The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting Tim Sundles from Buffalo BoreGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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| One of Us |
I have been watching some videos from Tim. I just wondered what the groups opinion of this man and his experiences. Thanks in advance, brair | ||
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"The 375 is NOT a stopping gun". That tells me all I need to know. He is AN IDIOT!  | |||
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Haven't seen them?? Link?? 470EDDY | |||
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Tim may be opinionated and certainly is not a shrinking violet, but he is a serious hunter, loves powerful rifles and handguns and makes great ammunition Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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Nice gentleman and generous with his time and advice. His ammunition is top notch. | |||
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I have used the Buffalo Bore ammo, but I have never seen any of their videos. I'll have to check them out. Their ammo has been uniformly good, except for one bad load that let me down. The bad load was their .45-70 Magnum loaded with a supposedly tough 350 gr. bullet at a nominal 2,150 fps. The bullet is not tough by any stretch. It required several shots in the vitals to drop and kill a big bull bison as the bullets all broke up. The bullet appears to be a standard Hornady cup and core design and is not up to the task. Why they use it and advertise it as tough is beyond me. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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He might be all that. But anyone who makes statements like he did, knowing full well more dangerous game animals are killed by the 375, is just plain STUPID! I probably killed more dangerous game animals with a 375 than most hunters today. NEVER felt it was inadequate. Year before last had to stop a lion charge with a 375. Worked like a charm! It is fine if one wishes to hunt with bigger calibers, nothing wrong with that. But to make statements that are patently untrue is just plain STUPID! | |||
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He does like his big bore guns and seems to think they are necessary or at least much better. Except for the publicity aspect I am not sure he was all that pleased with my success in stopping a large aggressive brown bear using his 9mm handgun ammo. But he does make good ammunition and multiple past generations of gun scribes have been touting the benefits of massive large bores. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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He brought the heat on Steve Hornady. I am not a big fan of Hornady products, but he gave a very poor description of the person. I use his ammo in my revolvers. | |||
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I have no problems with him using whatever bore he wishes. That is his choice. But making statements he knows nothing about, as facts, is patently a lie. I have hunted with professional hunters who used a 585 Nyati as back up rifle. Because "bigger is better". After seeing how well a 375 drops them dead. He relented and said "it just simply WORKS!" I have seen a 577 T.Rex fail to penetrate on a frontal brain shot on a cow elephant! I have dropped many elephants stone dead with a 375 frontal shot. Both bulls and cows. Experience in the field that counts, not making false statements on a computer keyboard. | |||
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After watching his video with the (I think it was .577) double, with 6 or so shots to kill a buffalo on his ZA farm, I don’t know that the .577 NE is a stopper, either. I admit I like a bigger bullet on elephant and Rhino than Saeed, and I’ve heard enough PH’s say the bigger rounds give more effect on suboptimal placement than smaller ones… but if a PH or hunter feels the .375 is a stopper for them, it is. I do think that a lot of the bigger is better came from the day when a plain cup and core was the limit of bullet technology. Then, terminal performance was iffy enough that I wouldn’t want to chase Buffalo in the thick stuff with one. Now? If I had to choose- hunt with a .375 or not hunt big game, I wouldn’t feel handicapped… and I “only” have the H&H version. | |||
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Mike, That 350 Hornady has a bad reputation. When you drive it hard it comes unglued as you found out. When I lived in AK people tried it in their 458's with exceedingly poor results. Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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The 350 RN Hornady is a stubby, light for caliber, non bonded 458 with a lot of lead exposed cup and core bullet, and thin jacket. The bullet is not meant to be pushed hard. Folks loading should recognize its limitations. That said, it is a prime example why I do not like Hornady products. At, 1750ish fps I have used that bullet on a year old doe. I shot her right in the vertebrae just in front of shoulder. She collapsed with a big hole and everything was broken. I found pieces of jacket and lead broken down the backstrap. The bullet did not exit. Thus, for my money it barely works on deer inside 30 yards. All that said, to say, the bullet is a thin skinned game bullet to be used at moderate velo. No one loading cartridges for big, heavy, potentially dangerous game should use it. Hornady would say, “The bullet worked as designed.” To that I say, “Sure.” | |||
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Like a lot of things in life, it's always good to use the "right tool for the job". I used to use Buffalo Bore stuff in my Ruger/Bowen Nimrod in .45 Colt before I started loading my own ".458 Kurz" ammo for it. Never gave me a reason to complain. Contrariwise, that Hornady 350 RN would NEVER be my choice on bison...but it HAS been my choice on dangerous game (just not the "big, heavy" variety). Chasing a spottie with hounds up and down kopjes is a game of "close and fast"...and a big saddlegun with moderate loads and the 350 Hornady does just fine. Horses for courses.  DRSS "I always take care to fire into the nearest hillside and, lacking that, into darkness." - the late Dr. Hunter S. Thompson | |||
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That would be about the sum of it. Wonderful leopard, and on hard(er) angles less worry of over penetration with dogs around. | |||
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To be clear, this is a direct quote from the Buffalo Bore website describing the 350 gr. JFN bullet they use in the 2,150 fps MV .45-70 Magnum load to which I refer in my post above: “The bullet we utilize in this load is very tough and gives only a small to moderately sized mushroom (about .60 cal) and because of the smallish mushroom, it penetrates very deep -- about 4 feet in muscles and bone and as such is a great bullet for use on dangerous game and on smaller game too as it does expand some. This load is the most versatile of our 45-70 loads.” From first hand experience, I can tell you that none of this is true. The bullet they use is actually a weak, cup and core bullet totally unlike this description and unsuited to the tasks they describe (except perhaps use for smaller game). Every one of them I fired into my bison experienced separation of the jacket from the core and broke apart. The shrapnel from several shots eventually killed my bull, but the advertising is false and misleading. I chose this load based on this advertising and my satisfaction with other Buffalo Bore ammo. Had I known the truth about this bullet, i.e., that it is apparently a totally unremarkable Hornady cup and core bullet, I would not have used the load in question. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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Yep, no one in the business of loading ammo for heavy use should use that bullet. Nor say that about that bullet. Again, it is a non-bonded cup and core bullet with a thin jacket. It has a lot of lead exposed. Yet, not looking at he bullet and just BB description one would have problems. It is a very standard Hornady product. Comes apart on light skinned game. Well, it did 4x times on me. Yes, deer died fast. However, not exiting a whitetail and major core-jacket separation says it all. It does not hold together at 1750. It sure ain’t at 2100 plus. I cannot understand why he would describe that bullet like that. | |||
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My lesson learned is that unless they specifically ID the bullet they are using by make and model I will stay away from their ammo. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQUycDK4aOc | |||
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Brair, thank you. Very interesting!! He makes a very good point!! He is making some of our favorite double rifle ammo available again too!! 470EDDY | |||
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I ‘get’ that he makes good ammunition, I’ll give him that. But, watching his video of shooting AT a buffalo with his 600 NE and claiming how tough it was when he was actually missing the buffalo with multiple offhand shots, I came away regarding him as a complete dipshit. My view of him hasn’t changed. | |||
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I use a lowly 375. And practically all the buffalo I have shot died with one shot! Those zombies with bigger is better, instead of matching the gun to the game, don’t seem to realize one needs to put the bullet in the right place! When shooting, instead of shooting their mouths!  That video is so embarrassing! He stands right there next to Mark Sullivan as an IDIOT HUNTER! The LOOK AT ME fakes pretending to be hunters! | |||
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Is he hunting one of those farm buffalo like Sullivan was doing?? | |||
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The buffalo in the 600 Nitro video was definitely a farm buffalo. No reaction to any of his 600 Nitro shots fired. He’d miss and the buffalo wouldn’t even raise its head from feeding. ….and he tried to pass it off as a buffalo so tough it wasn’t even reacting to being shot multiple times with a 600 Nitro. Total fake video and with that, he lost me forever. | |||
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Indeed and then they promote it as Black Death ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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I tried to watch a few of his videos, but I could not finish any of them. No new or useful information was offered, and worse, much was just nonsense. He might be a nice guy, but he comes off as a blowhard in these videos. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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| One of Us |
I wonder if the Horn 350 is made different now than years ago? I loaded it to 2050 fps in a 45-70. I had pass through on a couple Kudu, a gemsbok, hartebeest warthog. It didnt exit on the two eland I shot with it, but dumped them with a shot each within 50 yds. All broadside/slight quartering shots, so no big bones hit. | |||
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There is no magic in bullet making. In the old days hunters preferred FMJ because the soft points of the day were too fragile. FMJ were better in penetration. Then we got Partition bullets, which worked very well. Then came solid shank bullet, those like the Trophy Bonded, where the rear end of the bullet is solid copper. Worked even better than partition. Then came the hollow point all copper bullets, like the Barnes X. Worked best. Some silly claims are made for all sorts of bullets. Laws of physics never change. | |||
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As a whole I agree Saeed, but jacket thickness on cup and core bullets makes a difference on blow-up. | |||
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I have hunted with Sierra Match King bullets. Killed every single animal with a single shot. Hunting on farms in South Africa. It 3as a test under controlled conditions. I have also tried Swift A-Frame, Trophy Bonded, and Barnes X. The Swifts kept losing the lead in the rear part. Trophy bonded worked great. So did the Barnes X. Non of these bullets showed that they killed any better. Now I use my own Walterhog bullets. I designed and make them here in my workshop. And as far as I con, there is no better bullet. Copper hollow points are just as good. | |||
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Very interesting. Yeah self promotion can be fraught with hazard especially with some questionable videos etc. I think the ammo i have used is good and just bought some BB 45-70 350 on clearance (hmmm) but have yet to try it. I do have the 400 hard cast pretty sure that one works but haven’t used it on game yet. I’ve seen some of those videos and most i believe are on his game farm. Posting a video of missing and wounding a buffalo seems to be bad idea unless you fess up and try to learn something from it and not try pass it off as some heroic battle with “black death” lol White Mountains Arizona | |||
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A video from Tim that I find a bit confusing. He talks about what mediums can be accurate in predicting penetration from bullets, both expanding and non expanding. His comments that anything but real flesh is no good. Phil Shoemaker tested the 9mm plus P hard cast that saved his life and his clients in none flesh and bone. I believe he had faith in his testing and the bullets/cartridge worked for him. Thoughts? Thanks in advance, brair https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KytFtTr5RZk&t=1s | |||
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Interesting thread. I hunt with a lever action 45-70 a lot and have tried multiple different bullets. I find that it is hard to find a jacketed bullet that will perform well for hunting. They are either to soft or to hard so results in game are inconsistent. What I have found after much trail and error is that a good hard cast lead works every time. I use a 405 grain hard cast with a nice big sharp edged meplat. I load it to 1850 and it is very effective. I have gotten over 4 feet of penetration and because of the big meplat, the wound channel is always from 1.5 to 2 inches all the way through. It is just plain impressive. For those of you who do shoot 45-70 you really need to try a big hard cast bullet. I think once you do you will never go back to jacketed bullets again. | |||
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I can honestly say I have never killed anything with a hard cast bullet. Just never shot anything when I was carrying them. | |||
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He seems like a passionate hunter and a business owner that really cares about his products. I do not know him, so can't give you an opinion of his character in personal interactions. Having said that, as an established ammo manufacture, he is not very knowledgable on ballistics and physics as it relates to centerfire rifle ammo. He often makes false claims when it comes to this subject. EXAMPLE: Tim stated that the energy formula (KE) that we use in ballistics was "made-up" so faster bullets would "look better". Obviously he is unaware that the formular for Kinetic Energy was developed centuries ago, along with the formula for momentum and potential energy. Kenetic Energy was not a conspiracy theory thrust upon us by "Big Ammo". Much of what Tim postulates violates the Laws of Thermodynamics. Tim strikes me as one of those guys full of stories and elaborate conspiracy theories. I have many friends like that, and I love them with all my heart. Perhaps all hunters have that in them to some extent. He should also seriously consider stepping down to a 416 or 404, because he sure misses a lot of easy shots with his 600NE. Tim does not speak highly of Hornady, and Steve Hornady in particular. I don't know Steve Hornady, but I'm not fond of Hornady's (the company) bullet/cartridge hype and outrageous claims. I tend to agree with Tim on that. I've used Buffalo Bore 45/70 and 44 magnum ammo in the past, and it was very consistent stuff (although slower than advertised in my guns). | |||
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i have used a lot of hornady proj in particular the 180 gn 30 cal proj, and its one very good proj in the 06 at 2830 fps...not to far behind the 180 gn Nosler partition | |||
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He misses because he is not able to handle the rifle! To me, that’s the ultimate in unethical hunting! Someone trying to massage his ego. That is all. | |||
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You should see all the talk on the facebook groups about calibers and how a 375 is not enough gun. So many guys dont realize how many bad shots are from people scared of there gun and the recoil. Now a few of them are taking this video from this guy as the gospel and he is there new hero. The biggest joke on this subject is Bill davis the super facebook hero. | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting Tim Sundles from Buffalo Bore
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