This is the skull of a cow Elephant a customer of mine shot. They were in a herd trying to shoot a bull when then cow got tired of them being around and charged full tilt. They were on a very steep hill and the elephant was coming down hill. They fired several shots into the body and head. Four of them hit the head, as you can see one shot hit where the tusk would be, two and three hit in the center of the head and the fourth shot blew off the cheek bone. The back of the skull shows where the two center shots exited. None of these hit the brain. She finally dropped at 5 yds with both PH and hunter with empty magazines.

Neato, but what did cause her to drop then?

Ann,

It looks like one of the body shots might have done enough damage in the heart or lungs to kill her.

Jerry,

How much does that skull weigh as is?

George

More proof that talk is cheap.

At that angle, they would have had to shoot quite low on the head (trunk), although it would appear that penetration was not a problem.



Jerry, did the bullets that exited the rear of the skull exit above the brain? I'm trying to imagine the 3D image.



Do you happen to know what caliber and bullet they were using?



Thanks for posting!

At what angle? How do you know what angle it was?

I am sure this situation would have been resolved in one shot by a Marlin using cast lead bullets.

Out of curiousity, how do you handle "trophy" charges and licenses for something like this? I'm curious what this cost the client besides 4 rounds of ammo and a new pair of shorts.

Brent

My friend David Guitar sent me a video called "Death by Double Rifle". In this video a cow elephant charges a hunter and his PH. They are backing away and shouting trying to get the elephant to turn. Finally the PH ends the matter with a frontal shot. One of the most dramatic videos that I have seen. Nothing staged, no wounded animal, just a cow elephant who was tried of men being too close! The range looked like just feet when she went down!

Like someone once said here, "No such thing as too much gun!"

Bill, they are on a steep hill, elephant coming down towards the men, with head assumed not looking down at the ground. So if that is not correct, then let's hear it. After all, you are the expert, so how about enlightening us with your wisdom instead of your continual barrage of cute one-liners.

Since there is so much interest in the skull, how about the particulars; what rifles and calibers were used? I think that would be relevant to this thread.

Bill,



Nothing personal. I have no idea what the attitude of the cow's head was, and have no idea how to determine it from the photos given. Unless there are photos of the exit holes, so a guess can be made of the paths, who would know?



BUT, if I had to guess it would appear that the cow had her head fairly level in relation to the guns, as the cheek bone would probably have not been blown away as it was if it had been hit other than straight on.



Here is some more stuff to hate me for:



1) It is hysterical to me to hear this stuff about the PH protecting the client (which is witnessed by this story, though the cow finally bit the dust just in time).



2) John Taylor was right. A shot close to the brain will drop any elephant (but one never knows how close is close). This is especially true with cows, though in my experience they are down for only a second ot two at most.



3) Talk is cheap about dropping charging elephants with a brain shot. I have failed on two attempts. My hat is off to the PH's or whoever that can and do pull off that shot.



Here is some cheap talk on my part, since my credibility has come into question and possibly suspect: If the cow indeed had her head pretty much level, aim about a inch or so above a line between the eyes, and pray like hell!

Bill, now that's more like it!

You must be referring to the article about the heavy cast bullet that killed both a bull and cow buffalo. If you read a little more about loads etc. you will know that what a round can do, and what a round will usually do are often VERY different. You are correct that the bullet could cause the stoppage of differences with said elephant. BUT a larger/ higher energy round has more room for error, and in that instance, where an animal the size of a school bus decides that it wants to make you its new pincushion, you I'm sure you'd appreciate as much stopping power as possible.
Not to say that we should all borrow Saeed's .577, but there's nothing wrong with taking more gun than you'd ever think you'd need. Stopping the long nose in a charge can be quite an undertaking. I guess what I'm trying to convey, which is only my humble opinion, is that while penetration is great, force, size and location are equally, if not more important.

Bill,

When you get old and senile like me, it would help to look at the photos again before shooting off ones mouth. Indeed, there are photos of some exit holes.

From the exit holes it re-affirms my belief that the head was farily level, as the entrance and exit holes, from what I can tell are too high or too wide to hit the brain. But, hell, I wasn't there. But that would never stop me.

No problem Bill, I'm just trying to gather as much info as I can before it's more turn to put up, or, well I'd rather not think about that. And one can learn from other's successes, or mistakes. And you are absolutely right, even the best PH has a bad day now and then.

So Jerry, what do the forensics say? And what did it cost to have the skull shipped to the States???

The guns used must surely have been .375s as we all know on this forum that such minimum DG calibers only wound.

BillC,
Don't know about you but this works me up into a lather just thinking about eles in the bush in Zim later this year! When are you leaving? Are you making the hunt with Buzz this month?
Russell

Gentlemen



Very interesting pictures



I have read a stack of articles books etc. regarding calibers and elephant hunting. Some of you have been fortunate to hunt elephant(s). Which are the critical spots to shot at body and head. It would be great if great if anyone shared their experience. What caliber did you use, bullets etc.



Don't be shy



/ JOHAN

Surprizingly the skull only weighs 38lbs, I can easily pick it up with one hand. It doesn't weigh as much as a Cape Buffalo cape does so it shouldn't add to much cost to the freight to have one shipped back with the rest of your trophies. It was a very large cow according to the PH. The calibers used were .458 WM and .375 H&H. Her head must have been turned slightly because the bullets that entered the front center exited slightly off to the side in the back of the skull. The wound channels missed the brain to the side. Here are a couple of pictures of the wound channels. I couldn't get the stick to go straight through the bottom hole, apparently the bullet turn inside the head.

If an elephant is coming at you down a fairly steep slope, you will have a tendency to shoot high, because the closer he or she gets the steeper the angle gets and the lower you need to aim, each step the elephant makes changes the angle of the shot.

My suggestion is just point beteen the tusks entrance and hope the brain moves down and gets in the way of the bullet You might be surprised how well that works!!

There is no such thing as a stright on level shot at an elephants head, they are all angle shots and thats why Bell was so successfull with his tiny elephant guns, he understood the anatomy and angles needed under all circumstances to make a kill....Non of us will ever shoot enough elephants to perform as some of the old timers that made a liveing killing elephants...practice makes perfect one could say...

Thanks Jerry for the follow-up pict and CSI work! I'm surprised to learn about the weight, and will keep this in mind, although I guess most countries do not allow cows to be exported (?).



Hey Russell! Yea, leaving this month for Chewore North. We are going to drive in and hunt for 8 or 9-days. I want to scout around for the hopeful backpack trip next year, and am anxious to try out the new dig-camera. As time permits we are going to canoe down the Zambezi, maybe hunt bushbuck along the river, fish, etc. He's hired a videographer and this will be the guys trial-by-fire test. As it's a bit early, the roads will be ruff, bush thick/green...and the hunting will be interesting to say the least (which is why Jerry's pictures peaked my attention). You guys are getting close, let me know if there is anything you want me to relay to Buzz. He's got me shopping now for gadgets/goodies...



Ray, good advice. My thought is my tendancy would be to shoot high. I'll let you know how the .416 does, if we can even find the buggers.

Well, if you sissies would just wait a little, like I do, the brain shot will be much easier.






I am proud to say that I have never missed the brain on a charging elephant...


Rick.

WOW!!! Did you have to change your drawers after that or shock treatment to start your heart again? My hat off to both you and the guy taking the pic.

Don't believe it. That photo has been around awhile.

And I'm not sure it is for real anyway. Who has that much hair on their arms!

rick when you shave your arms dose it make them more aroedynamic as to allow faster reflex speed. also do you shave your legs so you can run faster in case your bolt action jams?

Anyway, with a scoped rifle at that range your tendencies will be to furrow the hairline. Ever seen an ele with a bad hairdo? It ain't pretty...

Rick3foxes,
You had me going with that pic. I was even ready to bow down and pay homage to you. Even if it is a hoax it is pretty cool.

Rookie Question:

Have any of you guys who have actually hunted elephant herd of anyone testing a premium soft point on one afetr it was down?

Seeing the skull photos with one shot close but high above brain and one close but below it astounded me. To be so close and not throw some bone fragments into the brain is amazing.

With the Barnes X, Trophy Bonded, and North Fork all having alot of solid copper left after expanding, why not use a soft point rather than a solid?

Andy

Think stainless steel. A clear miss as in the pics may pass through the skull, but most don't unless from a side brain shot, and some of those don't.

Penetration is king on elephants, and it usually sucks with solids, much less expanding bullets.

Andy,
The elephant's skull is notorious for its sponginess. What the evolutionary reason for this might be, I have no idea. But . . . it is well documented in the literature that the skull of any elephant, cow or bull, can soak up bullets and do nothing more to the beast than piss it off thoroughly. Barne's X bullets may work on body shots to the heart but no one whose reputation I respect has ever advocated using anything but the very best of solids on the skull. Penetration, penetration, penetration!