Would be good for all involved http://www.mmegi.bw/index.php?aid=4495
Only time will tell the outcame

At times security forces find it confusing to detect the difference between gunshots made by poachers and those made by trophy hunters when they shoot wild animals. When there are no hunters we will not have that confusion and it will help us deal effectively with poachers,"

It has been proven in many areas in Africa the where there were hunting operations the poaching declined. Most hunting operations runs anti-poaching units during and after the hunting season.

The Botswana goverment granted gas exploration permits to a few companies and exploration will take place in vast areas of Botswana, they first denied it and last week they eventually admitted to it. I saw a program on a local TV station on Sunday that proved that the exploration have all ready started in certain areas.

What will be left of nature after the fracking was done and the surface water was poisoned by the pumped out "produce water". Most animals would have died of poisoning. What will happen to the Delta, there are not enough water available for fracking in Botswana unless they use the water from the Delta.

Where are the bunny hugging greenies now, more game will be destroyed by the process of fracking than what hunters will kill in the next 100 years.

Once they see what gas exploration is doing they will invite the hunters back, it might be too late then, as most of the habitat will be destroyed

The question is.......... is there any game left that would be of interest to hunt? The poachers pretty much wipe out everything.

Jaco,

Anti fracking folks fall in the same category as anti hunters---completely uninformed. We have been fracking here in Louisiana for years without any of the problems the antis fear. I'm not a drilling engineer but there are several on this site, ask one of them to explain it to you sometime. BTW, the income generated by oil revenue to the government might actually solve some of Africa's problems, if of course Africans would elect leadership that actually cared about its people.

Yes I am sure the fracking/drill crews and the thousands of miles of right-of-ways created for access to drill sights, pump stations, pressure stations and for pipelines, haul roads, etc. will have no affect on the area and the game population.

I have lived in oil and gas country in Alberta and I know it improved the hunting and trophy quality there immensely……….. plus all of the activity added to the overall wilderness experience.

It may help the local economy, but it will not help the wild places. And, if it is Asian companies involved (which I do not know) I am sure the Botswana areas involved will end up being shining jewels of wildlife conservation.

quote:

Originally posted by BEGNO:
Jaco,

Anti fracking folks fall in the same category as anti hunters---completely uninformed. We have been fracking here in Louisiana for years without any of the problems the antis fear. I'm not a drilling engineer but there are several on this site, ask one of them to explain it to you sometime. BTW, the income generated by oil revenue to the government might actually solve some of Africa's problems, if of course Africans would elect leadership that actually cared about its people.

There's no oil, gas, diamonds or gold that will better the life of impoverished Africans; the poor will remain poor and the educated rich will get richer.

One needs to remember that its the ignorant masses that elect their leadership through brainwashing and false promises.

Nigeria has oil .... and plenty of it....need I say more.

I won't even bother with diamonds, gold and gas!

good news.

quote:

Originally posted by BEGNO:
Anti fracking folks fall in the same category as anti hunters---completely uninformed. We have been fracking here in Louisiana for years without any of the problems the antis fear. I'm not a drilling engineer but there are several on this site, ask one of them to explain it to you sometime. BTW, the income generated by oil revenue to the government might actually solve some of Africa's problems, if of course Africans would elect leadership that actually cared about its people.

In Ohio fracking has been linked to some earthquates. In Pennsylvania, the initially enthusiastic have become a lot less enthusiastic when they had to deal with traffic issues. Then there was the National Geographic issue that showed water in a kitchen sink lit on fire.

Personally, I would rather have good water and stable ground than gas.

quote:

Originally posted by BEGNO:
Jaco,

Anti fracking folks fall in the same category as anti hunters---completely uninformed. We have been fracking here in Louisiana for years without any of the problems the antis fear. I'm not a drilling engineer but there are several on this site, ask one of them to explain it to you sometime. BTW, the income generated by oil revenue to the government might actually solve some of Africa's problems, if of course Africans would elect leadership that actually cared about its people.

I do have to differ with you. I have seen the damage mining has done in RSA with poisonous water that is pumped out of coal mines, gold mines etc. All this water finds it way to the groundwater and poisen the whole underground aquafer, it poisons the wetlands and the river systems. All tipes of exploitation leaves a trail of disaster, maybe not now but in the years to come definately.

I do not know the topograghy, geology, habitat or water supply in Louisiana, but I have a reasonable good idea of what it is in the Karoo and in the Kalahari desert. Water is in very low supply and fracking needs a lot of it. There will be water polution, dust polution and noise polution.

I have listened to lots of interviews with people who is pro fracking and every one of them tried their best to side step some of the questions, WHY? because the know the real treats. Any African goverment will sell their souls for more money, its the greed factor causing Africa to be what it is today. They do not care bollocks for their people, the only ones that count is the connected people and family. It will only fill their personal coffers. Go look at what is busy happening in Mozambique, what is the real issue with Renamo at the moment........Renamo wants a share of the riches in the gas fields, but who is controlling it?

I am much more informed than what you might think, what they are planning is a disaster in the waiting.

quote:

Originally posted by Grumulkin:

quote:

Originally posted by BEGNO:
Anti fracking folks fall in the same category as anti hunters---completely uninformed. We have been fracking here in Louisiana for years without any of the problems the antis fear. I'm not a drilling engineer but there are several on this site, ask one of them to explain it to you sometime. BTW, the income generated by oil revenue to the government might actually solve some of Africa's problems, if of course Africans would elect leadership that actually cared about its people.

In Ohio fracking has been linked to some earthquates. In Pennsylvania, the initially enthusiastic have become a lot less enthusiastic when they had to deal with traffic issues. Then there was the National Geographic issue that showed water in a kitchen sink lit on fire.

Personally, I would rather have good water and stable ground than gas.

quote:

Originally posted by fujotupu:

quote:

Originally posted by BEGNO:
Jaco,

Anti fracking folks fall in the same category as anti hunters---completely uninformed. We have been fracking here in Louisiana for years without any of the problems the antis fear. I'm not a drilling engineer but there are several on this site, ask one of them to explain it to you sometime. BTW, the income generated by oil revenue to the government might actually solve some of Africa's problems, if of course Africans would elect leadership that actually cared about its people.

There's no oil, gas, diamonds or gold that will better the life of impoverished Africans; the poor will remain poor and the educated rich will get richer.

One needs to remember that its the ignorant masses that elect their leadership through brainwashing and false promises.

Nigeria has oil .... and plenty of it....need I say more.

I won't even bother with diamonds, gold and gas!

Mining operations and drilling for oil are two completely different things.

I agree that natural resources in Africa are squandered but don't blame fracking.

Natural gas occurs naturally in some places at ground water levels and can be ignited. That is not fracking's fault.

Linked (blamed you mean) to earthquakes--really--how about volcano eruptions while we are at it. Again, talk to the drilling engineers who have mastered the process, get it straight.

Botswana may end up with no animals but it won't be fracking's fault is my only point here.

Cheers,

I agree with Fujo, unfortunately.

As for fracking there is no reliable scientific proof that it results in any adverse effects. The studies I've seen linking earthquakes deal with injection wells, and frankly, I think the "science" is suspect.

Shell is involved with intended fracking here. Their record in Nigeria is disturbing enough without the fact that they appear to have got into bed with the ruling thieves here and all the bullshit that has come with wedding speeches, then concern does not even begin to cover it.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Is This What It Is Going To Be Like In Botswana?

Saeed. those are the images the antis should be showing and railing against.

quote:

Originally posted by SteveGl:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Is This What It Is Going To Be Like In Botswana?

Saeed. those are the images the antis should be showing and railing against.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Is This What It Is Going To Be Like In Botswana?

Look at that pollution & imagine what a similar thing could do to an area such as the Delta & it's surrounds. Then imagine the money someone must/might have copped to ban hunting & get the hunting companies out to stop them blowing the gaffe on what could have happened & could still happen.

Still, it's a good job Botswana is the least corrupt country in Africa as that article claimed!

I seem to remember Naki lecturing me on the same point a while ago as well...

quote:

Originally posted by Skyline:
Yes I am sure the fracking/drill crews and the thousands of miles of right-of-ways created for access to drill sights, pump stations, pressure stations and for pipelines, haul roads, etc. will have no affect on the area and the game population.

I have lived in oil and gas country in Alberta and I know it improved the hunting and trophy quality there immensely……….. plus all of the activity added to the overall wilderness experience.

It may help the local economy, but it will not help the wild places. And, if it is Asian companies involved (which I do not know) I am sure the Botswana areas involved will end up being shining jewels of wildlife conservation.

There are MORE Caribou in the Alpine herd of the North Slope since oil development than before. But we have game management in Alaska. The Caribou take refuse on drill pads in the summer to avoid insects and rub their fur on the Pipeline.

If Bot's allows road access those roads will bring poachers that will be a threat there far more than any fracking.

quote:

Originally posted by Grumulkin:

quote:

Originally posted by BEGNO:
Anti fracking folks fall in the same category as anti hunters---completely uninformed. We have been fracking here in Louisiana for years without any of the problems the antis fear. I'm not a drilling engineer but there are several on this site, ask one of them to explain it to you sometime. BTW, the income generated by oil revenue to the government might actually solve some of Africa's problems, if of course Africans would elect leadership that actually cared about its people.

In Ohio fracking has been linked to some earthquates. In Pennsylvania, the initially enthusiastic have become a lot less enthusiastic when they had to deal with traffic issues. Then there was the National Geographic issue that showed water in a kitchen sink lit on fire.

Personally, I would rather have good water and stable ground than gas.

The same people that brought you the Joubert's Lion disinformation campaign.

Saeed:
Those pictures are mighty troublesome to see no matter where that destruction happened. Everytime a new area is mentioned these need to be posted long, hard and often.

IF I or "WE" had any influence we should insist not one more hole is drilled by those companies anywhere until every damned bit of that mess is cleaned up and restored.
"Talk about pissing agin the wind!"

Here in Colorado, south of me 90 miles at Trinidad. They've been fracking a few yrs. Lots of wells contaminated, several earthquakes the last few yrs as well. I believe it was Evergreen Resources doing the drilling and building pipelines all over the area. Last I heard they were being shut down and mostly run out of the area. Lots of nasty articles about it in the local papers about how bad things have become down there.

Up NE of Denver there's a bunch of it going on too. Lots of hassles but, I don't know the details as that's out of our local area so the local papers don't write much about up there. I'd bet much could be learned from the Denver Post about it with a decent search.

Thanks for sharing these links and pictures. I'm much more educated about it after seeing this.

No matter where something is undertaken, accidents and spills WILL HAPPEN, count on it.

George

I got this from Allan Bunn's FB page

Here are some excellent comments on the motives behind the hunting ban in Botswana by Dr. Clay Wilson, a respected veterinary surgeon and an honorary warden at Chobe National Park.

~ Alan

Unbelievable turn of events by Minister of Wildlife TK Khama brother to the president of Botswana.

I personally know this man and I would trust a snake oil salesman before I would him and he had no knowledge of whatsoever of how to manage the country's wildlife.

I have screamed it 1000 times, trying to make people aware that Botswana had HALF of the entire population of wild elephants in the world. They are in this mans and his brothers hands.

In November it was perceived as great news that Botswana was going to ban trophy hunting. everyone was n the bandwagon congratulating Botswana for its excellent commitment to saving its wildlife and its outstanding knowledge and management in this field. A fact is that I worked with DWNP for 5 years and their management is extremely poor and unorganized, the wardens have no passion for the job and that's what it is for most of them, just a salary. They don't even have money to buy a spotlight to carry on their vehicles that are mostly run down in any case.
I can summarize this point in that in the 30 years I have been visiting Chobe not once have I ever seen a park warden patrolling in the park. Once they collect your money at the gate there is never a presence. Case closed.

Back to hunting by which by the way I am totally neutral on as there are so many cons and pros. When the ban was discussed I read between the lines and had inside information as to what was really happening. They were to stop hunting to remove the "eyes" from the remote areas so the Government can go in there in January and kill 70 to 80 thousand elephants for their own profit. Of course after that has happened then I predicted that they would start hunting back again. No one seemed to care or understand what I have been trying to expose.

Of course there has been countless discussions and arguments about this decision which I will not delve into as its well documented. Of course the Botswana government has no problem with unnecessarily slaughtering its cattle as an excuse to fight foot and Mouth did disease that has been around for millennia ( something fishy there), they have no problem alienating their own people the Bushmen of the Kalahari as their land had diamonds and now they are using an extreme method of harvesting natural gas called Fracking, no one complains that the president builds his own airstrip and palatial country house getting land appropriated illegally and that they can deport or just simply murder someone if they have a different opinion . The list can go on. Botswana is rapidly turning into a police state. It sickens me that the world will just stand by and let it happen as it did in Rwanda, Sierra Leone, the Congo etc., etc., etc.

So back to this article on Tshekedi Khama. It appears that they have stepped on their own tail again and he let the cat out of the bag to soon.
My main concern is the elephant population which I still believe is going to be slaughtered in January if it has not already done so. How can I stop it?

Tshekedi Khama is not the sharpest knife in the drawer. Differentiating gunshots from hunters and poaching?? Come on Tshekedi. They will just resort to poisoned arrows, poisoning the water holes and poisoning the carcasses so that all vultures will die so they cannot spot a carcass, never mind all the other animals that will eat of the poached meat that is left to rot and is such a waste.

I'm so disgusted I had to vent.

It's all too obvious why am I the only one exposing this?? As usual it will be conversation and not conservation and the elephants will be shot and trophy hunting will be back.