I just got a video from a friend of mine who is a PH who hunts in in Moz. The video shows a lion charging at incredible speed.

As the lion closes within a few feet of the hunters shots are ringing out. The lion drops and the the PH staggers off to the side and collapses. He has been shot through the left shoulder.

The client is struggling to clear his jammed rifle, as the lion is still kicking. Finally someone else finishes off the lion.

Seeing this video makes my respect for the Professional Hunters of Africa go over the top.

I would post the video, if I knew how, and had permission from the guy who sent it to me.

Certainly makes you think about why you need to stay calm in the face of danger.

BH63

quote:

Originally posted by BuffHunter63:
I just got a video from a friend of mine who is a PH who hunts in in Moz. The video shows a lion charging at incredible speed.

As the lion closes within a few feet of the hunters shots are ringing out. The lion drops and the the PH staggers off to the side and collapses. He has been shot through the left shoulder.

The client is struggling to clear his jammed rifle, as the lion is still kicking. Finally someone else finishes off the lion.

Seeing this video makes my respect for the Professional Hunters of Africa go over the top.

I would post the video, if I knew how, and had permission from the guy who sent it to me.

Certainly makes you think about why you need to stay calm in the face of danger.

BH63

This video and another from another angle has made the rounds.

This PH was hit by the lion and not shot.

This hunt was in the North West Province of South Africa and not in Mozambique.

The jammed rifle is actually the PH that shot the lion off the other PH.

The bolt was sticky after that shot, the client then also placed an insurance shot.

I have both the videos with me.

I have also seen the video. I was told the PH was injured by the Lion...not from being shot. It was hard to see from the video.

I believe it was on a farm in South Africa.

There are two videos of the incident. One is grainy and has been out since the mauling. The second looks like it was done by a professional and really started making the rounds 2-3 weeks ago.

The following gives more details if you are interested.

https://www.africahunting.com/...auled-by-lion.21202/

I seem to remember a thread here on AR, but I am obviously using the wrong search words.

http://www.sapeople.com/2017/0...-viral-south-africa/


Is this the video?

Kathi. I clicked on that link and got a virus warning and my computer locked up.

Whoa! One mean kitty

quote:

Originally posted by Grenadier:
[FLASH_VIDEO]<iframe frameborder="0" height="480" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/RjkwGRBOBlo?rel=0" width="853"></iframe>[/FLASH_VIDEO]

Whoa those things are fast! Lucky he was bit through the shoulder and not the head/neck area! I hope he is doing OK. When did this occur?

quote:

Originally posted by drongo:

Whoa those things are fast! Lucky he was bit through the shoulder and not the head/neck area! I hope he is doing OK. When did this occur?

The Video is evidence for the name "DANGEROUS GAME" and the reason one must have a lot of experience with the rifles he hunts dangerous game with. The above shows which of the dangerous game animals must be stopped when they charge or the result may even be worse that this, as was mentioned above about the lion getting his first bite in the head, neck, or chest. I believe this PH is very lucky considering the outcome that may have happened if that lion had been just a little more accurate.

IMO, the African Lion is the most dangerous animal in Africa to stand a charge from, and is the only African animal the truly frightens me!

................................................................

From the link I posted:


The ‘lion hunt’ was neither a canned hunt… nor even a lion hunt! It was a buffalo hunt that went wrong for the hunters.

Watch lion attacks professional hunter in South Africa



The hunt occurred two years ago near Bray in the North West, in which professional hunter Reinhard Heuser (then 34) was attacked by a male lion. Reinhard, who owns Kwalata Wilderness, had taken overseas clients to the Kalahari where they were tracking a buffalo when they stumbled upon the lion.



Jacques Spamer who assisted on the hunt, told Northern News at the time in March 2015, that they shot straight away but when it stormed Reinhard they couldn’t shoot again until both fell to the ground.

“Ek het net geweet ek moet die leeu sodra moontlik van Reinhard af wegkry en toe storm ek op hulle af en skree vir die leeu… Die volgende oomblik het die leeu vir Reinhard gelos en reguit op my afgestorm – ek het hom toe doodgeskiet met die .416-jaggeweer.” (“I just knew I had get rid of the lion as soon as possible from Reinhard and so I stormed them, screaming at the lion… the next moment the lion let Reinhard go and came straight for me – I shot him with the .416 rifle.”)

Reinhard suffered only flesh wounds, including a gash under his armpit and bite marks on his shoulder.

Not trying to throw stones here, but was it one of the PH's rifles that jammed???

No Bueno...

WOW!!!

quote:

Originally posted by Opus1:
Not trying to throw stones here, but was it one of the PH's rifles that jammed???

No Bueno...

How could that be possible? it looked like a M98 derivative not a Blaser

He must have been shooting one of those post-1937, hopped up, high-pressure, improved, blown out shoulder, non-sloping case, better than the old tried an true cartridges modern rounds.

quote:

Originally posted by Opus1:
Not trying to throw stones here, but was it one of the PH's rifles that jammed???

No Bueno...

Its a Ruger In 416 Ruger that he used if I remember correctly, the bolt got sticky after he shot the lion off the Ph.

Thanks for the clarification on the injury . My video did not show the actual attack, but the wounds looked like gunshot wounds to me.

From all the blood, it looked like the sub-clavicle artery got nicked. You can bleed out from that pretty fast.

BH63

I spend as much time watching peoples reactions in critical incidents as I do the lion in a video like this. I am frequently amazed at the complete lack of preparation in their subsequent responses to an out of control situation. Whether it is a client who just stands there with his mouth open and doesn't even consider reloading and shooting again, to in this case the "PH" who when faced with a jammed rifle( a topic for another day), a severely injured man on the ground and a wounded lion thrashing just a few feet away, turns his back on the threat, talks to the wounded guy, tries to work his bolt and when that fails ultimately directs someone else to shoot the cat and then chastises the guy when he shoots it again since its still obviously moving.

A well trained professional would have focused COMPLETELY on staying between the threat and the downed man and when his rifle failed he would instantly transition to the Glock on his hip (its full size so either a .45 or a 10mm)and finish off that lion before it regains its feet. Poor performance, in my opinion.

And before somebody throws down the "its easy to criticize when your not there", please realize that there are many of us who have spent a lifetime protecting people and we always have a fallback plan that was rehearsed a million times in our head so when something happens we know exactly how to respond!

I would bet money that the "PH" never once trained for or visualized what he would do in this instance and that lack of preparation could get somebody killed.

It would be interesting to know why the rifle jammed.

It is always a good idea to run each round through A rifle before embarking on a DG hunt. Could be some other problem. Regardless, it was really good he didn't have to shoot again.

But as Saeed tells us over and over, there is no such thing as Dangerous Game when you have a rifle in your hands.

All evidence to the contrary.


Reference this thread among others.


http://forums.accuratereloadin...691075132#8691075132

I have seen other Rugers do what the 2nd PHs Ruger did at the 40 second mark.

BTW, the PH indicated online a couple of years ago when this happened that the rifle was a Ruger, shooting 416 ruger factory ammo.

quote:

Originally posted by desert dog:
I have seen other Rugers do what the 2nd PHs Ruger did at the 40 second mark.

BTW, the PH indicated online a couple of years ago when this happened that the rifle was a Ruger, shooting 416 ruger factory ammo.

I've never seen any Ruger bolt action jam with factory ammo, but I have 2 different Hawkeyes (416 Ruger & 375) jam with very hot handloads.

quote:

Originally posted by JCS271:
I spend as much time watching peoples reactions in critical incidents as I do the lion in a video like this. I am frequently amazed at the complete lack of preparation in their subsequent responses to an out of control situation. Whether it is a client who just stands there with his mouth open and doesn't even consider reloading and shooting again, to in this case the "PH" who when faced with a jammed rifle( a topic for another day), a severely injured man on the ground and a wounded lion thrashing just a few feet away, turns his back on the threat, talks to the wounded guy, tries to work his bolt and when that fails ultimately directs someone else to shoot the cat and then chastises the guy when he shoots it again since its still obviously moving.

A well trained professional would have focused COMPLETELY on staying between the threat and the downed man and when his rifle failed he would instantly transition to the Glock on his hip (its full size so either a .45 or a 10mm)and finish off that lion before it regains its feet. Poor performance, in my opinion.

And before somebody throws down the "its easy to criticize when your not there", please realize that there are many of us who have spent a lifetime protecting people and we always have a fallback plan that was rehearsed a million times in our head so when something happens we know exactly how to respond!

I would bet money that the "PH" never once trained for or visualized what he would do in this instance and that lack of preparation could get somebody killed.

Have you been charge by a Lion?

Not calling you out, just asking.

I heard Mark Sullivan quote one time "Its easy to practice shooting at a charging piece of paper"

quote:

Originally posted by JCS271:
I spend as much time watching peoples reactions in critical incidents as I do the lion in a video like this. I am frequently amazed at the complete lack of preparation in their subsequent responses to an out of control situation. Whether it is a client who just stands there with his mouth open and doesn't even consider reloading and shooting again, to in this case the "PH" who when faced with a jammed rifle( a topic for another day), a severely injured man on the ground and a wounded lion thrashing just a few feet away, turns his back on the threat, talks to the wounded guy, tries to work his bolt and when that fails ultimately directs someone else to shoot the cat and then chastises the guy when he shoots it again since its still obviously moving.

A well trained professional would have focused COMPLETELY on staying between the threat and the downed man and when his rifle failed he would instantly transition to the Glock on his hip (its full size so either a .45 or a 10mm)and finish off that lion before it regains its feet. Poor performance, in my opinion.

And before somebody throws down the "its easy to criticize when your not there", please realize that there are many of us who have spent a lifetime protecting people and we always have a fallback plan that was rehearsed a million times in our head so when something happens we know exactly how to respond!

I would bet money that the "PH" never once trained for or visualized what he would do in this instance and that lack of preparation could get somebody killed.

I agree 100%.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by JCS271:
I spend as much time watching peoples reactions in critical incidents as I do the lion in a video like this. I am frequently amazed at the complete lack of preparation in their subsequent responses to an out of control situation. Whether it is a client who just stands there with his mouth open and doesn't even consider reloading and shooting again, to in this case the "PH" who when faced with a jammed rifle( a topic for another day), a severely injured man on the ground and a wounded lion thrashing just a few feet away, turns his back on the threat, talks to the wounded guy, tries to work his bolt and when that fails ultimately directs someone else to shoot the cat and then chastises the guy when he shoots it again since its still obviously moving.

A well trained professional would have focused COMPLETELY on staying between the threat and the downed man and when his rifle failed he would instantly transition to the Glock on his hip (its full size so either a .45 or a 10mm)and finish off that lion before it regains its feet. Poor performance, in my opinion.

And before somebody throws down the "its easy to criticize when your not there", please realize that there are many of us who have spent a lifetime protecting people and we always have a fallback plan that was rehearsed a million times in our head so when something happens we know exactly how to respond!

I would bet money that the "PH" never once trained for or visualized what he would do in this instance and that lack of preparation could get somebody killed.

Have you been charge by a Lion?

Not calling you out, just asking.

I heard Mark Sullivan quote one time "Its easy to practice shooting at a charging piece of paper"

That is funny as hell.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by JCS271:
I spend as much time watching peoples reactions in critical incidents as I do the lion in a video like this. I am frequently amazed at the complete lack of preparation in their subsequent responses to an out of control situation. Whether it is a client who just stands there with his mouth open and doesn't even consider reloading and shooting again, to in this case the "PH" who when faced with a jammed rifle( a topic for another day), a severely injured man on the ground and a wounded lion thrashing just a few feet away, turns his back on the threat, talks to the wounded guy, tries to work his bolt and when that fails ultimately directs someone else to shoot the cat and then chastises the guy when he shoots it again since its still obviously moving.

A well trained professional would have focused COMPLETELY on staying between the threat and the downed man and when his rifle failed he would instantly transition to the Glock on his hip (its full size so either a .45 or a 10mm)and finish off that lion before it regains its feet. Poor performance, in my opinion.

And before somebody throws down the "its easy to criticize when your not there", please realize that there are many of us who have spent a lifetime protecting people and we always have a fallback plan that was rehearsed a million times in our head so when something happens we know exactly how to respond!

I would bet money that the "PH" never once trained for or visualized what he would do in this instance and that lack of preparation could get somebody killed.

Have you been charge by a Lion?

Not calling you out, just asking.

I heard Mark Sullivan quote one time "Its easy to practice shooting at a charging piece of paper"

Yeah a charging lion on a buffalo hunt.

That rifle that jammed looks like a Ruger?

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
But as Saeed tells us over and over, there is no such thing as Dangerous Game when you have a rifle in your hands.

All evidence to the contrary.


Reference this thread among others.


http://forums.accuratereloadin...691075132#8691075132

I've commented on another forum about this event, but I counter your argument Todd by saying a rifle is not dangerous when it is at rest in storage. It only becomes dangerous when an idiot who doesn't know how to use or handle it properly gets hold of it.

Saeed's point has always been that it is most often the idiots who can't shoot properly and then fuck up the followup who create a dangerous situation. This video is a classic example of that. As others have here, I also noted that among other things the PH failed to draw his handgun and finish the lion off which even if the animal had been still, an instant shot to the head with the handgun would have been good insurance, instead of attending to wounded and a jammed gun. Maybe the handgun on the hip is just for a posing image. The situation was badly handled and not an example of dangerous game, just dangerous hunters.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
But as Saeed tells us over and over, there is no such thing as Dangerous Game when you have a rifle in your hands.

All evidence to the contrary.


Reference this thread among others.


http://forums.accuratereloadin...691075132#8691075132

Todd,

You might not believe this, but I actually do not feel I am in as much danger hunting than I do driving or walking in a major city.

When hunting I feel tha I have at least SOME control with a rifle in my hand.

A drunk idiot jumping a red light and killing you, you have absolutely no control over.

This video also proves one of my points.

In this sort of situation, one only gets one shot.

And you better make it count.

Last year we followed a herd of buffalo. Half were in thick bush and half were in an open grass area.

We must have been good at tracking them, as we surprised a bull feeding on the other side of a thick bush.

He was probably no more than 3 yards from us when he took off!

Half an hour later we short two bulls.

Saeed,

Traffic accidents aside, there are definitely situations within a DG safari where if everything isn't done exactly right, things can go pear shaped. Training and preparation limit the chances of things going south but as we have seen recently, even PHs who have spent a career preparing and training for those situations sometimes fall victim to events that allow the animal to reach the hunter. To ignore that this can happen simply because one is armed I believe to be folly.

I didn't chime in on the "Why do we hunt Dangerous Game" thread that I linked to simply because it was pure silliness. Many experienced posters fighting to gain the moral high ground proclaiming "nothing dangerous about it". There's a hundred other threads of similar nature here. The interesting thing is that that thread was running the same week of the thread where the PH from RSA was killed by an elephant and the anti's had despicably floated a photo of him lying dead under the animal. I found the comments in the "nothing dangerous" vain interesting in contrast to the other thread running concurrently.

I don't believe anyone goes on a DG safari expecting anything to really go bad. And from my experience, 99% of the time, there is no real danger. But in that 1% of time where there is real danger, many things happen. We learn things. We learn things about ourself, we learn from our PHs how to handle certain situations, and almost every time, we get to think back and learn from mistakes made afield. ALMOST every time.

A good example of this is that elephant hunt video I posted from December of 2013. I shot the bull at 6 paces and fired a back up shot. I completed the reload of my double rifle at the same time a second bull decided he no longer enjoyed our presence amongst the small herd and decided to chase us. I had a loaded rifle in my hand, but a dangerous situation came about because of the way the hunting party was positioned, strung out in a near straight line with me at the front taking the shot, the Ph behind me, camera man behind him, game scout behind him. The second bull charged us from perpendicular to the line of men. The easy thing to have done would be for me and the PH to stand our ground and shoot the second bull as it charged but because we didn't want to shoot an animal in self defense, the PH properly commanded "back, come back" as we retreated. Being on the far end of the line, as we retreated, I became the target of the bull's revenge. With a loaded rifle in my hand with which I could have stood and defended myself, I focused on the retreat being commanded. In the process, I turned my back while running placing myself completely out of position for defensive shooting. I saw the PH stop ahead of me and aim just before hearing a trumpet, looking back and seeing the bull about 8 or 9 steps behind me with his ears completely out. No way to stop, turn, and shoot before being overtaken. The PH would have had to shoot directly over my head to stop him, IF he had a shot at all as I was nearly on top of him at this point. Luckily, the PH and I ducked behind a line of Jess in our retreat and the bull lost sight of us ending the situation. This all took place in a matter of maybe 5 or 6 seconds.

At the time, it certainly got my adrenalin flowing but I didn't think much about it beyond that. In retrospect, I learned a few things. First and foremost, that with a loaded rifle in hand, I should have backed up as best I could while remaining focused on the second bull. That we didn't want to shoot in self defense should have been secondary to maintaining contact with the threat. The fact that the PH maintained contact and was ready to fire if necessary per his training and experience was momentarily nullified by the fact that we had strung out in a line where he probably didn't have a shot to stop the bull if it continued to close on me because I was in his direct line of fire. Lots of things learned that day. I'm sure the fellows in the lion charge thread here will look back at this event and have a lessons learned session as well. But to simply pass off these situations as "nothing dangerous about it" ... again I say, all evidence to the contrary.

Eagle, what the hell are you talking about? A gun in a rack? WTFO? The video we are speaking of shows a lion making it to the hunter during a charge and tearing him a new one. It doesn't show the PH getting shot by a fellow hunter. And the thread I linked to wasn't about anyone getting shot either. It was about members here denying how a DG safari can be in fact "dangerous" in the same week that the RSA PH was killed by an elephant.

Live and learn as the old saying goes. I think we all still learn especially from mistakes and new situations.

No one really knows how they will react to these situations until they have been in one. It is easy to be critical . Those who have been there may have gotten some real surprises. I once saw a very experienced guide in Alaska totally lose it over a grizzly charge. The guy damn near passed out. I never thought he would react that way, neither did he. He was extremely embarrassed. It could have ended up really bad.

For the most part, going to any big city scares me more than 99.9% of DG hunting especially these days. Obviously, both have danger. I would far rather face the danger in the bush than wonder if I am going to be robbed or if there is going to be in a terrorist attack.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by JCS271:
I spend as much time watching peoples reactions in critical incidents as I do the lion in a video like this. I am frequently amazed at the complete lack of preparation in their subsequent responses to an out of control situation. Whether it is a client who just stands there with his mouth open and doesn't even consider reloading and shooting again, to in this case the "PH" who when faced with a jammed rifle( a topic for another day), a severely injured man on the ground and a wounded lion thrashing just a few feet away, turns his back on the threat, talks to the wounded guy, tries to work his bolt and when that fails ultimately directs someone else to shoot the cat and then chastises the guy when he shoots it again since its still obviously moving.

A well trained professional would have focused COMPLETELY on staying between the threat and the downed man and when his rifle failed he would instantly transition to the Glock on his hip (its full size so either a .45 or a 10mm)and finish off that lion before it regains its feet. Poor performance, in my opinion.

And before somebody throws down the "its easy to criticize when your not there", please realize that there are many of us who have spent a lifetime protecting people and we always have a fallback plan that was rehearsed a million times in our head so when something happens we know exactly how to respond!

I would bet money that the "PH" never once trained for or visualized what he would do in this instance and that lack of preparation could get somebody killed.

Have you been charge by a Lion?

Not calling you out, just asking.

I heard Mark Sullivan quote one time "Its easy to practice shooting at a charging piece of paper"

I've hunted early season elephant with Alan Shearing and can use that as a gauge and if I was in a DG charge situation, JCS271 would be right at the top of men I'd want by my side when shit hit the fan.

What doesn't make sense to me, is that if they were hunting buffalo and a lion charged why did the take the time to set up shooting sticks for the client. Or what appears to be the client.

quote:

Originally posted by Victor Watson:
What doesn't make sense to me, is that if they were hunting buffalo and a lion charged why did the take the time to set up shooting sticks for the client. Or what appears to be the client.

This is something that seems odd to me as well...if they were simply following up a buff, why is the hunter on shooting sticks moments before the lion charges. It looks to me like he was setting up for a shot on the lion and it all went wrong instantly.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by JCS271:
I spend as much time watching peoples reactions in critical incidents as I do the lion in a video like this. I am frequently amazed at the complete lack of preparation in their subsequent responses to an out of control situation. Whether it is a client who just stands there with his mouth open and doesn't even consider reloading and shooting again, to in this case the "PH" who when faced with a jammed rifle( a topic for another day), a severely injured man on the ground and a wounded lion thrashing just a few feet away, turns his back on the threat, talks to the wounded guy, tries to work his bolt and when that fails ultimately directs someone else to shoot the cat and then chastises the guy when he shoots it again since its still obviously moving.

A well trained professional would have focused COMPLETELY on staying between the threat and the downed man and when his rifle failed he would instantly transition to the Glock on his hip (its full size so either a .45 or a 10mm)and finish off that lion before it regains its feet. Poor performance, in my opinion.

And before somebody throws down the "its easy to criticize when your not there", please realize that there are many of us who have spent a lifetime protecting people and we always have a fallback plan that was rehearsed a million times in our head so when something happens we know exactly how to respond!

I would bet money that the "PH" never once trained for or visualized what he would do in this instance and that lack of preparation could get somebody killed.

Have you been charge by a Lion?

Not calling you out, just asking.

I heard Mark Sullivan quote one time "Its easy to practice shooting at a charging piece of paper"

Nope, lion hunting is out of my budget. Not sure though what that has to do with my comment. Out of curiosity, do you concur with my critique of the PH's performance AFTER the charge?

quote:

It looks to me like he was setting up for a shot on the lion and it all went wrong instantly.

It looks that way to me. Doesn't mean the story is false, just not filled in. Hunting buffalo, stumbled into a Lion, decided to take it, found out that shooting over tall standing sticks on a charging lion is hopeless, other backup shooters failed to stop the lion, gentleman gets well chewed, Lion shot off of him at first opportunity, most everybody other than the chewed fellow who wisely stated crawling away, on camera anyway, went into brain freeze from stress of the moment. The other PH had a failure to extract and reload moment with his rifle and beating on it while he had a pistol on his hip proves the Stress level. That is "normal" I think. Happens to long serving Law Enforcement officers way too often. Soldiers too. We always wish our Professionals were superheros but the odds are they are human.

quote:

Originally posted by JCS271:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by JCS271:
I spend as much time watching peoples reactions in critical incidents as I do the lion in a video like this. I am frequently amazed at the complete lack of preparation in their subsequent responses to an out of control situation. Whether it is a client who just stands there with his mouth open and doesn't even consider reloading and shooting again, to in this case the "PH" who when faced with a jammed rifle( a topic for another day), a severely injured man on the ground and a wounded lion thrashing just a few feet away, turns his back on the threat, talks to the wounded guy, tries to work his bolt and when that fails ultimately directs someone else to shoot the cat and then chastises the guy when he shoots it again since its still obviously moving.

A well trained professional would have focused COMPLETELY on staying between the threat and the downed man and when his rifle failed he would instantly transition to the Glock on his hip (its full size so either a .45 or a 10mm)and finish off that lion before it regains its feet. Poor performance, in my opinion.

And before somebody throws down the "its easy to criticize when your not there", please realize that there are many of us who have spent a lifetime protecting people and we always have a fallback plan that was rehearsed a million times in our head so when something happens we know exactly how to respond!

I would bet money that the "PH" never once trained for or visualized what he would do in this instance and that lack of preparation could get somebody killed.

Have you been charge by a Lion?

Not calling you out, just asking.

I heard Mark Sullivan quote one time "Its easy to practice shooting at a charging piece of paper"

Nope, lion hunting is out of my budget. Not sure though what that has to do with my comment. Out of curiosity, do you concur with my critique of the PH's performance AFTER the charge?

No, not really. Here's my reasoning. None of us can predict how we will react to such a traumatic, life altering event. We might say differently, but for Gods sake, how can we know?

I was charged in 2005 in the Luangwa Valley, Nyaminga GMA with Alister Norton. I shot this Lion (poorly) from a machan, late in the evening.

The reasons for the piss poor shot are interesting but the fact remains, I screwed up. We followed in the dark for about three hours until Alister called it.

We went back first light. Johnny duPlooy and his client from the neighboring GMA (Chanjuzi) helped till about 10AM. We were only finding a small drop of blood, here and there. The cover was thick, I was scared shitless. None the less, I created the situation and followed through with it.

After Johnny left, Alister stopped for a smoke break. He assured me that this Lion isn't fatally hit and if we find him, HE IS GOING TO CHARGE.

About noon, a Lioness, bluff charged, giving space for the Lion to run out the back of the heavy cover in front of us. We both saw him and fired. I hit him in the hip as did Alister. Knowing this was close to an end, we ran after the Lion. He went into a korongo, and up the other side and out of sight. As we began up the far bank of the koronga, he came. A tawny blur of hair teeth and claws. Alister knelt and fired his .458 Lott hitting the Lion in the neck, I followed with my .470, also hitting him in the neck. The Lion lay dead at 12 feet.

Exciting, yes, But my point is, I was on auto pilot. I had no plan other than do as I was told by a competent PH.

To Quote our own Andrew Baldry "Following a wounded Lion into heavy cover, is a grim task in which few men will ever engage"

The only time I've been hit by a wounded animal was actually a warthog in South Africa. I went after him with an empty rifle, expecting a dead pig.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by JCS271:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by JCS271:
I spend as much time watching peoples reactions in critical incidents as I do the lion in a video like this. I am frequently amazed at the complete lack of preparation in their subsequent responses to an out of control situation. Whether it is a client who just stands there with his mouth open and doesn't even consider reloading and shooting again, to in this case the "PH" who when faced with a jammed rifle( a topic for another day), a severely injured man on the ground and a wounded lion thrashing just a few feet away, turns his back on the threat, talks to the wounded guy, tries to work his bolt and when that fails ultimately directs someone else to shoot the cat and then chastises the guy when he shoots it again since its still obviously moving.

A well trained professional would have focused COMPLETELY on staying between the threat and the downed man and when his rifle failed he would instantly transition to the Glock on his hip (its full size so either a .45 or a 10mm)and finish off that lion before it regains its feet. Poor performance, in my opinion.

And before somebody throws down the "its easy to criticize when your not there", please realize that there are many of us who have spent a lifetime protecting people and we always have a fallback plan that was rehearsed a million times in our head so when something happens we know exactly how to respond!

I would bet money that the "PH" never once trained for or visualized what he would do in this instance and that lack of preparation could get somebody killed.

Have you been charge by a Lion?

Not calling you out, just asking.

I heard Mark Sullivan quote one time "Its easy to practice shooting at a charging piece of paper"

Nope, lion hunting is out of my budget. Not sure though what that has to do with my comment. Out of curiosity, do you concur with my critique of the PH's performance AFTER the charge?

No, not really. Here's my reasoning. None of us can predict how we will react to such a traumatic, life altering event. We might say differently, but for Gods sake, how can we know?

I was charged in 2005 in the Luangwa Valley, Nyaminga GMA with Alister Norton. I shot this Lion (poorly) from a machan, late in the evening.

The reasons for the piss poor shot are interesting but the fact remains, I screwed up. We followed in the dark for about three hours until Alister called it.

We went back first light. Johnny duPlooy and his client from the neighboring GMA (Chanjuzi) helped till about 10AM. We were only finding a small drop of blood, here and there. The cover was thick, I was scared shitless. None the less, I created the situation and followed through with it.

After Johnny left, Alister stopped for a smoke break. He assured me that this Lion isn't fatally hit and if we find him, HE IS GOING TO CHARGE.

About noon, a Lioness, bluff charged, giving space for the Lion to run out the back of the heavy cover in front of us. We both saw him and fired. I hit him in the hip as did Alister. Knowing this was close to an end, we ran after the Lion. He went into a korongo, and up the other side and out of sight. As we began up the far bank of the koronga, he came. A tawny blur of hair teeth and claws. Alister knelt and fired his .458 Lott hitting the Lion in the neck, I followed with my .470, also hitting him in the neck. The Lion lay dead at 12 feet.

Exciting, yes, But my point is, I was on auto pilot. I had no plan other than do as I was told by a competent PH.

To Quote our own Andrew Baldry "Following a wounded Lion into heavy cover, is a grim task in which few men will ever engage"

The only time I've been hit by a wounded animal was actually a warthog in South Africa. I went after him with an empty rifle, expecting a dead pig.

That sounds like a wild adventure and you obviously stepped up to the plate, overcame your fear and finished what you started. I also think you just made my point. Nowhere in your tale did you turn your back on a wounded lion just feet away to talk with your injured buddy, fool with your now jammed rifle and then yell at the guy you told to shoot it after he fires two rounds at the still moving cat. I am quite confident that you, I, and most of the other folks on this site would have stepped forward, hammered the down but still thrashing lion, THEN dealt with the medical issues because nobody is safe until the threat has been neutralized.

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Originally posted by JCS271:

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Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

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Originally posted by JCS271:

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Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

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Originally posted by JCS271:
I spend as much time watching peoples reactions in critical incidents as I do the lion in a video like this. I am frequently amazed at the complete lack of preparation in their subsequent responses to an out of control situation. Whether it is a client who just stands there with his mouth open and doesn't even consider reloading and shooting again, to in this case the "PH" who when faced with a jammed rifle( a topic for another day), a severely injured man on the ground and a wounded lion thrashing just a few feet away, turns his back on the threat, talks to the wounded guy, tries to work his bolt and when that fails ultimately directs someone else to shoot the cat and then chastises the guy when he shoots it again since its still obviously moving.

A well trained professional would have focused COMPLETELY on staying between the threat and the downed man and when his rifle failed he would instantly transition to the Glock on his hip (its full size so either a .45 or a 10mm)and finish off that lion before it regains its feet. Poor performance, in my opinion.

And before somebody throws down the "its easy to criticize when your not there", please realize that there are many of us who have spent a lifetime protecting people and we always have a fallback plan that was rehearsed a million times in our head so when something happens we know exactly how to respond!

I would bet money that the "PH" never once trained for or visualized what he would do in this instance and that lack of preparation could get somebody killed.

Have you been charge by a Lion?

Not calling you out, just asking.

I heard Mark Sullivan quote one time "Its easy to practice shooting at a charging piece of paper"

Nope, lion hunting is out of my budget. Not sure though what that has to do with my comment. Out of curiosity, do you concur with my critique of the PH's performance AFTER the charge?

No, not really. Here's my reasoning. None of us can predict how we will react to such a traumatic, life altering event. We might say differently, but for Gods sake, how can we know?

I was charged in 2005 in the Luangwa Valley, Nyaminga GMA with Alister Norton. I shot this Lion (poorly) from a machan, late in the evening.

The reasons for the piss poor shot are interesting but the fact remains, I screwed up. We followed in the dark for about three hours until Alister called it.

We went back first light. Johnny duPlooy and his client from the neighboring GMA (Chanjuzi) helped till about 10AM. We were only finding a small drop of blood, here and there. The cover was thick, I was scared shitless. None the less, I created the situation and followed through with it.

After Johnny left, Alister stopped for a smoke break. He assured me that this Lion isn't fatally hit and if we find him, HE IS GOING TO CHARGE.

About noon, a Lioness, bluff charged, giving space for the Lion to run out the back of the heavy cover in front of us. We both saw him and fired. I hit him in the hip as did Alister. Knowing this was close to an end, we ran after the Lion. He went into a korongo, and up the other side and out of sight. As we began up the far bank of the koronga, he came. A tawny blur of hair teeth and claws. Alister knelt and fired his .458 Lott hitting the Lion in the neck, I followed with my .470, also hitting him in the neck. The Lion lay dead at 12 feet.

Exciting, yes, But my point is, I was on auto pilot. I had no plan other than do as I was told by a competent PH.

To Quote our own Andrew Baldry "Following a wounded Lion into heavy cover, is a grim task in which few men will ever engage"

The only time I've been hit by a wounded animal was actually a warthog in South Africa. I went after him with an empty rifle, expecting a dead pig.

That sounds like a wild adventure and you obviously stepped up to the plate, overcame your fear and finished what you started. I also think you just made my point. Nowhere in your tale did you turn your back on a wounded lion just feet away to talk with your injured buddy, fool with your now jammed rifle and then yell at the guy you told to shoot it after he fires two rounds at the still moving cat. I am quite confident that you, I, and most of the other folks on this site would have stepped forward, hammered the down but still thrashing lion, THEN dealt with the medical issues because nobody is safe until the threat has been neutralized.

I suppose you're right. Not staying focused on the task at hand isn't really a training issue, it's just common sense?

My only point is I don't think you can prepare for those life altering events. A terrible traffic accident, a plane crash, whatever.

I don't consider myself brave or gifted, in any sense. It was just how I reacted. I will tell you this in all honesty, as we searched for this Lion, I pondered fate, why am I here & doing this, Christ my wife would kill me if she had any concept. I wanted to be anywhere but where I was.

Without Alister Norton as a PH, lord only knows...

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I wanted to be anywhere but where I was.

You sir are Human. and a Honest one at that.