Congratulations JudgeG,

Look like a beast, this Searcy.
Never heard of a Searcy before Cannuck posts about a Tanzanian fruitful party.
Have you a link to Searcy?

I don�t brag speaking of far too much ele in Burkina. I was in Fada N�gourma, I saw villages ravaged, trees and plots, darn lucky that the outfitter fed the villagers, they would have starved. Our car was charged in Benin as well.
It�s a country where no tree can grow upper 15 feets, save Baobabs.
These ele are not territorial, they are roaming across the W, the W-shape of the stream Niger across Burkina, Niger and Benin.
Don�t count on Chirac to make the statu-quo move : he has said :� I am an anti-hunter, anyhow, I cannot forbid the hunters to shoot back hares in self-defence� An all-purpose nuisance this twisted-minded old politician.
Burkina is dependent on the CITES.
Good news, be sure the law is harshly applied, little poaching, warthogs mainly.

I am delighted you�ll enjoy such a nice safari. I crave for your account.
I cannot imagine hunting ele, my wife is dead against and so far, I am too old to roam again the nightclubs, pick a new wife and grow more children.

Good luck, Shoot straight..

Any creedence to Taylor's claims regarding the whole 5 min to 1/2 hr knockdown thing for near misses to the brain?

Or is this a case like PO ackely and his 475 A&M load data?
-A great gun guy just having a real bad day behind the type writer...

Karl.

Thanks Gentlemen,

Shot placement and circumstances�s management are yet clearer. The clash of opinions is nice, it makes us think and improve us.
My main concern was how to stop a charge because in Burkina we are harassed by ele and often the PH is totting only a mashie gun instead of his 416 . It works too, this year the week before I arrived, he stopped a charging lion at 10 paces, a slug right between the eyes.

Taking everything into consideration, we have to find a little genius who can make a dummy elephant head . I think a transparent head (scale 1/1) displaying all the landmarks of a genuine head and translucent enough to show a shiny brain. The device should be animated, providing any possible angles. The construction material could be Plexiglas or inflatable material.
This dummy could be videoed from any angles and the video and DVD sold. This dummy could be exhibited during shooting shows and even sold to hunting schools or associations.
Is there any genius on this forum?

There is an often repeated adage that to make a frontal brain shot on an elephant, you should imagine a broom stick placed between the elephant's ear holes, and then at whatever angle, shoot to break the broom stick.

Would it work if the hunter replaced the broom stick with the the horizontal reticle in his scope?

Do you plan to imagine the scope placed in the elephant's ear hole or actually stick it there?... just kidding.



Of course it would work, it is just a different way of saying or visualizing the same thing.



The tricky part is knowing where the ear holes are at any perspective or angle, near or far.



Some would say you best not be getting dependent on a scope for elephant. It needs to be up close and personal with iron sights ... of course I think a 1 to 1.5 X scope and backup irons would be fine. But what do I know ...

If you have to think about lines when shooting an elephant in the head, then just shoot him in the shoulder and you will not have to worry.

Huh?

Post deleted by T.Carr

Huh?


(Sorry, I just can't resist.)

Scott - In addition to the meaningful responses above, I'd also suggest that you purchase Ron Thomson's book entitled Mahohboh. It is available for $50 from Safari Press. In addition to a lot of info about elephant behavior and Thomson's opinions regarding habitat loss caused by overpopulation of elephant, there are some excellent descriptions of all possible elephant shots with pictures. I found this very helpful in preparing for my ele hunt.

The key to the "broomstick through the ear" thing is based on the premise that regardless of how high or low the ele's head is when looking at you, this horizontal plane will not change. But it is the cheekbones, not necessarily the ear holes, that you are looking for as a reference point on a frontal shot. The cheekbones are easy to spot regardless of which way the ele is facing. This is not me talking, but what I gleaned from Mahohboh and other resources, then put into practice.

What is tricky about the frontal brain shot is not just the placement of the bullet "up and down", but the angle "left and right" as the brain is deep inside the skull and it is easy to not account for this and not angle the shot far enough back/deep. I think the thing to do, as Adam said, is "study" enough pictures - and live ele's at the zoo until you can "see" the brain from all angles and head pivots. You may have time to place the shot especially on a bull, in which case the PH can help by telling you where to shoot using a reference point (clump of dirt, or x inches up and y inches over, for example). I'd personally rather have help before the shot, then afterwards�.

But, depending on hunting conditions, it can happen fast. In this case, you will be looking at the elephant and hopefully "see" the brain and angle, and then shoulder your rifle and shoot to the spot. Side brain shots are said to be easier as the reference points are greater, and the profile of the brain larger from the side.

Personally, in my very limited experience I found it easier to get the angles right w/o a scope, when up close, as it is easier to see the big picture especially if the ele is moving. Also, as others have suggested in other threads, I prepared and consciously found the point that I thought was correct, and aimed an inch or so down as it is easy to shoot too high, and if you are going to miss, lower is better then higher.

Safari Press Website: MAHOHBOH

Like I told Bill C, and everyone else, if you want to know, go buy Ron Thomson's book Mahohboh.



If you have to ask the PH where to shoot you don't know.

Post deleted by T.Carr

Having to "ask the PH where to shoot" would be just plain stupid and means you have not done your homework. As you are asking the questions Scott, this will obviously not be the case. Communicating with the PH about where to shoot if the opportunity presents itself is smart and much better then trying to be a hot-dog and blowing the shot. Especially, on your first ele.



And that is what normal people do, you will likely walk up on a few ele and the PH will point things out, go over the reference points with you so he knows you know what to do, etc. And this normal communication is not restricted to elephant, but applies to all dangerous game. But when it happens fast, as it did with me, there is no time to do anything but aim and shoot. So you can't count on the PH being there, which is what I think Will is saying.



I first read Mahohboh in the Caprivi on a leopard/buffalo hunt. It was in camp and "required reading" for all the rich guys showing up who had never looked at an anatomical diagram. I remember thinking how lousy that was, and how they didn't "deserve" to shoot a creature so magnificent as an elephant.



I applaud you Scott for doing your homework! It's fun too, if you let it be.

I'm not pretending to know where the elephant keeps his brain, but if the saying goes..."aim for the stick through the ears"..you'll have to put the crosshairs just there, on the stick through the ears..if that makes you miss the brain the trick doesn't work.

I'll be sure to study books, photos, live beasts, skulls, and what have you should I ever strike rich and go hunt elephant.

Frans

Frans,

Actually the side brain shot is a no-brainer , so to speak!

It is the frontal brain shot that gets tricky. But you are right about the stick, if you know where the stick is suppose to be. It is one thing to take a successful frontal shot when their ears are spread out wide, so you have some idea of where their ear holes are, and another when they have their ears held back against their sides, and then, shit, what do you do?

That is the kind of frontal brain shot that separates the men from the boys and as likely as not is the position of the elephant's ears in a real charge, but not always.

One old saying is to place the frontal shot about a hands width above a line between the eyes, when on approximately the same level as the elephant and when the elephant's head is held level. That is true because that is where the brain lies for that particular shot, which is not all that unusual. But, of course, there are a bunch of other possibilities.

I have always held the position of never seeking a PH's or anyone elses advice about taking a brain shot, or where to place a shot. I have the opinion that if you are serious about elephant hunting then you should know. If you ever face a charge you will find out what little you really know and just hope to survive to learn some more and to fight another day.

I give full and deserved credit to the guys that can pull off a frontal brain shot when the shit hits the fan. A lot of the old-timers couldn't and got killed. Some were lucky and lived. Some knew/know what the hell they were/are doing.

I'm striving to be in the last group.

SBT,

It should be a lot easier to use a scope because you take out the third dimension as opposed to using open sights, as in any other hunted animal.

The problem with scopes is what happens if you get charged. I've been close enough to some to almost slap them on the ass (not on purpose!). If you get charged at that range a scope is useless. So I decided from the beginning to never hunt them with a scope, but to each their own.

Will, Bill,

Congratulations, you know your job. I will order �Mahohboh�. More I study the trick, more I am puzzled.

I was twice in Burkina and we bumped in Elephants more than twice a day. Most are knowing they are protected and a couple have buckshots holes in the ears. To make short, at least once a day they won�t leave place and even charge. We aren�t supposed to shoot them, but we have better know how.
EVERYBODY IS SPEAKING OF THE EAR HOLE. WHERE IS THE EAR HOLE?
I have read a pile of books, even �the Perfect Shot�, but nobody clearly explains.
When a ele is charging, when it is unfolding it�s ears, you can see the arm-broad muscles and tendons� fascicle. That�s a reference mark. Where is the ear hole with regard to this fascicle? Or any other mark....

Second question : charging pattern is one thing but looking at the side of the ele, where is the ear hole ? with regard with which reference mark?

Sorry, my questions are candid, but more I learn, more I seem to get ignorant (I know there is the crater next door).

Who is going to team up with a computer game designer to create an accurate shot placement program? One that lets you take your shot using a crosshair curser then shows a 3D cross section of internal shot placement (with internal anatomy). This would be great for all big game and the technology is definatly available. Even though it could never compare with real field experiance it would be a great way to practice shots and gain confidence before actually pulling the trigger.

Lots of opinnions, but on a frontal brain shot the angle changes very quickly like with every step towards you as the elephant approaches you, so all the dotted pictures in the world don't mean much...Study the skull and all the angles to the brain and go with your instinct, thats all the time you have if he is coming your way... If you know where the brain lies in relation to his head, then you can correlate the shot pretty easily, and the brain is large enough to allow some error....If you can't do that, then perhaps you had better use the heart shot and it is very effective...they run off a little ways and crash over...The broadside shot is pretty easy in my opinnion.

SBT,
Here are some pictures of two frontal shots that missed the brain.

Jerry - Those are great pictures.

Here's the info from Jerry's initial post of these pict's back in early April:

This is the skull of a cow Elephant a customer of mine shot. They were in a herd trying to shoot a bull when then cow got tired of them being around and charged full tilt. They were on a very steep hill and the elephant was coming down hill. They fired several shots into the body and head. Four of them hit the head, as you can see one shot hit where the tusk would be, two and three hit in the center of the head and the fourth shot blew off the cheek bone. The back of the skull shows where the two center shots exited. None of these hit the brain. She finally dropped at 5 yds with both PH and hunter with empty magazines.

Surprizingly the skull only weighs 38lbs, I can easily pick it up with one hand. It doesn't weigh as much as a Cape Buffalo cape does so it shouldn't add to much cost to the freight to have one shipped back with the rest of your trophies. It was a very large cow according to the PH. The calibers used were .458 WM and .375 H&H. Her head must have been turned slightly because the bullets that entered the front center exited slightly off to the side in the back of the skull. The wound channels missed the brain to the side. Here are a couple of pictures of the wound channels. I couldn't get the stick to go straight through the bottom hole, apparently the bullet turn inside the head.

Jbderunz,

Maybe this will help a bit. The blood streaming down just in front of the muzzle of my rifle (another Searcy) is coming from the ear hole. It is very clear from this angle where the ear hole is from the blood stream.

Greg

This may sound a bit course, but why not just put him down with a shot to the knee, then walk up and administer the brain shot?