I understand that there are many variables such as rifle case, luggage handlers, scope bases, etc., but I was curious about how your rifles’ points of impacts have remained the same or changed after the long trip to Africa and back home. My experiences are as follows:
Nikon Scope on 7mm Remington Magnum—shifted 6 inches high on the trip to Africa, remained the same after trip home
Leupold Scope on 300 WSM—three trips over and back-no change
Leupold Scope on 375 H&H-one trip over and back-no change
Simmons Scope on 257 Weatherby Magnum-shifted two feet on both the trip over and back

I've never had a scope shift poi more than 1" on any of my rifles for 7 trips.
What brand of scope and what type of case are you shipping them in?

No shift for me. About all I use is Leupold.



.

I rarely have one shift. However, I sometimes have to adjust due to altitude. It is 50 feet above sea level here. If I hunt at altitude, I sometime find the gun shooting higher when I check the zero.

On my 1st trip using a 300wm with 6.5x20x56 Leupold I had to adjust elevation a couple of inches.
Next trip used a 375H&H with 4.5x14x40 Leupold, no change needed.
3rd trip, same 375 but with a 1.5x6x24 Leupold,
no change needed.
Used a TuffPak on the last 2 trips, can't remember the brand case on the 1st.
IMHO, using quality optics, bases & rings make a difference.

Once. On my leopard hunt last year, six inches low on arrival. S&B scope, Talley rings and bases, TuffPak.

One trip
Win 70 375 H&H w/ Leupold VX-R
No shift

Six trips. Leupold scopes. No Shifts - perfect
zero each time.

Six trips. Leupold scopes. No changes - perfect zero every time.

Never a change on mine.

14 trips.

I use NXS compacts on my rifles now........they are built like a tank. Hold zero perfectly.
Had a few shifts with Leupolds, but nothing major.
A Kahles on one rifle was out 10 inches........never again.

A good case is very important of course.

Living/shooting at 8,400 feet elevation then hunting at 40 feet usually requires an elevation adjustment. Have taken lots of different brands of scopes and have never had a failure or shift of zero. I always take a spare scope, even though I have ever had to use it. Most times rifles travel in a Tuff Pak enclosed in a soft case with never a damaged item.

Larry Sellers
SCI(International)Life Member
Sabatti 'trash' Double Shooter
R8 Blaser
DRSS

I have never had the POI change on any of my rifles.

Despite all the rough handling on safari.

i never have this problem. then again, i never take a rifle!!

Four trips in three countries, with a half dozen rifles. All Leupold scopes and no changes at all. Always figured the recoil of shooting them was worse than a porter dropping it tho, so shoot a lot before you go! On one other trip none of the three of us took rifles, and had issues with two out of three of the borrowed ones.

I wouldn't us a borrowed rifle if Christ came down from the cross

Trip over and back with no change in POI. Gun sat in my safe for a number of years. Used it this past deer season in the US, no shift in POI.

Win Mdl70 in .300WinMag
Leupold scope and mounts
HS Precision stock

Carl

On my first 9 trips across the pond I've never had a POI shift. All my scopes are Leupold. However, on my last trip (#10) I took two rifles in the same hard case. My 375 H&H was fine, but my .338 Win. was shooting high and to the right. It required an adjustment of several inches at 100 yds.

The interesting thing is the scope on the .338 Win. is a much newer Leupold than the old Vari XII on the .375 which held its zero fine.

Only time I have experienced a shift in POI was when I was going over a rifle before leaving and noticed the screws on the front ring were not as tight as I like. Not loose, just not torqued properly. Made the adjustment but had no time to shoot the rifle before we left.
When we shot it at camp it was shooting about 4 feet low. Probably gave the PH some pause when he saw the client not even near the target!

I have noticed that on four of my eight safaris that my .458 (leupold) and .300(Zeiss) have shot between 3 and 6 inches high. On two of the safaris my friends rifle with leupolds were also shooting high. I have never had to adjust for anything other than Height. The only thing we could think of was possibly the pressure in the plane, but then again it doesn't always happen.

quote:

Originally posted by Blair 338RUM:
I wouldn't us a borrowed rifle if Christ came down from the cross

i thought Christ was a fisher( of men), not a hunter. who knew? i guess i have been very lucky on the last 6-7 trips- 2 cape buffalo, 2 hippo, 2 crocs,1 mountain reedbuck,1 bushbuck, 1 common reedbuck, 1 elephant,2 bush pig,1 sable,1 suni,1 red duiker,1 western savannah buffalo,1 kob,1 leopard,1 kudu,1 gemsbok,1 springbok,1 jackal, 1 rusa stag( in New Caledonia). nothing wounded and escaped. all with camp rifles( and shotguns). damn, i am 1 lucky SOB!

My first and only trip was to Namibia in 2013.
Leupold scope & rings.
I had the same problem as Larryshores; rifle shooting high.
My PH said it's the altitude. My home and sight-in elevation is 350 ft. and I was hunting at 5,500+/- ft. in Namibia.
Made the adjustment and took five out of seven trophies with one shot,

Mauserk98

2008, Leupold VX3 mounted in Talley bases and QR rings on my 375 H&H shifted 2" left in a Tuffpack with another rifle.

2011, same rifle and scope in a Pelican case, no shift.

2013, same rifle and scope in the same Pelican case, no shift.

On my first trip to Namibia in 2012 I took two rifles: a Thompson Center ICON in .308 topped by a Leupold Vari-X III in 4.5 X 14 X 40 and a Winchester Model 70 in .300 WSM topped by a Leupold Vari-X III in 3.5 X 10 X 40. I bragged to the PH that the TC would shoot sub MOA all day. Well to my embarassment it shot more like 1 1/4" groups. The Model 70 shot the same 1 1/4" sized groups but with a lot more punch and flatter trajectory so that's what I shot all my game with. When I returned in 2013 I just brought the Model 70 in .300 WSM and it shot its usual 1 1/4" groups.

Does all the good and accurate info posted confuse you?

All the changes in POI, and others who found no change for similar scopes, transport packaging and so on, mentioned here can "probably" be explained!

1. If you set your telescope at 8 000 ft elevation and hunt near sea level [or the other way round] there is 8 000 feet less [or more] of rock to add to gravitational pull. It will increase [or decrease] the height of the POI.

2. If you set your telescope on a range where you shoot from North to a target South of your bench [or the other way round] and you are from the Northern hemisphere and you came to hunt in the Southern hemisphere, you should reverse the direction of shooting. If you don't, the Corriolis effect on the bullet spinning [at about 180 000 revs per minute] will deflect the bullet to the right [or to the left].

Naturally a combination of (1) and (2) can result, or not result in a change of height of POI, which may be up or down, or a left or right, or no shift of the POI. All of these changes, or lack of changes, are relatively easy to calculate and predict. [Newton's Law of Gravitation and other known physical laws.]

What is difficult to establish is the changes caused by either gorillas, or some even less intelligent creatures who handle - or mishandle - the rifles in your luggage, and the protective effect of different brands of scope mountings and rifle cases?

quote:

the Corriolis effect on the bullet spinning [at about 180 000 revs per minute] will deflect the bullet to the right [or to the left].

I really wouldn't expect much "Corriolis effect" at 100 yards..........


.

quote:

If you set your telescope at 8 000 ft elevation and hunt near sea level [or the other way round] there is 8 000 feet less [or more] of rock to add to gravitational pull. It will increase [or decrease] the height of the POI.

With instruments which are sensitive enough, scientists can actually measure tiny differences in gravity on the Earth's surface, differences which are far too small to make a measurable difference in the trajectory of a bullet. However, the difference in air pressure, meaning air density, can make a measurable difference in bullet POI. Barely.

According to the JBM ballistics calculator, a 180 grain .30 Nosler Partition fired at 2900 fps at sea level and zeroed at 100 yards drops 3.2 inches at 200 yards, rounded to the nearest 1/10th inch. At 5,000 feet altitude it drops . . . 3.1 inches. Once you reach 8,000 feet it drops a "staggering" 3.0 inches. So, in 8,000 feet of altitude difference, it makes only .2 inches, or less than one-tenth MOA difference in the zero at 200 yards. The difference increases with yardage, but most will check their zero at 100 yards or so, not 300 meters. Don't blame altitude for zero shift.

Most zero shift in transit can be traced to mount/rings which are not tightly torqued. Also, a sideways impact, as opposed to the fore-aft impact of recoil, can much more quickly change a scope's zero. Maybe some makes of scopes have reticle adjustments that can drift with vibration and/or impact. I don't know since I only use Leupolds. And sometimes, just sometimes, with a wooden stocked gun the significant changes in humidity during travel can shrink or swell a stock so the the zero is shifted (it's awfully dry and cold in that cargo hold at 38,000 feet.)

Bottom line: You never know if your zero is going to be the same when you get to your destination, whether it is Namibia or the Rockies or Patagonia. Always check your zero, because if you don't you won't be able to say "it was the altitude that screwed up my shot", or "gravity is just a lot stronger in Africa". Although I'd swear every time I try to get out of a chair these days that someone has turned up the gravity significantly in the last 20 years.

I've never experienced a shift in POI despite numerous trips to numerous places.

Most of my scopes are Leupolds but I've traveled and hunted with a number of Trijicons, Zeiss and Swarovski scopes as well. I prefer Talley rings and use them whenever possible. Ruger rings on my Rugers. Leupold bases and rings on several.

I use a Tuffpak or a Pelican Storm with custom cut interior.

I would bet that a shift in POI is most likely due to different temperature or altitude between home range and where you're hunting.

I used a Trijacon 1.25-4X24 nil change going over or comming back.

Three hunting trips to New Zealand and my Khales has taken the full impact of several falls on each trip, no change. Yet to see how the Ziess Victories and Aimpoints survive O/S trips. Shouldn't be a problem going by what they cop at home.

A good strong case should not be under eastimated.

In 64 years of using scopes on rifles I have never had a scope change zero internally, except on early pistol scopes. But I have had the point of impact change because of a rifle stock warping badly in Alaska rainy weather.

On one trip to Alaska where we did a 75 mile float on the Mulchatna River, and I bought one of those rifle shaped hard gun cases made for use on an ATV, because in September it rains in Alaska almost without letting up for weeks. The problem was thing has a place for a pad lock that let water fill the rifle case and it was about three days before we discovered the case was full of water.

The stock was so soaked that when I fired at a caribou at 200 yds I emptied the magazine without hitting the walking bou. I loaded one more round in the chamber and held on the bou’s nose in line with his eye and fired. That bullet broke both hind legs just above the knee joint, 5 feet to the right, and 3 feet low at 200 yds.

When I got back home I bought a synthetic stock and bedded the barreled action in it without changing the scope’s internal zero. When I go to the range to check the zero and it was shooting about two inches low, and 1 inch to the left at 100 yds. That was likely the fitting in the new stock not the scope.

I zeroed that scope and it has not changed in 20 years since! I still have that wood stock in my office as a reminder of that hunt.
.................................................................