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Earlier, when I said some doctors here are reluctant to look outside their usual realm of experience, it was because I had been a victim of such reluctance years ago. I'd been back from Africa about three or four days when I came down with a high fever and a wound with decaying flesh on the inside of my thigh. My doctor was certain I had been bitten by a brown recluse spider and prescribed antibiotics. He wouldn't listen when I told him about being in Zululand a week earlier, and that I might have been bitten by a tick. Ten days later, I was so weak I had trouble standing or walking. It was apparent his treatment wasn't helping, so I went to another doctor who prescribed something for tick fever. I felt better overnight and was well in a week. Bill Quimby | |||
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All of this stuff is the reason I choose to take Doxycycline for malaria prevention...cause it is also the cure for most of these and can prevent them as well. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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As Lane can also tell you, there is always some confusion between Lymes disease,, and tick bite fever. Why,, they come from ticks! For us deer hunters and deer ticks we have Rocky Moutain Spotted fever, a bacterium from the Rickettsia family,, here in the states, Rickettsia ricketsi and in Africa,, Rickettsia africae,, tick bite fever. And as Bill stated the initial infection usually leaves a bite mark like a spider, then rash, then all the other symtoms jump on you and take you down,,,treatment--Doxycycline Lymes disaese from the bacterium Borrelia burgdorferi It can have the same initial symptoms, but it can have 3 stages of the disease. Stage 1 1-4weeks rash, bite mark, etc, fever, all the flu like symptoms etc. but many cases have no rash at all and many patients can not recall any bite. Stage 2 1-4 months persistent , reoccurring flu like symptoms but you can add, memory problems, heart problems, arythmias, etc, facial paralysis, finger-toe numbness tingling etc. and stage 3, or late stage and that is where you can have permanent joint damage, heart and or neurological damage. Treatment __once again Doxycycline. Most in stage 1 should have daily doses for at least 14 days! When you get to Stage 2 you are looking at Iv's and longer duration of meds and their complications Are you seeing Lane's point with taking the Doxy with him? There are serological tests for both! For Lymes the ElISHA Test is the most common, if positive they confirm with a "western blot" it is an antibody titer test and to confirm a stage 3 PCR they look for The bacterial DNA in joint or spinal fluid. It is nothing to mess around with,, push for the tests,, I will take The squirts from too much Doxy just to be on the safe side.. you can make more money, you can not make more time | |||
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and then we have to consider relapsing fever caused by Borrrelia recurrentis and Borrelia duttoni, Borrelia hermsii, and Borrelia parkerii. transmitted by ticks and lice. i would contact the CDC for advice and referral | |||
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Duke Medical called and said I could not schedule with the infectious disease doc unless my primary care physician called with a referral and diagnosis. That is the problem, the primary care docs say each time- probably a stomach bug- probably your prostate- but if it is not better in 10 days come back... very frustrating, very. Oh but by the way....if you join Duke Executive Health ($4000) they will book you without a referral.................................... ______________________________ "Are you gonna pull them pistols,...or whistle Dixie??" Josie Wales 1866 | |||
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Okay, how about 100 of us throw in $40 for Joel so he can go on Monday? Paul Smith SCI Life Member NRA Life Member DSC Member Life Member of the "I Can't Wait to Get Back to Africa" Club DRSS I had the privilege to fire E. Hemingway's WR .577NE, E. Keith's WR .470NE, & F. Jamieson's WJJ .500 Jeffery I strongly recommend avoidance of "The Zambezi Safari & Travel Co., Ltd." and "Pisces Sportfishing-Cabo San Lucas" "A failed policy of national defense is its own punishment" Otto von Bismarck | |||
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Your mention of arrhythmia and other heart problems from tick fever rang a bell with me. About a year after my episode, I began suffering pericarditis attacks that recurred every few months. This "progressed" over the years to atrial fibrillation, congestive heart failure, peripheral arterial disease, and eventually a heart attack. Add that to my apnea, hypothyroidism and COPD (from smoking), and I'm a mess. It's awful to think that it may have begun with an ugly little tick and a doctor who wouldn't listen to his patient. Bill Quimby | |||
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Pretty standard--just tell your PCP you'd like him to make the referral. Have your lab results copied in duplicate-one to be sent ahead of your appointment (which probably will get lost in the shuffle) and the second copy for you to hand deliver when the first doesn't show. I doubt you have any imaging; if there is anything relevant, get it burned on a CD to bring along too. You won't be stepping on any toes and your PCP will be happy/relieved you're getting a second opinion at a tertiary center. . . | |||
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Sorry to hear you're ill Joel! Make your PC doc give you a referral...doesn't cost him anything and if he won't, find one that will! Then get to Duke. I imagine right now all you want is to start feeling better, so fighting with your doc isn't tops on the list, then you get healthy again and somewhat forget about it in hopes it never returns. Make sure when you get all healed up you pursue this, if not before then!! Best of luck, Scott "....but to protest against all hunting of game is a sign of softness of head, not of soundness of heart." Theodore Roosevelt | |||
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Once again, thanks to all for the kind replies. Hello to Paul, Bill and Scott- good to hear from you. I called a couple of times to my primary care doc to get test results. Everything is negative ie CBC all neg and all urine tests negative. Through the nurse, heard that she did make the referral to Duke, so I hope that link up works. Vagrouser- good tip, will do, and I hope I have time to get ER records from San Diego for the first visit when I was initially ill, and all the follow up visits to primary care docs. Fingers crossed. Huvius - I missed your post earlier- wow, what a terrible ordeal you went through and glad you are ok. Bill - thanks for your posts. I will also print this thread and take it with me. On Monday I see the urologist, though I think that is moot now. On Tuesday I am having the camera look from both ends - needed to have one anyway for a baseline. If anything pops up, I will post, because at least one other person, Jack, is in the same boat, so we will hopefully get to the bottom of this. ______________________________ "Are you gonna pull them pistols,...or whistle Dixie??" Josie Wales 1866 | |||
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Ya-but.. What if Doxy makes you sick a Hogans Goat?? MopaneMike | |||
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I have found that if you eat something like some toast ahead of time no problem. I get up in the morning...take my doxy capsule with me to the breakfast table...after about 2/3's done...swallow it and keep eating a bit. (toast with some Bovril...and no prob) Never had a problem doing it like this. But...if I swallow it on an empty stomach watch out!!! Also...need to apply some good suncreen and stay covered if you can as the doxy makes you burn easier. Have medicated a sick appy or too for tick-bite fever with doxy while their. Usually works like a charm if started early. Doxy just makes sense to me as you kill multiple birds with one stone. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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BUt ultimately YOU are in control of your healthcare, don;t forget that. IN this case, its not a matter of getting a doc to tell you what you want him to, its about a doc being an adult enough to refer you to someone else because he has reached the limit of his capability, period. Demand a referral and be out of his hair or else explain how you will see another doctor who will work WITH you and not just treat you by the same old book that has had people waiting forever for good care. If we had listened to the docs when my wife had cancer, well ,she wouldn;t have had cancer. ALL of the primamry docs said her case was most likely, "not gonna say 100%" but as close as you can get, a benign tumor. They were all wrong, it was the most obscure form of the disease and all of the docs were shocked. Explain to that idiot that if he cant expand his learning and think outside of the box he does no one any good. Sorry for the rant but I get a little pissy when I hear of docs doing the old 'give it 10 days' routine and simply trying to treat a symptom and not a person... I relinquish my soapbox for the remainder of my time... | |||
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Joel, Bummer, I sure hope you find the cure for that. Good Luck. BUTCH C'est Tout Bon (It is all good) | |||
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Good luck, Joel with your recovery! As for me and trying my best to avoid a similar problem, I agree with the good animal doc. For several years I've taken doxy as an anti-malarial in the evening just before my meal and use Bull Frog Mosquito Coast as a sunscreen (and bug repellent.. it has DEET in the formula) liberally before leaving camp and at lunch. Works for me with no stomach upset, sunburn, tick problem or funky dreams (as was the case with Larium) in the multiple safaris that I've done so since, both in the Selous and in Zim. I usually hunt in shorts and closed-toe sandals and find that thorn and brush cuts on my legs and feet don't get infected as often as before and the crab-apple two step and chapped butt syndrome is less frequent with a bit of antibiotic in my system. That said, while I was still using Larium, I discovered a tick attached to me one evening while in Tanzania. I paid little attention to it, being used to bites down here in South Georgia. Predictably, on the trip home, I became feverish and just worn out. I'm lucky that I live in a town that has several good tropical disease doctors. They asked me the right question and gave me the right tests. Three weeks on tetraclycline (I think?) and the symptoms went away to never appear again. I wish I knew what the blood test showed, but it was a relatively regular tick-borne disease and the doctors caught it immediately because they dealt with folks traveling to Africa as a regular part of their practices.
JudgeG ... just counting time 'til I am again finding balm in Gilead chilled out somewhere in the Selous. | |||
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Have you been pig hunting? If so do not discount brucellosis--not very common but can happen. Just something to check out. Hope you feel better Joel. Ed DRSS Member | |||
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Hi Guys Thanks for the good wishes. The past three business days have ben spent trying to breech Fortress DukeMed. My GP says she sent the referral, the general appointments people at Duke don't know aythi8ng about a referral, and the ID office secretary has not returned 2 messages over 2 days..... ______________________________ "Are you gonna pull them pistols,...or whistle Dixie??" Josie Wales 1866 | |||
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Very disappointed. The GP nurse called today to say that the Infectious Disease doc will not giv eme an apointment "based on the chart notes, there is no basis for a referral". Any ideas? The GP was scrolling thru the CDC site as she was talking to me reading about African diseases saying "I don't think it is Africa related" so who knows what she put in her chart. I calendered all the times I was sick - 12 times since June 2008, wiped out, high fever, as sick as I have ever been....12 times in less than 3 years. Again, any ideas? Anybody around around Raleigh that knows what they are doing - or a way to get thru to this doc for an appointment? ______________________________ "Are you gonna pull them pistols,...or whistle Dixie??" Josie Wales 1866 | |||
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Malaria? | |||
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Had an Uncle who had Malaria from the South Pacific with the same symptoms. Jim "Bwana Umfundi" NRA | |||
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That is outrageous. Joel, I am sending you a PM. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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I got African tick fever in 2006; felt like shit. Had some doxycycline on hand from the trip, took that, was good. And don't look to African or tick diseases all the time either. Lots of things folks overlook - vitamin deficiencies, thyroid issues (just because a test says you are normal, doesn't mean you are), heart issues, etc. Everyone over 40 should have a thorough physical every year - full blood work, labs, treadmill, artery check (ultra-sound and stethoscope, not scan), etc. And do the colonoscopy ever 5 years (or more) if your doc recommends. And if you get blood in your urine, even a spec, go to an urologist. I waited 18 months and then had two tumors (benign) removed. "Evil is powerless if the good are unafraid" -- Ronald Reagan "Ignorance of The People gives strength to totalitarians." Want to make just about anything work better? Keep the government as far away from it as possible, then step back and behold the wonderment and goodness. | |||
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Did you feel a slight tingling/burning in your central abdomen off and on? I hesitated to wade in here, but I had a similar reaction by time my flight from Jo-Berg got to refuel in Dakar December 23rd of 2008. I had been in Zim for ten days hunting Cape Buffalo. It was 108-116 degrees every day and rained. I went from 227 to 217 in eleven days. I marked it down to just not being shape to hump the hills 12-15K a day in the heat and rain at age 58. By time I flew out to Denver I was running a good fever. I was afraid to say anything to anybody, they had used the word "Cholera" in Harare. I called my oldest and had him pick me up at the Boise Airport and take me to the VAMC ER. I was burning up so bad, and scared, I rode the four miles in the bed of the P/U. My fever was 103, and I felt very lightheaded. Luckily, the ER Doctor had just returned from Africa and figured it out. They gave me Doxycycline for ten days straight with a needle, and kept me overnight. They never did actually explain it, just said "some malarial-type fever." Dengue Fever maybe? Every six months or so, you just feel like somebody ran you thru one of those old fashioned wringer style washer units... Just enough fever (100-101) to make you listless. I am retired, so I can get this same guy to prescribe me some sort of multi-purpose antibiotic and say flop for a week. It goes away in about that time. I made one trip to the Seattle VAMC, every test you can imagine, but no answers. If you knew what it was, even if there were no cure, you could deal with it. I just keep praying it is not contagious... Rich | |||
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Very interesting; the infectious disease specialist won't see you based on what a nurse wrote in the chart? Maybe that's true but I think it's more likely that some reviewer decided the consultation wasn't necessary and is trying to save money. All the infectious disease specialists I've known have had too high an opinion of themselves to delegate their clinical evaluation to a nurse. If you haven't already done so, start a paper trail. I would suggest you write a letter to whoever your insurer is and send copies to your Attorney General and whatever other official body oversees medical care in your state. Nothing may happen real soon but eventually, they may decide that with the negative exposure it would be easier to listen to you and give you what you need. | |||
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It's frigging outrageous that you have to jump thru all these hoops to try to get decent medical care, especially considering it would be paid for. Where are all those cheerleaders saying "America has the best medical sytem in the world." and how would they care to explain this one? Bah, humbug. Take a flt to South Africa with a pre-scheduled visit after a bit of research. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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+1 and +1 Jason "You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core." _______________________ Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt. Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure. -Jason Brown | |||
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Actually, America does have the best medical care in the world but people don't want to pay for it. The run around is what you get with HMOs hoping to save money. This "managed care" model also known in some circles as mismanaged care, is what Obama and others wish to bring to all of us. Believe it or not, there is a reason Canadians come to the U.S.A. for gallbladder surgery and why wealthy Saudis donated a lot of money to the Cleveland Clinic. Try getting care in RSA if you have no insurance or money to pay; you'll be out of luck. Even if you have no money, go to any ER in the USA of a facility that takes public funds and you will get care mandated by Federal law. Since the logical disease that would cause recurrent fevers of an infectious disease nature would be a blood born parasite, all that would really be needed would be to make a peripheral blood smear during the time the fever, etc. was occurring and have the smear sent to a reference lab competent in tropical diseases. Said slides could be sent to the CDC or to a lab in RSA with specific instructions to check for malaria, babesiosis, trypanosomiasis, etc. | |||
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Colonoscopy recommendations are actually start at age 50, or 10 yrs earlier than a 1st degree relative was diagnosed with colon cancer. If no polyps and no family history, every 10 yrs. If polyps found repeat in 2-3 yrs. Positive family history, repeat in 5-8 yrs. Caleb | |||
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Did you take Malaria prophylaxsis? ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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I doubt very much that it was dengue. I'm not a doctor, but I did have dengue nearly thirty years ago while working in a refugee camp in thailand. Folks I knew who had that and malaria said the two felt similarly awful (in fact, at first we all thought it was malaria that was running through the camp) but dengue does not recur the way malaria does. So, if you get whateveritis periodically, it can't be dengue.
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So no one thinks it is readjusting to American packaged foods with all their steroids and chemicals in their food and on their veggies??? | |||
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BTW I am fortunate to have PPO top of the line insurance, so it is not an HMO issue, the Duke doc can decide who he sees, based upon the notes of the referring doc. And no, no malaria preventatives on the trip as it was represented as a non-malaria area. ______________________________ "Are you gonna pull them pistols,...or whistle Dixie??" Josie Wales 1866 | |||
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Yea, a PPO; just another version of managed care. | |||
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Very frustrated. I made one more pass at Corey M.D.s office, dialiing until I got a live person instead of VM. I didn't get 2 sentences out before 'Christie" interrrupted and said Dr. Corey reviewed your chart notes and did not feel there was a basis for referral to an infectous disease physician. you are welcome to call other ID physician and ask them for an appointment. She gave me the response a few more times after each appeal, and I gave up. Thanks to a couple of friends here, I hope to see someone soon, even though I may have to travel to another state for the appointment. Really frustrating. ______________________________ "Are you gonna pull them pistols,...or whistle Dixie??" Josie Wales 1866 | |||
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Actually it's not even close, we spend more money with less results than many nations who provide better care with better results for their citizens at substantially lower per capita cost. It's a damn shame really. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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Specifically...??? Jack OH GOD! {Seriously, we need the help.} | |||
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Pray tell: 1. Which nations provide better care than the U.S.A.? 2. Which nations get better results than the U.S.A.? Lower cost? Yes, that's easy. As I said, in the U.S.A., they want everything but don't want to pay for it. | |||
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Among others, Australia, France, Germany, Canada, Netherlands, New Zealand, and the UK. If you want to start a separate thread on this, I'll be glad to discuss it with you anytime, but I'm not going to post anymore in this thread except for the one follow up copy and paste to get some of the non-brainwashed, or non-participants in the financial screwing of the public. I'll wait and see if Joel can get a decent response to his problems. Let's see, so far, it's been a couple of years and "the best medical system in the world" has failed miserably. Not an uncommon result, especially for those who don't have insurance. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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This is old and much of the information is history now, but it will give you an idea of the basis for the problems with American Health Care.
xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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