Every commentator I've seen on TV says probably. They say it will strictly be a political decision by Obama administration, and that it's clear that Obama will take the path most liberal.

God I'm starting to hate what we've become since 2008!

Oh, and I guess ol' Obama told the airlines this as well:

"NEW YORK (Reuters) - Three U.S. airlines have banned the transport of lion, leopard, elephant, rhino or buffalo killed by trophy hunters, in the latest fallout from the killing of Zimbabwe's Cecil the lion last month."
Who were the 'every commentator I've seen". Probably all on FOX news! These damn liberals!!!
Peter

No way this happens.

Jeff

http://www.startribune.com/zim...-of-speed/320504802/



A senior Zimbabwean diplomat said Monday that his government will move quickly in requesting extradition for Eden Prairie big-game hunter Walter Palmer, who faces allegations that he illegally shot a much-loved research lion during a hunt last month.

Richard Chibuwe, deputy chief of mission at Zimbabwe’s embassy in Washington, D.C., said his nation’s top prosecutor and other officials “are keeping in touch with our authorities to see if we can bring some kind of speed to extradition. We are hoping that things will move with a bit of speed.”

The U.S. State Department declined to comment and said it does not discuss extradition requests. A spokesperson said that since Zimbabwe and the United States signed an extradition treaty in 2000, neither nation has extradited anyone to the other.

quote:

Originally posted by Bwana Bunduki:
No way this happens.

Jeff

I do believe that our president will decide in favor of those who want both doctors extradited because he is not all that bright, but I am not sure the courts will uphold that decision, and I am very sure that it would be appealed. There is no way any American or any citizen of any country on earth should be extradited to Zimbabwe. Their record is abominable and indefensible.

No matter what all the crazies are saying or threatening ... of all the horrible crimes against humanity (is Mugabe innocent of such things ??) ... shooting a lion without a license (if true ???) ... cannot come close to the people who beat their babies to death, murder someone over a few bucks, cut off heads to 'please' their deities .. etc. etc .. and the unborn babies ... sheesh .. what garbage !!!

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:
Oh, and I guess ol' Obama told the airlines this as well:

"NEW YORK (Reuters) - Three U.S. airlines have banned the transport of lion, leopard, elephant, rhino or buffalo killed by trophy hunters, in the latest fallout from the killing of Zimbabwe's Cecil the lion last month."
Who were the 'every commentator I've seen". Probably all on FOX news! These damn liberals!!!
Peter

The fact is Peter...that the U.S. is a much different place since 2008. I can name numerous things that have declined...but...can you name anything that has improved?

Virtually no way is Palmer extradited. Shipping off an American citizen to a third world country with third world courts. A country where we have sanctions on the people running the country. A country with human rights atrocities. etc.

Americans didn't like the whole Amanda Knox fiasco with a first world country and court. Worse things happen where the US refuses to extradite.

There is no way this administration, DOS/DOJ can afford to have an American they have extradited before a kangaroo court with the media following it if things went wrong. What happens if Palmer gets AIDS in prison? etc.

I think the odds of extradition are incredibly low. But I can't say he isn't at the least considering it. Weighing the benefits against the consequences.

The problem is that he seems to be pretty immune to the consequences of any of his actions. Media protects him, and he doesn't care what the conservatives think of him.

How can you be taken seriously as a dictator if you don't slit some throats occasionally?

quote:

Virtually no way is Palmer extradited. Shipping off an American citizen to a third world country with third world courts. A country where we have sanctions on the people running the country. A country with human rights atrocities. etc.

Americans didn't like the whole Amanda Knox fiasco with a first world country and court. Worse things happen where the US refuses to extradite.

There is no way this administration, DOS/DOJ can afford to have an American they have extradited before a kangaroo court with the media following it if things went wrong. What happens if Palmer gets AIDS in prison? etc.

I agree with most of this. Couple of points however:
1. What is the liability of a client, if he books a hunt with an outfitter but then it turns out that the animal was taken illegally? Surely this is not the first time this has happened. I do not know the answer, but perhaps you folks do. That it was taken illegally is no longer in question. No permit was issued for a lion in that area. Should a client ask to see the permit when he arrives? Isn't that a bit late?
2. Americans may not like the whole Amanda Knox fiasco, but did you ever bother to find out what the dead person's family thought of this? America is NOT the only country on this planet, and a few minutes research might show what the British thought of this "fiasco".
Peter.

going to a Zim jail for even a week is a death sentence.

this "extradition" will never happen. Parks and Wildlife cleared Palmer of any wrongdoing and said there would be no charges placed against him.

Well Lane:

"In 2012, the last year before open enrollment through the ACA began, 45.6 million people nationwide, or 14.8% of Americans did not have health insurance. 24/7 Wall St. estimated that 28.6 million people, or 9.1% of Americans did not have health insurance as of March this year -- a decrease of roughly 17 million people or a drop of 5.7 percentage points. Based on the change in the rate of the uninsured population from 2012 through the first part of this year, the percentage of Kentucky’s population without health insurance declined by 10.4 percentage points, the largest improvement nationwide. Iowa, on the other end of the spectrum, had the most modest improvement, with its uninsured population shrinking by 1.7 percentage points"

"The number of unpaid medical bills is shrinking across the United States thanks to the Obama administration's Affordable Care Act. As more people sign up for private health insurance, and as more states expand Medicaid programs for low-income Americans, hospital companies are reporting lower expenses for charity and uncompensated expenses, a Forbes columnist noted Sunday."

I would call this an improvement, but I'm sure you would not. Could these numbers be better? Yes, I am sure they could if the Republicans had engaged in the debate instead of voting 54 times in the House to repeal it.
You are presumably an intelligent person, so, you know that despite the rhetoric from the right, ACA is here to stay. DONE!
But, I don't think this is a topic for the African Hunting Forum.
Peter

http://www.washingtonpost.com/...df8af8eb9_story.html



The investigation could lead to charges under U.S. law. If Palmer is charged with similar offenses by Zimbabwe, that would clear the way for him to be extradited to that country under a treaty Zimbabwe entered into with the United States in July 1997. It calls for persons of interest to be extradited between the two countries in cases that include a conspiracy or attempt to commit a crime, aiding and abetting a crime, or being an accessory.


The extradition process cannot begin until Zimbabwe officially issues a charge and requests Palmer’s return. Oppah Muchinguri, the nation’s minister of the environment and climate, vowed to press charges in a Friday news conference in the capital, Harare.

“I have already consulted with the authorities within the police force who are responsible for arresting the criminal. We have certain processes we have to follow,” Muchinguri said, according to the Associated Press. “. . . The processes have already started.”



Legal experts said Palmer wouldn’t have a lot of options to fight a return to Zimbabwe to face trial. “Once Zimbabwe provides a charge, it depends on how fast the U.S. moves,” said Stephen Vladeck, an American University law professor who specializes in international affairs.


“Anyone subject to extradition has the right to challenge it, but the grounds upon which he can successfully oppose extradition is fairly narrow,” Vladeck said. “He would have to argue that it violates the treaty or somehow that it violates his rights.”


Zimbabwean authorities confirmed Friday that they want to extradite the American dentist who killed Cecil the lion. A U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service official said the State Department is looking into the matter. (AP)
Palmer’s lawyers could cite the poor condition of Zimbabwe’s prisons, a humanitarian concern, as a reason to deny extradition. The prisons were recently described as a “hellhole” in a report by the Zimbabwe Independent, a daily business newspaper, according to its Web site.

“I think it could factor into the State Department’s analysis,” said Jens David Ohlin, an expert in international and criminal law who teaches at Cornell University. U.S. officials “could decide the prison conditions are too harsh and we don’t want our citizens to spend time in jail there.”

The extradition process could take years to play out. If a federal court approves Zimbabwe’s request to extradite him, Palmer could appeal the decision, experts said. If he were to lose on appeal, the State Department would make the final decision.



Ohlin said the State Department would be hard-pressed to turn down a formal extradition request from Zimbabwe. If it did, in a worst-case scenario Zimbabwe could become a sanctuary for criminals who flee crimes committed in the United States.

“If the U.S. doesn’t play ball in this case,” Ohlin said, “in the future if the U.S. wants someone extradited, Zimbabwe can say, ‘We’re not going to help you out.’ ”

Kathi, any thoughts on my question?

quote:

What is the liability of a client, if he books a hunt with an outfitter but then it turns out that the animal was taken illegally? Surely this is not the first time this has happened. I do not know the answer, but perhaps you folks do. That it was taken illegally is no longer in question. No permit was issued for a lion in that area. Should a client ask to see the permit when he arrives? Isn't that a bit late?

Peter

IF they do the extradition or even start it here in the US. Zim hunting is and will be completely out for majority of U S hunters. I'll never set foot on Zim ground again. Zim could bring even trumped up charges on anyone anytime.

Anyway Trump has publicly offered to ay all his legal costs...

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:

quote:

Virtually no way is Palmer extradited. Shipping off an American citizen to a third world country with third world courts. A country where we have sanctions on the people running the country. A country with human rights atrocities. etc.

Americans didn't like the whole Amanda Knox fiasco with a first world country and court. Worse things happen where the US refuses to extradite.

There is no way this administration, DOS/DOJ can afford to have an American they have extradited before a kangaroo court with the media following it if things went wrong. What happens if Palmer gets AIDS in prison? etc.

I agree with most of this. Couple of points however:
1. What is the liability of a client, if he books a hunt with an outfitter but then it turns out that the animal was taken illegally? Surely this is not the first time this has happened. I do not know the answer, but perhaps you folks do. That it was taken illegally is no longer in question. No permit was issued for a lion in that area. Should a client ask to see the permit when he arrives? Isn't that a bit late?
2. Americans may not like the whole Amanda Knox fiasco, but did you ever bother to find out what the dead person's family thought of this? America is NOT the only country on this planet, and a few minutes research might show what the British thought of this "fiasco".
Peter.

Regarding your point number 2.

I didn't realize we were talking about Great Britain. I thought we were talking about a US citizen being extradited to Zimbabwe and the reaction that American citizens would have if/when things didn't turn out to be on the up and up.

I doubt the extradition request will be honored. If Zimbabwe really does want to prosecute the dentist-- which I would say is not at all a forgone conclusion-- it presents our government with an opportunity to extract various concessions from Zimbabwe. Surely our government would like the opportunity to prosecute or sue a number of Mugabe's cronies who are on the State Dept's "black list." As such, I don't see a strong likelihood of our government honoring an extradition request.

if he is extradited we--the U.S. citizens are under a full DICTATORSHIP. The govt/ should not be into the situation period. A hunt is a hunt.

http://www.huntingreport.com/h..._details.cfm?id=3291


Peter,

Check out the below article.



A Call to Fellow Hunters Affected by Outfitter Chris Loncarich's Indictment

Published: March - 2014

Shortly after going to press with February issue of The Hunting Report, we heard from a subscriber (who wishes to remain anonymous) who had been interviewed during the Chris Loncarich investigation. This subscriber had been interviewed by US Fish and Wildlife agents. He had been told he was being interviewed as a potential witness and, he, as he put it, "talked freely and offered the government any help he could deliver." At the end of that interview, he was told by the agents that he was "criminally culpable" for his actions. His trophy was confiscated, and he has not heard anything more since. With Loncarich now charged on 17 counts, including several felonies, this subscriber is waiting for the sword to fall on him.
He had been told that more than 40 hunters were interviewed during the investigation and he wonders if any other subscribers are in his situation and would be interested in sharing information and, perhaps, legal strategies and counsel should charges be pressed. If you were somehow caught up in the Loncarich debacle and wish to contact others in the same situation, please send us your contact information and we will forward it.

quote:

Originally posted by Kathi:
http://www.huntingreport.com/h..._details.cfm?id=3291


Peter,

Check out the below article.



A Call to Fellow Hunters Affected by Outfitter Chris Loncarich's Indictment

Published: March - 2014

Shortly after going to press with February issue of The Hunting Report, we heard from a subscriber (who wishes to remain anonymous) who had been interviewed during the Chris Loncarich investigation. This subscriber had been interviewed by US Fish and Wildlife agents. He had been told he was being interviewed as a potential witness and, he, as he put it, "talked freely and offered the government any help he could deliver." At the end of that interview, he was told by the agents that he was "criminally culpable" for his actions. His trophy was confiscated, and he has not heard anything more since. With Loncarich now charged on 17 counts, including several felonies, this subscriber is waiting for the sword to fall on him.
He had been told that more than 40 hunters were interviewed during the investigation and he wonders if any other subscribers are in his situation and would be interested in sharing information and, perhaps, legal strategies and counsel should charges be pressed. If you were somehow caught up in the Loncarich debacle and wish to contact others in the same situation, please send us your contact information and we will forward it.

Never talk to the FEDS EVER without legal council. I mean EVER.

Jeff

Until he is formally charged with committing a crime in Zimbabwe AND the alleged offense is a crime in the USA, I doubt it.

kathi, do you mean this case:

"Aug 15 (Reuters) - A Colorado hunting outfitter accused of injuring mountain lions and bobcats to help clients kill them more easily pleaded guilty on Friday in a U.S. court in Denver to one felony count of conspiring to break a federal wildlife law, prosecutors said.

In a plea agreement struck with federal attorneys, Christopher Loncarich, 55, of Mack, Colorado, admitted to conspiring to violate the Lacey Act, which bans the transportation or sale across state lines of illegally gained wildlife, according to the U.S. Justice Department.

As part of the plea deal, Loncarich admitted he led a ring of professional hunters who shot, trapped and caged the wild cats to provide clients with phony fair chase hunts in Colorado and Utah from 2007 to 2010, prosecutors said in a statement.

Loncarich's hunting packages targeting mountain lions ranged in price from $3,500 to $7,500 and bobcat hunts cost between $700 and $1,500, U.S. attorneys said.

Nicholaus Rodgers of Shady Cove, Oregon, Loncarich's lead hunting guide, last month pleaded guilty to one count of conspiring to violate the Lacey Act for his part in the illegal big-game hunts, according to the Justice Department."

I had not heard of it but it seems pretty disgusting to me. Sorry I still don't understand. Let me re-phrase my question: Is it the responsibility of the client who books a hunt with an outfitter who assures him that he (the outfitter) has a permit and permission to hunt on the land (if applicable) to verify that these are true. Should he be doing due diligence? What constitutes proof in an African country? I used to frequent the African Hunting Forum and I do not remember these questions ever coming up as things that a client hunter should do. We seem to be dancing around extradition and "it's all Obama's fault" and the dirty rotten US Fish and Wildlife, when to me, the key issue is " of what is the client hunter guilty", whether under Zim law or US law. This to my mind applies to the Loncarich case as well as the "Cecil" case. So, my question to the subscriber you quoted is: "what sword"?
Peter

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:
Well Lane:

"In 2012, the last year before open enrollment through the ACA began, 45.6 million people nationwide, or 14.8% of Americans did not have health insurance. 24/7 Wall St. estimated that 28.6 million people, or 9.1% of Americans did not have health insurance as of March this year -- a decrease of roughly 17 million people or a drop of 5.7 percentage points. Based on the change in the rate of the uninsured population from 2012 through the first part of this year, the percentage of Kentucky’s population without health insurance declined by 10.4 percentage points, the largest improvement nationwide. Iowa, on the other end of the spectrum, had the most modest improvement, with its uninsured population shrinking by 1.7 percentage points"

"The number of unpaid medical bills is shrinking across the United States thanks to the Obama administration's Affordable Care Act. As more people sign up for private health insurance, and as more states expand Medicaid programs for low-income Americans, hospital companies are reporting lower expenses for charity and uncompensated expenses, a Forbes columnist noted Sunday."

I would call this an improvement, but I'm sure you would not. Could these numbers be better? Yes, I am sure they could if the Republicans had engaged in the debate instead of voting 54 times in the House to repeal it.
You are presumably an intelligent person, so, you know that despite the rhetoric from the right, ACA is here to stay. DONE!
But, I don't think this is a topic for the African Hunting Forum.
Peter

I just got my health insurance premiums for my employees for 2016: a 50% increase. I shit you not. In 2016 I will also have to pay a 40% "Cadillac tax" on single person plans in excess of 10K (that is basically any female and any middle aged male) or family plan in excess of 20K/year. One guy that I want to hire has two kids and a wife: 46K plus a 9600 tax for me on top.

UHC told me the costs went up because we have a non-compliant plan that as grandfathered.

"You can keep your current plan," Obama said. What he didn't say is that he was going to tax the hell out of you.

The middle class is getting crushed by the government's desire to "spread the wealth."

p live about 50 miles away from the poor guy and my dentist shares the same last name. being the kind soul i am i offered to loan him my life sized lion for an office display- he offed to pull my teeth in return

So, AZ, 17 million people now have health insurance which they did not have before, but your premiums went up, so let's sh-tcan the whole thing? Don't you think that some of your genius Republican representatives could have figured out a better plan? Why didn't they? Too busy saying NO to everything that Obama says "yes" to. Is that any way to run a country. Obviously you think so! I don't know how many employees you have but I can GUARANTEE you that Bank of America doesn't pay that. There is a very good reason why "Cadillac" plans are taxed. because that is what they are: premium plans for the top executives of companies while the peons get the shaft ie. low premium, high deductible, catastrophic only coverage. But hey, my employees have health care insurance!!!!
But, that's OK I guess.
Peter.

No way.
Democrats would never allow it. Election year Gents!!!!
Plus Zimbabwe is not a country we are friendly with in first place.
Zim politicians will just try to beat the drums so maybe they will get some kinda compensation from Obama.
They are dreaming...

Peter, you are just that, Peter Pan.
Holy shit man, you think like 15 year old child...

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:
So, AZ, 17 million people now have health insurance which they did not have before, but your premiums went up, so let's sh-tcan the whole thing? Don't you think that some of your genius Republican representatives could have figured out a better plan? Why din't they? Too busy saying NO to everything that Obama says "yes" to. Is that any way to run a country. Obviously you think so! I don't know how many employees you have but I can GUARANTEE you that Bank of America doesn't pay that. There is a very good reason why "Cadillac" plans are taxed. because that is what they are: premium plans for the top executives of companies while the peons get the shaft ie. low premium, high deductible, catastrophic only coverage. But hey, my employees have health care insurance!!!!
But, that's OK I guess.
Peter.

Peter:

I also have employees in Canada. Funny how it is easier to hire Canadians (and much cheaper) than US citizens. A lot less bureacracy, no quarterly filings, no state by state BS, etc. Is it any wonder that new business creation is the lowest in 50 years under Obama?


Now we have a situation where asset classes are at best fair valued (real estate, equities, debt, etc.) but since Obama can't seem to get wages up there, I can hire some pretty talented folks.

I know you love ObamaCare, but it is going to result in stagnant wages for years to come, since employee health care costs are sucking up the raises of the middle class.

My employees work their ass off, so why shouldn't I give them a Cadillac plan? I also contribute 20 percent of their salary to a retirement plan - a great way to reduce their taxes and let them build wealth.

PS: I love Obama. My net worth has gone up 5X since you voted for him. Thank you.

Numerous people have asked me why I pay the extra freight to hunt in Tanzania. Nothing will happen, they said. Nothing has happened, they said. I'm just paranoid they said.

I'll keep hunting in Tanzania, thank you very much.

Hey Lane, as far as things that have increased in America since 2008, I can think of several -- let's see, unemployment, racism, class division, riots -- riots are way up, the deficit. Probably a lot of other things are way up too, but one thing that is way down is the respect for our country and our citizens around the world, which translates into our safety.

Headed right behind Zimbabwe unless we get a major regime change, which means no (D)'s, forever and always, everywhere.

AnotherAZ, please tell us how much you pay for healthcare insurance for your Canadian employees.
As to:
"no state by state BS", do tell. Is this new with Obama? He created the states? I thought you guys were all for "less Federal government" and more states rights?
And:
"since Obama can't seem to get wages up there",
that's the job of the President???
Peter
BTW. My net worth has increased pretty well also!!

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:
AnotherAZ, please tell us how much you pay for healthcare insurance for your Canadian employees.
As to:
"no state by state BS", do tell. Is this new with Obama? He created the states? I thought you guys were all for "less Federal government" and more states rights?
Peter
BTW. My net worth has increased pretty well also!!

It is a lot less than the US; they "max out" social security a lot sooner than in the US as well. I don't know the exact cost because it is all one tax bill.

You are right, there was a lot of state BS, but Obama has done nothing to reduce it, but rather he has increased it.

So why is business formation so low under Obama? Under Obama, more businesses have been destroyed than have been created.

Here is what I love about higher marginal tax rates: I can hire people to run my businesses who will work their ass off. Under current tax rates I only work for 1/2 pay (if I hire a guy for $100 it only costs me $50 out of pocket at current tax rates) assuming he/she can do the same job. But you can hire some awfully hungry people and give them a great comp plan and they work their butts off. Viola, profit goes up for working less hard. I get to go hunting and fishing. Isn't that what you Democrats call a "win-win?"

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:
So, AZ, 17 million people now have health insurance which they did not have before, but your premiums went up, so let's sh-tcan the whole thing? Don't you think that some of your genius Republican representatives could have figured out a better plan? Why didn't they? Too busy saying NO to everything that Obama says "yes" to. Is that any way to run a country. Obviously you think so! I don't know how many employees you have but I can GUARANTEE you that Bank of America doesn't pay that. There is a very good reason why "Cadillac" plans are taxed. because that is what they are: premium plans for the top executives of companies while the peons get the shaft ie. low premium, high deductible, catastrophic only coverage. But hey, my employees have health care insurance!!!!
But, that's OK I guess.
Peter.

Peter,

I have not read all of your posts on this but on the ACA and cadillac plans you obviously know little. I am in healthcare and I can tell you there may be 17 million more insured but we are all paying more for the privilege. You talk about the republicans voting no all the time, maybe they were seeing the forest for the trees. I am 49 years old and my wife is 50. We do not need to be paying for maternity coverage or well baby care. But in order for a plan to be "compliant" under the ACA those are items which have to be included. Maybe they should have asked some of us that are actually involved daily in healthcare what was needed instead of just assuming they new. Guess what assuming does?

quote:

Originally posted by GAHUNTER:
Every commentator I've seen on TV says probably. They say it will strictly be a political decision by Obama administration, and that it's clear that Obama will take the path most liberal.

God I'm starting to hate what we've become since 2008!

I don't think there will be ample reason for an extradition. No matter who did what, the path of least resistance for the blame will be the Ph.

quote:

Originally posted by Kathi:
http://www.startribune.com/zim...-of-speed/320504802/



A senior Zimbabwean diplomat said Monday that his government will move quickly in requesting extradition for Eden Prairie big-game hunter Walter Palmer, who faces allegations that he illegally shot a much-loved research lion during a hunt last month.

Richard Chibuwe, deputy chief of mission at Zimbabwe’s embassy in Washington, D.C., said his nation’s top prosecutor and other officials “are keeping in touch with our authorities to see if we can bring some kind of speed to extradition. We are hoping that things will move with a bit of speed.”

The U.S. State Department declined to comment and said it does not discuss extradition requests. A spokesperson said that since Zimbabwe and the United States signed an extradition treaty in 2000, neither nation has extradited anyone to the other.

Unfortunately the US is being used as a pawn in an anti west smear campaign. Zim calls for extradition, which it knows full well is unreaslistic. The US refuses, and then theres a month long tirade about how the US is targeting Zim with its western imperialistic policies and its illegal sanctions.

I'm of the opinion that an extradition would ensure no American hunter ever sets foot in Zim again.

If i were in Palmer's shoes, and the U.S. (Obozo) decided to allow me to be extradited to Zim, I think I would renounce my citizenship and move to South America with whats left of the Nazi's.

Magistrate Lindiwe Maphosa ordered the trial to reconvene on September 28 to hear the case against Bronkhorst, who has been charged with "failing to prevent an illegal hunt".

Bronkhorst, who runs a safari company, denies any wrongdoing over the hunt in early July when Walter Palmer, a dentist from Minnesota, paid $55,000 (50,000 euros) to shoot the lion with a bow and arrow.

The hunt provoked worldwide outrage when it emerged that Cecil was a well-known attraction among visitors to the Hwange National Park and was wearing a tracking collar as part of an Oxford University research project.

"I feel sorry for my client (Palmer). He is a good man. He did nothing wrong," Bronkhorst told reporters as he left the court in Hwange town.

Palmer, an experienced trophy hunter, became the target of vicious abuse over the killing, and went into hiding after demonstrations outside his dental practice.

Palmer apologised for killing Cecil, who was renowned for his distinctive black mane, and appeared to blame Bronkhorst for misleading him.

But Bronkhorst said he was innocent of all charges and had obtained all the permits required to kill an elderly lion that was outside the national park boundaries.

quote:

Originally posted by lavaca:
Numerous people have asked me why I pay the extra freight to hunt in Tanzania. Nothing will happen, they said. Nothing has happened, they said. I'm just paranoid they said.

I'll keep hunting in Tanzania, thank you very much.

Hey Lane, as far as things that have increased in America since 2008, I can think of several -- let's see, unemployment, racism, class division, riots -- riots are way up, the deficit. Probably a lot of other things are way up too, but one thing that is way down is the respect for our country and our citizens around the world, which translates into our safety.

Headed right behind Zimbabwe unless we get a major regime change, which means no (D)'s, forever and always, everywhere.

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:
Well Lane:

"In 2012, the last year before open enrollment through the ACA began, 45.6 million people nationwide, or 14.8% of Americans did not have health insurance. 24/7 Wall St. estimated that 28.6 million people, or 9.1% of Americans did not have health insurance as of March this year -- a decrease of roughly 17 million people or a drop of 5.7 percentage points. Based on the change in the rate of the uninsured population from 2012 through the first part of this year, the percentage of Kentucky’s population without health insurance declined by 10.4 percentage points, the largest improvement nationwide. Iowa, on the other end of the spectrum, had the most modest improvement, with its uninsured population shrinking by 1.7 percentage points"

"The number of unpaid medical bills is shrinking across the United States thanks to the Obama administration's Affordable Care Act. As more people sign up for private health insurance, and as more states expand Medicaid programs for low-income Americans, hospital companies are reporting lower expenses for charity and uncompensated expenses, a Forbes columnist noted Sunday."

I would call this an improvement, but I'm sure you would not. Could these numbers be better? Yes, I am sure they could if the Republicans had engaged in the debate instead of voting 54 times in the House to repeal it.
You are presumably an intelligent person, so, you know that despite the rhetoric from the right, ACA is here to stay. DONE!
But, I don't think this is a topic for the African Hunting Forum.
Peter

All the while...my healthcare costs tripled and the cost my company pays for its employees tripled...therefore we are a smaller company than we were prior...adding to more unemployment...which when looked at in real terms is horrific. Socialism at work though. Next???

Zim was way down on my list of countries I'd like to hunt because of the land theft and Bobby Mugabe, but now it's off my list to hunt and on my list of places I'll never go.
I also just added the first person to another list: my ignore list. Even shootaway makes more sense than a socialist.