quote:

Originally posted by Michael Robinson:
It's all about means and methods, my friends.

That's what measures the difference between what's truth and what's bullshit.

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Look at it this way.

This is the results of the SCI glorifying trophies, and making worthless idiots look like great hunters.

It involves people on both sides of the fence.

The LOOK AT ME Kardashian sort of worthless hunting bimbo who thinks he is better than everyone else.

And the crooks masquerading as professional hunter who cater for them.

This is one reason I refuse to hunt in Europe and New Zealand.

Price depends on the size.

To me, this ranks right up there with charging non refundable trophy fees in advance.

Those doing it can enjoy their time without me.

I will go and hunt with real professionals who do have a sense of what hunting should be.

I am in New Zealand now; finished a hunt earlier in the week. If you don't want to pay based on size, hunt free range - you can certainly do it.

I couldn't believe the size of the red stag racks at the taxidermist yesterday - all high fenced operations.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Not many people hunt on their own.

quote:

Originally posted by eagle27:

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Look at it this way.

This is the results of the SCI glorifying trophies, and making worthless idiots look like great hunters.

It involves people on both sides of the fence.

The LOOK AT ME Kardashian sort of worthless hunting bimbo who thinks he is better than everyone else.

And the crooks masquerading as professional hunter who cater for them.

This is one reason I refuse to hunt in Europe and New Zealand.

Price depends on the size.

To me, this ranks right up there with charging non refundable trophy fees in advance.

Those doing it can enjoy their time without me.

I will go and hunt with real professionals who do have a sense of what hunting should be.

I am in New Zealand now; finished a hunt earlier in the week. If you don't want to pay based on size, hunt free range - you can certainly do it.

I couldn't believe the size of the red stag racks at the taxidermist yesterday - all high fenced operations.

I think Saeed's statement that he refuses to hunt in New Zealand is a little ignorant of just what hunting can be like here in NZ. Yes it is true that like many countries, including Australia and Africa I might add, New Zealand does cater for the rich American and European who have to have bragging rights for the biggest and the best, irrespective of how ugly these farm bred and captive trophies maybe.

However free range hunting can also have a couple of different meanings too. Saeed takes part in hunting African game that are free ranging i.e. not fenced, but he is led to game by PH's who point out the correct animal to shoot, with game rangers accompanying the party to ensure all is done according to the game regulations that apply in that particular country. This type of hunting is also available in NZ and most other countries where hunting is permitted too.

Now in my opinion there is a second type of free range hunting and this is increasingly rare around the world now but New Zealand is one of the few countries where this can be carried out. Here in New Zealand any hunter licensed to carry a firearm (international hunters too) can obtain a free permit to hunt any of our game animals all year round on public land throughout New Zealand. You can choose to shoot as many animals, of both sexes, of any trophy size, of any age, use the meat or leave it where it lays. You find the animals, you decide if you wish to shoot or not. You can go alone, you do not need a PH or guide.

Come to New Zealand and get out in our vast and wild Southern Alps for example and find yourself a truly wild trophy red stag, bull tahr or buck chamois. Just see how good a REAL free range hunter you are

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Not many people hunt on their own.

They do in the US. I am almost 64 and hunt on my own all the time.

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:

quote:

Originally posted by eagle27:

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Look at it this way.

This is the results of the SCI glorifying trophies, and making worthless idiots look like great hunters.

It involves people on both sides of the fence.

The LOOK AT ME Kardashian sort of worthless hunting bimbo who thinks he is better than everyone else.

And the crooks masquerading as professional hunter who cater for them.

This is one reason I refuse to hunt in Europe and New Zealand.

Price depends on the size.

To me, this ranks right up there with charging non refundable trophy fees in advance.

Those doing it can enjoy their time without me.

I will go and hunt with real professionals who do have a sense of what hunting should be.

I am in New Zealand now; finished a hunt earlier in the week. If you don't want to pay based on size, hunt free range - you can certainly do it.

I couldn't believe the size of the red stag racks at the taxidermist yesterday - all high fenced operations.

I think Saeed's statement that he refuses to hunt in New Zealand is a little ignorant of just what hunting can be like here in NZ. Yes it is true that like many countries, including Australia and Africa I might add, New Zealand does cater for the rich American and European who have to have bragging rights for the biggest and the best, irrespective of how ugly these farm bred and captive trophies maybe.

However free range hunting can also have a couple of different meanings too. Saeed takes part in hunting African game that are free ranging i.e. not fenced, but he is led to game by PH's who point out the correct animal to shoot, with game rangers accompanying the party to ensure all is done according to the game regulations that apply in that particular country. This type of hunting is also available in NZ and most other countries where hunting is permitted too.

Now in my opinion there is a second type of free range hunting and this is increasingly rare around the world now but New Zealand is one of the few countries where this can be carried out. Here in New Zealand any hunter licensed to carry a firearm (international hunters too) can obtain a free permit to hunt any of our game animals all year round on public land throughout New Zealand. You can choose to shoot as many animals, of both sexes, of any trophy size, of any age, use the meat or leave it where it lays. You find the animals, you decide if you wish to shoot or not. You can go alone, you do not need a PH or guide.

Come to New Zealand and get out in our vast and wild Southern Alps for example and find yourself a truly wild trophy red stag, bull tahr or buck chamois. Just see how good a REAL free range hunter you are

Sounds like an invitation

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Not many people hunt on their own.

And at my age I wouldn’t even try it at home.

The overwhelming majority of hunters hunt with some outfit which provides them with everything necessary.

I have friends who have hunted New Zealand, and they had a great time.

Not much different from my hunts in South Africa.

We hunted there to have fun, knowing full well we were hunting on farms.

Nothing wrong with that.

If any of the farms we hunted offered a price scale on animals I wouldn’t have gone there.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Can someone please explain to us how a foreign visitor, to either the US or New Zealand, can go about getting into the country with his own rifle and hunt without an outfitter?

quote:

Originally posted by Fjold:
I've been looking for a no pressure Eastern European hunt for Fallow, Red Stag or even Roe but all the sliding scale for trophies and the talk about Euros per gram over X amount, etc. just turns me off.

I hunt to enjoy myself so one of the last thing that I want to do is have to calculate costs before each pull of the trigger. I've turned down shots because the animals were too young before but having to turn down a trophy because the calculator says that it's too big just seems strange to me. I'll be happy with any old, mature buck with representative antlers but not shooting because the guide says he's too big isn't part of a fun hunt for me.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Can someone please explain to us how a foreign visitor, to either the US or New Zealand, can go about getting into the country with his own rifle and hunt without an outfitter?

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Can someone please explain to us how a foreign visitor, to either the US or New Zealand, can go about getting into the country with his own rifle and hunt without an outfitter?

quote:

Originally posted by miketaylor:

quote:

Originally posted by Fjold:
I've been looking for a no pressure Eastern European hunt for Fallow, Red Stag or even Roe but all the sliding scale for trophies and the talk about Euros per gram over X amount, etc. just turns me off.

I hunt to enjoy myself so one of the last thing that I want to do is have to calculate costs before each pull of the trigger. I've turned down shots because the animals were too young before but having to turn down a trophy because the calculator says that it's too big just seems strange to me. I'll be happy with any old, mature buck with representative antlers but not shooting because the guide says he's too big isn't part of a fun hunt for me.

Come and hunt in England for Roe bucks. My pricing is very simple. If it's a management/cull buck it's included in the outing fee and if it's a trophy/medal buck it's one price, no sliding scale!

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Can someone please explain to us how a foreign visitor, to either the US or New Zealand, can go about getting into the country with his own rifle and hunt without an outfitter?

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Can someone please explain to us how a foreign visitor, to either the US or New Zealand, can go about getting into the country with his own rifle and hunt without an outfitter?

I did it in 2003. I hunted with an outfitter. Shot a chamois and a tahr free range. Then my outfitter arranged for a helicopter to take me and Ms AZW into a national park. We watched glaciers calve off into a lake for 30 min, then loaded up our packs and followed a creek down the mountain until it hit a small river. Forded that river, then followed it until it hit another river. At the confluence of those rivers were several fly fishermen that had been dropped off by a jet boat. The helicopter pilot said the jet boat would return at 3 pm and for $50/each we could get a ride back to the highway, and from there we could hitchhike a few miles back to his house.

The trip took us two days and we covered about 25 miles. Didn't shoot any stags or anything else. First car that came by picked us up, even though I clearly had a rifle. Was told last week that we would have trouble today hitchhiking with a rifle, but back then it was great.

Once we were back at the pilot's house we took showers and then ate grilled lamb chops on a picnic table with the Alps in the background, all while polishing off a bottle of wine. Great trip even though I didn't shoot anything on my own (in reality, it was a backpack trip carrying a rifle just in case).

quote:

Originally posted by the Pom:
Eagle 27 , I agree that few Kiwis use a guide and many hunt alone. In the Forest Service we hunted alone and the Ranger used to come and check up on us once a month. However, suggesting that overseas hunters should try hunting alone is just making work for the search and rescue guys and an expense to the taxpayer. Overseas hunters should make a contribution to the economy by hiring a guide and then they might get something better than a spiker.