the volume that many have on here and certainly have slowed way down on any others coming home. That said, each piece is a 3D picture of sorts that does bring back memories.

I will have the Leopards sent back and if the Zim import ban is lifted certainly the tusks and some skin panels will come back as well.

quote:

Originally posted by Frostbit:

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

Taxidermy is from a pure financial perspective the worst use of ones hunting dollars.

On a delightful hunt in Alaska one of the packer's mentioned his father buys and sells used taxidermy. His dad had just bought all of taxidermy at a Colorado Cabelas location for $39 a mount - he had to buy 100 plus mounts. He had to go collect all the taxidermy at the store as they were bringing in new stuff. The many truckloads of taxidermy used costs significantly less than all the taxidermy I have done to date (2 buff table mounts, impala and waterbuck shoulders, zebra and wildbeeste rug).

I don't even know why I am going thru the pain of mounting the lion.

To date only two people have ever asked me to see taxidermy. 99% of non hunters don't care about trophy rooms or taxidermy.

For the two people who asked (friend's parents) I told them next time they are in Orlando we will go to Larry Shores house and they can see all the taxidermy they want. Larry was very kind to accommodate.

Mike

Definitely the most foolish financial move I have ever made was taxidermy. I don't have the volume that many have on here and certainly have slowed way down on any others coming home. That said, each piece is a 3D picture of sorts that does bring back memories.

I will have the Leopards sent back and if the Zim import ban is lifted certainly the tusks and some skin panels will come back as well.

Jim

Your lion does serve a dual role as a home protection system. Scared me when I walked up the steps.

Mike

Scared? Imagine how Jim and Joyce felt seeing you coming up the walkway!!!!!

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
Scared? Imagine how Jim and Joyce felt seeing you coming up the walkway!!!!!

I don't know Biebs - I was just happy to have had a home cooked meal with great biscuits before starving for 10 days in Alaska.

I think the next great meal I had was at subway with you.

Actually I take it back. Bob (the master guide) and I had a pretty good moose steak dinner after you took off the last day from spike camp - kind of like Saigon in 1975 you beat me to the plane and left all your gear other than the blaser for me to haul up the mountain!!!!. In our great moose steak we used the last (and only on the trip) onion and potato that he had been hiding from you.

But starving on $1K a day hunts does not happen in Africa - most of these guys have decency to stock some food even if some charge $40 a pound to ship back trophies.

Mike

quote:

But starving on $1K a day hunts does not happen in Africa - most of these guys have decency to stock some food even if some charge $40 a pound to ship back trophies.

Why the African outfitter gets blamed for the shipping (air freight) costs beats me!

As far as I know all he does is book the space on a flight and the airline charges accordingly; by weight or by volume, whichever rate is more financially convenient and the client is billed directly by the airline on a COD basis.

To the best of my knowledge, no freight is prepaid and this arrangement is clearly indicated in all hunting offers.

The manner in which trophies are packaged and crated also happen to be health/airline requirements.

Last but not least, yes, I agree its not cheap but this is one gripe that should not be directed at the African outfitter.

quote:

Originally posted by fujotupu:

quote:

But starving on $1K a day hunts does not happen in Africa - most of these guys have decency to stock some food even if some charge $40 a pound to ship back trophies.

Why the African outfitter gets blamed for the shipping (air freight) costs beats me!

As far as I know all he does is book the space on a flight and the airline charges accordingly; by weight or by volume, whichever rate is more financially convenient and the client is billed directly by the airline on a COD basis.

To the best of my knowledge, no freight is prepaid and this arrangement is clearly indicated in all hunting offers.

The manner in which trophies are packaged and crated also happen to be health/airline requirements.

Last but not least, yes, I agree its not cheap but this is one gripe that should not be directed at the African outfitter.

Cause the gripe is general shipping from africa is a lot more than air freight.

In the tanzania charter flight gripe discussion we were told commissions to outfitters were standard business practice. Does the same not hold true for shipping agents

Mike

I had a crate shipped just after Christmas.

It contained the following:

1 oribi full skin and skull
1 common reedbuck cape and skull
1 blesbok cape and skull
1 Vaal rhebok full skin and skull
1 zebra flat skin
1 blue wildebeest flat skin and skull
1 bushpig half skin and skull
1 blue duiker full skin and skull
1 ostrich cape, back skin and legs
1 bushbuck cape and skull

Total shipping cost $938.44 for a crate size 115 x 96 x 65 cm with a volumetric weight of 119.6, which they charged based upon the volumetric size from paperwork. Weight was 79 kg.

I thought this quote was very affordable and happily paid it.

quote:

Originally posted by fujotupu:

quote:

But starving on $1K a day hunts does not happen in Africa - most of these guys have decency to stock some food even if some charge $40 a pound to ship back trophies.

Why the African outfitter gets blamed for the shipping (air freight) costs beats me!

As far as I know all he does is book the space on a flight and the airline charges accordingly; by weight or by volume, whichever rate is more financially convenient and the client is billed directly by the airline on a COD basis.

To the best of my knowledge, no freight is prepaid and this arrangement is clearly indicated in all hunting offers.

The manner in which trophies are packaged and crated also happen to be health/airline requirements.

Last but not least, yes, I agree its not cheap but this is one gripe that should not be directed at the African outfitter.

I don't think the operators are being blamed for freight charges. It is the entire system.

> The operator charges for prep.
> an agent charges for dipping packing and crating.
> There is obviously air freight.
>There are clearing charges and perhaps storage charges.

These can really add up quickly.

To raise another question or two:
1. Do kickbacks play any part the the prices? I know the folks I've hunted with get kickbacks from the tourist shops, flight seeing operators, taxidermists, etc.
2. Any comment on pricing higher rates for more valuable animals event hough the crate is the same size and/or weight: i.e. lion and elephant in one crate compared to a crate of common plains game.
Cheers,
Cal

Kickbacks, rebates, discounts, etc. happen in everyday business, so it doesn't bother me in the least. My company calls them a rebate. The more products our distributors sell, the bigger their rebate at the end of the year. Plain and simple you sell our stuff, we'll send you more money.

It would be interesting to compare the differences between a common PG crate versus a DG crate. Haven't hunted any DG animals to-date, so can't comment.

Having had three different crates sent my way, none of my shipping costs have been more than $1K. Two were raw hides and the first had completed taxidermy.

quote:

In the tanzania charter flight gripe discussion we were told commissions to outfitters were standard business practice. Does the same not hold true for shipping agents

Charter flights and export of trophies are 2 totally different issues.

While commissions, kickbacks, etc. may be entertained in the charter business, I have reservations the same can be said for commercial airlines.

Again, to the best of my knowledge, most outfitters handle the entire process themselves as a company representative has to be at the airport cargo section for inspection of trophies in the presence of government officers from Customs, Wildlife and Anti-poaching, among others.

To save on expenses, trophy shipments are therefore handled in batches, the fewer the batches the more economical it will be to the outfitter (don't ask why - common sense should answer that).


Booking your safari through an agent though is OK? - these guys provide you this service for nothing.

Fulvio:

The difference is that everyone knows the agent is getting paid. Generally the price is the same with or without an agent.

Let me give you an analogy . If I sell my house, I know the real estate agent is getting a commission . No problem . If this real estate agent is getting a commission on the appraisal, survey and wood destroying organism inspection , no one has ever disclosed that to me. I have a problem with that .


It appears that is what is happening with the charter flights.

Maybe this should be as part of booking, give us very good idea what would all the charges be for our trophies from outfitter camp to our home.
Agent could research all the pricing and then tell us and set it up.
This trophy shipping reminds me health industry in US
Nobody will ever give you price until you get the bill.
That's my beef with this whole thing
This is how I see it.
I think it's that simple.
If there is no openness prior to hunt, I smell skunk

I'm going through this right now. 11 plains game animals from South Africa this past August. I was given the option of several taxidermist to prepare my mounts and I chose the most expensive one. I saw the work they did and the most expensive one did the best work. While he is only dipping and shipping them, I feel that it's worth paying more for better work regardless of what is being done.

My reason for going to Africa is to collet the animals that I can enjoy seeing in my collection. I will shoot an animal with a better cape over larger horns every time. And while I agree that the cost of those mounts makes absolutely no financial sense, I do believe that the long term enjoyment I get out of seeing them makes it all worthwhile. In comparison, how much money is spent on alcohol, food or a show that is gone the next day? How many even remember any of those experiences?

To me, hunting over seas or in different states has nothing to do with killing. It's all about experiencing something different and unique. I want to have that unique experience on display for my personal pleasure the rest of my life.

Eddie

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Fulvio:

The difference is that everyone knows the agent is getting paid. Generally the price is the same with or without an agent.

Let me give you an analogy . If I sell my house, I know the real estate agent is getting a commission . No problem . If this real estate agent is getting a commission on the appraisal, survey and wood destroying organism inspection , no one has ever disclosed that to me. I have a problem with that .


It appears that is what is happening with the charter flights.

Nailed it Larry

The issue that gets clients/hunters/people like me is all these incidentals that are not properly disclosed upfront. They just keep on piling up. Also the costs of these incidentals and the price inflation in them shows it far more reflective of collusion and behind the scene rebates than any fair competitive pricing.

Just disclose this upfront.

Also Fulvio on role of the booking agent - I always assume they are working for outfitter. They are paid by the outfitter not me. On travel agents the one I use occasionally for hunting Africa charges a fixed fee upfront for services. If he or she was them also seeking a comp from the airlines and not getting me the best fare - I would have serious issues.

The main gripe in this thread is the irritation caused by hidden uncompetitive prices. As I have said earlier clients who hunt Africa by and large are very successful professionally. This hunting activity regardless of what we hear on this site is a purely discretionary activity - no ones needs to go 10k miles to shoot a buffalo - they go caused they want too not need too.

No one would tolerate these shenanigans if they were on a high end vacation - we give the African experience a pass.

Given comments from some people who have spent serious money hunting Africa - this is changing.

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Fulvio:

The difference is that everyone knows the agent is getting paid. Generally the price is the same with or without an agent.

Let me give you an analogy . If I sell my house, I know the real estate agent is getting a commission . No problem . If this real estate agent is getting a commission on the appraisal, survey and wood destroying organism inspection , no one has ever disclosed that to me. I have a problem with that .


It appears that is what is happening with the charter flights.

Larry:

Very few booking agents will not work for less than 15% and as though that weren't enough, a few even have the balls to hike on the total safari (DR) cost and the 15% becomes 18/20/22%.

A 21 day hunt priced at $50,000(for sake of argument) commissioned at 15% = $7,500 to the agent - not a bad day's work.

And you can live with that ?

Or look at it from a different perspective: book directly with the outfitter and he can afford to give you 15% off the cuff as it would be going to the agent anyway and possibly more.

Not all charter companies offer a commission.

There are those that have fat contracts with the oil/gas conglomerates that couldn't care less about hunting charters and would rather do without (landing on bush strips beats the crap out of the undercarriage and some of the shorter strips can be pretty hairy to the inexperienced pilot who is used to tarmac runways).

Their prices have rocketed because of contractual demands laid out by the client's insurers and/or company policies - demands which are not normally required for conventional charters.

For those that do give commissions and whose aircraft have seen better days: max 10%

So for a $3000 "drop and pick", the client would be getting "fleeced" out of $300? - similarly as being fleeced $7,500 by the agent - hell, at least you got to fly in and out.

quote:

Originally posted by fujotupu:

A 21 day hunt priced at $50,000(for sake of argument) commissioned at 15% = $7,500 to the agent - not a bad day's work .

Depending on the client I suspect it is rarely a "day's work".

I've booked direct and through booking agents. The agents fielded any questions long after the booking, especially when getting no response from the PH, who may be away in the bush.

Fulvio:

The difference is we know about it. It is common knowledge . Plus I never see anyone offer a bunt at $50,000 with a booking agent. $42,500 without .

And yes, I am fine with it. They know where to go. More than once they have stopped me from going on what would have been a bad hunt. They save me immense amounts of time researching.

quote:

Originally posted by boarkiller:
Maybe this should be as part of booking, give us very good idea what would all the charges be for our trophies from outfitter camp to our home.
Agent could research all the pricing and then tell us and set it up.
This trophy shipping reminds me health industry in US
Nobody will ever give you price until you get the bill.
That's my beef with this whole thing
This is how I see it.
I think it's that simple.
If there is no openness prior to hunt, I smell skunk

Boarkiller:

I cannot speak for RSA/ZIM/ZAMBIA but am pretty familiar with TANZANIA.

Look at any of the offered hunts and I very much doubt there are any hidden costs.

Daily Rate/Govt. Fees/Trophy Fees/Dip & Pack, etc. etc.

You might note that once dipped/packed/crated, airfreight of trophies to final destination are excluded from the amount you have paid for your safari. The airfreight charges can only be known once the carrier has gone through all the formalities in determining your bill which is on a COD basis at destination.

The outfitter cannot guesstimate, as he cannot know what parts of the animal/s will be of interest to you. (European clients, for example are more inclined to take the skull only; no cape, no nothing)

The more you shoot, the bigger the box and if that aint enough, there's going to be a second and a third and you can hardly blame him for the animals you have shot and what you want to take home.

You are right about the agent: make him earn his 15% and if there's a fit to be thrown, you know on whose door to go knocking.

quote:

Originally posted by fujotupu:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Fulvio:

The difference is that everyone knows the agent is getting paid. Generally the price is the same with or without an agent.

Let me give you an analogy . If I sell my house, I know the real estate agent is getting a commission . No problem . If this real estate agent is getting a commission on the appraisal, survey and wood destroying organism inspection , no one has ever disclosed that to me. I have a problem with that .


It appears that is what is happening with the charter flights.

Larry:

Very few booking agents will not work for less than 15% and as though that weren't enough, a few even have the balls to hike on the total safari (DR) cost and the 15% becomes 18/20/22%.

A 21 day hunt priced at $50,000(for sake of argument) commissioned at 15% = $7,500 to the agent - not a bad day's work.

And you can live with that ?

Or look at it from a different perspective: book directly with the outfitter and he can afford to give you 15% off the cuff as it would be going to the agent anyway and possibly more.

Not all charter companies offer a commission.

There are those that have fat contracts with the oil/gas conglomerates that couldn't care less about hunting charters and would rather do without (landing on bush strips beats the crap out of the undercarriage and some of the shorter strips can be pretty hairy to the inexperienced pilot who is used to tarmac runways).

Their prices have rocketed because of contractual demands laid out by the client's insurers and/or company policies - demands which are not normally required for conventional charters.

For those that do give commissions and whose aircraft have seen better days: max 10%

So for a $3000 "drop and pick", the client would be getting "fleeced" out of $300? - similarly as being fleeced $7,500 by the agent - hell, at least you got to fly in and out.

Never seen or been offered a 15 percent not using booking agent price discount

Never seen a single sign at Dsc that ever said book directly with outfitter save x percent off listed prices.

Why I always assume booking agents are sellers agents not buyers agents.

Mike

Taxidermy may be a waste of money, but in the end does it really matter?

How much do people spend on cars, clothes, etc... just to wear them out and eventually throw away?

When I look at my mounts I'm taken back to that moment and can relive the entire experience. With pictures I just don't get the same feeling.

With that said, dip and pack & shipping is a complete rip off. My 2013 plains game trip from Botswana was dip and pack for zebra, warthog, kudu, impala, eland, 2 X gemsbok = $700

Freight $2,072
Export duties $160
SA Intransit permit $100
Bank Charges $50
Total - $3,082.00

Plus the $553. 00 to clear them

quote:

Never seen or been offered a 15 percent not using booking agent price discount

Never seen a single sign at Dsc that ever said book directly with outfitter save x percent off listed prices.

Why I always assume booking agents are sellers agents not buyers agents.

Daily rates are quoted inclusive of the agent's commission which will ultimately be paid by the consumer, much in the same manner as VAT.


There's an old quote that goes something like this: "If you don't ask you don't get"

The only time you are likely to get a discount without asking, is on a discounted hunt (where the discounted part is already accounted for)

And there are of course those super cheap hunts which come with the caption: "Buy cheap, get cheap" ..... AND get screwed with the hidden costs that have made this offer look like a steal of a deal.

quote:

Originally posted by fujotupu:

quote:

Never seen or been offered a 15 percent not using booking agent price discount

Never seen a single sign at Dsc that ever said book directly with outfitter save x percent off listed prices.

Why I always assume booking agents are sellers agents not buyers agents.

Daily rates are quoted inclusive of the agent's commission which will ultimately be paid by the consumer, much in the same manner as VAT.


There's an old quote that goes something like this: "If you don't ask you don't get"

The only time you are likely to get a discount without asking, is on a discounted hunt (where the discounted part is already accounted for)

And there are of course those super cheap hunts which come with the caption: "Buy cheap, get cheap" ..... AND get screwed with the hidden costs that have made this offer look like a steal of a deal.

Then why do all the outfitters go to DSC or SCI ? Is it not for direct marketing ?

But it's direct marketing with a built up price structure of using a seller's agent !!

Seems like everything in the business is like a tourist bazzaar in Marrakesh.

Mike

quote:

Then why do all the outfitters go to DSC or SCI ? Is it not for direct marketing ?

But it's direct marketing with a built up price structure of using a seller's agent !!

Seems like everything in the business is like a tourist bazzaar in Marrakesh.

Try re-reading and digesting the contents of the previous post (opening paragraph should offer a conclusive answer).

Agents won't be selling hunts of an outfitter who is also present and has a booth and if he/she does get involved in pushing a deal through, you can bet your bottom dollar you will NOT be getting much of a discount as it would come off the agent's commission.

Come along now, its not that hard to understand.

quote:

Originally posted by fujotupu:

quote:

Then why do all the outfitters go to DSC or SCI ? Is it not for direct marketing ?

But it's direct marketing with a built up price structure of using a seller's agent !!

Seems like everything in the business is like a tourist bazzaar in Marrakesh.

Try re-reading and digesting the contents of the previous post (opening paragraph should offer a conclusive answer).

Agents won't be selling hunts of an outfitter who is also present and has a booth and if he/she does get involved in pushing a deal through, you can bet your bottom dollar you will NOT be getting much of a discount as it would come off the agent's commission.

Come along now, its not that hard to understand.

Damn I tried re-reading it and am still confused.

Every hunt has a 15% or greater booking agent commission built into it like a VAT tax - with no refund at the airport when you leave - for people who don't use a booking agent.

The rule is simple then always hire a booking agent - at least at DSC or SCI you can hold his feet to the fire and get him to buy you a nice steak dinner. Cause you are going to pay his commission directly or indirectly.

When you pay it indirectly - you book without a booking agent but still pay full commission included rates. Then the commission flows to the outfitters bottom line I assume. So the outfitter gets to charge a VAT like tax with all left over tax like proceeds flowing to the bottom line. Damn no wonder we slightly slow (in efficient tax collection via a consumption tax mechanism design) American don't like or get the VAT tax.

I need to find a booking agent that will rebate me back some of the VAT tax or at least buys me a nice steak I will have as much luck finding one as __________

Mike

Anyone going to africa..CONTACT your taxidermist first not after the hunt...He can help you thru this mess of confusion.

Dip pack fees very so much it's getting out of hand. I know of them being as low as $85.00 for cape and horns to $285.00+ cape and horns for same species.
I have three in S A under or about $100 cape and horns. Export Paperwork and documentation under $200.00.

I have tannery in S A going to start tanning our capes and ship tanned. 1/2 the weight to ship. We take off the cost of the tanning credited to your mounts.

A lot of ways to get this worked out and many ways to feel your being dealt with some form of respect when it comes to fees and costs.

Get your Dip Pack company to get your crate ready and then contact a U S freight broker here in the states to get your SHIPPING QUOTE. It's done all the time! They will give you 2 or 3 options.
Once the paperwork is approved by your customs broker your carrier picks up and ships Those broker import fees get just as crazy.

My broker under 350.00 to clear,complete fee. I've seen it almost 3x that by others brokers

Get in touch with any Taxidermist that can help you thru this. We want your work plain and simple and want you to be able to afford to being them home. Planes are getting bigger and have more room to ship more freight per flight. Just have to KNOW how to work without all the middlemen. And find REASONABLE Dip PAck fees from reputable companies in Africa. Seems like everyone wants a piece of your pie these days. I always thought it should be offered. Nowadays they just seem to take it without even asking.

Just had a friend send back a waterbuck skull, cape and baboon skull. That's all. NOT counting trophy fees, by the time he got it to his door was over $1500. My friend will never bring a trophy back from Africa again.
The question is, how do we as a group seek a fairer deal? The US brokers are just as bad or worse than the African guys.
And we just thought the antis would be the group to keep us from going to Africa, wrong!!!

quote:

Originally posted by sevenmagltd.:
Just had a friend send back a waterbuck skull, cape and baboon skull. That's all. NOT counting trophy fees, by the time he got it to his door was over $1500. My friend will never bring a trophy back from Africa again.
The question is, how do we as a group seek a fairer deal? The US brokers are just as bad or worse than the African guys.
And we just thought the antis would be the group to keep us from going to Africa, wrong!!!

There are 4 costs after the safari is over and all trophies are in the salt - for those that want to mount the trophies.

Dip & Pack
African Shipping Agent
US Clearing Agent
Taxidermy

Only one is disclosed normally when one books a safari - Dip and Pack.

I think the main issue on this thread is that the others slowly creep into the equation and these costs are not insignificant. Its like a hidden cost and that is frustrating to a lot of people including very experienced international hunters. Their price inflation has been significant too.

I think one just learns over time. I have met some very experienced hunters thru AR - a majority have regretted doing too much taxidermy .

What can we do ?

If it is legal (non cites animals) I don't know why outfitters and booking agents don't bundle crates together ?

Why not offer a sea borne shipping alternative ?

Why there is no effort from outfitters to reduce this cost on clients - makes the whole rebate issue relevant ?

There is a direct impact on outfitters - if people start taking just pictures and leaving behind trophies (more people become like me) who cares if a buffalo is 40 inches or a kudu 60 ?

Mike

I have taken with air from Africa,Europe,America and Asia. Also boat from Africa. Most expensive is air from Africa.

That piss me off the most is that we need to pay like 15% tax on our animals when we take it in here. 2 cats from from Zim to RSA to America to Sweden and tax on 10k taxidermy

quote:

Originally posted by A.Dahlgren:
I have taken with air from Africa,Europe,America and Asia. Also boat from Africa. Most expensive is air from Africa.

That piss me off the most is that we need to pay like 15% tax on our animals when we take it in here. 2 cats from from Zim to RSA to America to Sweden and tax on 10k taxidermy

Our tax here in Portugal is 23% VAT on trophy value, shipping and packaging and we reduced that to 5% by bringing it into Denmark and then road freighting it down and thereby saved well over €1k.

For me I'm in the process of working with a tannery in Africa to do my skins for mounting there and ship here to studio ready to mount.

Most skins tanned for shoulder mounts or life-size COST LESS than the just the DIP PACK FEE COST. Then that fee charged for the tanning IS TAKEN OFF your bill for the mounting.

NO DIP PACK FEES. Less Document fees. Less shipping COSTS.

As for your vat can't help you...

More than one crate in a safari...
Can you say consolidate..
Strap the 2 or 3 crates together for the group. That's consolidation. One way bill One set of docs..USFW only cares that each is in separate crates for each hunter for inspection purposes they don't care if the crates are strapped together...


For me, I have friend, not a client, that is an international freight broker and works with me. This is a close friend...

Raw skins weigh a lot. Skulls are always shipped back whole even when mounts are being done not euro's we request them to be cut in 1/2 and cleaning skulls is even less weight that way.


To me it's pretty simple why it's so expensive to ship back....You taking away work from the african taxidermy studio's when you ship home. It's not hard to see, in my opinion, But that's just my opinion.


One more thing Raw Skins Cannot Be be Sea Freighted. The bigger planes makes it almost the same cost anyway on these crates.

Add another cost. After we lost some 24 trophies in the Bulawayo fire of 2011 we were quite happy to pay the extra for insurance the second time around but a lot more and added extras. The last trip decided only to do skulls and hides - and some momentos in the pocket.

Its kind of odd, for me, the less "advanced" the country, the less BS on the dip and pack and shipping.

Tanzania, Zambia, and Zimbabwe, while air freight is a little uglier than I would like, its not that odd. South Africa, on the other hand, I felt taken advantage of. 5 PG animals costing more to d&p and ship than a 21 day Tanz safari with cats? Umm hmm.

Friends, I have been jabbering about this for more than 5 years....GLAD Y'ALL are finally waking up after a few bruises and flatter wallets!!....I did NOT SAY FATTER!!

This is really a bad trend and I have spoken with Richard Lendrum at African Hunting Gazette as well as a few PH's....this is a very serious plague that is going to kill or seriously limit hunting offshore and bringing trophies home....along with the TAXIDERMY business.

It is high time that PH's wake up and get serious and Taxidermists get together to fight this....or the game is over!!

Luckily, I started African hunting in 1978 and am almost finished....trophies were prepared by the Outfitters and taken to the airport and booked to a Port of Entry near their clients or their designated taxidermist and THEY would CLEAR and Pick up...maybe a $80-100 fee from the taxidermist, or if you had primates or pigs you would have to pay $50 for a Dept of AG inspection.
It has MORPHED into-
Outfitter salts and dries- Ships to Taxidermist, not NOT Delivers- 1st charge, truck freight
Taxidermist does his thing and Docs-$100-200/trophy+ $250-400 Docs, $2-400 Crate, then SHIPS to Freight Forwarder- another Truck Bill
Freight Forwarder does his fizzle Dust- charges $1000-1500 and generally delivers to Airline, maybe another FREIGHT Charge?
Airline Bof L presented by Freight Forwarder, including Air Freight...and FF gets commission from Airline!
Freight Forwarder then routes BL to a Customs Broker (unless client demands- stame NO BROKERS on docs) So Customs Brokers get the Docs, and client pays another $3-500 for Clearance. Yu can do this yourself for $30 fee, when a commercial clearance is done Govt fee is $90!!
Then you must remove the Trophies from the Airline warehouse in 24 hours or face storage- Taxidermist then orders Truck Freight from Airport to Shop....a few $Hundreds More.....
Then the Taxidermy starts....
So rather than PH to Airport to Client, it NOW has potential of 4 truck bills, 3 professional services bills between Hunt and Home/taxidermists!!....I saw a $2440 bill in New Zealand for 6 trophies which included a $350 shipping crate of heavy veneer that increased the shipping bill by 30-40KG!
This is a serious situation that we all must get to our PH's and say...enough is enough....you process and get to the airline or I hunt with someone else!!
I have actually threatened to abandon trophies in two different locations in the last 5 years over these RIDICULOUS GOUGING FEES!!
WE HAVE GOT TO JUST START SAYING NO... NO, NO!!

I am NOT bringing my trophies home from Zambia on my next trip...$1500 Dip/Pack/Doc on TWO Animals.....NOPE!! So no Airline fees and No Taxidermy!!

For those who choose a lower cost route, I do see some containerized ocean shipment consolidations services coming up. I used that from Namibia for my Dik Dik and Common Duiker...air freight was minimum 45kg's at $800, NOPE, sea freight was under $100 and took 30 days longer....so what??

Cheers,

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Originally posted by Beretta682E:

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Originally posted by Bill C:

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Originally posted by Beretta682E: Feels like a minibar or crappy wifi.....

Shhhhh, the list of exclusions is getting long enough. I'm just glad that "Usage of a hunting vehicle" is still included!

I have seen some crazy rates for observers, road transfers, and rifle rentals lately. I know it must be tempting to jack up the incidentals, and it is not uncommon for an industry experiencing pressures with margins, but eventualy it will just get to be too much for an already dwindeling market pool, especially given all the other associated costs as being discussed in this thread.

I am single and hunt alone. But if I was paying $1k plus a day to hunt and my wife/ gf who ever went with me and the outfitter charged $250-300 bucks I would go ballistic. Person sleeps in the same tent, eats proteins that you have paid trophy fees on and cost little more than laundry service and drinks. To charge $250-300 again takes clients for fools.

I want to see one outfitter come and explain $250-300 cost for a wife/gf - 30 percent of the daily rate for laundry and drink service.

Mike

Champagne mate and the prohibitive cost of running a hair dryer in camp.

To me, it's the U.S. clearing agent fee that is the biggest rip-off. All they do is prepare the papers, present them to the shipping agent who has the shipment, and then deliver them to your house. For that, they will charge $500+.

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Shhhhh, the list of exclusions is getting long enough. I'm just glad that "Usage of a hunting vehicle" is still included!

One also has the choice of doing a walking safari, in the very same way the legendary hunters did, with porters, setting up spike camps along the hunting route at the end of the day and a sure way of losing weight at no extra cost.