The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting SCI Action on the elephant issueGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
| SCI Action on the elephant issue | Login/Join |
| One of Us |
I am happy with SCI for their response to this issue & believe they are doing their best to make a difference. They may be urinating into the wind, but I would rather them do what they are doing than nothing. Our U.S. senators & representatives are very powerful people when dealing with agencies that rely on them for funding. I recently had problems with 2 agencies here in our state over licenses that we needed for a business, on our own we could not get anything done. 1 call to our state senator & they started calling us letting us know just how quickly we could expect our licenses. Lobbying ain't just about passing laws! LORD, let my bullets go where my crosshairs show. Not all who wander are lost. NEVER TRUST A FART!!! Cecil Leonard | |||
|
| one of us |
Someone needs a more strategic plan than "just show up in DC on may 8." First of all, how many members of SCI are there, anyway? How many hunt elephants? Second, how do we get hunters of other game on our side? The issue should be protecting all hunting from capricious idiotic decisions, and not to allow elephants to be separated from rabbits. What about folding the whole thing under the NRA? SCI would talk to them. Third, how do we leverage the fact that most elephant hunters are RELATIVELY WELL FIXED, and in a position to support politicians? Fourth, there are a lot of congress people on our side. How do we get them to DO something? Finally, everyone here should be an NRA member (there is currently a $300 sale on being a Life Member), should register to vote, should vote for whichever Republican you like in the primaries, and vote for whomever the Republicans nominate in the general election. Doing otherwise is a vote for Obama (or Hillary), and a vote to end hunting. Indy Life is short. Hunt hard. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Outstanding! Thank you! . | |||
|
| One of Us |
Thank you Mike  "If you are not working to protect hunting, then you are working to destroy it". Fred Bear | |||
|
| One of Us |
The NRA is a one issue organization & I for one want them to continue fighting for my second amendment rights, not diluting themselves & their resources anywhere else. I certainly want to hunt an elephant & want to support others as well, but my 2nd amendment right protects my right to be a free man & that is way more important to me. SCI & DSC are the correct organizations to fight this issue. LORD, let my bullets go where my crosshairs show. Not all who wander are lost. NEVER TRUST A FART!!! Cecil Leonard | |||
|
| One of Us |
It is my understanding that the NRA does involve itself into hunter's issues promoting legislation to protect hunters rights, etc... No reason why they should not be involved. They carry a lot of clout as a lobbying organization. Dutch | |||
|
| One of Us |
Gentlemen: I recently hosted the NRA president on a turkey hunt. He told me of a new NRA initiative called the NRA Hunters Leadership Forum. I am told by the local NRA guy that the NRA is aware of this and will be involved. | |||
|
| One of Us |
NRA has bigger issue than the Elephant hunting/importing restriction. http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04...enge-to-the-nra.html Bloomberg has a lot more than this to go. I hate the fact I pay this f*cker $2000 a month for a terminal. I just cancelled one and now have one on contract. Mike | |||
|
| One of Us |
The following is the body of a letter written to my senators, congressman and forwarded to SCI. The day has been spent educating congressional staffers who have no clue but some at least seem to care. My letter is very narrow and certainly doesn't cover the entire situation but I feel it may be the only way I can successfully import the elephant. I am not sure what will happen but as Mike Jines mentioned, I will go down swinging as well. Dear Senator, On March 22, 2014, I travelled to Zimbabwe to hunt elephant. This has been a lifelong dream including years of saving money to afford this opportunity. Hunting elephant is legal in Zimbabwe and the proper licensing procedures were followed. On March 30, 2014, I was successful in taking an elephant. On April 4, 2014, United States Fish and Wildlife announced that legally taken sport-hunted elephant from Zimbabwe wouldn’t be allowed to enter the United States, and back-dated the effective date to January 1, 2014. http://www.fws.gov/news/ShowNe...2BC-DAE08807810E3C6B I have spent money to hunt elephant, been successful, and that money has now been changed into private property, i.e.: ivory, skin in various forms, etc. Due to a back-dated ruling by USFW, I cannot now bring that private property into my country or state. USFW has effectively “taken” my private property without compensation or due process contrary to the Fifth Amendment. As one of your constituents, I ask for your help in interceding with USFW on my behalf to allow my private property to legally enter the United States that I may enjoy that property in my home. Your Humble Constituent, | |||
|
one of us |
Good job. "There are worse memorials to a life well-lived than a pair of elephant tusks." Robert Ruark | |||
|
| One of Us |
If sci is only looking for members names, maybe they should not call them selves "SCI first for HUNTERS"? | |||
|
| Administrator |
From all the bullshit we hear from what SCI is doing for us, this should never have happened! Every time we ask where the money is going, we are told most goes for political "lobbying". So what happened here? | |||
|
| One of Us |
Saeed, I have to respectfully disagree. You have seen how many around here view the current US administration. Having them come up with something out of the blue with a lack of due diligence has been a habit of theirs for the past 6 or so years. How one could expect a lobbying group that is opposed to most of what they want to do to get an inside track on something that very few in the government would have known about until they decided to do it is unreasonable. I remember talking with Al Maki at the convention. He was quite concerned about Lion, but while he thought Elephant would be the next big push, he confidently told me that it couldn't happen for 2 years due to the due process required. He was wrong. They decided to do this outside of the proper way and channels. It goes to show us Americans need to be much more careful every other November than we have been. It can bollux up the rest of the world, unfortunately, if we don't. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Nice letter Wheels, you should sue. You have standing and I like the case. | |||
|
One of Us |
Very good point. Good for them. I haven't been an SCI member for years, and I do not always agree with everything they do, but I think that it is fine for it to take an independent stand. Others can join in, but if SCI has a strategy for which it feels it useful counting members in order to qualify for legal standing to sue, let's not complain about that. Norman Solberg International lawyer back in the US after 25 years and, having met a few of the bad guys and governments here and around the world, now focusing on private trusts that protect wealth from them. NRA Life Member for 50 years, NRA Endowment Member from 2014, NRA Patron from 2016. | |||
|
| One of Us |
+1000 This is far more effective that anything else. You can also get some real legal fire power form parties that actual care about the law and admistrative process. Mike | |||
|
| One of Us |
| |||
|
One of Us |
Now "that" is a true statement! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
|
One of Us |
You should spend a little less time looking in the rearview mirror and being critical and more time focused on the future and being constructive. Forget about what got us here, what would you do now? Call SCI names and pout? Take some of your energy spent complaining and criticizing and direct it to being more productive for once. Mike | |||
|
One of Us |
Hey Mike, I really respect your passion and desire to put bemoaning into action. If you look at the current state of society, it is actually surprising to me that we as International Sport Hunters, have had it so good, for so long. Despite the high cost of Safari hunting, it has been the dream of most of us here to hunt Africa. For the most part, this (AR) demographic has succeeded. Point here is; We are relics, we live in days gone by. Society has chosen leaders that represent them, their environmental and philosophical beliefs. Sport hunting is not one of them. My personal belief is that, there are just too few of us left. Most un-informed, rank and file Americans believe that Elephants are endangered as are Lions. We don't have the media, in fact, just the opposite is true. If a real conservation message were to get out, how would it get out? When I was on the BOD of the Phoenix Chapter, we realized something. There is a "Lost Generation" of American sportsman. That's when this started. Fathers quit sharing their passion for the outdoors with their sons and daughters. As CHC continually states, fighting amongst ourselves produces nothing but animosity. Best, Steve Formerly "Nganga" | |||
|
| One of Us |
I am ready to support almost anyone who will fight GFW , including SCI , dSc and NRA. All paid up. | |||
|
| One of Us |
The flaw in that logic is that it assumes that policy is made based on the views of society as a whole or a majority. That is a fallacy. Policy is made in many cases by a vocal, well organized and well funded minority. That has been the reality in politics for decades. We just need to play the game the way others play it to win. Mike | |||
|
| One of Us |
That is a fact...we are relics...remnants of the past. But for me...that is a proud fact as the past was a better time...but to never return.  But I am going to fight like hell to preserve what's left of it for as long as I breath air.  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
|
| One of Us |
I agree Mike. My point is that even though our leaders may not represent the majority opinion, on this issue, they do. Killing Elephants and Lions will absolutely never ever be accepted, regardless the science. That was my entire point on the whole Lion thing. "The first rule about fight club…Don't talk about fight club." I am a avid bicycle racer. I have my "Big 5" tattooed on my outer lower legs. I am a pariah in my sport because I chose to hunt, My son is chided at school because he is proud of his fathers hunting accomplishments. I'm not surrendering, I am simply laying out the facts. In order to mount a credible defense, one must completely understand his opponents strength's and his own weaknesses. Our weakness is numbers. Having science and the facts on our side won't do it. Public opinion is what needs to be swayed. All the facts show that global warming is a fallacy. That doesn't stop the "carbon credit" bunch from going crazy. Al Gore is worth 200 million dollars, brokering carbon credits. The same ol' responses from the same ol' bunch at SCI and the NRA will not do it. It needs to come from younger, more hip folks. Just look what happened to Donald Trumps sons for hunting. They didn't quit hunting, they quit talking about hunting. (Don't talk about fight club) Fucking social media is our enemy. Always has been and always will be. Even this venue in which we are discussing this right now is unhealthy for the betterment of our passions. Just the way I see things. Steve Formerly "Nganga" | |||
|
| One of Us |
Thanks. USFW must have agreed with you. With their new ruling I am a happy camper. Hopefully all or other parts of their ruling will be revised as well. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Original quote by MJines[/QUOTE] The flaw in that logic is that it assumes that policy is made based on the views of society as a whole or a majority. That is a fallacy. Policy is made in many cases by a vocal, well organized and well funded minority. That has been the reality in politics for decades. We just need to play the game the way others play it to win.[/QUOTE] Could not have hit it more precisely on the fucking head than that policy for years has not been made for the majority - its been made by/for the outspoken minorities Indians, Asians. Blacks, Hispanics, gays, religious zealots, save the whale, save the wild horse, Sierra Club, PETA, snails are life forms too, etc. What we need to figure out is what they are doing to get all the feds (and positive media) attention and start passing laws protecting our way of life and "alternative" lifestyle. Social media Has to be our tool just as it is for all the other minorities. Face the facts "WE" are a minority I think its a bit above my pay grade (intelligence)but I bet a couple guys on here can figure it out Its a awful good thing to have a couple full blown attorneys on our team | |||
|
| Powered by Social Strata | Page 1 2 |
 | Please Wait. Your request is being processed... |
|
The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting SCI Action on the elephant issue
Visit our on-line store for AR Memorabilia