I saw a show yesterday, I think Northwestern Hunter. They were shoot from the back of the bakkie and it got me thinking about the long discussions on here about the subject.

What is the difference of shooting from the back of the bakkie and sitting in a box blind and shooting whitetails, or whitetails from a tree stand with a rest.

No difference.

Thank you!

quote:

Originally posted by LHowell:
No difference.

Yup

I didn't spend $10000+ and take two weeks off work to shoot the whitetail is the first thing that comes to mind.

I don't shoot from the truck.

I do shoot does from a shooting house for venison.

I hunt whitetails by finding their runs, patterning their hours, hanging stands, etc etc.

I am lucky to own a nice ranch in Texas thanks to my parents hard work.
I have yet to understand how I am more of a sportsman standing outside of my pickup with gun barrel waving in the breeze taking a shot at a deer or any other critter on the ranch or using some sort of a rest.
I thought the idea was to take the target as quickly as possibe and to cause as little suffering as possible. Using the window sill of my pickup as a rest and shooting something at any distance seems more humane to me.
I can't recall when I heard or saw any of my hunters take a deer while just walking up on them. Many a deer in th Lone Star State is taken from some sort of a stand or right out the window of what ever you are driving.
Seems that "Bang flop" is not sporting but "Bang, gut shot and run, Bang, run again then Bang,flop" standing out along side the safari car is the proper way to do it!
I doubt we will all agree on what is right and wrong on this subject.
The nice thing is when it is your property you can pretty much do like you do in the privacy of the voting booth...as you damn well please.
Better tomorrows to all.

There is no difference at all.

But, let me expand on this.

Hunt any which way you wish, as long as it is legal in the country and area you are hunting in.

It really is no one's business to tell others how to hunt.

Personally, I have worn out lots of shoe leather walking while hunting all sorts of game. Including elephant, buffalo, lion etc.

I have also sat in a blind and shot leopards, lions and hyaenas.

I have also shot plains game animals from the back of the truck in South Africa.

It's the law in many states as well in mozambique I just read (200 yards from motor vehicle)

Similar to laws stating you can't fly and hunt the same day

The law in Zambia stipulates that you have to be 200m from the truck and this is purely to stop game becoming nervous of vehicles.

Blinds in Africa are normally reserved for the hunting of cats and a lion blind can be the most exciting room you will ever occupy, that is apart from your honey moon suite.

quote:

purely to stop game becoming nervous of vehicles.

That is the answer!....Look no further.

To me, I don't see a difference.

I would like to know why is it not ok to hunt from a elevated blind over a water hole in Africa but, it's fine to hunt over a corn pile/feeder/food plot for deer???

I have done both, hunt from a tree stand and shoot from the back of the truck. There I've said it. I personally prefer to get out and stalk the animal I am after. Tree stands for archery season, over a trail or water hole give me time to enjoy the sights, sounds, smells and take my bow for a hike.
As for the truck, Only where legal and less frequently than stalking.

quote:

Originally posted by cjfoster:
To me, I don't see a difference.

I would like to know why is it not ok to hunt from a elevated blind over a water hole in Africa but, it's fine to hunt over a corn pile/feeder/food plot for deer???

Archery at waterholes is seen as more sporting than using a rifle. 'Okay' is up to the PH and you, not "the law" (where none exists). If the country cannot be really hunted without blind/feeder, like most of Texas brush country, it's more a matter of selection than bumping into something while stalking...

Just another "My way is better than yours" thread. Sorry but this is boring now after the what, 1,000th thread on the same topic!!

quote:

.

Hunt any which way you wish, as long as it is legal in the country and area you are hunting in.

It really is no one's business to tell others how to hunt.

Personally, I have worn out lots of shoe leather walking while hunting all sorts of game. Including elephant, buffalo, lion etc.

I have also sat in a blind and shot leopards, lions and hyaenas.

I have also shot plains game animals from the back of the truck in South Africa.

+1

Todd, I agree many strings but damn this one remains civil. I guess it was the others that gave me pause to ask again.

I've done it. I wasn't a fan, I guess it kinda made me feel 'dirty', for reasons i'm not quite sure. I have sat in uncountable deer blinds, but now prefer to hunt on the ground, stalking between stands. Some animals (leopard, hyena, etc,) you just HAVE to shoot from a blind. In the Canadian spring season you pretty much NEED to shoot bears over bait. I guess maybe I just felt that with all that African scenery in front of me, I should have been walking.

That aside, I do love the rules and feel of hunting in a dangerous game block, and probably would only hunt that way, if ever I am able to return to Africa.

During my last trip to RSA in April of this year there was a guy in camp who proclaimed, "you can't shoot an animal from the truck if you're NOT IN THE TRUCK!"

I laughed my butt off!

Take it in context & don't get your underwear in a wad if you don't hunt this way.

Let us bring back up a time honored meaning less POS issue.

Saeed stated it as best as can be done.

quote:

There is no difference at all.

But, let me expand on this.

Hunt any which way you wish, as long as it is legal in the country and area you are hunting in.

It really is no one's business to tell others how to hunt.

Personally, I have worn out lots of shoe leather walking while hunting all sorts of game. Including elephant, buffalo, lion etc.

I have also sat in a blind and shot leopards, lions and hyaenas.

I have also shot plains game animals from the back of the truck in South Africa.

Some folks really need to get a grip on reality, if it is LEGAL and the person footing the bill has no problem with what they are doing, everyone else can go straight to hell with their damn opinion.

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:
Let us bring back up a time honored meaning less POS issue.

Saeed stated it as best as can be done.

quote:

There is no difference at all.

But, let me expand on this.

Hunt any which way you wish, as long as it is legal in the country and area you are hunting in.

It really is no one's business to tell others how to hunt.

Personally, I have worn out lots of shoe leather walking while hunting all sorts of game. Including elephant, buffalo, lion etc.

I have also sat in a blind and shot leopards, lions and hyaenas.

I have also shot plains game animals from the back of the truck in South Africa.

Some folks really need to get a grip on reality, if it is LEGAL and the person footing the bill has no problem with what they are doing, everyone else can go straight to hell with their damn opinion.

Plus one! There is an old cowboy saying that reads: "Mind your own business and you wont have time to mind mine!"
...........................................................................

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
There is no difference at all.

+1

There is one significant difference. I hunt deer on my own property, or on other smallish properties where I have been granted permission. When you are hunting a chunk of only 100 acres or so, utilizing a correctly positioned blind/stand is pretty much the only way to go. You can't go tromping around such a small parcel and expect to see deer after a day or two. I hunt from a blind because I have little choice. In Africa, I have the choice of hunting method...and I choose to spot and stalk rather than sit on my butt.

quote:

Originally posted by Die Ou Jagter:
I saw a show yesterday, I think Northwestern Hunter. They were shoot from the back of the bakkie and it got me thinking about the long discussions on here about the subject.

What is the difference of shooting from the back of the bakkie and sitting in a box blind and shooting whitetails, or whitetails from a tree stand with a rest.

Die,
One has wheels and covers a lot of ground, the other doesn't but uses bait instead.

I see no difference ethically.

I do not hunt from stands over feeders, period.

With all due respect, I must say I disagree with many of you concerning this topic.

For me it's a big difference between shooting from a vehicle and hunting from a stand. I agree that it's more difficult to hunt spot and stalk. But stand hunting can be very sporting in my opinion.

I've never hunted whitetails, but I do hunt quite a lot from stands, normally in combination with spot and stalk. For species like roe deer, red deer and moose.

To successfully hunt these species alone you still have to put in a lot of off- and on-season work. Learn the pattern of how, where and when the animals move. You have to carefully "stalk" into the area where your stand is, being on the ground, in a blind, behind a bush or in a tree. You might have to wait for hours, days before you're pulling the trigger.
But remember a lot of our hunting grounds have quite low population densities.

Anders,
Your type of stand hunting and the common type of stand hunting in UK and Europe is different that stand hunting in many parts of the US.

In the US, feeders (baiting stations) are placed in areas where deer pass. The feeders frequently have a timer that emits a sound when it is about to dispense corn or deer feed. When the feeder's timer emits the sound, the deer usually come trotting to the feeder to get an easy meal. A stand is set up nearby where the shooter waits on his deer to show up, then shoots the deer.

Hog hunting is similar in many places.

The issue to me is the baiting and shooting, then calling it hunting.
Not very ethical or sporting.

Anders I was refering to the aid of transportation and a rest. Here in Penn's woods I have a 160 acre wood lot on which about 6 of us hunt whitetail and never get in each others way. In Africa I have hunted properties with many many thousand acres, I don't know about you but this old man just can't walk those acres in a day. To me the vehicle is a tool like a scope and the bakkie is like the rest in a stand.

We hunted plains game in South Africa.

Walter has had a quaruple bypass operation, and cannot walk very far.

He shot all his animals from the back of the truck, and said that was the best hunt he had ever had!

At the beginning, I started jumping out of the truck and then shooting. Everyone was laughing at me. Eventually I followed that old saying "when in Rome...." and shot a few animals from the truck.

quote:

Originally posted by dogcat:
Anders,
Your type of stand hunting and the common type of stand hunting in UK and Europe is different that stand hunting in many parts of the US.

In the US, feeders (baiting stations) are placed in areas where deer pass. The feeders frequently have a timer that emits a sound when it is about to dispense corn or deer feed. When the feeder's timer emits the sound, the deer usually come trotting to the feeder to get an easy meal. A stand is set up nearby where the shooter waits on his deer to show up, then shoots the deer.

Hog hunting is similar in many places.

The issue to me is the baiting and shooting, then calling it hunting.
Not very ethical or sporting.

Again, the "my way is better than your way so you say isn't very ETHICAL OR SPORTING" argument. Why does this persist? There are different methods of hunting in different locales. These different methods have usually been developed because of local conditions and what does or does not work under those local conditions.

To simply state that hunting Whitetail deer over a feeder is a matter of placing a feeder and shooting the deer when it shows up for an easy meal shows a true lack of understanding of the method in the same way the anti hunter believes hunting is simply about killing.

Growing up in Texas, hunting deer from a stand, sometimes with a feeder and often without, was all I knew for many years. A trip to Wyoming for Pronghorn was my first experience with spot and stalk techniques for big game. I had done spot and stalk as well as sitting under a tree at a likely spot for squirrels. On my first "spot and stalk" hunt for said Pronghorns, I did not experience any great epiphany in that "this is the only way to hunt" and sitting in a stand is "unethical". I simply viewed it as another method to enjoy hunting.

This is just silly to continue the "my way is better than yours" argument. It's all enjoyable to me, as long as it is legal. Many will take issue with that statement but I've said this before and firmly believe it when I say that what is legal in specific areas is usually a result of regional differences in hunt methods derived from the techniques that have proven most effective in that locale.

For example, in Africa, the American West, Alaska, and "wild" areas such as that, I absolutely love to spot and stalk and can't imagine sitting in a blind, except for those species that are best pursued by use of bait such as the great cats of Africa. But come on down to South Texas and attempt to spot and stalk Whitetails in the brush country! That, my friends, would truly be an exercise in futility. Sure, you can spot and stalk Whitetails in many places, but in certain parts of Texas, it is literally impossible to walk through the brush, let alone being stealthy enough to sneak up on a deer. If you haven't seen the "brush country" of South Texas, it is hard to adequately describe how thick it is. Literally an impenetrable wall of entangled and overlapping vegetation with long, sharp thorns.

I can hear it now, "well in that case, one must sneak along the senderos (man made long thin openings in the brush made by bull dozers)". Well, it won't be long before the "that isn't ethical because the senderos are man made and therefore provide an unfair advantage to the hunter" crowd begins their diatribe.

Back to the feeder issue briefly. As I've stated before, I've hunted deer in Texas from stands over feeders for 43 years now. I have never seen a trophy deer under a feeder during the open hunting season unless it was in the middle of the night on a trail camera. Where the feeder is useful is during the rut. The feeder primarily draws in does and immature bucks. The purpose of the feeder is to create a place that mature bucks will travel past in their search for a "hot" doe. Not a place for them to eat an easy meal. Whitetails hunted under these conditions quickly learn where danger exists and the mature buck will avoid these areas except at night. The better bet is to attempt to find travel routes between feeders and hope to intercept a buck while making his rounds. How this is different from hunting travel routes between corn fields in the midwest is beyond me. But I digress.

Consider duck hunting for a moment. One technique is to set out decoys, build a blind, and call the birds into the set up. Another is to stalk between ponds (or tanks) and jump shoot the birds as they take flight. Is the latter method the only "ETHICAL" manner in which to hunt ducks because it involves no deception and resembles "spot and stalk".

Why can't we just accept the fact that there are many different ways to enjoy hunting. It is really tiresome to continue hearing that "that isn't ethical" or "that isn't really hunting" simply because the method is different from the way you learned it where you lived. Again, there are many ways to enjoy our sport. I enjoy most of them as long as they are within the limits of the local laws. If I find a method that I have objections to, I'll just choose not to participate without pronouncing it as "unethical".

A perfect example is that I don't really have much interest in hunting Mountain Lion with hounds. I've spoken with a lot of guys who have done it and they say it is a great time and very physically challenging. I can understand that and respect it. I also understand that there is really no other reliable way to hunt Mountain Lion. So if you want a Mountain Lion, that's pretty much how it gets done. Just like hunting out of a stand for Whitetails in South Texas is pretty much how it gets done. There really aren't many other options if you hope to be successful. Because I don't want to hunt Mountain Lion with dogs does not make it "Unethical" or "Not very sporting" for the guys who do.

It would be quite arrogant to expect the entire hunting community to view my way of hunting as the only acceptable way. Sorry for the long rant but this crap really gets old.

Forget Texas, what about the totally legal method here in Pa i e driving. You set up an area and you have drivers walk thru the area which is basically suronded by flankers and headers and you dirve the deer to them. Totally legal in Pa with a hunting party of no more than 25 people. I can assure you those who hunt like this consider themselves to be ethically hunting. One must remember in most of these cases they are hunting for meat, if it is a legal deer the lead is going to be flying!!!

quote:

Originally posted by Die Ou Jagter:
I saw a show yesterday, I think Northwestern Hunter. They were shoot from the back of the bakkie and it got me thinking about the long discussions on here about the subject.

What is the difference of shooting from the back of the bakkie and sitting in a box blind and shooting whitetails, or whitetails from a tree stand with a rest.

In my mind the main difference is in how it is perceived by the non-hunting but not anti-hunting public. In most states they are the majority of the voting population compared to hunters or anti-hunters and are the ones that decide which laws we have. I suspect that shooting from a vehicle will be not well received by that group.

A secondary affect of shooting from a vehicle is how it affects the amount of habitat available to big game species. If animals are not shot from vehicles they will use areas much closer to where vehicles travel as the vehicles are not a threat to them. If they fear being shot at from vehicles they will avoid areas close to vehicle travel routes, effectively reducing the amount of habitat available and in turn it means that the habitat will support fewer animals.

465H&H

465, I was refering to hunting and shooting from a truck in Africa, to the best of my knowledge (limited) it is illegal to hunt or shoot from a vehicle in most of the US.

quote:

Originally posted by Die Ou Jagter:
465, I was refering to hunting and shooting from a truck in Africa, to the best of my knowledge (limited) it is illegal to hunt or shoot from a vehicle in most of the US.

Where is it legal to shoot from a truck? With the exception of culling.

quote:

Originally posted by Die Ou Jagter:
465, I was refering to hunting and shooting from a truck in Africa, to the best of my knowledge (limited) it is illegal to hunt or shoot from a vehicle in most of the US.

I suspect that many antis and well as non-hunters watch the Saturday morning hunting shows on occasion. I doubt it makes much diffeence to them whether hunters do it in Africa or the USA. They will lump us all together. I also suspect that African wildlife will learn to avoid vehicles as fast as US wildlife.

465H&H

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:

quote:

Originally posted by Die Ou Jagter:
465, I was refering to hunting and shooting from a truck in Africa, to the best of my knowledge (limited) it is illegal to hunt or shoot from a vehicle in most of the US.

Where is it legal to shoot from a truck? With the exception of culling.

You can shoot off the truck on private farms in South Africa.

quote:

You can shoot off the truck on private farms in South Africa.

Largely true but technically only ranches with a CAE (certificate of adequate enclosure), so any low-fenced farms/ ranches shooting from a vehicle is illegal, as are things such as spotlighting.

quote:

it is illegal to hunt or shoot from a vehicle in most of the US.

It is legal anywhere in Texas on Private Land, and no animals, except coyotes learn to be afraid of a vehicle.

Now with that totally useless information out of the way, what is wrong with the concept that if legal, and a person chooses to do so and can live with their choice, what difference does it make to anyone else.

It is their hunt, their money, their choice, no one is forcing anyone to make the same choice.

Don't want to shoot from a vehicle, DON'T!

Don't want to shoot from a road, DON'T!

Don't want to hunt near a water hole, DON'T!

Don't want to shoot an animal in sigght of camp, DON'T.

It is your hunt, talk to your PH and advise him of the parameters you will operate with in and what actions you will NOT do, And Let EVERYONE Else Do The Same On Their Hunt, UNLESS YOU are paying for their hunt. Otherwise, do not worry about what actions another person is willing to take, ESPECIALLY If They Are LEGAL!

quote:

Originally posted by dogcat:

quote:

Originally posted by Die Ou Jagter:
I saw a show yesterday, I think Northwestern Hunter. They were shoot from the back of the bakkie and it got me thinking about the long discussions on here about the subject.

What is the difference of shooting from the back of the bakkie and sitting in a box blind and shooting whitetails, or whitetails from a tree stand with a rest.

Die,
One has wheels and covers a lot of ground, the other doesn't but uses bait instead.

I see no difference ethically.

I do not hunt from stands over feeders, period.

Many use blinds or tree stands without bait of any kind. There is great skill involved in placing a tree stand or ground blind without useing bait. One must know the habits of the animal being hunted, so as to place the set-up to utilize the patteren found throug scouting before the hunt begins. Early research to find trails being used, from bedding areas to water or to feeding areas being used by the animal. This is only posible by knowing your quarys habits before placing the stand or blind. There is certainly nothing gurenteed with this use of stand or blind. If you think even bait and a blind will gurantee a trophy just sit in a leopard blind that was imprpoerly placed, or even properly placed and see!

On shooting from a car, I will shoot nontrophy bait animals, or camp supplies from the car. Trophies I want to spot and stalk, or blinds for the cats or black bear. Others may do as it suits!

.........................................................................

as a youngster, I hunted an oats field...
just layed in the weeds w/the 30-30 poking thru the fence wire.
taught me alot about being still and patience.
a deer will stare at you for an eternity if they catch a slight movement

quote:

Originally posted by Die Ou Jagter:
I saw a show yesterday, I think Northwestern Hunter. They were shoot from the back of the bakkie and it got me thinking about the long discussions on here about the subject.

What is the difference of shooting from the back of the bakkie and sitting in a box blind and shooting whitetails, or whitetails from a tree stand with a rest.

No difference!

As long as its legal and you enjoy it...Go for it

- "Damn, the game sure is spooky around here"

- "This place has been shot to hell and gone - the game is running the moment it hears the car"

- "Don't they ever stand still?"

- "I was told my hunt was the first of the season in this concession - I sure pity the guy doing the last safari"

Ever heard those phrases before?