The Accurate Reloading Forums
Poll: High Dollar Rifle Scopes
09 December 2010, 20:07
Eland SlayerPoll: High Dollar Rifle Scopes
I'm posting this here because I know many of you who hunt Africa frequently have a lot of knowledge regarding these brands.Which of these brands do you consider the best quality for rifle scopes? Please feel free to elaborate with additional comments.<BR><BR>Thank you.SwarovskiZeissKahlesSchmidt & BenderLeupold (higher grade version such as VX-7)
09 December 2010, 20:15
SaeedI have used all of them, and frankly, cannot find anything better than Leupold for my hunting.
09 December 2010, 20:22
Eland SlayerSaeed,
Very interesting. Which models of Leupold do you prefer?
09 December 2010, 20:26
SkylineI have not owned a Kahles scope yet, nor S&B, but I have had several Zeiss, Swaro and Leupold. I have never had the US Zeiss scopes, only the manufactured and assembled in Germany models.
My scopes get used hard and can spend 6-7 months in service every year and get pounded around in boats, on ATV's, horses, 4x4 trucks and of course packed around on foot. They get used in +90 and -40, sun, rain, sleet and snow.
The only brand of scope I have NEVER had problems with in the field is Leupold. I can't say that with Zeiss or Swarovski. Getting repairs done has also proven to be costly in the shipping department and time consuming.
I have had Leupold repair scopes twice for me...........no fault of the scope. One scope was kicked by a horse and the other was damaged in a fall on a goat hunt. Leupold was fast and they went above and beyond, fixing the scopes at no charge.
They will get my business without fail because their track record for me up to this point in my life has been flawless.
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09 December 2010, 20:38
gunslinger55Just broke a swarovski. Beware of 2 piece scope bodies. For the warranty and general quality I am leaning to Leupold, which I have a bunch. I'll update what happens I have sent the scope into swarovski, had god luck with binos. But leupold really bends over backwards.
White Mountains Arizona
09 December 2010, 20:43
BriceI prefer the Leupolds because:
-light weight makes them more likely to stay with the rifle
-Extreme durability
-More than adequate optical quality
I have used Zeiss and Swaro. Both are optically better than Leupold, and I use binos frrom them.
09 December 2010, 20:47
Die Ou JagterLeupold hands down and you don't have to go to their top of the line for quality. $ for $ they just can't be beat.
09 December 2010, 20:49
Saeedquote:
Originally posted by Eland Slayer:
Saeed,
Very interesting. Which models of Leupold do you prefer?
I have several VXII scopes on my rifles, most used are the two 2.5-8 which are on my 2 375/404 rifles.
They have had a lot of rough treatment and knocks, and have never required any adjustment.
I have made up my mind a long time ago that on my own rifles, I will install only Leupolds.
They run the gamut from the light weight RF models to the most expensive Mark 4 models.
09 December 2010, 20:49
Jerry Huffakerquote:
Originally posted by Saeed:
I have used all of them, and frankly, cannot find anything better than Leupold for my hunting.
+1
Jerry Huffaker
State, National and World Champion Taxidermist
09 December 2010, 20:57
FjoldMost of my big game scopes are Leupies (VX-II and VX-III) but I also have a Nightforce NXS mounted on one gun for long range shooting.
Frank
"I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money."
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09 December 2010, 20:59
Steve MalinverniHonestly I prefer the European/German school in building scopes than the American one, but I however have Weaver and Nikon brands in my scope fleet and I use them without problems.
The reason of my preference is that I'm faster in aiming a target with a S&B, my preferred brand, or a Swarovski than with a Leupold or a Nikon or anyone else.
And it is a less effort for my eyes too......
bye
Stefano
Waidmannsheil
09 December 2010, 21:00
mboga biga bwanaSWAROVSKI's Z Models are the best not only for Africa hunting IMO
Nec Timor Nec Temeritas
09 December 2010, 21:05
GrumulkinI didn't participate in the poll because I haven't used all brands of scopes listed. For quality, my opinion would be based on reading and hearsay. For what it's worth, in my opinion from highest to lowest quality would be:
1. Schmidt & Bender and Zeiss
2. Swarovski
3. Leuopld
Kahles; I know pretty much nothing about it.
That said, I have mostly Leupolds because the quality for the money is quite good and their warranty service is second to none. I've used VX II scopes on some heavy hitters like a 375 H&H Magnum and 458 Lott with no problems. I have broken several of their handgun scopes on stuff like a 460 S&W Magnum and 500 S&W Magnum but they were repaired promptly under warranty without any bitching.
My main complaint with Leupold scopes is that their tracking isn't always as it shout be. It's a bit frustrating to make what you think is a 2 MOA correction and find the scope actually mad a 4 MOA correction. As expected, Leupold Mark 4 scopes have better tracking than the lower grades.
I have a couple of Nightforce scopes and a Swarovski scope I'm quite pleased with.
09 December 2010, 21:05
safari-lawyerI have three Zeiss (one Euro and two American), three Swaro (Two euro and one American) and two Leupolds.
The 30mm Euro models are superior to anything I've ever looked through, especially at first and last light.
The 1" American model Swaro is equal to my Leupolds, but the 1" Zeiss are not as good as Leupold IMHO.
Any are adequate for hunting in the broad daylight.
If you are shooting in low light or at night, I'll take the 30mm Euro models every time. My Zeiss 2.5-10 x 50 with Illuminated German #4 is perfect for night and last light hunting.
Will J. Parks, III
09 December 2010, 21:12
LRH270I use Leupold on the .375 and a Burris on the 9,3, and spend my money on trophy fees.
Took my Leopard in pitch-dark with a straight-tube 4x Burris and a flashlight.
There are WAY too many unnecessary gimmicks and gadgets out there, IMHO.
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09 December 2010, 21:19
Schauckisquote:
Originally posted by Eland Slayer:
the best quality for rifle scopes?
So what's Leupold gotta do with this?
Choose any of Zeiss, Swaro, or S&B and you have a dandy scope!
Swaro is best today due to the widest field of view.
In the tests it's usually also rated as having the most clear picture, but all three are so good I can tell no difference at all.
Looking at various tests these three are always the top choice. Sometimes one is the winner; sometimes the other.
I picked Zeiss, however, as my friends have found it to be very robust.
For long it probably was the best. Today, of the top three, it tends to have the narrowest field of view but it is also usually quite light.
Kahles is very good also but together with the Docter it runs after the top three brands.
Biggest difference probably being night vision. If you don't hunt in the dusk/dark, you probably don't notice any difference.
- Lars/Finland
A.k.a. Bwana One-Shot
09 December 2010, 21:20
Tracker49I have only had the Leupie's, never looked at any others after buying my first one. Never had a problem, so why change.
09 December 2010, 21:36
McCrayLeupold makes a nice, light weight scope with a lot of eye relief. But I have had to use their customer service too many times to have any faith in their durability.
For Africa rifles, I'll take a Swarovski. For my toys, a Leupold is fine.
"There always seems to be a big market for making the clear, complex."
09 December 2010, 21:38
RIPLeupold is winning the poll, eh?
Leupold scopes seem to be the best balance of attributes that make a great hunting rifle scope:
Optical quality
Eye relief
Ruggedness/durability
Light weight
I have purchased one each of Swarovski, Zeiss, and Schmidt&Bender. Most are best left on the unlimited-weight-class target rifle.
Leupold beats them all on sporting rigs.
Trijicon and Sightron also have been very very good to me.
My order of preference, by quantities owned and used:
Leupold
Sightron
Trijicon
About one in 22 of my Leupolds have needed warranty work, but they always come back better than new and no charge for the fix.
I also kill a deer on the highway with my car about once every 22 years ... S%@$ happens.
09 December 2010, 22:07
Eland SlayerTo be a little more specific.....
The reason I'm asking the question is because I'm looking at putting together a new "go to" rifle within the next year or two. Whatever scope I choose MUST have a minimum of a 30mm tube and 50mm objective because I do a lot of hunting in low-light conditions (dawn and dusk).
For what it's worth.....all of the scopes I own now, except for one, are Leupold. The other scope is a Zeiss Conquest 3-12x56mm which I got for a very good price and am fairly satisfied with. However, I won't buy another Conquest that size due to their extremely short eye relief (3.2 inches). I like to have 3.5 inches or more if I can.
I really appreciate all the replies and opinions so far. Thanks.
09 December 2010, 22:08
BaxterBDifferent scopes will perform differently for different people, period. The coatings will react differently with different eyes. I think Nikon Monarchs are as bright or slightly brighter than Leupold, As bright as Swarovski and Kahles but I'll pretty much only pout Leuopold on my guns because I have used them forever; my brother is still using the first VX2 I bought 25 years ago. I have never needed anything more than a Leupold could deliver. Plus, they are made close by and they have excellent support from what I hear but i;ve never had to use it. And to boot, I can spend 400 bucks on a VX3 (1.75 to 6 or 2.5 to 8) and spend the rest on the gun itself. Its a win-win in my book.
09 December 2010, 22:34
Dave FulsonTrijicon did not make the poll ?
Dave Fulson
09 December 2010, 22:40
eezridrA comment on the Leupold tracking (windage and elevation). I would agree that it was not extremely accurate in the past however the new VX3 seems to have addressed that issue. Leupold must have changed something internally going from the VX III to the VX3. My VX3's track right on.
09 December 2010, 22:50
eezridrThe only issue I see with Trijicon is lack of eye relief on their low end variables. 3.25" is a little on the low side for big bangers. Most of the maker of these type scopes are offering 3.75-4". If Trijicon was to address this issue they might gain a stronger following for the big bore guys. Everyone wants a wide field of view but that typically comes at the expense of some eye relief.
EZ
quote:
Originally posted by Dave Fulson:
Trijicon did not make the poll ?
09 December 2010, 22:52
miles58My experience does not include Kahles.
I love the FFP high end Euro scopes. They have FOV, clarity, light transmission and color rendition that is second to none.
My Leupy experience is that they are fine scopes but there is enough difference to notice all things considered.
I could easily hunt the rest of my days with any of them, but the Leupy VX-IIs I have need a pipe wrench to change power, and that weight penalty makes them wiegh a little more than a Schmidt and Bender. My VX-Is are not the glass of the VX-IIs which do not measure up to the Euro glass.
09 December 2010, 23:02
graybirdMy go to scope is actually the Nikon Monarch series. I prefer them over the Leupold scopes, which I have both, because the eye relief on the Nikon fits my eyes better. Not knocking the Leupolds, just saying the Nikons fit me the best.
Graybird
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09 December 2010, 23:06
FrostbitI've used Redfield, Leupold, and Swarovski. The optics with the Swaro's are noticibly better than the other two. I don't buy big buck latest and greatest. All my Swaro's are the discontinued PH model what I have snagged via classifieds over the last couple of years.
09 December 2010, 23:09
Schauckisquote:
Originally posted by Eland Slayer:
The reason I'm asking the question is because I'm looking at putting together a new "go to" rifle within the next year or two. Whatever scope I choose MUST have a minimum of a 30mm tube and 50mm objective because I do a lot of hunting in low-light conditions (dawn and dusk).
For what it's worth.....all of the scopes I own now, except for one, are Leupold. The other scope is a Zeiss Conquest 3-12x56mm which I got for a very good price and am fairly satisfied with. However, I won't buy another Conquest that size due to their extremely short eye relief (3.2 inches). I like to have 3.5 inches or more if I can.
Ahhh.....!
Then you need an illuminated reticle, too.
Here also the price counts: on the better makes you can adjust the light low enough. Too bright a dot or reticle will blind you.
On my Zeiss even the highest setting is so low that you cannot see it in daylight at all.
For long eye relief, look at the Swarovski EE (Extended Eye relief) series scopes.
Also the new model Zeiss scopes are much better in this regard than older model scopes.
That said: My Classic model Zeiss is the one with the longest eye relief I have experienced thus far.
I cannot comment on the S&B in this regard, I'm afraid. You'll have to check the tech spec sheet.
- Lars/Finland
A.k.a. Bwana One-Shot
09 December 2010, 23:24
L. David KeithI agree with Saeed. Leupold makes excellent scopes. Having a background in wholesale and retail sporting goods, I've listened to a number of insider comments and gun manufacturers remarks on various high end scopes. I see nothing wrong with any of them and at any time you can have problems with any product. But my money remains with Leupold.
LDK
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09 December 2010, 23:39
Eland Slayerquote:
Originally posted by Schauckis:
quote:
Originally posted by Eland Slayer:
The reason I'm asking the question is because I'm looking at putting together a new "go to" rifle within the next year or two. Whatever scope I choose MUST have a minimum of a 30mm tube and 50mm objective because I do a lot of hunting in low-light conditions (dawn and dusk).
For what it's worth.....all of the scopes I own now, except for one, are Leupold. The other scope is a Zeiss Conquest 3-12x56mm which I got for a very good price and am fairly satisfied with. However, I won't buy another Conquest that size due to their extremely short eye relief (3.2 inches). I like to have 3.5 inches or more if I can.
Ahhh.....!
Then you need an illuminated reticle, too.
I am not interested in an illuminated reticle. I do just fine with the medium/heavy-duplex style black reticle. I have already shot wild hogs at night with less than a half moon with my Zeiss Conquest.
09 December 2010, 23:40
WoodmnctryLeupold hands down --- their warranty service and customer service alone is totally unmatched by those "other" scope manufacturers
OMG!-- my bow is "pull-push feed" - how dreadfully embarrasing!!!!!
09 December 2010, 23:44
Arild IversenIf day light hunting only was the issue, Leupold would fit in very nicely.
But as Eland Slayer emphasis the need of low light quality optics, I for one, will go with one of the European top brands.
Of those, my personal experience is limited to S&B and Zeiss, and on my low ligth rifles sits only Zeiss Victory scopes today.
I do a lot of dusk and dawn as well as night hunting over moon lit fields for roe and red deer, and top quality optics is a must!
That said, my old Vari X III in 2,5-8x36 with the # 4 reticle still see a lot of use on my "day time" moose rifle (Ruger 375).
Arild Iversen.
09 December 2010, 23:54
charlieTIf dawn/dusk is going to be a factor or longer distance I'd look at the 30mm tubes. The new Ziess Duralyte's are very clear and may be one to look at
09 December 2010, 23:54
jwp475quote:
Originally posted by Steve Malinverni:
Honestly I prefer the European/German school in building scopes than the American one, but I however have Weaver and Nikon brands in my scope fleet and I use them without problems.
The reason of my preference is that I'm faster in aiming a target with a S&B, my preferred brand, or a Swarovski than with a Leupold or a Nikon or anyone else.
And it is a less effort for my eyes too......
All things considered, ruggedness, optics and reliability IMHO S&B for sure and certain. The low light capability of a S&B has to be seen to be believed.
Leupold should never be mentioned in the same paragraph much less the same sentence as a S&B.
_____________________________________________________
A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink
Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened.
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10 December 2010, 00:11
Code4quote:
Originally posted by Saeed:
I have used all of them, and frankly, cannot find anything better than Leupold for my hunting.
I know you own this forum but you need to get your eyes checked mate. Yes, Leupold will do the job but they are a mid cost (do not refer to them as high dollar, please) average performance brand and what I consider entry level for reliability on an overseas hunt. There is a lot of light in Africa and Saudi and I will conceed that will hide the optical short comings of the Leupolds. Get to dusk though and the whole story changes.
I hope the Zeiss referred to in the poll is German and the S&B not the Hungarian models.
10 December 2010, 00:13
500Nquote:
Originally posted by charlieT:
If dawn/dusk is going to be a factor ........
Euro scopes have always been better than others as this is where most of the hunting in Germany is done.
I still think US and other scopes have some way to catch up.
.
10 December 2010, 00:18
GeoffM24quote:
Originally posted by safari-lawyer:
I have three Zeiss (one Euro and two American), three Swaro (Two euro and one American) and two Leupolds.
The 30mm Euro models are superior to anything I've ever looked through, especially at first and last light.
The 1" American model Swaro is equal to my Leupolds, but the 1" Zeiss are not as good as Leupold IMHO.
Any are adequate for hunting in the broad daylight.
If you are shooting in low light or at night, I'll take the 30mm Euro models every time. My Zeiss 2.5-10 x 50 with Illuminated German #4 is perfect for night and last light hunting.
That is interesting. Personally I like Swarovski scopes the best especially the Z6 line. To me the Leupolds optics are inferior to pretty much every other scope I have from Swarovskis, Zeiss Conquests, and even Nikons. I'd take a Zeiss Conquest over a Leupold any day.
Best Scope: Swarovski
Best Value: Zeiss Conquest
Decent scope at a decent price: Leupold
10 December 2010, 00:19
eezridrIt will not be very many years before all the manufacturers will be providing Flourite glass on most scopes (objectives). My understanding is that these are grown crystals and are far more fragile than glass but wonderful as we all know for viewing. As this process is perfected in a manner for mass production, I believe you will see a drop off in the superiority of European optics. I am a huge fan of Leica, Swar and Zeiss however their dominance in optical performance may be short lived.
EZ
10 December 2010, 00:25
jwp475quote:
Originally posted by eezridr:
It will not be very many years before all the manufacturers will be providing Flourite glass on most scopes (objectives). My understanding is that these are grown crystals and are far more fragile than glass but wonderful as we all know for viewing. As this process is perfected in a manner for mass production, I believe you will see a drop off in the superiority of European optics. I am a huge fan of Leica, Swar and Zeiss however their dominance in optical performance may be short lived.
EZ
Glass is certainly a part of the equation for the best view, but is not the entire equation
_____________________________________________________
A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink
Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened.
- Winston Churchill
10 December 2010, 00:52
Eland Slayerquote:
Originally posted by Code4:
quote:
Originally posted by Saeed:
I have used all of them, and frankly, cannot find anything better than Leupold for my hunting.
I know you own this forum but you need to get your eyes checked mate. Yes, Leupold will do the job but they are a mid cost (do not refer to them as high dollar, please) average performance brand and what I consider entry level for reliability on an overseas hunt. There is a lot of light in Africa and Saudi and I will conceed that will hide the optical short comings of the Leupolds. Get to dusk though and the whole story changes.
I hope the Zeiss referred to in the poll is German and the S&B not the Hungarian models.
First of all, I don't believe Saeed said Leupold was the world's overall best scope brand.....he just said he cannot find anything better for HIS hunting.
Second of all, I deliberately stated in the original post that I was not referring to the low-level Leupolds, but rather their high-end scopes (such as the VX-7 series). These are not "mid cost" optics. The large 56mm objective models are typically between $1,500 and $2,000. That is hardly "mid cost" for a scope.
Personally, I think the comment towards Saeed was uncalled for.