https://www.dailymail.co.uk/ne...d-trophy-hunter.html


Link to article and photos.

A normal person being Persecuted!

The world has gone bonkers.

quote:

The world has gone bonkers.

It did that long ago.
Right is wrong and wrong is right today.
It is only one way and that is their way!

Just skimming over the Mail gave me the idea that it is merely a gossip rag. Much like some other publications that are sold near the check out line of grocery stores. Who reads such trash anyhow?

The Mail is a rag not fit for loo paper!

Mr Eduardo Goncalves acts as if he's an investigative reporter, 'outing' hunters he encounters. As if SCI records and awards are a secret that he has discovered.

Here's a thought; what if we 'outed' ourselves in a massed manner? Deluge him with plenty of the material he seems to think is so important.

Here's his Facebook page....

https://www.facebook.com/eduardo.c.goncalves

And his website.....

https://bantrophyhunting.org/about/

Daily Mail

Cambridge-educated female lawyer is revealed as top trophy hunter

A Cambridge-educated lawyer has been revealed as a top trophy hunter accused of killing dozens of African animals.

Ms Day - who graduated with a law degree in 1987 - has also won an 'African Big 5 award' for shooting a lion, elephant, leopard, rhino and cape buffalo. 

Abigail Day has won more than 20 awards from Safari Club International - a US hunting organisation - whose London division she founded in 2006.

She is one of only two living British hunters to have received the 'award', reports The Telegraph.  

In a book published tomorrow by Eduardo Goncalves - the founder of the Campaign to Ban Trophy Hunting - further details of Ms Day's involvement in hunting will be revealed.

Mr Goncalves's book Trophy Leaks: Top Hunters & Industry Secrets Revealed will also expose another trophy hunter who boasted about the 'thrill' of killing animals all over the world on his social media.

Thames Water customer service manager Asif Wattoo, from Berkshire, has hunted zebras and also posed with giraffe carcasses on trips to France, Pakistan and South Africa, according to The Star.
 
In 2008, Ms Day was the recipient of SCI's 'Diana' award for being the world's top female trophy hunter and has hunted in 36 countries. 

Mr Goncalves said: 'There is no other Briton so deeply enmeshed in the global industry. To see her list of awards was extraordinary.' 

When The Telegraph visited her home in west London they said that found oryx, warthog and a stuffed big cat thought to be a leopard mounted on her walls. 

Ms Day declined to comment on the contents of the book.  

In 2005 she wrote to the publication to explain how hunting plays a 'vital role' in conservation. 

The other hunter exposed in the book Mr Wattoo has one Facebook album containing 50 hunting photographs.

He goes on regular hunting trips with South African firm Umlilo Safaris - who offer 'canned' lion hunts and shooting trips where you can hunt rhino, elephant, leopard, hippo and antelope.

Canned hunting is the killing of captive-bred wild animals in small enclosures. It is most commonly associated with the trophy-hunting of lions.   
    
Writing on Facebook about one of his stalks with Umlilo Safaris, Wattoo said: 'We saw three nice Impala Rams, but my Professional Hunter knew exactly what I was after (Big and old RAM).

The ram was quartering away so hit him a bit back but the bullet came out of the neck so you can image how much was he quartering away? he only ran about 10m and dropped.'

In another post he describes hunting a waterbuck: 'I could've shot him at 80m but I wanted my first animal to be a full symmetrical/represented trophy.

'We waited for about 30min for my animal to stand up, and as soon as he stood up, BOOM straight in the chest, he only ran about 30m and dropped.' 
He added: 'If you've hunted in Africa you know exactly how thrilling it is, but if you have not, I suggest you go soon (try Umlilo Safaris)?.
'Only then you will know exactly what and how I am feeling right now?. Lol.'   

Campaigner Mr Goncalves has battled for years to ban the importation of hunting trophies to the UK.

Hunters have been persecuted by the anti's for decades.

I recall a story submitted by a FB page labelled as "Robert Ruarks", ages ago, showing magazine and newspaper articles written at the time, attacking hunters. Times have changed but the rhetoric has not; they now have the platforms to make their noise louder, and they are not holding back.

I deleted my FB page a number of years ago because of the same crap. I just couldn't be bothered with reading or being faced with their BS rants anymore.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but the well heeled going to Africa and 'hunt' in a continent with ever decreasing wildlife is going to go the way of the well heeled in the UK fox hunting with dogs.

quote:

Originally posted by Doug W:
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but the well heeled going to Africa and 'hunt' in a continent with ever decreasing wildlife is going to go the way of the well heeled in the UK fox hunting with dogs.

And why did fox hunting stop? I hear there are plenty of fox in Great Britain. Hint...it had nothing to do with dwindling numbers of fox.

And now to Africa. Yes, wildlife numbers are decreasing. Why? Human encroachment, loss of habitat, and poaching...especially commercial poaching.

In hunting area’s where wildlife is protected and good quota management is implemented...wildlife teems.

Why are hunters attacked? Pure stupidity!!!

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Norman:
Mr Eduardo Goncalves acts as if he's an investigative reporter, 'outing' hunters he encounters. As if SCI records and awards are a secret that he has discovered.

Here's a thought; what if we 'outed' ourselves in a massed manner? Deluge him with plenty of the material he seems to think is so important.

Here's his Facebook page....

https://www.facebook.com/eduardo.c.goncalves

And his website.....

https://bantrophyhunting.org/about/

It is all our own fault.

We have become scared of telling the truth, hiding what we are like it is the biggest shame there is.

I get approached quite often by the media here, asking to do an interview about my hunting in Africa and shooting trap in the US.

I always agreed.

Only condition is I have my own video camera going to.

No editing to suit a clueless producer.

No publishing without my approving it.

No one agrees!

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Norman:
Mr Eduardo Goncalves acts as if he's an investigative reporter, 'outing' hunters he encounters. As if SCI records and awards are a secret that he has discovered.

Here's a thought; what if we 'outed' ourselves in a massed manner? Deluge him with plenty of the material he seems to think is so important.

Here's his Facebook page....

https://www.facebook.com/eduardo.c.goncalves

And his website.....

https://bantrophyhunting.org/about/

It is all our own fault.

We have become scared of telling the truth, hiding what we are like it is the biggest shame there is.

I get approached quite often by the media here, asking to do an interview about my hunting in Africa and shooting trap in the US.

I always agreed.

Only condition is I have my own video camera going to.

No editing to suit a clueless producer.

No publishing without my approving it.

No one agrees!

Sounds like what Donald Trump did with "Sixty Minutes", y'all do have a,lot in common!

quote:

And why did fox hunting stop?

There seem to be plenty of foxes the English countryside and I belong to another forum where an English hunter regularly posts game he has shot- including foxes.

Now if fox hunting means chasing the fox while riding a horse, I know nothing about that except that it appears to be a sport only for excellent horsemen.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

And why did fox hunting stop?

It was outlawed because enough vocal UK citizens wanted it to stop (insert reason) and since the 'sport' was far removed from everyday people participating it wasn't like ending it affected any of them.

Probably even 'screw these wealthy snobs' was a factor.

See the parallels?

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Norman:
Mr Eduardo Goncalves acts as if he's an investigative reporter, 'outing' hunters he encounters. As if SCI records and awards are a secret that he has discovered.

Here's a thought; what if we 'outed' ourselves in a massed manner? Deluge him with plenty of the material he seems to think is so important.

Here's his Facebook page....

https://www.facebook.com/eduardo.c.goncalves

And his website.....

https://bantrophyhunting.org/about/

It is all our own fault.

We have become scared of telling the truth, hiding what we are like it is the biggest shame there is.

I get approached quite often by the media here, asking to do an interview about my hunting in Africa and shooting trap in the US.

I always agreed.

Only condition is I have my own video camera going to.

No editing to suit a clueless producer.

No publishing without my approving it.

No one agrees!

Sounds like what Donald Trump did with "Sixty Minutes", y'all do have a,lot in common!

I doubt it.

I hunt, he thinks hunting is a horror show!

quote:

Now if fox hunting means chasing the fox while riding a horse, I know nothing about that except that it appears to be a sport only for excellent horsemen.

One could be as excellent a horseman as far as horsemanship goes but without a pack of trained hounds that fox would disappear into thin air.

quote:

Originally posted by Doug W:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

And why did fox hunting stop?

It was outlawed because enough vocal UK citizens wanted it to stop (insert reason) and since the 'sport' was far removed from everyday people participating it wasn't like ending it affected any of them.

Probably even 'screw these wealthy snobs' was a factor.

See the parallels?

Exactly. So it was ended out of stupidity and spite. Agree?

quote:

Originally posted by fulvio:

quote:

Now if fox hunting means chasing the fox while riding a horse, I know nothing about that except that it appears to be a sport only for excellent horsemen.

One could be as excellent a horseman as far as horsemanship goes but without a pack of trained hounds that fox would disappear into thin air.

Very true.

And if people don't quit accepting this stuff when nothing but emotion, stupidity, and spite drives it...the world will be driven by emotion, stupidity, and spite.

My friends in the UK think the anti hunting movement is very much driven by the thought that hunting is only for the upper class which of course it was for hundreds of years. Ordinary people now can hunt if they can pay for it but the stigma still exists. Yes! Stick it to the rich definitely is at play with the antis in the UK.

Mark

I thought everyone was rich in Western Europe??? That is what the media tells us.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

Exactly. So it was ended out of stupidity and spite. Agree?

No I would say it was ended because the anti's made a more convincing argument to the public about it being cruel, unnecessary, etc and I would put it more as a small dose of retribution against the have a lot by the have far less.

There is class warfare going on in BOTH directions.

quote:

Originally posted by Doug W:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

Exactly. So it was ended out of stupidity and spite. Agree?

No I would say it was ended because the anti's made a more convincing argument to the public about it being cruel, unnecessary, etc and I would put it more as a small dose of retribution against the have a lot by the have far less.

There is class warfare going on in BOTH directions.

Cruel? It is hunting no different than any other form of hunting. What you wrote above boils down to stupidity and spite.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Cruel? It is hunting no different than any other form of hunting.

Sure it is.
There are lots of forms of hunting where the prey isn't chased down and torn apart by dogs but instead unaware they are even being hunted and killed in an instant.

I have been a lifelong hunter and all my hunting has been of the later type.

By hunters like yourself denying the obvious only makes them look more extreme and unreasonable to the public.

Ditto calling the oppositions arguments stupid.

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:
My friends in the UK think the anti hunting movement is very much driven by the thought that hunting is only for the upper class which of course it was for hundreds of years. Ordinary people now can hunt if they can pay for it but the stigma still exists. Yes! Stick it to the rich definitely is at play with the antis in the UK.

Mark

It is going to get worse under Boris.

His blonde bimbo is an anti hunting greens!

She has already persuaded him to ban petrol and diesel cars not long in the future.

Without thinking of the effect of that.

Stupidity over rules common sense!

quote:

Originally posted by Doug W:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Cruel? It is hunting no different than any other form of hunting.

Sure it is.
There are lots of forms of hunting where the prey isn't chased down and torn apart by dogs but instead unaware they are even being hunted and killed in an instant.

I have been a lifelong hunter and all my hunting has been of the later type.

By hunters like yourself denying the obvious only makes them look more extreme and unreasonable to the public.

Ditto calling the oppositions arguments stupid.

If an argument is stupid, not calling it stupid does not make it sensible. And I question whether you are a "lifelong hunter."

quote:

Originally posted by muttleysgone:

If an argument is stupid, not calling it stupid does not make it sensible. And I question whether you are a "lifelong hunter."

Hunters are a minority, especially hunters who travel and hunt in Africa.
There is no constitutional right to hunt, we do so at the approval of the general public.

Being politically inept and ignoring the optics will only hasten hunting in Africa or returning with the trophies.

Carry on.

Guys,

I kinda have to agree with Doug. The optics of the fox hunt were pretty bad. A bunch of the gentry running a fox to ground and having it torn to pieces by the dogs. That even makes me a little squeamish. The fox hunt was more about horsemanship than hunting.

Mark

quote:

the world will be driven by emotion, stupidity, and spite.

Precisely Lane, just substitute "will" with "is" as that is the current trend being fueled by the people who have been chosen to participate in the crusade to save the world.

God help American society now that the "majority" have chosen the "right people" to guide them.

quote:

Originally posted by Doug W:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Cruel? It is hunting no different than any other form of hunting.

Sure it is.
There are lots of forms of hunting where the prey isn't chased down and torn apart by dogs but instead unaware they are even being hunted and killed in an instant.

I have been a lifelong hunter and all my hunting has been of the later type.

By hunters like yourself denying the obvious only makes them look more extreme and unreasonable to the public.

Ditto calling the oppositions arguments stupid.

You sir are part of the problem...not part of the solution.

I grew up with hounds. I was running my own dogs before I was old enough to drive. Your statement — “torn apart by dogs” — exemplifies you are speaking on a subject in which know nothing about and certainly have no experience with. While dogs do kill foxes and coons. They do not ‘rip them apart.’ They simply employ the only means of killing they possess—a bite. Never in all my life have I seen anything “torn apart” by hunting hounds. Using terms like these just fuels the untruth presented by our adversaries—antis.

Should we eradicate other natural forms of predatory animals taking prey like that of the African Wild Dog, wolf, or hyenas? Ever watch them hunt, kill, and eat? That is true nature—I take as it was meant to be. There is some “ripping apart” here. Should these animals be eradicated for cruelty?

Hounds do not kill foxes like a pack of African Wild Dog killing and eating an impala. Most are really quite happy to let others do the bite. Hence why dogs like Airedales were often released as hounds neared their quarry.

Let me ask: What about falconing? Ever watch a raptor eat a squirrel.

Please sir be knowledgeable about what you post and be careful lending support to the groups who wish us demise.

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:
Guys,

I kinda have to agree with Doug. The optics of the fox hunt were pretty bad. A bunch of the gentry running a fox to ground and having it torn to pieces by the dogs. That even makes me a little squeamish. The fox hunt was more about horsemanship than hunting.

Mark

Mark you are now showing your ignorance as well.

Sure fox hunting is about good horsemanship. It is a great gentlemanly sport. Cruel??? Absolutely not!

Do not feed the antis!

quote:

Hounds do not kill foxes like a pack of African Wild Dog killing and eating an impala. Most are really quite happy to let others do the bite. Hence why dogs like Airedales were often released as hounds neared their quarry.

Herewith an excerpt from Wikipedia:

What happens to the fox in a fox hunt?

The Fox is Killed

The fox dies by being torn limb from limb. It can take a while. Up at the viewing point, the hunt supporters have got their binoculars trained on the spot where the fox is being killed. Many of them cheer and congratulate each other on the kill.

quote:

Originally posted by fulvio:

quote:

Hounds do not kill foxes like a pack of African Wild Dog killing and eating an impala. Most are really quite happy to let others do the bite. Hence why dogs like Airedales were often released as hounds neared their quarry.

Herewith an excerpt from Wikipedia:

What happens to the fox in a fox hunt?

The Fox is Killed

The fox dies by being torn limb from limb. It can take a while. Up at the viewing point, the hunt supporters have got their binoculars trained on the spot where the fox is being killed. Many of them cheer and congratulate each other on the kill.

Which cannot be further from the truth and why Wikipedia gets beaten in court all the time by experts.

For those that have not figured it out...Wikipedia is part of the campaign to rule the earth with disinformation.

I am a veterinarian. In fact I am a board certified equine surgeon. I have dedicated my life to healing horses with catastrophic injuries and giving them life verses euthanasia. I have hunted coon, fox, and bobcat since I was old enough to walk behind hounds. I would consider myself a qualified expert witness on the subject and I would be happy to go up against Wikipedia in court in this instance.

We as hunters should be wide awake (as opposed to woke) to all the factions against us and guard diligently against ALL if them—the gist of my posts here.

Wikipedia is the strongest tool the postmodernists have to continually rewrite history and the present.

Read Winston’s warning from 1984. Wikipedia is literally that.

The best chance the world has is to destroy it along with social media. Those tools were knowingly built to sew disinformation for the gains of the few. You think being a 1% means anything? When you own information, you also own the 1%.

Think about it.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

Your statement — “torn apart by dogs” — exemplifies you are speaking on a subject in which know nothing about and certainly have no experience with. While dogs do kill foxes and coons. They do not ‘rip them apart.’ They simply employ the only means of killing they possess—a bite.

Next time someone brings in their beloved cat, dog, or horse to be put down by you, please do suggest that instead of the needle you will have a pack of your hounds put them down. LOL

There are plenty of videos SHOWING foxes torn apart, here is but one.
https://metro.co.uk/video/hunt...part-hounds-2078634/
Just a bite by many pulling in every direction.

You are either intentionally ignorant or dishonest.

quote:

Originally posted by Doug W:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

Your statement — “torn apart by dogs” — exemplifies you are speaking on a subject in which know nothing about and certainly have no experience with. While dogs do kill foxes and coons. They do not ‘rip them apart.’ They simply employ the only means of killing they possess—a bite.

Next time someone brings in their beloved cat, dog, or horse to be put down by you, please do suggest that instead of the needle you will have a pack of your hounds put them down. LOL

There are plenty of videos SHOWING foxes torn apart, here is but one.
https://metro.co.uk/video/hunt...part-hounds-2078634/
Just a bite by many pulling in every direction.

You are either intentionally ignorant or dishonest.

As to your first statement...

I don’t work on dogs or cats. If I asked the owner of a horse if we could just turn it loose in a pasture and when it walked under the tree where they wanted to bury it we can just double lung it with a .300 Win Mag...do you think they would be fine? Of course not. Your analogy is stupid.

Now to the video. It really didn’t “show” anything. The death of the fox took place with a lethal bite and happened quickly. It was no less humane than putting a 180 gr bullet through the lungs of a large animal.

If you don’t like it...don’t do it. If you want to blatantly criticize other hunters for doing it...you are hurting hunters in general. You are free to do either...just don’t tell us you are not hurting hunting by publicly siding with the people wanting to stop the form you don’t like.

It’s like the old adage about feeding the croc in hopes it will eat you last.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

Now to the video. It really didn’t “show” anything. The death of the fox took place with a lethal bite and happened quickly.

What is showed is a guy picking up fox parts and pieces scattered about a field that according to you they don't ‘rip them apart'.

Must be my lying eyes.

And a second time for you, there are lots of videos showing foxes getting torn apart, but I won't post anymore because they are easily found and I would expect your denials to be as farcical as the last.

quote:

Originally posted by Doug W:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

Now to the video. It really didn’t “show” anything. The death of the fox took place with a lethal bite and happened quickly.

What is showed is a guy picking up fox parts and pieces scattered about a field that according to you they don't ‘rip them apart'.

Must be my lying eyes.

And a second time for you, there are lots of videos showing foxes getting torn apart, but I won't post anymore because they are easily found and I would expect your denials to be as farcical as the last.

Like I said...it really didn’t show anything.

At least you didn’t make any stupid analogies this time or to pretend to be pro-hunting.

That will occur after the fox was dead and the rest of the pack catches up and wants a piece.

I agree with Lane. It's hunting.

How would they characterize hog hunting in East Texas with a pack of black-mouth curs and just knives? It's a thing.

I will apologize to Mark for using the harsh language of "ignorant." Please accept Mark.

That said...fox hunting with hounds is an age old form of hunting. It is a gentlemanly low take sport at that. Occasionally dogs may do more damage to a carcass than aesthetically pleasing to some. But I can assure you from a lifetime of hunting furred varmints with hounds...it is the exception rather than the rule. Varmints are dispatched by killing dogs with bites to the skull, neck, or thorax that generally kill quickly. I have skinned 100's if not 1000's of dog-killed varmints as a youth and young adult to be sold for fur. Generally death is quicker than even a lung shot large animal. Mutilation while extremely rare only occurs after death. And again...it is the exception...rather than the rule.

Video of heart/lung shot elephant would not please some as well including some hunters. But it is still an acceptable means of take.

The gist of what I am saying is that we as hunters and especially representatives of the hunting community, like booking agents, should never denounce a time-honored method of hunting on a public forum.

Written and signed off on public criticism on the internet by respected representatives of the industry does much harm--just as some pictures and videos do.

More...we must dispel myths in our community and stick together in our true beliefs as that (our internal feelings/beliefs) is all we carry with us into voting booths where it counts the most.

Again Mark I apologize for my methodology but stand by my point.

quote:

Originally posted by lavaca:
That will occur after the fox was dead and the rest of the pack catches up and wants a piece.

According to our Dr in denial, it doesn't occur. LOL

quote:

Originally posted by lavaca:
I agree with Lane. It's hunting.

No, it is now outlawed hunting.
Pondering why fox hunters lost and anti won the public support and pressured the legislature to ban fox hunting with dogs requires some thinking.
And not just labeling it stupid.