In an effort as not to turn the tragic news thread sideways, I just felt compelled to ask;

What if the client had not stopped to rest?

I demand that I stay fit for many reasons, this is but one.

As you were.

Steve

It is not my place to explain, but you are all three way out of line and completely incorrect in your supposition. Hopefully the facts will emerge.

Steve, leave this alone.

quote:

Originally posted by LionHunter:
It is not my place to explain, but you are all three way out of line and completely incorrect in your supposition. Hopefully the facts will emerge.

Steve, leave this alone.

"as the client stayed with the game scout to rest"

Copied and pasted direct from Dave Fulson. Not supposition.

quote:

Originally posted by LionHunter:
It is not my place to explain, but you are all three way out of line and completely incorrect in your supposition. Hopefully the facts will emerge.

Steve, leave this alone.

Well said.

Steve,

I suggested once you leave this alone. I had hoped you would consider my advice to be based upon more knowledge of the incident than has been published. But you continue as you please and we will accept your apology at a later date.

There are many reasons to "rest", and not all of them have to do with the state of ones physical conditioning.

quote:

Originally posted by LionHunter:
It is not my place to explain, but you are all three way out of line and completely incorrect in your supposition. Hopefully the facts will emerge.

Steve, leave this alone.

Precisely!

So now one has to be a marathon runner to hunt??

Or may be the client should never have gone hunting in the first place?

Or the PH should never have picked elephant hunting as choice of animal to hunt?

The possibilities are endless, but, knowing how Steve has behaved in the past, it is hard to expect anything positive to come from him!

Why can't we simply take a little time to mourn and celebrate the legacy of a great professional hunter. There will be plenty of time for the inevitable second guessing, recriminations and armchair quarterbacking that some on this site find irresistible.

My fondest memory of Gibbo will be his big smile with his front teeth biting his bottom lip. C'mon fellows, let's give this one a little time.

Is this the guy that says he does 400 push ups a day or some such nonsense, or is that some other ass on here? Shut the f up. Sorry I clicked on this sorry thread.

Some things have no taste and some are tasteless.

Seems some people can't read and understand, some can.

Larry Sellers
SCI(International)Life Member
R8 Blaser

What if they had stopped 15 minutes earlier? Or an hour later? Or had to pick a thorn out of their eye?

I am sure that there are a lot of people that feel upset about this event. But there are LOTS of things that can happen out there everyday.

You would think men that participate and share in the same sport should be more compassionate in difficult times.

Steve
I have enjoyed many of your posts. Some I agree with and some I don't. This one, I don't agree with.
Ian could have "rested" with the client.
He chose to go and look.
Please, let him rest in peace........
The client was not at fault, Ian waited too long to shoot or made a wrong shot.
We don't have the absolute facts.
Please leave it be....
Please

Ok,
I get it. My apologies to all involved. The facts looked clear to me. I guess they are not.

I can admit when I've made a mistake.

Steve

Thanks Steve.

Just when I thought KPete would have to come out of hiding to bring positive thoughts and words to this thread. Speaking of, where is the well spoken wise man? Did he tire of the BS?

A good man that can see his mistake.
Perhaps in good taste this posting could be shut down?

Mike, you are very correct and Steve, we don't know the facts. I think we should wait for them.

Guys,
Please leave this one alone!!! Moderators, maybe delete the thread as suggested. A little respect for this tragedy please .

Nick

Oh, no, another 'I am more holy than you' post.

The information I received indicated the client was an amputee (leg) who was giving it his all. If that is indeed the case, we may want to give him a bit of slack.

quote:

Originally posted by subsailor74:
The information I received indicated the client was an amputee (leg) who was giving it his all. If that is indeed the case, we may want to give him a bit of slack.

Actually, it really makes no difference what the client condition is.

It is his hunt, and he and his professional hunter can decide how to hunt.

It is no business of anyone sitting thousands of miles away and criticizing!

Saeed,

As always, you are a voice of reason.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by subsailor74:
The information I received indicated the client was an amputee (leg) who was giving it his all. If that is indeed the case, we may want to give him a bit of slack.

Actually, it really makes no difference what the client condition is.

It is his hunt, and he and his professional hunter can decide how to hunt.

It is no business of anyone sitting thousands of miles away and criticizing!

thank you Saeed

I have to admit that my first thought was the same as Steve's then I thought about it. There could be a lot of legitimate reasons for a "rest." I wasn't there, I am not going to criticize.

I have made up my mind on one thing. The hell with yelling at these elephants. Inside of 25 yards, I am shooting if they are headed my way. As one of my friends said last night. There is one of me. There is one of him. There was one Gibbo. There are lots of disposable elephants. That is what checkbooks are for.

Horrible situation.

quote:

Originally posted by Jerry Huffaker:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by subsailor74:
The information I received indicated the client was an amputee (leg) who was giving it his all. If that is indeed the case, we may want to give him a bit of slack.

Actually, it really makes no difference what the client condition is.

It is his hunt, and he and his professional hunter can decide how to hunt.

It is no business of anyone sitting thousands of miles away and criticizing!

thank you Saeed

Yes x2 Thank you Saeed. Bad things do just happen.

quote:

Originally posted by subsailor74:
The information I received indicated the client was an amputee (leg) who was giving it his all. If that is indeed the case, we may want to give him a bit of slack.

Thank you subsailor74 for posting this. It reminded me that Ian talked about this bull of a man that has mountain hunted on crutches. Ian was excited and looking forward to taking this man on a hunt, if, in fact, this is the same client. Whoever he is, he's been through a traumatic experience also and deserves our prayers and respect.

I've been there
We decided we will take a break in the middle of hot day and then PH said " I'm gonna look around"
This can happen to anyone
Thing is, PH's wait in moments of trouble with elephants for several reasons, but the biggest reason Id assume is Game dept could nail them if they deem " it wasn't close enough "
Terrible tragedy and of course simply an accident

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I have to admit that my first thought was the same as Steve's then I thought about it. There could be a lot of legitimate reasons for a "rest." I wasn't there, I am not going to criticize.

I have made up my mind on one thing. The hell with yelling at these elephants. Inside of 25 yards, I am shooting if they are headed my way. As one of my friends said last night. There is one of me. There is one of him. There was one Gibbo. There are lots of disposable elephants. That is what checkbooks are for.

Horrible situation.

Damn Straight. Sue me. Bill me. What ever. I am going down shooting. What gets me is a sustained charge that started at over 50 yards. that is one determined bull. Just awful. I am sure the client is sick with woulda, coulda, shoulda and doesn't need any back seat speculation from here.

Jeff

quote:

Originally posted by Jerry Huffaker:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by subsailor74:
The information I received indicated the client was an amputee (leg) who was giving it his all. If that is indeed the case, we may want to give him a bit of slack.

Actually, it really makes no difference what the client condition is.

It is his hunt, and he and his professional hunter can decide how to hunt.

It is no business of anyone sitting thousands of miles away and criticizing!

thank you Saeed

Agreed. Thanks.

on almost every single hunt where a large amount of walking was involved one stops to rest , if not to rest , simply to take a little time and assess - at times the PH will go a little further and look - no harm or foul in that -

i wasn't there but i will say that from the facts that we have seen nobody is at fault for taking a rest - gibbo had more experience than almost anyone i know after several decades of big game hunting and certainly one of the toughest people i know - he could walk anyone into the ground and so far be it for us to judge wether he should have or should not have taken a break - stuff happens and when it does its tragic - we have lost a great man -

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by subsailor74:
The information I received indicated the client was an amputee (leg) who was giving it his all. If that is indeed the case, we may want to give him a bit of slack.

Actually, it really makes no difference what the client condition is.

It is his hunt, and he and his professional hunter can decide how to hunt.

It is no business of anyone sitting thousands of miles away and criticizing!

Tell me, Saeed, how come you don't follow your own advise when it comes to Mark Sullivan? I stopped counting after 300+ negative posts of yours. If a PH and a client agree to hunt and you're sitting thousands of miles away and criticizing…. well, you get my point.
Cheers,
Cal

Just a thought. When I spoke with Jim about his recent elephant hunt he was describing 100 degree plus heat. Some people don't handle heat well no matter how young, old, in shape, or out of shape they are. Just ask an Alaskan in 100 plus degree heat! Also there are so many factors like dehydration. Perhaps the hunter stopped to hydrate and Ian asked him to stay while he moved up ahead to check. I have no point other than who knows? Not me.

Brett

quote:

Reply

Men
This will be the final word. This was NOT the fault of the client, in ANY WAY. He is a good man and hunter. Gibbo called the rest. Please do not turn this into something it was not. The client is devastated. Please let this die right here.

And when was it decided it is the responsibility of a client to save a PH?

quote:

Originally posted by BrettAKSCI:
Just a thought. When I spoke with Jim about his recent elephant hunt he was describing 100 degree plus heat. Some people don't handle heat well no matter how young, old, in shape, or out of shape they are. Just ask an Alaskan in 100 plus degree heat! Also there are so many factors like dehydration. Perhaps the hunter stopped to hydrate and Ian asked him to stay while he moved up ahead to check. I have no point other than who knows? Not me.

Brett

I now have traditional tracking Elephant hunt experience of one trip. We tracked one Bull in musth on three different attempts. He mixed with cow herds when he was not beating feet down elephant trails and not resting to eat.

Both Joyce and I are in representative good shape for elders of 61 and yes the heat was tough on us. None of those facts matter when the bull mixes in with cows and the trackers and PH have to sort out the track. This many times took 10 minutes or more.

Buzz told us even before we set foot into the Jesse that any opportunity to find shade and sit while tracks are sorted out is the norm. Take advantage of the break. We did!! Buzz, Cryton, or Nyati could easily have gotten into trouble far away from my line of sight and vice versa.

It's dangerous game hunting and there is no fault to be placed.

I was at Buzz's house when this news first hit AR. I can tell you the CMS team was devastated and over dinner you heard tales of past close encounters by all.

Everyone on our team had been hit in the past at one time or another by Elephants. Cryton's pelvis was crushed. Cement, our game scout, had a tusk driven through him and survived. Buzz was knocked off a river bank with a trunk. These guys all still hunt Elephant knowing that danger.

Anyone who steps foot into the wilds of Africa is taking a chance.

My .02
Jim

It will take a new record for a low life to put the blame of what had happened here on any one.

Hunting IS dangerous, and despite all the precautions one takes, things do not go according to plan.

All of us, clients and professionals, participate in this knowing full well that someone undesirable might happen at any moment.

Anyone who does not believe this better stay home.

And that is not going to stop him dying either!

This is a tragedy, we can all agree. Obviously, all of our thoughts and prayers are directed to Ian, his family, and his close friends. However, I thought Ivan's comment was very appropriate.

Anonymous or not, Ian was a jolly fellow as I saw on the show. I will only say pray for his family, but if you can't, please visit: http://dscfrontlinefoundation.org

quote:

Originally posted by ivan carter:
i wasn't there but i will say that from the facts that we have seen nobody is at fault for taking a rest - gibbo had more experience than almost anyone i know after several decades of big game hunting and certainly one of the toughest people i know - he could walk anyone into the ground and so far be it for us to judge wether he should have or should not have taken a break - stuff happens and when it does its tragic - we have lost a great man -

I hunted with Gibbo when I was 32 years old and my brother was 30. He walked my brother not only into the ground but into his tent to "rest" for the afternoon. I wasn't far behind but my 38" inseam saved me (poor little brother has short little legs - typical Welshman). If I can he half as tough as Gibbo when I'm his age I'll be a happy man. He was a legend.

May I ask what has the client and the Gov man resting have to do with Ian getting run down by a bull elephant in musk when his first shot failed to stop him?

It's easy to quarterback a game when it is over from a report which may or may not be accurate.

Ian Gibson was a very capable PH but he was not superman. It seems only those on computers are the ones who wouldn't have made his misplaced shot that failed to stop the charge in time!
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