UEG - Still confused as to who I would ask or who wants the new tag filled out???? Who exactly are "they"? Customs, baggage handlers, Domestic luggage expeditors, not security as all the bags are long gone before reaching this point. They just grab the case from me, tell me it's going to transfer and direct me to put the non-firearm bearing bags on the other conveyor. At least half the time on arrival, no body has even opened my gun case. I of course delare there is a weapon in the case. All the other gun carriers on the flights I have been on haven't filled out these tags on arrival either. After making at least a dozen out of Country and return carrying firearms trips and never once seen or heard of anyone wanting this "new" tag on arrival makes me wonder what is really going on??

I guess I would gladly fill one out, but like I said clueless as to who has them.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
Larry: Yes, the problem was upon bull 1's arrival back in the country and the lack of a new and current firarms declaration tag being filled out, signed and placed in his gun case AFTER coming back into the country. You get the new firearms declaration tag when you recheck your gun case after coming through customs and as you hand off and they take your luggage and your gun case again and run it through the machines and their system. (The airport personnel) They have always had me fill one out there, open the case, put it in and lock it. They then put the case through their machine and on the way to the domestic flight. If you've not done it you better start asking for the card and do it, as many more of you may be having the same story to tell and the same citation to face in the future.

Hi Larry: This has been the scenario for me. After having come through customs and being directed to the inspection area for firearms (always for me as I have declared the firearms to the customs officer), I have my firearms inspected and matched to the 4457's. They then direct me to the baggage recheck area nearby. The baggage handlers take my regular luggage and put it on the conveyor. As to my gun case, they have asked me to open the case, fill out and sign a new firearms declarations tag. Quite frankly, I can't recall if its a TSA employee, but I believe it is. Once the tag is signed and put into the firearms case and locked they then put it on to the conveyor as well and on I go to the domestic gate. Anyone with recent experience out there? Coming back from Mexico last year and arriving in Phoenix, I picked up my bags and firearms case and proceeded to the U.S. Airways counter (no recheck area like Atlanta, Dulles, Detroit), and was asked at the ticket counter to fill out and sign out a new firearms declaration tag for the flight home. Domestically, flying home this last month from the SCI Convention with my new double rifle, Southwest Airlines called a TSA female representative to the counter and she escorted me and my firearms case into the back, had me open it up, fill out the firearms declaration tag, put it in, lock it and then go out front and on to the gate. The locked firearms case was left with her in the back area behind the ticketing counter. Everything arrived at my destination.

Hey Guys,

Just got back to my computer after having been snowed-in in Washington, DC this past weekend.

As I said earlier, I understand the TSA rules and regs. On my previous four safaris, I have gone through customs and presented my gun case and firearms for inspection. After doing this, I took control of my luggage and proceeded to the airline check-in where I declared my firearms and completed the declaration tag.

There is no disputing that I did not do that on re-entering the US in September. That aspect is not in question. My contention is that I was not given a chance to sign the declaration tag as my locked gun case was given to a baggage handler to be loaded on the plane at the direction of the airport employee/security/personnel. Even after I told her I needed to re-check my luggage and gun case
and over the concerns of the baggage handler.

Yes, I should have recognized she was wrong and protested. As I was in a semi-coherent state of mind from lack of sleep, I convinced myself that she was in charge and she knew what she was doing. With so many changes that occur and considering the frequency of some of those changes, I even thought something may have changed while I was in Africa. Obviously this was not the case. Now I have to deal with a situation that was not of my doing but ultimately is my responsibility.

My attorney has instructed my to not communicate with the TSA but, instead, to contact my US Senator and get his office involved. I will be meeting with a representative from his office within the next few days. I'll post what transpires. Again, just be careful and make sure you are familiar with the rules and regulations, not only of the TSA but, the airlines as well.

Bull1

Congrats... That's the way to fight (IMHO) Senators are OK, but with 2 per state they're often pretty overworked. If that appears to be the case try your Congressman too

Collins

Good luck bull 1. We're all rooting for a positive outcome for you!

Use Enough Gun,

Thanks dude! A guy needs all the luck when he's going up against the government!

Bull1

As I have saud previously on this thread, I have never gotten another red tag on re-entering the US at Atlanta, NYC or Washington D.C. I just got back from a fishing trip to Mexico last night and had a talk with a TSA guy at the Phoenix airport abput this problem. He suggested that to forestall any problems the the responsibility is on the airlines to assure that the red tags is signed and included in the gun case. It is our reponsibility to declare that we have firearms and that they are unloaded. From now on, I will not budge from check in until the red tag is filled out and inserted into my gun case.

465h&H

Just returned from a meeting with my US Senator's Constituent Advocate. She was very interested in my case and said her office will start work on the situation as soon as possible. She did not make any promises but did say the TSA was a little slow and that it may take a while for us to hear anything. That's odd...it only took them 4 1/2 months to tell me they were going to assess a fine!

Bull1

Dont give up. I believe we need to start contesting all of this kind of crap. Instead of looking for actuall terrorists, thieves, smugglers etc they waste their resources on someting like this. Makes as much sense as seizing an elephant tusk because it is attached to a base. It somehow turns it into "worked ivory" and as such it is contraband. Of course once it is in th USA you can do what was contraband if done in Africa. Too many bureaucrats in this world. Regardless we all need to fight this silliness.

UPDATE, I PREVAILED!!!

As I said, I would let the AR readers know what happened with this situation. Well, today I got a call on my cell phone from a TSA attorney from Washington, DC. He said he had reviewed my email request to speak with a TSA attorney and had read my letter to my US Senator's office. After careful consideration, they were not going to assess me the $500.00 fine for "presenting an unloaded and undeclared firearm" to an inspection station. He said he felt I did what a reasonable person would have done under similar circumstances. He cautioned me to request to speak with an airline supervisor if any airline representative refused or neglected to have me fill out a declaration form in the future.

I asked him if the "warning" would automatically cause me to be singled out for more detailed inspection on any future flights and he assured me, it would not. I would not be placed on any type "watch" list because of the warning and everything should be business as usual on any future flights.

Obviously, I was very pleased to hear this news. However, I will be extremely cautious and diligent in the future. I know I'm "preaching to the choir" but learn from my mistake...don't allow your gun case to pass through an airport screening area without demanding that you be furnished with a declaration form, complete it and put it in your case.

I do not fully know why the TSA decided to waive the $500.00 fine. Maybe because I requested a hearing or maybe the communication from the US Senator's office...I really don't care, just as long as I didn't have to pay the penalty and that there are no future consequences with this incident. Anyway, all is well that ends well.

Bull1

Glad to hear it.

Congratulations!

Ain't often you can beat the b******s on their own court!

Good on YA!!!!
Congrats!
I don't need much of a reason to travel to NC and buy a brother a beer.

Collins

Hooray! Congratulations!

One for the good guys.

Glad to read it worked out for you bull1

Good to hear.


But you are a bit naive. You most certainly are on the "Tell them they are not on any list" list.

Thats good news Bull

Bull1;

Congratulations...I sure hope you get or receive something in writing to confirm all of this!!!

Regards, D. Nelson

Glad you had the fine removed. But the entire case is BS from the start. Do we have to call our congressmen everytime something like this occurs to resolve it?

dale

daleW, I would like to say no but, what else are they going to do with their spare time. After all, they work for us. Even though it doesn't seem that way most of the time. Seriously, if you are in the "right" don't ever hesitate to utilize all the resources at your disposal to get the results that are due to you in any situation. Thanks for the words of support from all the AR members.

Bull1

quote:

if you are in the "right" don't ever hesitate to utilize all the resources at your disposal to get the results that are due to you in any situation

+1 Congrats again!

Thank you, Bull 1. You invested a lot of time and energy, and it benefits us all.
Brice