I have an elephant/croc hunt set up for May in Zimbabwe with Russ Broom. There will be the possibility of taking buffalo and hippo also. This is my first trip to Africa and I would like some recommendations from those who have gone before me. I have read most everything I can get my hands on, and I have been shooting African rifles for years dreaming of the day I could hunt elephant.

The rifle I am most comfortable with is a 9.3x64. It is the largest rifle which I feel comfortable shooting prone, is very accurate (5/8" to 1 1/4" groups at 100 yards depending on the bullet), has a detachable low power scope and iron sights (a shallow "v" and bead). I also have a 458 Lott which I can set up with either an aperture sight or a 1.5x5 Leupold. I shoot this rifle well, but would not want to take a shot at a croc lying down with it.

1. Should I bring one rifle (the 9.3x64) or two (the 9.3 and 458)?

2. If I take the 458 Lott it will be primarily for elephant...should I set it up with the aperture sights or the scope?

3. If I take two rifles do I have to choose which one I hunt with each day, or is it reasonable to expect one of the trackers to carry the second rifle for me?

Your insights are appreciated!

Take them both, and set the Lott up however you are most comfortable. The light rifle can stay on the truck or be carried by a tracker when you are chasing eles.

Russ Broom's outfit can give you their views on all this as well.

Gringo,

This is your safari and if you want to take both rifles everytime that you leave the truck that is perfectly alright. I would at least have a scope in quick detachable mounts available for the Lott just in case you need to press it into service for longer shots. You also might find you prefer it with the scope anyway.

Mark

Gringo, You should take both. What if you have a problem, back up rifle is nice to have. On my recent trip a tracker carried my 2cd rifle everyday. He even carried the heavy one

Gringo,

Take 2 rifles. It's always a good idea on Safari..you never know. The Lott would be perfect for Elephant, and you may also want to do your Buff with it as well. No such thing as too much rifle on a Buff, no matter what you're shooting. You're right about the Croc...head shots as they bob on the water are not for big rifles with heavy recoil. The one we just took in Mozambique was shot on the Zambezi at about 110 yards off sticks...the exposed head is not much of a target. If you go early enough (and May should be perfect), you stand a good chance of shooting one on the banks where they come up to sun, and get the body temperature up. Have fun...you'll be booking again!!!

I would be happy to only use the 9.3x64 but If it wasn't a problem to take two rifles then Take both.
More than likely I will do this next season with a 425WR and 9.3x62.
With the scope detached from the 9.3 I will be able to fit both rifles in a large single case.

gringo,

best to get a better group with the 9.3 x 64 if you want to take a croc. Your shot will most likely be 80-125 yards.

Check out Saeed's post....he has great shots on a croc.

the 9.3 x64 will do it all, however, if you are having trouble hitting the mark with solids and lead,....use the 9.3 for croc and plains game....the .458 lott on your elephant,buff, and hippo

Take both rifles with you every day. Put the in soft sided cases partially unzipped on the truck and then have one of the trackers carry your other one, as has been stated above.

quote:

best to get a better group with the 9.3 x 64 if you want to take a croc.

quote:

very accurate (5/8" to 1 1/4" groups at 100 yards depending on the bullet),

Better than what he has quoted??? LOL! His groups look dang good to me.

I am probably the wrong guy to ask, because on a long, full bag safari, I will take three rifles.

quote:

Originally posted by gringo_pistolero:
I have an elephant/croc hunt set up for May in Zimbabwe with Russ Broom. There will be the possibility of taking buffalo and hippo also. This is my first trip to Africa and I would like some recommendations from those who have gone before me. I have read most everything I can get my hands on, and I have been shooting African rifles for years dreaming of the day I could hunt elephant.

The rifle I am most comfortable with is a 9.3x64. It is the largest rifle which I feel comfortable shooting prone, is very accurate (5/8" to 1 1/4" groups at 100 yards depending on the bullet), has a detachable low power scope and iron sights (a shallow "v" and bead). I also have a 458 Lott which I can set up with either an aperture sight or a 1.5x5 Leupold. I shoot this rifle well, but would not want to take a shot at a croc lying down with it.

1. Should I bring one rifle (the 9.3x64) or two (the 9.3 and 458)?

2. If I take the 458 Lott it will be primarily for elephant...should I set it up with the aperture sights or the scope?

3. If I take two rifles do I have to choose which one I hunt with each day, or is it reasonable to expect one of the trackers to carry the second rifle for me?

Your insights are appreciated!

Gringo:

I took elephant, buffalo, hippo, and croc on a 14 day safari with Russ Broom in 2008. I suspect your PH will be Rory Muil and you are going to Binga District, charter from Vic Falls. Rory does most of their elephant work.

If so, excellent choice.

I took the first three with a .458 Winchester and the croc with a .300 Weatherby and 180 grain Partitions at about 100 yards. I also (stupidly) forgot to put a box of .458s in the glove box that day and killed the hippo with the .300 Wby after runnning out of .458 ammo.

Make sure to take both rifles. You will want the .458 for elephant and hippo. I might use the 9.3 for buffalo, if it's lighter, as my buffalo hunt was mostly walking. Crocs need accuracy. There are only two spots--the brain and the spine right behind the head--where a shot will prevent the dead croc from going in the water and becoming lost.

I used the 1.5-5X scope on the .458 for all hunting, keeping it set on 1.5X. When hunting elephant, I didn't even take the "light" rifle out of camp. You almost certainly will not see any crocs in the areas where there are elephant or buffalo.

As for hippo and croc, you will drive to and glass areas where you might find both. Be prepared to shoot a hippo or a crock. While looking for one, you might come across the other. Take both rifles in the truck. But when you find a target, you will stalk it on foot, sometimes for an hour or more, and I only took one rifle on this part. Coincidentally, I shot the hippo near the truck and near a native village. BTW: Be prepared to shoot a hippo or a crock. While looking for one, you might come across the other.

You are about to have a life changing experience. I envy you. One can only go on the first DG safari once. You've picked a great outfit. Give the trackers and Rory a large tip.

Feel free to PM me if you have any questions.

If I could go on safari and had a chance to hunt dangerous animals, large antelope (eland, and the like) and other smaller ones, I take my three rifles, one in 458 Lott caliber (for elephant, buffalo, etc. ...), the 375 H & H Magnum (for eland, cats, etc ...) and the 338 Winchester Magnum for hunting smaller antelopes.

Oscar.

Isn't it in Zimbabwe where the PHs send trackers out the night before to find a big croc and stuff an old fashioned alarm down its thoat so it'll be easy to find in the morning?

Indy, I would love to hear more about your hunt. Do you have a hunt report I can look up?


daleW, with 250gr Accubonds my rifle will shoot 1/2-5/8" groups consistently with me shooting prone. I e-mailed Nosler and their tech guy said this bullet was appropriate for croc. This is the most accurate rifle I currently own other than my 22lr. With the new Barnes X3 bullet I get 1-1,3/8" groups (the 250gr X bullets shoot better than the 285gr X bullets in my rifle), with 285 partitions 3/4-1" groups, and the Nosler solids 1" groups. These are all loads from Superior Ammo. I spoke with Larry at Superior and he said that the Accubonds/Ballistic Tips are consistently his most accurate hunting load, the X bullets some rifles like and some don't. Larry did not think I would get better accuracy by trying other bullets.


It sounds like everyone would recommend two rifles. I was not sure how much more difficult having two would be logistically, it doesn't seem like it's an issue.


In my readings I've seen experienced professionals state hunters should use iron sights only for elephant, and also that all client hunters should have a scoped rifle always. I know elephants are typically shot close and I would like the BEST setup for a successful hunt. Any more thoughts on the ele gun sight setup?

Thanks for the help.

Gringo and speaking from experience I always take two rifles my choices 375H&H and 450#2 double. Last heavy was a 458Lott. I do prefer the TXS bullets for croc and buf. They simply do massive destruction of flesh and bone. All of todays solids do work.
Just did some testing of Hornady solids via a red oak log 24 inches of straight line penetration and pass thru.
Hitting a croc in the head at 100yds with any of your loadings will work. To be creative on the range start shooting eggs laying on side around the size o crocs brain.

Mike
16 feet long 110 yd shot


Arrival at taxidermists

I am a big fan of Harris bipods - the sitting models. Usually not much use in Africa, but on crocs they are just the ticket. You keep talking about shooting prone - is that what Broom told you you would use? I find this sitting position very useful - and you won't have any problem hitting that egg at 100 yards.

Here is a story I wrote about the position. Note that I put the buttstock on my knee and use the sling to tighten everything up.

http://www.rifleshootermag.com...rs_benchrest_200809/

AZ, I have not had much of a chance to speak with Russ, I hope to spend some time with him at SCI in Reno. I shoot prone for accuracy testing as it is my most stable position. Most of my practice is done kneeling or off-hand.

quote:

In my readings I've seen experienced professionals state hunters should use iron sights only for elephant, and also that all client hunters should have a scoped rifle always. I know elephants are typically shot close and I would like the BEST setup for a successful hunt. Any more thoughts on the ele gun sight setup?

In my limited experience, I prefer open sights for elephant. If you are comfortable with open sights given the target and distance your PH suggests, then you should be good to go. Some people are more comfortable with a low-powered scope or may be hunting in an open-enough area for a long heart shot, and may want to go with the scope.

quote:

Originally posted by gringo_pistolero:
Indy, I would love to hear more about your hunt. Do you have a hunt report I can look up?


daleW, with 250gr Accubonds my rifle will shoot 1/2-5/8" groups consistently with me shooting prone. I e-mailed Nosler and their tech guy said this bullet was appropriate for croc. This is the most accurate rifle I currently own other than my 22lr. With the new Barnes X3 bullet I get 1-1,3/8" groups (the 250gr X bullets shoot better than the 285gr X bullets in my rifle), with 285 partitions 3/4-1" groups, and the Nosler solids 1" groups. These are all loads from Superior Ammo. I spoke with Larry at Superior and he said that the Accubonds/Ballistic Tips are consistently his most accurate hunting load, the X bullets some rifles like and some don't. Larry did not think I would get better accuracy by trying other bullets.


It sounds like everyone would recommend two rifles. I was not sure how much more difficult having two would be logistically, it doesn't seem like it's an issue.


In my readings I've seen experienced professionals state hunters should use iron sights only for elephant, and also that all client hunters should have a scoped rifle always. I know elephants are typically shot close and I would like the BEST setup for a successful hunt. Any more thoughts on the ele gun sight setup?

Thanks for the help.

I posted a hunting report on AR about October or so of 2008.

Indy, very nice Have you gotten any of your trophies back yet?

About calibres etc. I will not comment

ONE THING I WILL SAY

Do not expect your croc too be dead from one shot, shoot him again those bastards get up and walk away

quote:

Originally posted by gringo_pistolero:
Indy, very nice Have you gotten any of your trophies back yet?

Russ Broom knows how to do this. They all shipped out of Zim within four months. They spent a lot of time at the Carolina Fur Dressers and more at my taxidermist's. The elephant tusks are hanging on my wall and I've got a huge hippo skull for conversation. My buff will be ready in about two weeks and I'm still figuring out what to do with a 13.5 foot croc. Probably a rug.

When are you going?

quote:

I'm still figuring out what to do with a 13.5 foot croc. Probably a rug.

Yes, a rug with the full head on it.

Then for some added fun, smuggle it into your local golf club, and hide it in the bushes next to a lake. Then get yourself a pair of binoculars, and watch all the fun!

There is nothing as funny as seeing a golfer running screaming after he had thrown his gold club

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

I'm still figuring out what to do with a 13.5 foot croc. Probably a rug.

Yes, a rug with the full head on it.

Then for some added fun, smuggle it into your local golf club, and hide it in the bushes next to a lake. Then get yourself a pair of binoculars, and watch all the fun!

There is nothing as funny as seeing a golfer running screaming after he had thrown his gold club

I can imagine that scenario...

Saeed,

Is this experience speaking? Do tell.

Carl

quote:

To be creative on the range start shooting eggs laying on side around the size o crocs brain.

Mike: Eggs are okay to shoot but sometimes the gravel or energy of the bullet if strike next to the egg will cause the shell to break, giving the shooter a false sense of success. I prefer golf balls instead. The unfortunate temptation is to lift your head off your gun, to see what happens to the golf ball . That's not good because "peeking" is sometimes toxic to accuracy. I get up and recover the golf ball and inspect the hit marks.

Set the golf ball down with the manufacturer's name on top (i.e. Titleist, Nike) to get a feel how accurate your hit mark is. Sometimes when you hit it just right, it sails like a great tee shot. And yes it does make shooting practice real fun.

You might get some of the Boddington tapes produced by Dave Fulson as they cover your two interests. Call them and they will suggest choices. Practice every day mounting your rifle and gain ownership and muscle memory. Practice relosding fast with eye on the game. Follow thru and not make the American Admiration Shot.Use top quality ammo. Take both rifles as they will do nicely.Enjoy your adventure.
Elton Rambin