Given the thread on clients not paying, it made me start to think. What is the worst thing a safari company has done to you financially? I have 2 things.

I went to the RSA with my kids. We shot up a bunch of stuff. When I got the bill, they charged more for packing and dipping than I had been charged on 10 prior safaris in total! I balked . We got into a dispute. Ultimately, I had to pay to get the trophies. However, he ultimately refunded some of the fee.

I shot a large elephant a long time ago. It charged unprovoked right at dark. It ran a short distance and died. The problem was that it's behind was in a park. It's head was in a tribal trust land. How lucky could I be? I paid the fee which I believe was $8,000 and was assured that all would be worked out between parks and the council. Wrong! That was something like 15 years ago. I saw the PH at SCI. we started discussing. We tracked down the dates and the location. For a small fee of $7,500 he got the tusks from parks. They are in his garage. One of my friends took pictures. Perhaps 3 years later, I still don't have the tusks and I am scared to even try and import them after such a long time. The PH who I have known for over 20 years is not responding to e mails, texts or calls. I guess I won't be going with him again.

I bought a package hunt and was informed a few weeks before leaving it would be short 1 day. I said fine as long as we can get all the animals....answer no problem. Lucky I was able to change flight arrangements without penalty. Neither me nor my partner got all our animals. Fortunately they consisted of a duiker, a steenbok and an impala, all low cost animals.

Went back with the same outfitter for another hunt and shot the missing animals and they charged us for them. Was told that it was a government issue and their hands were tied.

My partner mentioned going back with them a third time......my look apparently was enough to answer that question.

I loved it so much that I can't think of anything except getting back!!!!!!!!!


.

I lost my first day of hunting on my first safari because the PH was drunk or at least woke up drunk. I refused to hunt with him that day. I didn't totally blow a gasket but I did have a discussion where I was poking the PH pretty hard with my finger. All worked out nicely as I shot a PAC bull ele the next day that I had not planned on at all and a beautiful old Dugga boy 4 days later. I guess if that's the only real complaint I have I've been lucky but most safaris contain so many positive elements it would be the great exception to have a safari that was really a total disaster. A North American disaster hunt? Just ask me.

Mark

Financially not too bad. My daughter decided she wanted to become an African game killer. It was fun though. Two zebra, orax, springbuck.What a thrill to watch her kill.The taxidermy fee is going to be the killer.

Never had a huge financial problem in 6 safaris, minor stuff which i figured was part of the game of going to an impoverished place.
But I always chose outfitters I knew

I have had ph's arrange for huge representatives of species I did not know I wanted, to appear in front of me and cause me shoot them.

Granted, these were free range areas in dangerous game country, but I am pretty sure the ph had something to do with it.

They rarely seem to be cheap animals I have noticed.

It is all a conspiracy.

Other than this, I have never had a financial surprise on the final bill that was not caused by my trigger finger.

I ran out of money before I ran out of bullets!!!!

JD

had a bum outfitter who held out baggage in town for the entire hunt. he wanted $4400 for charter a king air to bring it to camp. he could have just thrown it on a bush flight that came into the village 3 hrs away but wouldn't

Interesting topic Larry. In 2007 I had my father and two friends on a trip with a PH/operater who was recently in a dispute on these boards regarding travelers checks. I personally counted, had a friend recount and bundled $21,155 USD. I was put away until it was time to pay the tab. Two weeks and two camps later; The entire bundle was handed over by the friend who was watching it. Low and behold the PH disappears and returns without the cash saying the pile was EXACTLY $6000 short of the stated amount.

WTF??? We did not count it in front of him and at that time we had no choice but to scrape up 6K more from the group. I should have told him to pound sand. I completely mishandled the siuation.

Jeff

On my second hunt in Zimbabwe (with Chifuti in Dande) I was really short on funds; long story. In fact, when I was in Harare in the airport on the way home I had four cents US in cash and that was it!

Anyway, I had enough for my buffalo, tuskless, and bushbuck trophies and the tips etc. for everyone. But they offered me a management bull elephant for $5,000 and I just couldn't figure out how to get that much money and had to pass. I should have done it and sold my Jeep when I got home.

I have have really great luck on my two hunts; great PHs, great outfitters, great luck with the animals.

quote:

Originally posted by J D:
I ran out of money before I ran out of bullets!!!!

JD

Yep... Same thing happens to me..

The worst financial thing that happened to me on safari?...I went on my first on and now I can't get enough. I leave tomorrow on my fifth trip to Africa.

It wasn't the "Safari Company" and wasn't in Africa but last year I took a wad of cash to pay expenses on a hunt in Ireland only to find out that no US bill larger than a $20 were accepted by any bank or institution in the country.

(I took cash because I could not get AMX travelers checks cashed in ZIM on my last trip there)

So one trip I carried the checks round trip and this one I carreid the cash round trip and both times I payed with credit cards racking up numerous fees but also lots of airmiles!



Best regards
Mike Ohlmann
Mike's Custom Taxidermy Inc.
4102 Cane Run Rd.
Louisville KY 40216
502-448-1309
Mike@mikescustomtaxidermy.com

I didn't exactly lose any money, maybe, but in a way I lost value in the hunt I paid for.

Back in 2002 I took my youngest son to Zimbabwe for a college graduation Cape buffalo hunt. It was booked through an American outfitter who assured me we would be the only clients in camp.

When we arrived, there were two doctors from new Jersey and three of their friends in camp, along with a Landcruiser and PH for each. Their PH's had lost their concessions and made a quick deal with the landowner to hunt on his place--a conservancy he co-op'd with several other landowners.

Later on another group of hunters arrived--there were so many in camp that the landowner had to open an older facility he had built years before.

The excuse? The landowner had had many cancellations that year and needed to make up the losses.

Needless to say, we didn't get near the animals we planned on taking, and on the last day, the PH (the landowner's son) had my son shoot a 2-curl kudu.

He did get an OK buffalo, although with soft bosses, and a pretty fair sable.

The American outfitter knew nothing of the landowner's actions and was furious. It was not his fault and I would book a hunt with him again.

About a month after we hunted, Mugabe's goons seized the man's land & threw him and his whole family in jail. They lost everything. Even though he did us wrong, I felt terrible for him--and I guess he was just trying to watch out for his family and keep afloat.

So, bottom line, I paid daily rates and trophy fees for something less than I had been promised. Is that the same as losing money?

In light of the thread on bad clients, not all of the crooks are on this side of the pond.

In January of 2000 I booked my first safari to Africa. The PH/outfitter met me here in the states. He had good referances, and seemed honest. It was to be a package hunt up by Kruger. 10 days 5 animals for two of us, my son and myself. I wanted a kudu, gemsbok, zebra, impala, and warthog. My son wanted a kudu, nyala, zebra, and impala, with the kudu at the top of our lists. I was assured that although he couldn't guarantee our shooting, he would guarantee we would see at least 6 kudu over 50". He told me to bring our shotguns as we could shoot all the birds we wanted. He also promised that HE, with his son would be our ph's.

When we arrived in Joberg, we were met by the 21 year old son, and another ph who told us that Papa would be along in a few days. They also said that it was raining up by Kruger, so we would be going down to Douglass for a few days, (a 10 hour drive).

We never saw a shootable kudu,nyala, or zebra. Didn't get a shot at a warthog, and were told that the bird season didn't start for a month. WE never made it up by kruger, and Papa never showed up. I stated that we wanted mature male animals. My ph, (the son) told me to shoot a gemsbok at about 350 to 400 yards. When we got to the animal it was a very fine cow.

My son did get a nice gemsbok, impala, and wildebeast. Along with the gemsbok I took a nice impala, and a springbok.

When we settled up back in Joberg, and I told the other ph I wasn't sopposed to have to pay for the kudu or nyala we didn't get, he said he didn't know anything about that. So I paid the full price.

After I had been home for about a month The outfitter called and said he had herd I was unhappy with my hunt. After I explained my problem, he offered fo me to come back the next year and I would stay for free, only paying for the animals I took. I said that it was a very generous offer, but he already lied to me once and I couldn't trust him.

Thaqt myght have been my last trip to Africa, but I wasn't going to let one bad apple ruin Africa for me. Besides I already had the dust of Africa on my boots. HOOKED!!

In the long run it was that outfitter who lost out because I have been back 8 times. Almost all of those have been great.

One other incident. In 2007 I was visiting St. Lucia with my ph friend and his family fishing, and sight seeing. I asked him to check into an nyala for me. A guy said we as it was SEptember we could shoot an nyala for $1400. US.



when we got there and the guy heard my accent the price went up to 2800 US. That offends me! Needless to say I didn't hunt his Gold inlaid nyala.

Bowhunt in Namibia --- last day/evening of what had been a reasonably good hunt with the taking of several nice critters including: Kudu, Eland, Hartebeest, and Gemsbok. Prior to going to dinner, and knowing it was now time to compensate for the results of my sharp stick harvest, I carefully counted out the cash according to the price sheet I had been given by the booking agent just prior to going on the hunt. The owner of the concession had been away on other affairs and had turned the management of the camp over to his wife and their son. When his wife handed me the invoice at dinner, it was obvious that her numbers did not match mine on several of the critters that I had put in the salt. When I questioned her as to the issue, I was abruptly and emphatically informed that she could charge anything she dam well wanted to for an individual animal and that if I wanted my critters to arrive on the other side of the pond I had to pay. Needless to say it was a very quiet dinner that night as the other hunter in camp also received the same treatment.
I begrudgingly paid the requested amount and notified the booking agent upon my return to the US. Fortunately I was later refunded the disputed amounts along with some other funds that had become an issue. Interestingly this was not the only issues that we faced with this company---------- I have not been back.

Not really an issue with the PH, but...

I got to SA with several thousand dollars in cash. My concern was the hassle with exchanging them for rand. It was even worse than trying to keep up with the exchange rate when vacationing in Canada.

Since the SA government won't let people use USD, my PH had to buy things for me and then we got to sit down in the evening and do the conversion thing. Just a PITA.

But I am headed back to hunt with him again next spring. I know now to get a couple hundred dollars exchanged at the airport.

Rich

Been screwed once..booked a hunt in Zambia only to find out 7 days before we were to go, that the PH did not have (and never had) consession rights) to any area.

I had paid my booking agent $6,000 at SCI Reno to book the hunt. He paid me back, but I know he never go a dime refunded.

Want the names... send me a PM.

Another close call was with the now (disappeared) David Vander Muelen. Upon completion of the hunt, I was handed a bill for $500 Airport pick and return.

I promptly got my files in which I had a signed receipt for "Airport transfers Included". And that ended that relationship.

Other than that in 22 trips to many PH's and outfitters in Zim, Namibia, and RSA I've had no
real problems.

All this is so very interesting ... After I paid an outfitter in Zimbabwe after the safari ... he grabbed my wallet out of my hand and looked inside of it .. It was pretty damn flat .. We then got into an argument where He said that I needed to keep some money for the long journey back to Canada. I disagreed ... but lost. He gave me $500 cash back and I exchanged it for a cheque. That fine man in 1989 was the late Dave Masson. Another ourfitter 5 years later offered me an elephant bull on the installment plan !!! Some now and some next year . My lady accepted on the spot for me ... Her reasoning was that we were already there .. and would never have a better chance. Back then the trophy fee with our lousy Canadian buck was four months take home salary for me. So I took the legendary Roger Whittal up on his generous offer ... and he trusted me enough to send the tusks before the second payment was due .. I consider both of these gentlemen to be men of honor ...

All interesting stories. It is amazing what can happen. While the things I listed were by far the worst two, I have had some more minor things such changing prices.

I also had 2 safaris that were very disappointing and very expensive (one was about $90K). Imagine spending $90K and never seeing a lion or having a lion on bait. In retrospect, drought was the issue in both cases. Some people think I should have been angry. I wasn't. Disappointed but not angry. Definitely not in the category of an outright screwing.

I figured we would get some Usangu stories here but haven't. I have heard some of those and they are scary.

Jeff, that is interesting in light of the recently discussed issue here. It would cause me to view the recent brouhaha differently. I also note his agent has disappeared from AR. makes one wonder......

I've had 4 great hunts and 4 great PHs in 4 trips over, but have had a few little hiccups:

Lost a day of hunting because I got to Harare but the guns stayed in JoBerg

Took a Cashier's Check to pay and had the wrong company name (DBA) on it; didn't know it till I got home, and the PH had to have his next client mail it to me after HIS return.

Shot a PAC ele that wasn't in the cash flow plan...

Shot a Leopard that wasn't in the cash flow plan......

Left my best Warthog skull in Zim, rather than pay the $ 2300 quoted to ship it...

Got way too carried away last trip and ran up the bill.....

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
All interesting stories. It is amazing what can happen. While the things I listed were by far the worst two, I have had some more minor things such changing prices.

I also had 2 safaris that were very disappointing and very expensive (one was about $90K). Imagine spending $90K and never seeing a lion or having a lion on bait. In retrospect, drought was the issue in both cases. Some people think I should have been angry. I wasn't. Disappointed but not angry. Definitely not in the category of an outright screwing.

I figured we would get some Usangu stories here but haven't. I have heard some of those and they are scary.

Jeff, that is interesting in light of the recently discussed issue here. It would cause me to view the recent brouhaha differently. I also note his agent has disappeared from AR. makes one wonder......

Just the tip of the iceberg Larry. I am still owed an ele by this"chap". Rotsa Ruck...

A lot of things can happen on a safari. Most of them beyond the control of the ph, the outfitter, or the client. That's hunting, and part of the alure of Africa. We should all try to adjust, and make the best of the situation. Most of my hunts have turned out better than I had hoped.

When I nook a hunt I have decided to trust that company. In some cases my life is in their hands. I trust a man for his word until he violates that trust. I would like the same courtesy.

I would hate for a few jerks ruin it for the rest of us.

quote:

Originally posted by Terry Blauwkamp:
Been screwed once..booked a hunt in Zambia only to find out 7 days before we were to go, that the PH did not have (and never had) consession rights) to any area.

I had paid my booking agent $6,000 at SCI Reno to book the hunt. He paid me back, but I know he never go a dime refunded.

Want the names... send me a PM.

Another close call was with the now (disappeared) David Vander Muelen. Upon completion of the hunt, I was handed a bill for $500 Airport pick and return.

I promptly got my files in which I had a signed receipt for "Airport transfers Included". And that ended that relationship.

Other than that in 22 trips to many PH's and outfitters in Zim, Namibia, and RSA I've had no
real problems.

Van der Muelen - Another of SCI's blue eyed boys?

My first hunt to Zim, the "administrative assistant" for my PH was called about my travel plans from Jo'berg to BULAWAYO...which they always had been...just a reminder call the day beofre I was to get there. So she doesn't say a word to my PH, who, by the way had doubled booked himself and was scrambling to find another PH to hunt me. The PH he found (Craig Robinson who was awesome!) was told to pick me up in Harare at a much later time. Well, the plane landed in Bulawayo....as it was supposed to all along and with no one to meet me, "customs/immigration" personnel decided I was up to no good and confiscated EVERYTHING and put me in the corner. Only after a VERY nice lady I had been conversing with on the plane, and who lived in Bulawayo, told her husband something wasn't right, did things start to get better. He was able to get a hold of the "administrative assistant" and sort out that I was IN Bulawayo. Evidently thru her panic she was able to get Craig turned around....he had barely left...and many hours later I was on my way to the Omay. Oh yeah....she forgot to book the charter flight into Omay as well.
Come to find out, her "administrative" skills had nothing to do with paperwork and my original PH ended up divorcing his wife for her. Seems her talents were well known around Bulawayo,
Got my buff though!!

Gary
DRSS
NRA Lifer
SCI
DSC

twas many moons ago & I was in natal with trevor shaw. the guy that was there before me was an italian chap who wanted to shoot a white rhino. anyway they drove up to a bull and the PH told the guy to shoot. he did and the rhino ran off into the heavy bush. PH told him to stay put but he ran off after the rhino. got a few yards into the bush and the ph heard the bang. When he got there he finds the 2nd rhino dead, but this was a pregnant cow. at the time if i remember right the trophy fee was 10,00 for a rhino and this guy just did in 3.

quote:

Originally posted by J D:
I ran out of money before I ran out of bullets!!!!

JD

Ditto, especially when I was budgeting on '06 prices in '08.

My nightmare was in England in 2001 with a scoundrel by the name of Derrick Bond.

We had put together a multi area, multi species hunt all the while staying in castles and B&Bs. We were two hunters and three observers. Two cars were contracted so the hunters could hunt and others could see the sights. The observers were to have a tour guide/driver to keep them entertained, fed, and busy.

I knew we were in trouble when we got off the plane and the hunter met us asking us for the balance of the money for our hunt. We had paid big deposits, and we only owed a small amount for the balance of the day rate and the observer fees.

Having only been on English soil for 10 minutes, we were stunned. I say, "Your agent said we could settle up at the end of the hunt with a check. We have a few hundred bucks each, but other than that we only have plastic and checks."

The hunter says, "We've just bought a big piece of property in Scotland and we're unable to put on this hunt unless you come up with some cash. We've just driven down from Scotland last night and we've spent the last of our money to put petrol in the vehicles."

So, we start drawing money from ATM machines and we go by a bank and advance some money on our credit cards. We eventually put together about $7500, which was enough to pay our bill and get the hunt done. I shot a huge Chineese Water Deer as well as nice Roe Deer. My partner shot the same animals. We did not shoot (or even see) Muntjac. That said, there were times when we were in positions to shoot other and different game, but we could not because the landowners had to be paid when the game was shot. It was apparant this guy had NO credit and we had no cash. The lack of cash was an issue every minute of every day. It sucked the fun out of the hunt.

At the end of the hunt, we were to be driven back to London from the North of England for a few days of R&R. Without notification, we pull into a train station and the hunter tells us we are taking the train. "What about the money we paid for transportation, what about our contract, etc, etc, etc?" He then gave me some bill of goods about how long it takes to drive, how far it was, how much it costs, how they need to get home, and all that jazz.

So, we buy tickets and are loading onto the train and I say (mainly for sport), "You owe me $1000 for the muntjac trophy fee I paid in advance. I've not even seen a muntjac." He stammers and stutters about the cost of the hunt, that he's broke, yak yak yak. I say, "Well, I'll go home and make another $1000 and I may even come back and shoot a muntjac some day, but you'll still be a no good, lying, thieving sumbitch."

I get on the train and go to London which, by the way, was delightful. While there, Mohammed al Fayed almost ran off with my mother, but that's another story for another day.

A few years later, this guy was kicked out of SCI. I know his expulsion was well deserved.

My wife talking me into shipping back an elephant skull. All the freight cost for the thing to sit in the back yard and decay.

BigB

I had a safari outfitter misrepresent his hunting concession and then renig on a deal he made to compensate me for the problem.

not having enough money to got to Africa this year.........

Some have mentioned places other than Africa. My absolute worst screwing was at the hands of a guy in New Zealand named Richard Nunnick.

I hunted with him as my guide at Glenroy. We had a fantastic hunt and a lot of fun. we got along famously and stayed in touch.

At some point, he told me he was dying of liver cancer. I spent about $5,000 of my own money to buy him and his girlfriend tickets to come to my annual Christmas party in Orlando. He never showed claiming that he wasn't cleared to fly. I had also arranged for some of his clients to fly in to see him one last time.

To briefly summarize, he got better and went on his own a guide. I booked and sent him a $6,000 deposit check. He then offered to return the check if I would wire him the money. No big deal, I wired the money. My check also cleared the bank the same week. Now he has $12,000 of my money.

At some point,. I learned that he had screwed a bunch of people in NZ badly. I also started to see holes in his story. Bottom line is that he was a criminal.

I told Richard that if I didn't get my money back I would become his worst nightmare. I will bet he believes me now. I sued him in civil court and won a judgment. I had him arrested. He plead guilty. All of this was nothing. In the course of investigating, I learned that he had scammed a lot of women out of money. I got the women together. One of the largest papers in NZ printed an article about him and his antics in scamming women. Before the article, I took all of these women to dinner in Auckland. My fiance took a picture of me with all of his victims around me. We then e mailed it to him. I would have loved to have seen his reaction!

I wonder if it was worth $12,000? His life is wrecked and the bastard deserves it!

Larry,

I am negotiating with a chap for a late season Leopard in the Luangwa. This time of year the odds will not be in his favor so I have suggested we start the hunt off as a plains game safari and upgrades if he shoots his Leopard.

How about a $55,000.00 - 21 Day Masailand hunt in which the PH and his trackers/hunters had a total of 3 days more experience in the area than I. Which didn't really matter much since the entire area had ONLY 1 road, which we drove up and down for 21 days. Not to mention we were hunting a different block than was agreed to when I booked the hunt. I was told there were no Gerenuk in the area, but after seeing two good ones 15 minutes apart, and freaking out when I was told I could not shoot one, things started to unravel. We could not bait within 2 kilometers of water, company rule, not law. Hunted July 1-21, never saw a buffalo, not one. Saw two 3 yr old lions, passed them up obviously. And did have 1 good leopard in the tree at 4:30am, but while waiting for daylight, the PH thought it was a good idea to start talking a mere 38 yards from the bait. My PH, was a MORON! Needless to say, the leopard bailed out of the tree, never to be seen again. On the flip side, I was able to shoot 6 beautiful plains game animals, all for a mere $55,000.00 (fringe eared oryx/EA impala/Coke's hartebeest/ostrich/zebra/grant's gazelle)

I guess I forgot to mention the $38,800USD that Zahir Mulla stole from me.

Jeff

I am surprised we haven't heard more Usangu stories. Mr Mulla certainly f'ed enough people with out kissing them.

Well it had nothing to do with the safari, only getting there!

I took six weeks of vacation once to book only a 7 day cape Buffalo hunt. I booked this safari at the DSC show many years ago, and I needed in the spring of the same year, and found that the only week I could get was in the last 10 days of that vacation. Because of the short time before the hunt, the only flights I could get were from D/FW to EWR on American, connecting with British Air to London, connect with BA down to Lusaka, and picking up Zambia air up to Mfuwe for pick up. Well that was the plan, anyway!
I flew to EWR from D/FW, then the connecting flight hit a pelican on arivl at EWR, breaking a leading edge flap servo, causeing an over night wait for parts from London. I spent the night in EWR, then missed all my connections to Lusaka, so that the plane up to Mfuwe was no longer available as it only flew twice per week. The only seat I could get to london was to fly back to DFW, then to LAX,on American, to pick up a flight from LAX to London two days late, and still in the USA. By the time I got to camp, I had three days left of my 7 day hunt. This was way back, and the daily fee in those days of $500 per day on a buffalo hunt was quite expensive,for the time, so I had already lost $2000 in daily fees, and the extra fights had cost me another $2000, and two nights in Lusaka cost me another $300. So I was out $4300 USD before I even got into camp. I could have recovered the hunting days because the PH didn't have another client for 5 days, and he said I could simply stay longer to get all my days, but My vacation ws over, and I had to be back in my office in four days!

These are things that happen on occasion and are not the fault of anyone other than Murphy's law, what ever can go wrong will go wrong, at the most inopertune time!

How about contracting a hunt for a daily fee rate then getting home and being charged a higher rate than the contracted fee? Only a low rent scumbag outfit would do that right? RIGHT?

Actually, on my very first African hunt I was disembarking the plane at our destination in Kimberley, South Africa, when much to my surprise, I discovered on the tarmac and right behind me that, unbeknownst me, a number of my many thousands of dollars in travelers checks hidden in my money belt had been slipping out of the belt, down my right pants leg and onto the aisle of the plane and the tarmac. I quickly picked up the checks near me and fortunately my hunting partner had been right behind me picking up the rest and laughing. After gathering them up, I slipped into the airport bathroom and counted them all before even meeting the PH, who thought that I had a bad case of diarrhea! True story! Just ask Bwanna!