Well, I think I will just let that renewal notice sit on the counter for a while till this gets fleshed out a bit. If it ends up being as bad as we are discussing here, then I am done!

Are ya'll posolutlty, absotivly 100% without a doubt sure this isn't a late Aprils fool joke???

Hilarious!

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
May be the idiots running SCI need some of this treatment?

Nothing like competing with those for whom you supposedly advocate! SCI remains a joke and I am proud to have never given them a dime of my money.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
May be the idiots running SCI need some of this treatment?

On this issue I'd agree. SCI just like the NRA, sometimes I don't see eye to eye with things they say or decisions they make. I still am a life member of both.

Brett

A member suggested we ask the witch doctor to use a knobkerrie!

quote:

Originally posted by BrettAKSCI:

Well as of Thursday I'm president elect of the Alaska chapter. I tend to think this is a poor idea. I'll voice that and see what it gets me.

Brett

Congrats Brett !! They chose a good man for the job

When I left SCI (for a long laundry list of disagreements)I contacted DSC. Myself, nearly the entire BOD, to include 5 past Presidents inquired as to DSC taking on a Chapter business model. At the time, while interested, they decided it was not something they wanted to pursue at that time.

Perhaps now would be the time to catch "lightening in a Bottle."

Steve

If I had the time, I would work on an alternative. It would be a lot of work.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
If I had the time, I would work on an alternative. It would be a lot of work.

Morning Larry,

Like you, my life is busy. That's why I always thought volunteering time was a noble pusuit, we give time to something we believe in, even though we haven't the time. All it would take for me to re-engage is for DSC to adopt chapters. We, in Phoenix have the knowledge, people and commitment required to establish a successful chapter in short order. I think the risk here is, if nothing is done and no alternatives are offered, we risk losing the constant battle to live our lives and pursue our collective passion. This is a watershed moment for conservation.

Steve

Never belonged to SCI, not planning on it.

I worked with a company that made products for auctions for SCI, DU, NRA, RMEF, Turkey Fed, Pheas Forever, you name it. Most of the people are great, some do some good, but the business side is pathetic.

A not-uncommon scenario is:
-guy with deep pockets donates a pile to the group to hang out with the brass. While shooting game behind a high fence (sorry for the sarcasm) the new pals come up with "ideas" like this stupid one from SCI. Ergo: crap like this happens.

Some were particularly funny or egregious depending on where you're coming from.
One group started an annual series of gifts touting made in USA and switched to imported in year two to save a few bucks. Of course no mention of this to Joe Six Pack who buys the crap at auctions.
Another group that claims that they help public land hunters donated money to make improvements on a billionaire's ranch. I asked a high-profile member how they sleep at night pulling off crap like that. His answer didn't pass the laugh test.

Here's an idea for guys with time on their hands: start a new group that's a watch dog for the conservation groups. They might actually start doing what they're supposed to.

Maybe it would be good to hear from SCI;s Nelson Freeman on this issue if he is out there?? I would like to know from their side what EXACTLY their plans are. Not saying it's any different than what we have seen posted here, just wondering.

Larry Sellers
SCI(International)Life Member
Sabatti 'trash' Double Shooter
R8 Blaser
DRSS

I doubt Nelson is involved with this matter at all . He is involved with lobbying.

I am in direct contact with a board member . He assures me that this is being misinterpreted by the masses . He says they are working on correcting this perception . I also told him that based upon my current perception , I would never buy anything from SCI Outdoors.

There is a whole lot of activity going with the members . Hopefully this will get SCi's attention.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
He says they are working on correcting this perception.

Larry no dog in this fight, but from the outside looking in...looks like SCI/TOP BRASS had their plans failed miserably and now only want to TRY and cover up their tracks!!! This is insane!!! These guys are beyond embarrassment to put it mildly my friend!!!

They would never put anything out there that they did not CAREFULLY consider and WORD...But now they say the PERCEPTION is incorrect!!!

Sheesh!

They pull over the wools over the eyes and then...

Are we stupid???

Think not!!!

Yet I commend you on your efforts!

The original statement was:

"CEO Phil DeLone announced in recent executive meetings held in Washington D.C. that SCI has begun the process of starting a complete hunting and travel service out of Tucson AZ. SCI-Outdoors is the name and will have services such as hunting trips, airfare, tag services etc. They have hired Kirk Kelso as director to run SCI Outdoors".

Quite honestly, that strikes me as a very straightforward statement so I don't understand how people could misinterpret it....... I can however, understand how SCI might be having second thoughts and so they bloody well should!

Time will tell I guess.

quote:

Originally posted by Late-Bloomer:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
He says they are working on correcting this perception.

Larry no dog in this fight, but from the outside looking in...looks like SCI/TOP BRASS had their plans failed miserably and now only want to TRY and cover up their tracks!!! This is insane!!! These guys are beyond embarrassment to put it mildly my friend!!!

They would never put anything out there that they did not CAREFULLY consider and WORD...But now they say the PERCEPTION is incorrect!!!

Sheesh!

They pull over the wools over the eyes and then...

Are we stupid???

Think not!!!

Yet I commend you on your efforts!

All I am doing is conveying what I was told. I am not saying I agree at all. I do not view this favorably at all . Should SCI clarify these actions , I am willing to listen . I have yet or hear anything that changes my mind.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:

quote:

Originally posted by Late-Bloomer:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
He says they are working on correcting this perception.

Larry no dog in this fight, but from the outside looking in...looks like SCI/TOP BRASS had their plans failed miserably and now only want to TRY and cover up their tracks!!! This is insane!!! These guys are beyond embarrassment to put it mildly my friend!!!

They would never put anything out there that they did not CAREFULLY consider and WORD...But now they say the PERCEPTION is incorrect!!!

Sheesh!

They pull over the wools over the eyes and then...

Are we stupid???

Think not!!!

Yet I commend you on your efforts!

All I am doing is conveying what I was told. I am not saying I agree at all. I do not view this favorably at all . Should SCI clarify these actions , I am willing to listen . I have yet or hear anything that changes my mind.

I realize that SCI has already been tried, convicted and a rope is being rounded up, but I think I prefer to see how this settles out before passing judgment. If it is true, I am happy to join the mob since it seems to me to be a very ill-advised, ill-conceived action. On the other hand, perhaps the rumor mill is a little off base. Unlike many others on this thread who seem to have access to all the facts, I do not. So I will reserve judgment.

On the issue of a group picking up the SCI baton and carrying it forward, the logical choice of course would be DSC. That said, I have not been overwhelmed to say the least in DSC's response (or lack thereof) to the elephant importation ban. Frankly, at this point on that issue, if SCI had not engaged, I see no evidence that much of anything would have been done by hunting groups.

Now folks can grab another rope for me . . .

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:

quote:

Originally posted by Late-Bloomer:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
He says they are working on correcting this perception.

Larry no dog in this fight, but from the outside looking in...looks like SCI/TOP BRASS had their plans failed miserably and now only want to TRY and cover up their tracks!!! This is insane!!! These guys are beyond embarrassment to put it mildly my friend!!!

They would never put anything out there that they did not CAREFULLY consider and WORD...But now they say the PERCEPTION is incorrect!!!

Sheesh!

They pull over the wools over the eyes and then...

Are we stupid???

Think not!!!

Yet I commend you on your efforts!

All I am doing is conveying what I was told. I am not saying I agree at all. I do not view this favorably at all . Should SCI clarify these actions , I am willing to listen . I have yet or hear anything that changes my mind.

I realize that SCI has already been tried, convicted and a rope is being rounded up, but I think I prefer to see how this settles out before passing judgment. If it is true, I am happy to join the mob since it seems to me to be a very ill-advised, ill-conceived action. On the other hand, perhaps the rumor mill is a little off base. Unlike many others on this thread who seem to have access to all the facts, I do not. So I will reserve judgment.

On the issue of a group picking up the SCI baton and carrying it forward, the logical choice of course would be DSC. That said, I have not been overwhelmed to say the least in DSC's response (or lack thereof) to the elephant importation ban. Frankly, at this point on that issue, if SCI had not engaged, I see no evidence that much of anything would have been done by hunting groups.

Now folks can grab another rope for me . . .

Mike,

Looking back at what had happened to the polar bear issue, do you think SCI taking the action they did will be of any benefit at all?

From what I understand, the USF&W could not careless what others tell them they should do, they just do as they please.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:

quote:

Originally posted by Late-Bloomer:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
He says they are working on correcting this perception.

Larry no dog in this fight, but from the outside looking in...looks like SCI/TOP BRASS had their plans failed miserably and now only want to TRY and cover up their tracks!!! This is insane!!! These guys are beyond embarrassment to put it mildly my friend!!!

They would never put anything out there that they did not CAREFULLY consider and WORD...But now they say the PERCEPTION is incorrect!!!

Sheesh!

They pull over the wools over the eyes and then...

Are we stupid???

Think not!!!

Yet I commend you on your efforts!

All I am doing is conveying what I was told. I am not saying I agree at all. I do not view this favorably at all . Should SCI clarify these actions , I am willing to listen . I have yet or hear anything that changes my mind.

I realize that SCI has already been tried, convicted and a rope is being rounded up, but I think I prefer to see how this settles out before passing judgment. If it is true, I am happy to join the mob since it seems to me to be a very ill-advised, ill-conceived action. On the other hand, perhaps the rumor mill is a little off base. Unlike many others on this thread who seem to have access to all the facts, I do not. So I will reserve judgment.

On the issue of a group picking up the SCI baton and carrying it forward, the logical choice of course would be DSC. That said, I have not been overwhelmed to say the least in DSC's response (or lack thereof) to the elephant importation ban. Frankly, at this point on that issue, if SCI had not engaged, I see no evidence that much of anything would have been done by hunting groups.

Now folks can grab another rope for me . . .

Mike,

Looking back at what had happened to the polar bear issue, do you think SCI taking the action they did will be of any benefit at all?

From what I understand, the USF&W could not careless what others tell them they should do, they just do as they please.

So your suggestion is that no one should do anything? Trying spitting in one hand and wishing in the other and see which one fills up faster. As they say, hope is not a strategy.

Frankly I have no desire to waste my time debating this issue with you and others that have made their myopic views on SCI known ad nausem to date. Unless and until SCI clarifies its position I am done on this thread, please proceed to beat the mob into a lather, and grab an extra rope for me.

Lovely!

We know for a fact that taking legal action against USF&W did no good in court last time.

But now it will ha?

How about their action might have antagonized other actions being taken by others?

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I doubt Nelson is involved with this matter at all . He is involved with lobbying.

+1

Brett

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I am in direct contact with a board member . He assures me that this is being misinterpreted by the masses . He says they are working on correcting this perception .

Sounds like what they did with Obamacare. More time spent "selling" the idea than anything.

quote:

Originally posted by Wendell Reich:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I am in direct contact with a board member . He assures me that this is being misinterpreted by the masses . He says they are working on correcting this perception .

Sounds like what they did with Obamacare. More time spent "selling" the idea than anything.

I am not saying that I agree. Just relaying what I was told.

I have some other documents that I am seeking permission to post.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Lovely!

We know for a fact that taking legal action against USF&W did no good in court last time.

But now it will ha?

How about their action might have antagonized other actions being taken by others?

Sometime. Sometimes not. The polar bear was politically charged and unwinnable. The elephant I believe is more winnable......at least in Zimwabe.

Brett

As a relatively new SCI member (about 5 years now) the more I learn the less I like contributing to this organization. It is a similar problem in many of these so-called conservation organizations. It all ends up being about the leadership of the organization feathering their own nest. I dumped any involvement with RMEF and DU after getting first-hand exposure to their self-serving non-sense and now I am done with SCI as well.

I disagree with many of the comparisons to the NRA as I can at least see how the efforts of the NRA protect 2nd Amendment Rights. It appears that SCI is only protecting the privileged few!!

Well, I hate to say it abut I have hard evidence that some thing is badly wrong with this matter.

I have in my possession a letter from Craig Kaufman indicating that the SCI Board voted on this matter unanimously on 5/10. Maybe they did. I was not there . However, I did check the Arizona corporate records. SCI Outdoors, LLC was incorporated 4/14/14.

I am in a meeting at the moment with only my I phone. I am trying to get the AZ incorporation documents posted.

Opps, that's gonna be hard to cover up or put spin on.

As soon as I get permission, I will post the Kaufman letter.

It would be interesting to see what the SCI bylaws say about setting up a corporation prior to a vote of the BOD.

I don't remember what the Phoenix Chapter bylaws would have stated but, if any monies were spent, it had to be voted on, prior to an action.

This is gonna be worth two buckets, extra butter please.

Mr Jines;

What color rope would you like for the lynching?

Any neutral color will work. Very disappointing but I guess I should not be surprised. I will not renew my membership if SCI does not rethink this . . . not that my membership means that much to them.

Mike,
In all honesty, I feel badly for you and guys like you that really believe in SCI and their mission.

Imagine, if you will, the good that this organization could do with its reach and finances.

Too bad.

Regards,

Steve

This is sad
Thanks for posting Larry!!!

One bright spot in this whole mess is in the second to last paragraph of Kauffman's letter.

I would love to see the NRA become more aggressive in representing hunter's rights.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:

.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike70560:
One bright spot in this whole mess is in the second to last paragraph of Kauffman's letter.

I would love to see the NRA become more aggressive in representing hunter's rights.

They have something called (I think) the Hunters Leadership Forum. It is supposed to be involved in hunting rights and related issues.

I personally have never heard of NRA Outdoors. I checked their website. Click on big 5 hunting . They have exactly nothing .