TNN News:
"Hunting advisories here in the USA, such as newsletters, clubs and organisations have picked up on the 17+ American hunters who have been robbed leaving OR Tambo and/or their motels in Johannesburg in the span of a week just recently.
Speculation is rampant that the robberies are part and parcel of an organisation involving airport employees privy to the customs forms which list where the hunters are staying and the amount of cash they are carrying.
This will no doubt result in American hunters being advised to book flights not ending or laying over in Johannesburg and will no doubt start the hunt-booking agencies looking to Cape Town as the alternative airport and to Namibia, Botswana, Mozambique, etc. as alternative hunt destinations."

This is nothing new, but seems to be getting more common. I've gone through Jo'burgs airport without incident many times and on my last visit to Zim, had my bags and rifle case forwarded to Bulawayo. The only problem I encountered was here in the States. I made the flight to Dulles/Jo'burg/Bulawayo, my baggage didn't. Due to having to change planes at the last minute (bad weather) my bags were left on the original plane. I had them a few days later without any problems (other than TSA cutting off a few of my small locks).
I was later advised I was lucky. Having my bag and rifle case in Jo'burgs care, then traveling unescorted if you will to Bulawayo. I do consider myself lucky. I recommend taking all precautions at your disposal, and have plan B (and C) in mind.
Cheers,
LDK

Air2000, and expiditing agency, will no longer accept payment in cash on arrival at O.R. Tambo because of the crime rate. Apparently, their personnel and the hunters they met who were observed exchanging cash were frequent victims of later theft as they left the airport.

JPK

I cannot imagine it will get better.....I hope to go to Botswana in 2009, already planning how to avoid Joburg (go via Windhoek) and I have to believe I am not alone. Even if airfares are higher, it sounds as if it is worth it to avoid this place.

You'd really hope that our good friends, outfitters and PH's from South Africa would be making this one of their top priorities with their own government, police, and the requisite officials at the OR Tambo Airport, since their very own livlihood is directly connected to this problem, which if it continues or gets worse will result in hunters abandoning South African hunting. Between this problem and the problem with bags being rifled through and items stolen, no one wants to put up with that at all.

Look at the bright side, at least you are not coming to Chicago.


Apr 21, 2008 11:15 am

37 Shot, 2 Stabbed, 7 Dead In Chicago Over Weekend


CBS News Interactive: Crime Beat
CHICAGO (CBS) ― Five people were shot overnight in Chicago Sunday, capping off a violent weekend that left 37 people shot, two stabbed and seven dead, CBS station WBBM-TV reported.

Chicago police say that warmer weather means more opportunities for violent crime. They are stepping up patrols and focusing their efforts on targeting gang leaders.

Chicago Police Supt. Jody Weis says more officers have been deployed to the city's violent areas, but he says a lot of the violence involves young people, after curfew, and parents need to help stop them.

"You just have too many guns, gangs, too many weapons out here. That's why we have to work hard to take them off. Chicago has probably enjoyed the greatest success in taking weapons off the street," Weis said.

Police admit that three dozen shootings in one weekend is a lot, but through the end of March in Chicago, violent crime was down. On Friday, 15 people were shot -- four fatally.

About 7 p.m., a man was fatally shot in the abdomen pronounced dead at an area hospital. Police were able to arrest a suspect and charge the 39-year-old man with one count of first-degree murder for allegedly firing shots at responding officers. Police recovered an AK-47 assault rifle from the scene, police said.

A 17-year-old was charged Sunday afternoon with attempted murder and home invasion in an attack.


(© MMVIII, CBS Broadcasting Inc. All Rights Reserved.)

Kathi,

While I am sure this is true and correct, how many of these victims were tourists targeted at the airport on arrival??????

And I would bet you money that JoBerg still wins on a day to day basis for crime and murder.

Not that it will stop me! I just ain't too smart I guess.

A solution. 1)Wire most monies ahead, 2) Stay at a facility like the Afton House for secure and safe in country pre/post hunt accomodations, 3)don't look like a hunter/tourist. JM2CW

quote:

Originally posted by Kathi:
Look at the bright side, at least you are not coming to Chicago.


Apr 21, 2008 11:15 am

37 Shot, 2 Stabbed, 7 Dead In Chicago Over Weekend


CBS News Interactive: Crime Beat
CHICAGO (CBS) ― Five people were shot overnight in Chicago Sunday, capping off a violent weekend that left 37 people shot, two stabbed and seven dead, CBS station WBBM-TV reported.

Chicago police say that warmer weather means more opportunities for violent crime. They are stepping up patrols and focusing their efforts on targeting gang leaders.

Chicago Police Supt. Jody Weis says more officers have been deployed to the city's violent areas, but he says a lot of the violence involves young people, after curfew, and parents need to help stop them.

"You just have too many guns, gangs, too many weapons out here. That's why we have to work hard to take them off. Chicago has probably enjoyed the greatest success in taking weapons off the street," Weis said.

Police admit that three dozen shootings in one weekend is a lot, but through the end of March in Chicago, violent crime was down. On Friday, 15 people were shot -- four fatally.

About 7 p.m., a man was fatally shot in the abdomen pronounced dead at an area hospital. Police were able to arrest a suspect and charge the 39-year-old man with one count of first-degree murder for allegedly firing shots at responding officers. Police recovered an AK-47 assault rifle from the scene, police said.

A 17-year-old was charged Sunday afternoon with attempted murder and home invasion in an attack.


(© MMVIII, CBS Broadcasting Inc. All Rights Reserved.)

Im curious to know what race most of them were? Call me racist if you want but I would still like to know.

quote:

Originally posted by Jarrod:

quote:

Originally posted by Kathi:
Look at the bright side, at least you are not coming to Chicago.


Apr 21, 2008 11:15 am

37 Shot, 2 Stabbed, 7 Dead In Chicago Over Weekend


CBS News Interactive: Crime Beat
CHICAGO (CBS) ― Five people were shot overnight in Chicago Sunday, capping off a violent weekend that left 37 people shot, two stabbed and seven dead, CBS station WBBM-TV reported.

Chicago police say that warmer weather means more opportunities for violent crime. They are stepping up patrols and focusing their efforts on targeting gang leaders.

Chicago Police Supt. Jody Weis says more officers have been deployed to the city's violent areas, but he says a lot of the violence involves young people, after curfew, and parents need to help stop them.

"You just have too many guns, gangs, too many weapons out here. That's why we have to work hard to take them off. Chicago has probably enjoyed the greatest success in taking weapons off the street," Weis said.

Police admit that three dozen shootings in one weekend is a lot, but through the end of March in Chicago, violent crime was down. On Friday, 15 people were shot -- four fatally.

About 7 p.m., a man was fatally shot in the abdomen pronounced dead at an area hospital. Police were able to arrest a suspect and charge the 39-year-old man with one count of first-degree murder for allegedly firing shots at responding officers. Police recovered an AK-47 assault rifle from the scene, police said.

A 17-year-old was charged Sunday afternoon with attempted murder and home invasion in an attack.


(© MMVIII, CBS Broadcasting Inc. All Rights Reserved.)

Im curious to know what race most of them were? Call me racist if you want but I would still like to know.

How about the HUMAN RACE!. Most of them were probably not of the same race as the some of the greatest killers in world history. Wouldn't it suffice to say travelers to Joberg be careful & mindful of your surroundings rather than an attempt to fault a race of people.

quote:

How about the HUMAN RACE!. Most of them were probably not of the same race as the some of the greatest killers in world history. Wouldn't it suffice to say travelers to Joberg be careful & mindful of your surroundings rather than an attempt to fault a race of people.

+1

Some more politically correct bull shit! The question is relative. If 99 % of the crimes are committed by any race, then the question is not racist, but a valid concern.

Criminals come in all flavors, but there are pockets where the crime is committed predominantly by one race over all others. I don't think the question was needed in this case, however, because the law of averages here tells the answer to that question! However the PC crap is the absolute doom awaiting all society.

When did it become politically correct to ignore the truth, and not just say it like it is! POLITICAL CORRECTNESS is nothing more than a LIBERAL sponsored censorship!

quote:

When did it become politically correct to ignore the truth, and not just say it like it is! POLITICAL CORRECTNESS is nothing more than a LIBERAL sponsored censorship!

Way too true!

Forget the political correctness. Stay the fuck out of Chicago

The article Kathi posted can't be true. Chicago banned guns in 1982 and everyone knows that when guns are banned, crime is eliminated.

John

quote:

"You just have too many guns, gangs, too many weapons out here. That's why we have to work hard to take them off. Chicago has probably enjoyed the greatest success in taking weapons off the street," Weis said.

What a lying sack of crap. If true, why are they running around shooting each other.

Give them more guns, I say!

Hmmm, I seem to see my tag line repeated here. As a psychologist/sociologist, I see too much political correctness used over valid researched fact. As a fact, who were the people who were responsible for the deaths in 911? Then why should we, in the name of political correctness, search grandma?

What a crappy feeling when you come home from a hunt with gifts from a once in a lifetime hunt and have some dirt bag in JoBerg steal things out of your bags. With the World Cup comming in 2010 I would hope anyone who has been robbed would raise and continue to raise hell. If the threat of being hurt financially on the world stage perhaps something would be done about this crap. It has happened to me. Two Ostrich purses and some jewlery for my daughters were taken in JoBerg.

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:
Some more politically correct bull shit! The question is relative. If 99 % of the crimes are committed by any race, then the question is not racist, but a valid concern.

Criminals come in all flavors, but there are pockets where the crime is committed predominantly by one race over all others. I don't think the question was needed in this case, however, because the law of averages here tells the answer to that question! However the PC crap is the absolute doom awaiting all society.

When did it become politically correct to ignore the truth, and not just say it like it is! POLITICAL CORRECTNESS is nothing more than a LIBERAL sponsored censorship!

Well said Mac. Here in Oz we have been plagued by PC for as long as I can remember. Call me an optimist but I believe the tide is slowly turning, more folks are saying "if the truth hurts, too fucking bad" Long may this trend continue!!!!!

NRA members: I encourage you to read Wayne LaPierre's article on page 10 of the recent issue of American Hunter. Titled: Barack Obama's Slippery Oratory, it reveals our Senator from Illinois true colors on our 2nd Amendment and Right to Carry law. I think as Chief he would speak with forked tongue.

Not trying to hi-jack my own post, but since we're talking about Chicago, it lies in Illinois, a State I happen to be very fond of, and enjoy the privilege of hunting.
LDK

Apart for myself, I can talk for two other outfitters who work with me. We help each other out when need be. Relevant facts. Last three years, about 120 clients per year between the three business. NOT ONE PROBLEM. We meet the clients ourselves, and clear the firearms ourselves. I do not say never, but someone must do something very wrong, or were very unlcuky to get done in like that.

And I have had 12 foreign tourists and hunters since the beginning of March this year......

Also, an American retired SF col. told me once after leaving that airport. "These guys are like hyenas, they smell people who are not alert".

Look sharp, and have your wits about you at all times (I know it is difficult after such a long flight), they prey on the tired and unwarry looks......

Good luck, and do not let this keep you from the best hunting experience you can get.

www.infinito-safaris.com

Our erstwhile government has just admitted that in excess of 7000 bags went AWOL from our airports in the last 3 months, the vast majority from OR Tambo. When I went back to cut and paste the article from www.iol.co.za it had already gone. This is in starke contrast to the claim that only 6600 went missing over the past 10 months and was in a written reply from our trade and industries manager Alec Irwin, in a response to a question posed in parliament by the opposition party.
I have sent a letter to SA Tourism asking them to make some waves, and will forward to Phasa.
I suggest all forumites also have a rant.

found it;

Missing luggage figures don't add up

April 29 2008 at 10:25AM

By Natasha Joseph

A total of 7 868 items of luggage belonging to South African Airways passengers were reported missing from airports in Johannesburg, Cape Town, Durban, Port Elizabeth and East London in the three-month period between December 1 last year and February 29 this year, says the minister of public enterprises.

That's in stark contrast to figures supplied to The Mercury's sister paper the Cape Times by SAA last week. The airline said that according to its figures, about 6 600 of its passengers would have their luggage stolen each year.

According to public enterprises minister Alec Erwin most of the luggage - 7 617 items - disappeared from Johannesburg's O R Tambo Airport, while 178 SAA passengers at Cape Town International Airport were not reunited with their bags.

Erwin's department supplied the figures in response to a parliamentary question put to him by the DA's spokesperson on public enterprises, Manie van Dyk. The DA's question related only to SAA

Erwin noted in his reply that baggage handling was "the joint responsibility of the (handling) company contracted by SAA and the Airports Company of South Africa".

The figures supplied in his answer reflected only incidents that had been reported to SAA, said Erwin.

In December, SAA handled 470 390 pieces of luggage. Of these, 1 293 were pilfered at O R Tambo. SAA baggage handling staff at Johannesburg's airport worked with a total of 769 467 bags over the three-month period, far outstripping the numbers in Cape Town, where staff handled 283 161 bags between December and February.

Rates for pilfering, damage and theft dropped considerably in Durban, Port Elizabeth and East London. In December, out of 9 738 items handled in East London, no cases of pilfering were reported.

December was the worst month for missing luggage: a total of 4 170 bags went missing from all airports. The figure dropped to 1 728 in January, rising slightly again in February to 1 978.

In January, nine items of baggage were reported missing from Durban International - handlers there worked with 44 362 bags that month.

A total of 1 866 bags were damaged at O R Tambo during the three-month period. Three hundred and sixty-five bags were damaged in Cape Town during the same period, while 69 bags out of 48 699 were damaged in Port Elizabeth.

Last week, SAA said that more than 10 000 SAA passengers lodged claims for damaged luggage annually and around 6 600 would have their luggage stolen each year.



This article was originally published on page 2 of The Mercury on April 29, 2008

Never give anybody your passport after clearing customs or your firearm papers unless your ph say you may

quote:

Some more politically correct bull shit! The question is relative. If 99 % of the crimes are committed by any race, then the question is not racist, but a valid concern.

Criminals come in all flavors, but there are pockets where the crime is committed predominantly by one race over all others. I don't think the question was needed in this case, however, because the law of averages here tells the answer to that question! However the PC crap is the absolute doom awaiting all society.

When did it become politically correct to ignore the truth, and not just say it like it is! POLITICAL CORRECTNESS is nothing more than a LIBERAL sponsored censorship!

+1

After careful thought, I've decided to include a rather large 6 foot rubber snake inside my checked bag. I'll know any BS is going on by the blood curdling screams I hear coming from the baggage area. As for my gun case, I think Voodoo and Witch Craft symbols painted on the outside should do nicely. Too bad PHASA hasn't taken a strong stand on this. It's a black eye on an otherwise great trip for most. As mentioned, be very aware of your surroundings and preferably, have your PH there to greet you or another "meet and greet" person.
LDK

I agree with LDK. I had also suggested earlier that PHASA and other groups with direct vested interests in arriving passengers put some pressure on OR TAMBO INT'L, the government and SAA to stop this nonsense, or at least cut it back significantly. I like your idea of voodoo and witchcraft symbols. . . . .

quote:

Originally posted by prof242:
As a fact, who were the people who were responsible for the deaths in 911? Then why should we, in the name of political correctness, search grandma?

On that note who is responsible for most of the international terrorist attacks in the last forty years? Easy answer.

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:
When did it become politically correct to ignore the truth, and not just say it like it is! POLITICAL CORRECTNESS is nothing more than a LIBERAL sponsored censorship!

George Orwell called it "NewSpeak".

I am late to this discussion, but I have to comment on the initial Chicago posting. A PC discussion broke out before any real comment was made. I think this posting is frankly way off base. Chicago has a crime problem, as do a lot of big cities. However, to compare it to the situation under discussion is not really relevant. The report indicates that most of the problem is due to youths after curfew and gang activity. I see little connection here to a transient passenger. The Chicago problem is a general crime problem. The J'Burg problem is one which is targeted at a small group to which many here belong. I doubt that a businessman planning an overnight layover through O'Hare and staying at a reputable hotel would have a second thought about changeing his plans after reading this. The same isn't true of the J'Burg situation. The fact is that the general crime situation in J'Burg is likely worse than Chicago, but neither of these facts should be used to divert attention from a serious ploblem which exists for hunters that needs to be addressed.

Chicago is no worse than any city in the states including smaller ones in the south. And the cities here in the States are often better than cities around the world. There are areas you do not go into at certain times.

I worked UPS in Chicago and spent a minimum two weeks every year in the Cabrini Green projects when the regular driver was on vacation. I never had a problem.

Someone has already mentioned to be aware of your surroundings and the people. Don't flash money or discuss your trip in public. Be alert. We have stayed at the Afton House or have hired a Car service.

Curious at which Hotels are people being hit?

A number of years ago gangs targeted tourists renting cars in Miami. You could easily take a wrong turn and be in a dark corner. Some were shot and killed.

Kathi, I am suprised.