Correct me if I'm wrong, but if I sight in my .30-06 rifle at 50 yards, it will be pretty much dead on at 200 yards. About 2" high at 100 yards and about 9" low at 300 yards.

Given that, do you sight in at 50/200 yards yourself for PG hunting?

I don't know about the 50-yard sight in, but i sight most of my big game rifles to be 2 in. high at 100. I don't want them any higher than that, as they can cause high shots at the mid range.

The only problem with the 50 yard guess thing is if you are off a bit at 50 it's 4 times as much at 200 yards. I comfirmed my sightin as 200 metres by shooting at that distance and then checked what that worked out to at 100 and 50 if necessary.

It has depended upon where I was hunting and with what cartridge. Generally, a 200yd zero is very good but I've used a 300yd zero on more than one occasion when using my 300mag. Regardless of the zero range, shoot your rifle at various ranges to verify where it strikes the target.

What is even more important, learn how to judge distances!

It is not easy, and even experienced hunters can be thrown way off by different terrain.

I think JohnCrighton is trying to take advantage of the fact that a bullet crosses the line of sight twice, but instead of sighting in at 50 yards he should adjust his scope to be spot on at 25 yards.

With his .30-06, a bullet traveling about 2700 fps will again cross the line of sight at 225-250 yards.

This should allow him to hold slightly about the center of an impala-size antelope from 0 yards out to 275 yards and not have to hold over it.

Bill Quimby

I agree with both billrquimby and Saeed. I have zeroed that way for years precisely BECAUSE I'm poor at judging range and after 73 years have decided it's not something you can LEARN but something you are either born with or not. I'm a not. I tried for years to develop the skill to no avail. I either use a rangefinder or lots of hope that the PH is correct (and he sometimes is not) and take the shot.

If one assumes your scope is 1.5" above the center of your bore, and you shoot a 180gr bullet at @2750 the trajectory of your bullet will be:
25yds 0
50yds +1"
75yds +2"
100yds +2.5"
150yds +2.5"
200yds +1
235yds 0
250yds -2
275yds -4
300yds -6 (actually -6.5, but 2, 4, 6 is easier to remember and I can't hold within .5"@300)

Hopes this clarifies the trajectory. Kudude

Sighting in at a short range, and extrapolating POI at longer ranges will give some nasty surprises sooner or later. There just isn't a substitute for shooting the longer distances. Go back and shoot the short distances afterward.
A 200 yard zero is quite useful for plains game.

Agree with all of the above.

And then when you get to Africa your PH will put a target 100 yards in front of you and have you shoot at it
- to see if you can hit the target,
- to see if your rifle is properly sighted in,
- to see if your rifle is safe,
- to see if you can safely handle your rifle,
- to see if you're afraid of your rifle

If they think you can't shoot then they'll just have to work a little harder and bring you to within 25 yards of the animal.

Namibiahunter

A small caveat - I'm not planning on sighting my rifle in at 50 yards. I was just wondering what range most people here would sight it in at. Once I get my new scope dialed in so it is hitting paper on my new rifle at 50 yards, I am planning on 200 yards being the zero-in distance so that I can extrapolate from 50-300 yards with relative ease.

John Crighton,
It sounds like you're on the right track. A advantage to knowing your exact POI at the close ranges is that your "zero check" at the other end might be a few cracks at a close range cardboard box taken over a truck hood. They are probably happy if you can even hit the box, I suspect you want a little more.

quote:

Originally posted by kudude:
If one assumes your scope is 1.5" above the center of your bore, and you shoot a 180gr bullet at @2750 the trajectory of your bullet will be:
25yds 0
50yds +1"
75yds +2"
100yds +2.5"
150yds +2.5"
200yds +1
235yds 0
250yds -2
275yds -4
300yds -6 (actually -6.5, but 2, 4, 6 is easier to remember and I can't hold within .5"@300)

Hopes this clarifies the trajectory. Kudude

Good job, Kudude!

You've clearly demonstrated with numbers what I was clumsily trying to say in words: Sight your .30-06 spot on at 25 yards and you won't have to hold over out to 300 yards with the .270, 7mm RM, .30-06, etc. With the load you specified, the bullet crosses line of sight at 25 and 235 yards.

Bill Quimby

What scope do you have?

the bushnell on my 243 has turats that turns by hand so i zero on 100 make a mark then move to 200 rezero and a mark and i do the same for 300 so when i shoot at 300 i move to the 300m mark on my scope and shoot where i aim i always move it back to 200m as its the one i use the most

John,

Presumably this question is related to your coming hunt...... I'd recommend that before you get too technical, you contact your outfitter and ask about the terrain and bush of the area you'll be hunting in and what kind of ranges are normal for that area. Once you know that, you can set your rifle up accordingly....... However, don't be at all suprised if you have to re-zero the rifle when you arrive in the bush. It's not at all uncommon for rifles to lose zero during the trip from home to hunting area.

I'm really positive impressed by John's capacity in examining all the possible problems and aspects of a Safari.
Hope to see huge trophies taken by John.

About your question, when I arrived at Johan's farm in the Kalahari desert, he asked me to check the zero of the rifle. Well we did it at 200,300 and 400 meters. I was using a 9.3x62 rifle. Shooting distances between 50-250 meters.

I don't know about your shooting possibilities, but a good concentration at 200 meters/yards, repeatedly verified, is necessary. If you can make test at 300 and 400 yards/meter it is really better.

John,

Great posts on this.

You've asked a question with two implications: a) what is the distance your range is capable of letting you shoot at; and b) at what distance do you want the rifle capable of making a killing shot by putting your scope on the vitals (not needing to hold high), i.e. what's the "point blank" range?

My range west of DC is short, so I set targets to just 100 yards. The scope is set for dead center at 100, and after arriving in Namibia I check to see if the scope is still there, look to where the bullet prints at 200 yards and 50 yards and go hunting. Rarely if ever have I found the need to shoot more than 200 yards, but that is partly due to the terrain and bush and more due to the dictum to get as close as you can and then ten yards closer. On more open areas the scope would be set dead on at 200 and checked to where the bullets print at 300, 150, 100 and 50.

Setting the scope for 25 yards and assuming it prints the same place at 100 has never worked. The scope is always a little off high or low or left or right when checked at 100.

The iron sights print two inches high with a six o'clock hold at 100 yards.

Regards, Tim

John:

I usually use the maximum point blank range method when sighting in my rifles. Check out biggameinfo.com. They have a ballistis calculator. On most cartridges, if you set the bullet to strike between two and three inches high at 100 yards, it will give you a mazimum point blank range (cartridge never more than four inches high or four inches low) well beyond 200 yards and that is sufficient for most hunting situations.

Dave

I set mine at 2" high at 100yds.

Most of my shots were between 175 - 225.

Same as TexasHunter with all of my rifles. For my .375 H&H - dead on at 75 yards.

Sight them in for the distance or distances your are most likely to see game.

200 yard zero.

If you shoot a banded bullet like a North Fork or a Barnes TSX you will get a highter velocity and hence been down range ballistics...
I use a 3 inch high at 100yds..

Mike

I sight dead on at 100 yds. I have a tendancy to hold high at longer ranges anyway so 100 yds is just right for me.

Thanks for all the great advice, guys. My range has a 200 yard rifle spot, so I'll get it hitting dead center at 200 and extrapolate from there. Given the advice here, aiming at dead center at any range from 0-300 yards shoud get me in the vitals - any shot farther than 300 yards I think I will pass on and wait for a better shot.

Using a Zeiss 3-9x40 scope with #4 reticle. Have used "range" finding reticles in the past and just don't care for them.

By plains game I believe you are talking about the potential for a long shot, one in excess of 200 yards. Though the exprapulation of the 25 yard zero can be handy, if I know I will be reaching out there, my zeroing, for my "long range" .270 Holehan Remington custom on a 26" Douglas air gauged barrel, Leupold 6.5 - 20 scope) is as follows:

100 +3.25
150 +4.25
200 +4.00
250 +2.50
300 -0-
325 -2.00
350 -4.00
375 -7.00
400 -10.00
425 -13.50
450 -17.50

And if I can, I will shoot at 200, 300 and 400 at a local range. There are too many variable entering into a long shot to rely comfortably on the short range calculations. And have I done it....you bet. And this is with Hornady Light Magnum 130 grain cartridges.

quote:

Originally posted by JohnCrighton:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but if I sight in my .30-06 rifle at 50 yards, it will be pretty much dead on at 200 yards. About 2" high at 100 yards and about 9" low at 300 yards.

Given that, do you sight in at 50/200 yards yourself for PG hunting?

What you haven't identified is what you will be shooting through your .30-06. Say you use a 180 grain Nosler Partition ... a classic load and proven bullet ... consult the Federal Cartridge website. With a 200 yard zero it shows 2" high at 100 yards and 8.4" low at 300 yards. Very close to what you wrote. At 400 yards it will be 24.3" low. How much further are you planning to shoot?

There are a lot of long range shooters on this board. I'm not one of them. My limit is 300 yards. I don't have to think that hard at that range.

www.federalcartridge.com

Yup - max range for me is 300 yards, using 180 Nosler Partitions form a 30.-06 rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by WPN:

quote:

Originally posted by JohnCrighton:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but if I sight in my .30-06 rifle at 50 yards, it will be pretty much dead on at 200 yards. About 2" high at 100 yards and about 9" low at 300 yards.

Given that, do you sight in at 50/200 yards yourself for PG hunting?

What you haven't identified is what you will be shooting through your .30-06. Say you use a 180 grain Nosler Partition ... a classic load and proven bullet ... consult the Federal Cartridge website. With a 200 yard zero it shows 2" high at 100 yards and 8.4" low at 300 yards. Very close to what you wrote. At 400 yards it will be 24.3" low. How much further are you planning to shoot?

There are a lot of long range shooters on this board. I'm not one of them. My limit is 300 yards. I don't have to think that hard at that range.

www.federalcartridge.com

I sight my 300 Magnum with 180 Noslers dead on at 200 yards. Yeah, I could use the maximum point blank range method but why bother?

I sight my .458 in dead on at 100 yards. It's aboput 6" low at 200.

The plus 3 rule used to be the norm. your gun shot 3" high at 100 an 4" high at 200 and on at 275 yards..Jack O'Connor liked this method. It is a good sight in plan.

However, I have seen so many misses from shooting high high with the 3 plus method, and the misses I personally had were always high shot misses, never low, so I went to the 2" high at 100 yards and it has worked better for me over the years.

I think the 2" high at 100 yards is more condusive to fast shooting, off hand shooting, and running shots, as this is where you tend to shoot high most of the time. The 3 plus method is fine for blind shooting and shooting from a rest as you have time to think about the trajectory and make the adjustment.

The vast majority of guides and PHs sight in dead on at 100 yards.

I'm with Ray, always 2 in. high at 100. That 3 in setting is 4- 4.5 high at 150, where you will shoot most of your game, or possibly over its back. My real fast calibers or for coyote sized game or smaller with .220 Swift, I like 1.5 in. high.

UPDATE:

Went to the range today to sight in and get on paper with my new Tikka rifle. Took along some 150 grain Greek Milsurp ammo that I had heard good things about. Granted it isn't 180 grain yet (have to load that up).

Sighted dead-on at 25 yards. Was about 1.5 inches high at 50 and 3.5" high at 100 yards. Grouping under 1 MOA (.3" at 50 yards) - again, this is with milsurp ammo. I think that is pretty decent.

Now, given that this is 150 and not 180 grain, is this about right? From what Kudude said, if I sight in at 25 yards with the 180 grain stuff, I should be dead on at 235 yards. But what would my 25-300 yard plus/minus be with 150 grain ammo?

Thanks!

What Ray said.... We have a bunch of deer hunters around here who hunt on pipelines out of box stands and sight in their guns to shoot high at 100 yards so they can take the maybe 400 yard shot at the big buck. (but have never shot a target, much less a deer from 400 yards) Then they shoot something which invariably crosses at 100 yards or less and shoot through the backbone or even higher through the meat above the backbone. I have heard more than one hunter tell me he shot a deer, it went down, and by the time he walked up to it it had recovered from the shock from the bullet passing so close to the spine and ran off.

Remember the highest point of the bullet's arc is usually somewhere around 150 yards so make sure your shots don't go too high. A lot of these antelopes will fool you with that hump and all you will hit is non- vital meat. Think more about a third of the way up from the bottom.

I believe you are going to Namibia so you might have some longer shots present themselves but since you have never really hunted you should try to keep your shots shorter if you can. A living animal adds much more to the equation than a paper target.

Personally, if I was you I would sight for no more than a 200 yard zero and shoot the snot of you rifle using FIELD POSITIONS before you go hunting.

John

Sighting in at 25 always makes it a little too high to suit me, pretty much like yours turned out. When just starting a sight in I put a quarter in low at 25, works out pretty close.

I honestly was just trying to get it on paper so I could eventually get it out to 100 and 200 yards. The range I use unfortunately only opens up the 200 yard range occasionally. I'm spoiled on the range I used to use in Oak Ridge, TN - 1000 yard range, 100, 200, plinking, pistol, shotgun, etc. - all private, 7 days a week, and gated/key access only for members. Sigh.

Of course it makes a difference in what caliber one uses for his plains game rifle. Your suggestion of the 30-06 is a fine one, for a concession where no dangerous game exists. This is true of about 90% of RSA, and the 06 is a great choice. The way you have decided is almost perfect with a 180 gr quality controlled expansion bullet @ 2700 fps. That load will take care of everything you need to shoot in a plains game setting, if you place your shots carefully on things like Eland, and Zebra.

If your choice of concession has dangerous, you never know what you might walk into, you can use a 375 H&H, and zero it exactly the same way with a 300 gr bullet 2550 fps, and hold the same for all distances out to 300 yds. The trajectories are almost identical between these tow cartridges, and a 30-06 and a 375 H&H are a great pair of light, and heavy rifle to use because of the similarity in trajectory. Just zero either, or both 2" high @100 yds, and hold the same with either. The key, no matter which you use, or both, use only one bullet in either/or both. That way you will always know how to hold no matter which is in your hands at the moment! The worse shots I've ever seen are guys who have two or three different bullet weights for the same rifle on the same hunt, thinking they need the perfect bullet for each of a dozen different animals. They seem to never know what they are shooting at any given time!

30-06 with a 180 gr controlled expansion bullet, @ 2700 fps, zeroed 2" high @ 100 yds, and a 375 H&H with a 300 gr controlled expansion bullet,@ 2550 fps, zeroed 2"high @ 100 yds. Out at 300 yds, the 06 will be 8" low, and the 375 will be 12" low,(4" more)but all closer ranges, the hold is exactly the same, and at 300 yds 4" is closer than most can hold from hunting positions! for all practical purposes, both are the same!

Any zero that puts a bullet 4 inches high at any range is a zero too far. Lots of folks have mentioned this, but no one has mentioned this: any group you fire is not going to be one hole; you will shoot a group. As one astute poster noted, the range you shoot a lot of animals in Africa is 150 yards, often from less than perfect conditions. Assuming a 10 inch vital area you would have to shoot 2 inch groups at 150 yards to score 100% of the time. I can keep my shots in 10 inches standing at that range, but not 2 inches, so I will take a 200 yard zero, thank you very much. And we all know there are plenty of smaller animals that have a vital area of about 8 inches, so anything 4 inches high would require one to shoot one hole groups or risk missing. Actually, a zero 4 inches high and treated as a "point blank" zero guarantees a miss 50 percent of the time that bullet is 4 inches high.

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:
The worse shots I've ever seen are guys who have two or three different bullet weights for the same rifle on the same hunt, thinking they need the perfect bullet for each of a dozen different animals. They seem to never know what they are shooting at any given time!

That is so true!

Shakari and Shootaway gave great advice.

I sight mine in at 200 yds and mark the target 200 yds along with the ammo used and caliber. Then don't change ammo. I buy enough ammo so I have the same lot number. Then I shoot 50, 100, 300 and 400 yards and mark all the targets so I remember where my scope is at those distances. I draw a picture of the reticle on each target and mark it. I have a BallisticPlex reticle and that works well for me. The problem I had was finding a range that was more than 200 yds.

Enjoy your trip. I was planning to go in April 2008, but some health issues came up and all plans are on hold. I hope to post a hunt report here some day. Now are those not sad words. Good advice for anyone, do it while you still can.

All of my scoped rifles are zeroed at 100 yards.

Then I zero them at 200 yards.

And if it is a 300 yard rifle I zero it at 300 yards.

For several years I had a 300 yard range avialable to me on a regular basis.

When I get a chance I shoot my long range guns at 400 500 and 600 yards.

So I have "Hard Zeros" at several different ranges.

Then depending on where I am hunting I set my scope accordingly.

Most game shooting takes place at under 300 yards.

If hunting in the thick I keep my zero at 100 yards.

For general purpose I would set it at 200 yards.

Like Ray I have seen many more misses high than low.

In Zimbabwe I had my 9,3x74R set at 150 yards.



Worked perfect.