Brett...You hit it on the nose. Not many people relize what damage the LR regime did to SCI.

Max

quote:

Originally posted by maxart:
Brett...You hit it on the nose. Not many people relize what damage the LR regime did to SCI.

Max

Yep! We can, will, and are currently doing better. Here's to national on the mend!!!



Brett

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:
What I don't understand is the degree of almost hatred shown by some here simply because their attitude is different to someone else's.

Hi Steve. Sorry to hear about Mrs. Shikari. Hope she gets well soon.

I can't speak for anyone else nor will I try. That said I know from my point of view it gets rather exasperating when people complain about SCI, but have no skin in the game. They have no affiliation with other conservation organizations and they are not donating towards or actively supporting the efforts to advance hunting or conservation. It's kind of like people complaining about elected officials when they don't vote.....really.......how about you vote or be quiet? So how about we get skin in the game of conservation and hunter advocacy or be quiet about the imperfections of SCI?

Brett

Brett,

I have been one of the vocals who have been complaining about SCI top management.

My questions have always been,

"What has SCI done for conservation in Africa?"

I have not gotten one single answer yet.

I am a Life Member of SCI.

In the past 12 months, we have collected about $150,000 for rhino and lion conservation in Africa.

I know, SCI does a lot of political lobbying, but my main concern is about conservation in Africa.

Do you know what they have done, and how much they have donated?

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
In the past 12 months, we have collected about $150,000 for rhino and lion conservation in Africa.

Who's we and where did the money go/what was it use for?

I'm not privy to every SCI national expenditure nor do I have the time to keep track. I will ask a bit and see.

Brett

quote:

Originally posted by maxart:
Brett...You hit it on the nose. Not many people relize what damage the LR regime did to SCI.

Max

Yet at the time the plunder and devastation was taking place nobody noticed ?..... Never mind, its water under the bridge so here's a to the future.

"I'm not privy to every SCI national expenditure nor do I have the time to keep track".

Regrettably this is a classic model answer by many to any question related to the amount donated by SCI towards Wildlife Conservation in Africa and quite frankly it boils down to either genuinely not knowing, not giving a shit, or both.

Not knowing......

Brett

I think we can take it for granted that SCI does very little for conservation in Africa.

If they did, I bet they would be screaming their heads off about it.

I may have missed one or two, but I counted four mentions of "SCI National" in this thread. It's something that has been mentioned frequently on this forum over the last couple of years by AR members who should know better because they are or were actively involved in SCI's chapters

I've been out of the loop of SCI's internal workings for way more than a decade but, as far as I know, it remains an international organization operating from its international headquarters in Arizona, and offices in Canada, South Africa and Washington, D.C.

I know. It's a little thing, but it belittles a great worldwide organization as well as the efforts of members from more than a dozen countries who helped make it what it is.

Bill Quimby

Bill,

Do you know anyway we can find out what SCI involvement in conservation in Africa?

I did a Google search, and came up with something they did many years ago, and then nothing at all.

quote:

Originally posted by billrquimby:
I may have missed one or two, but I counted four mentions of "SCI National" in this thread. It's something that has been mentioned frequently on this forum over the last couple of years by AR members who should know better because they are or were actively involved in SCI's chapters

I've been out of the loop of SCI's internal workings for way more than a decade but, as far as I know, it remains an international organization operating from its international headquarters in Arizona, and offices in Canada, South Africa and Washington, D.C.

I know. It's a little thing, but it belittles a great worldwide organization as well as the efforts of members from more than a dozen countries who helped make it what it is.

Bill Quimby

Very true Bill. SCI INTERNATIONAL is on the mend!!!

Brett

Saeed:

Try searching for SCI's conservation wing, the Safari Club International Foundation or SCIF. It's a separate non-profit organization with separate funding sources that was formed about the time I retired in 1999. That could account for the sudden absence of SCI conservation efforts listed on Google.

I have no idea how much SCIF spends or what it does in Africa -- or any of the five other continents where we hunt -- but there probably is a detailed financial statement on-line somewhere. Even if you do locate it, it will not present a true picture of expenditures for individual on-the-ground programs in Africa.

Such programs (in the past and probably now) typically were conceived, funded and run by individual chapters. Unlike most U.S.-based hunting/conservation groups whose chapters send 100% of their net fund-raising proceeds to headquarters, SCI is unique in that its various chapters retain 70% and decide -- without having to seek consent or advice from headquarters -- how those funds will be spent.

Just maintaining an office near Pretoria, along with hosting wildlife meetings in Africa and sending representatives of various African wildlife agencies to CITES and other meetings, which SCIF frequently does, would be a considerable amount, I would think.

As I said above, it's been more than thirteen years since I closely followed what the club does.

As with many on this forum, I have had problems at times with some of the actions and policies of the club and (more recently) a couple of its officers, but (you may agree or not) there is no other international hunting organization with its clout and potential to protect our interests around the world.

Bill Quimby

About the Safari Club International Foundation

Since 2000, SCI Foundation (SCIF) has provided $47 million to conservation, wildlife education, and humanitarian programs around the world. Growth of SCIF has continued to gain momentum through charitable donations from SCI members and direct grants from local chapters and the SCI organization. A recent effort that just completed its fund-raising drive is the Hunter Legacy Fund which is a dedicated funding source for wildlife conservation. This endowment was created by one hundred individuals and corporations, dedicating a pledge of $100,000 to create a $10 million endowment to ensure conservation programs of SCIF will continue long into the future. A similar effort kicked off in 2008 to create an endowment for conservation education.

With recent expenditures exceeding $5 million annually, SCI Foundation has continued to promote science–based conservation through wildlife research, capacity building in governments, youth and teacher education, and humanitarian programs which show the importance of the hunting community in society. A project nearing completion, called the “White Book”, will showcase nearly 150 conservation projects where SCIF has made major contributions to the world of wildlife management.

This year, the Conservation Department facilitated nine African nations to sit down together and discuss conservation of the African lion, including the issue of human-lion conflict. SCIF continues to strengthen our emphasis on North American conservation, with major support for two predator-prey projects and involvement in several projects throughout the continent. Our Eurasian efforts feature a ground breaking field study of snow leopards in Siberia as well as significant contributions to the management of several species across that continent.

Nestled in the beautiful Bridger-Teton National Forest near Jackson, Wyoming, SCIF’s American Wilderness Leadership School (AWLS) provides the perfect atmosphere for the accredited educational programs. Established in 1976 with the vision of providing educators with a useful hands-on experience that they can use in the classroom, AWLS has provided a credited wildlife management program more than 5,000 teachers who reach more than a million students annually, and fun, challenging experiences for 1273 high school students. The AWLS program has expanded to provide conservation education opportunities in 4 other locations in the United States. SCIF has also provided scholarships to nearly 100 college students who have enrolled in natural resource management or conservation education fields.


SCIF Humanitarian Services programs have also experienced significant growth in recent years. Since 2003, the SCIF Sportsmen Against HungerTM program has donated more than 2.2 million pounds of wild game meat to those in need. SCI members delivered 1,114 SafariCareTM “Blue Bags” filled with humanitarian supplies to needy villagers, schools, clinics and orphanages around the world since 2005. In the same time period, more than 1,000 disabled hunters were given an assisted hunting experience through the Disabled HunterTM program, and 224 youngsters with terminal or life-threatening illnesses had their hunting dreams fulfilled through our SafariWishTM program. Each year, via our Sensory SafariTM program, SCI member volunteers assist between 60,000 and 70,000 children and adults through a maze of mobile touch displays, describing the animal’s size, sounds, habitats and behaviors to give the visually impaired a unique opportunity to “see” wildlife through the sense of touch. Through its annual Pathfinder award, a part of our Disabled HunterTM program, the Foundation sponsors and coordinates world-class hunting safaris for one or two deserving recipients each year.

The International Wildlife Museum is dedicated to increasing knowledge of, and appreciation for, the diverse wildlife of the world as well as explaining the role of wildlife management in conservation. Founded in 1988, the museum has over 400 kinds of insects, mammals and birds from all over the globe, provides visitors the opportunity to see animals up close, and to gain a better understanding of their size and adaptive characteristics. At the museum, visitors are also exposed to the role of hunting in wildlife management and the role SCI and SCIF play in promoting wildlife management. In 2008, nearly 70,000 visitors from all over the world (almost 40% of them children) experienced the exhibits and were exposed to SCI’s message.

These are just a few of the accomplishments of Safari Club International and Safari Club International Foundation Throughout the world, our approximately 190 chapters contribute time, talent and financial support to local, national, and international conservation projects. While economic times may be trying, the passion for conservation remains strong with SCI Foundation. Please join us in membership or partnership as we continue to ensure that wildlife remains abundant for future generations. SCI and SCIF have earned the coveted Charity Navigator 4-star rating, your contribution will be used in an effective manner.

Safari Club International Foundation is a 501(c)(3) charitable organization.

How does SCI rate on the charity analysis? What percentage of money taken in, goes directly to SCI's stated purpose?

I have not been able to find this information, so far.

I was a member of SCI for a few short years. I've never seen so many lardass rich guys trying to impress each other in my life, especially at the annual conventions. The master measurer in this region is a joke as well.

quote:

Originally posted by SG Olds:
How does SCI rate on the charity analysis? What percentage of money taken in, goes directly to SCI's stated purpose?

I have not been able to find this information, so far.

Safari Club International Foundation is currently rated at 3 stars, lower than the 4-star (highest) rating it has had in previous years ... but better than the 2-star rating it has occasionally dropped to (according to Charity Navigator).

By comparison, Rocky Mountain Elk is rated at 4-stars, Boone and Crockett, 3-stars, and Ducks Unlimited 2-stars. The Dallas Ecological Foundation (DSC's Charity) is not rated.

Assuming those numbers are accurate, for every dollar I give to SCI to help wildlife, they skim 26 cents. And that's based on SCI's numbers?

It's about as useful as paying taxes to the Feds I guess.

I was once a member of SCI. No one can deny that SCI has an image problem. Your average hunter sees it as a "Rich Guys" hunting Club period. Ionce with a guy in Africa who was so obsessed with SCI "scores" and Gold medal ratings that he didn't seem to give a shit when his animals didn't measure up. He was upset when I showed up with a larger critter and didn't care what it "scored" Why is there a Dallas and Houston SC? Do Texans need thereown Club?

Well as one can see Education is SCIF top prioty and in fact one can see they spent more on Conservation in 11. I do wonder why the cost of fund raising increased so much. The good sign in these hard economic times they increased their fund raising by 9.8% of which basically went to F & A. Of course those working people need more money, eh.

quote:

Originally posted by SteveGl:

quote:

Originally posted by SG Olds:
How does SCI rate on the charity analysis? What percentage of money taken in, goes directly to SCI's stated purpose?

I have not been able to find this information, so far.

Safari Club International Foundation is currently rated at 3 stars, lower than the 4-star (highest) rating it has had in previous years ... but better than the 2-star rating it has occasionally dropped to (according to Charity Navigator).

By comparison, Rocky Mountain Elk is rated at 4-stars, Boone and Crockett, 3-stars, and Ducks Unlimited 2-stars. The Dallas Ecological Foundation (DSC's Charity) is not rated.

Still does not answer m,y question.

WHERE does all that money goes?

Why is there no breakdown of it?

Saeed, with all due respect I don't believe anyone or any org. will ever give you an answer that will stisfy you.

quote:

Originally posted by Die Ou Jagter:
Saeed, with all due respect I don't believe anyone or any org. will ever give you an answer that will stisfy you.

Here's just one organisation that collects millions and donates it to a wide variety of good (individual & national) causes every year and manages to list & publish every penny for all the world to see & I'm sure they're not the only ones to do it so it's far from impossible.

Touche' Bro.

Further to Saeed's point about how much they spend (and on what) I don't think I've ever seen the figures SCI make from memberships, hunt donations & show income etc published anywhere either?

I'd have thought they must publish it somewhere because according to their constitution, they're a corporation and although I might be wrong, I'd have thought they'd be legally bound to publish such figures but I don't think I've ever seen them anywhere.

Their income from the convention alone must be helluva big.

Basically SCI operates under US law and I am sure they are in compliance with all IRS Code requirements. Like the hey hire leaders (masons) they have an audit. They may not report in the same detail as the hey but then SCI is such a small org compared to the hey.

quote:

Originally posted by Die Ou Jagter:
but then SCI is such a small org compared to the hey.

I'n not so sure about that..... at least as far as finances go.

According to this, that organisation has about 250K members and all their funds come directly from the membership and nothing from outside.

I don't know how many members SCI has and probably not close to 250K but their income comes not only from membership subscriptions but also the auction of a considerable number of 'donated' hunts, sales from other related products and probably several other sources of income as well.

If you think about it, the value of donated hunts alone must run to many millions every year.

Never heard them called 'the hey' though...... is that an American expression?

This is so tiresome. Everything you need to know about the SCI Foundation can be found at their website HERE ... including all of their finacial reports AND actual tax returns all the way back to 2006. You will, however, need to have a basic understanding of how to use a computer to find them. I found them in about 3 minutes ... but I've got better things to do than other peoples' research (unless I get paid).

I will go so far as to list a few of the projects that the SCIF operates and funds: African Buffalo Blood Parasite Research Project, Alberta Elk Project, Alpine Ibex Project, American Wilderness Leadership School, Chronic Wasting Disease Project, Disabled Hunter Program, ZiMoZa Project, Biological Status of Elephant Project, Elephants and Ivory in Zimbabwe Project, Regional Conservation Strategy for the Lion in Eastern and Southern Africa, Regional Conservation Strategy For The Lion Panthera Leo In West And Central Africa, Save The Rhino Foundation, Lowveld Rhino Trust, SCIF CoP15 Guide (in English, Spanish and French), Wood Bison Restoration Project, Sportsmen Against Hunger Program, Food-Drive-Web, Scholarships, Youth Programs, Conservation Grants, and more ... ... ...

The SCIF CoP15 Project is particularly important as it relates directly to the hunting and transport of any and all CITES listed species. The link to the SCIF recommendations to CITES is HERE
... but that’s about as much as I have time for.

Later,
S.

CITES: Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora

Thanks SteveGl and that should just about do it? Does for me. Sounds like a whole lot of "African" things they are doing/done to me. Probably won't satisfy some of the naysayers though? Hopefully they will click on some of the links you provided and will see it firsthand? If not, who cares? The uniformed will just have to stay that way, huh?

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by SteveGl:
This is so tiresome. Everything you need to know about the SCI Foundation can be found at their website HERE ... including all of their finacial reports AND actual tax returns all the way back to 2006. You will, however, need to have a basic understanding of how to use a computer to find them. I found them in about 3 minutes ... but I've got better things to do than other peoples' research (unless I get paid).

I will go so far as to list a few of the projects that the SCIF operates and funds: African Buffalo Blood Parasite Research Project, Alberta Elk Project, Alpine Ibex Project, American Wilderness Leadership School, Chronic Wasting Disease Project, Disabled Hunter Program, ZiMoZa Project, Biological Status of Elephant Project, Elephants and Ivory in Zimbabwe Project, Regional Conservation Strategy for the Lion in Eastern and Southern Africa, Regional Conservation Strategy For The Lion Panthera Leo In West And Central Africa, Save The Rhino Foundation, Lowveld Rhino Trust, SCIF CoP15 Guide (in English, Spanish and French), Wood Bison Restoration Project, Sportsmen Against Hunger Program, Food-Drive-Web, Scholarships, Youth Programs, Conservation Grants, and more ... ... ...

The SCIF CoP15 Project is particularly important as it relates directly to the hunting and transport of any and all CITES listed species. The link to the SCIF recommendations to CITES is HERE
... but that’s about as much as I have time for.

Later,
S.

CITES: Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora

If you want a understanding of SCI Finances you can read this

http://forums.accuratereloadin...541090541#3541090541

Thanks Mike,

So it seems SCI pays a total of 4.8% of all the money collected to conservation!

Saeed,

For 2009, yes, that is the percentage that went for outside grant money.

Potentially, another 9% went to Programs and Projects that were related to conservation and 2.4% went to outside lobbying.

The single largest category of expenses related to SCI/SCIF employee wages, benefits, pensions, and taxes which accounted for 61.9% of all expenses.

Another interesting figure is that in 2009, SCI paid more to Mike Roger's (host of the SCI TV show)company then it spent on conservation grants to third parties.

Saeed,

For the fiscal year ended June 30, 2011; SCI/SCIF spent a total of $355K in sub Saharan Africa. That includes all expenditures: employee wages (they have 2), rent (they have 1 office), office expenses, utilities, travel, janitors, etc and all other expenditures including grants.

Any grant to another party must be individually identified if it is in excess of $5,000. There were three totaling $36,200.

quote:

Originally posted by Brett Adam Barringer:

quote:

Originally posted by Oryxhunter1983:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Brett Adam Barringer:

The good doctor Larry Rudolph as well........don't let the door hit you in the.......SCI national is on the mend.



Brett

What do you have against Larry Rudolph?

I'm going to intentionally keep it vague. There are two types of people who seek positions of leadership. Those who seek leadership positions to serve the membership and the mission of said organization and those who seek leadership positions for power, influence, personal betterment, and pushing personal agendas. The first is a boon to any organization, its mission, and its membership. The second is a cancer that must be cut from the organization before the organization whithers and dies. I would tend to lump Dr. Rudolph and his "posse" into the second group. They ran on a platform basis which was never done before in SCI elections. Mr. Rudolph and his "posse" got in and they ran the place as a good old boy's club. SCI was set back for his efforts and it will take a bit to recover as an organization as well as reparing our reputation. That said Dr. Rudolph and his "posse" tried to take over again this year. They were summarily shown the door bar room style. The new leadership seems to be a step in the right direction. Time will tell. Aside from that Dr. Rudolph has his issues and time will tell what is in store for him, but I'm quite certain he will not be a leading force again in SCI.

Brett

PS> During the Rudolph admin it got so bad that at least a few chapters were considering going the way of DSC and defecting. Luckily things have changed and it didn't come to that.[/QUOTE

in other word, he waa a pathetic excuse for the spokesman for a group claiming to be first for hunters. now tjhere is a big surprise. maybe he and Kevin are twins- both out to be first for hunters- as long as they are the hunters on junket hunts


in other words, he was ]

quote:

Originally posted by Mike_Dettorre:
Saeed,

For the fiscal year ended June 30,2011; SCI/SCIF spent a total of $355K in sub Saharan Africa. That includes all expenditures: employee wages (they have 2), rent (they have 1 office), office expenses, utilities, travel, janitors, etc and all other expenditures including grants. Any grant to another party must be individually identified if it is in excess of $5,000. There were three totaling $36,200.

This apparently does not include the African projects of SCI's chapters.

Bill Quimby

Bill,

You are actually emphasizing the point of many.

The SCI local chapters do great work. However, the SCI Local Chapters are separate entities.

The national/international entity's ("SCI" as it refers to itself) behavior and expenditures of money is quite suspect in the minds of many.

It would be inappropriate to count the expenditures of Local Chapters as their financials are separate from SCI.

When SCI gives money to a Local Chapter those expenditures are accounted for on SCIs financial statements.

News Release: June 27th, 2012

SCI Foundation Contributes $537,590 To Worldwide Wildlife Conservation Projects Over Last 6 Months

Washington, DC – Safari Club International Foundation (SCI Foundation) announced today that it has contributed $537,590 in the past six months to fund worldwide wildlife conservation projects. SCI Foundation strategically focuses funding towards research and management of large predators and their prey, including game species, principally throughout North America, Asia, and Southern Africa.

“The research programs selected by SCI Foundation’s professional biologists inform wildlife managers and policy makers on critical wildlife management needs worldwide,” said SCI Foundation President Joe Hosmer. “SCI Foundation strives to ensure management decisions are based on the best available science.”

North American Projects
SCI Foundation donated $350,000 to fund multiple predator/prey projects in the U.S. and Canada. Conservation projects include Predator/Prey studies observing rates of white-tailed deer fawn survival in Michigan and Wisconsin, elk survival in Montana, and caribou survival in Newfoundland. The results of these projects will help properly manage both predators and prey in systems where both exist. Donations were also made to wildlife population research and enhancement programs including mule deer in the Eastern Mojave Desert, brown bears on Kodiak Island, black bears in Missouri, and moose in Alaska, among others.

The most recent project is a partnership with Alaska Department of Fish and Game’s Kenai Moose Project. SCI Foundation donated $20,000 to learn productivity and seasonal mortality of moose.

African Projects
In multiple African nations, SCI Foundation has given over $123,000 to wildlife conservation and human-wildlife conflict programs. Most recently, SCI Foundation donated $30,000 for the upcoming African Wildlife Consultative Forum, which will be held in Botswana.

SCI Foundation also continues to fund lion research in Zambia to improve the accuracy of aging lions in their natural environment. Being able to accurately age lions in the field will assist range states develop appropriate lion harvest regulations to ensure sustainability.

“Throughout the year, SCI Foundation contributes over one million dollars to wildlife research, management, and anti-poaching programs. As an international organization, SCI Foundation continues to increase our financial impact for sustainable-use conservation and we hope more organizations can follow our lead,” concluded Hosmer.

Below is a partial list of contributions to wildlife species made over the last 6 months:

Lion (Southern Africa) -- $30,000
Elephant (Zimbabwe) -- $25,200
Leopard (Zimbabwe, Namibia) -- $18,000
Wildlife Genetics (Africa) -- $20,000
Brown Bear (Alaska) -- $50,000
Black Bear (Missouri) -- $25,000
Elk (Montana. & Ontario)--$69,800
White-tailed deer (Mich. & Wisc.)--$75,000
Mule Deer (Calif. & Colorado)--$40,880
Moose (Alaska) --$33,500
Caribou (Newfoundland) -- $8,550
Bighorn Sheep (Mont. & Wyo.) -- $31,500
Dall Sheep (Alaska) -- $5,000
Predator ID Manual (Intl) -- $10,000
Conservation Matching Grants -- $8,000
African Wildlife Forum -- $30,000

Contact:
Nelson Freeman; media@safariclub.org

Steve - Thanks again for the latest report, saw it today also in a note from SCI. Guess that sums it up pretty good? Looks like quite a bit of $$, time and effort going to Africa and projects there from SCI. I would further guess that it is a WHOLE lot more than some of the other so called, "helpers of Africa" are doing. Maybe some other folks can post what some of those others are doing? Would be interesting to see.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

Larry,

Yes, it really sums it up very well!

SCI has paid a grand total of $123,000, from all the "donations" they blackmail from the African outfitters.

In the past 12 months, we have collected and sent $150,000 to conservation orgenizations in Africa.

Now, you have an orgenization that claims to represent us as hunters, squeezes every dime from its members, and spends as little as it can on true conservation.

I know individual chapters do more than SCI does, which is great.

Still, SCI biggest fault is alienting many hunters because of their silly top management.

The most important impression a normal individual has of SCI is NOT of a conservation orgenization.

It is of an an old boy's club, whose sole purpose is to awards each other all sorts of awards for killing the biggest animal.

Regardless whether they were killed legally or not.

The holy grail is BIGGER IS BETTER and MINE IS BIGGER THAN YOURS.

This, to me at least, is as far removed from true hunting ethics as it can get..

Hunting is supposed to be enjoyed in its own, regardless of how big an animal one shoots.

Some time, (probably years) ago, I seem to remember doing some rough calculations on the total value of donations from just African outfitters and if I recall correctly, it was in the millions of dollars and that figure is taken out of the industry.

Then they auction those donations and raise let's say something like 30C in the dollar and then according to the figures quoted here, they donate something like $123K back to the industry.

Not only is that a bloody good profit margin for SCI, it can't do the safari industry a lot of good and perhaps goes at least part way to explaining why African hunting is so expensive because those costs obviously have to passed on to cutsomers.