quote:

I have no doubt that the union adds to the expense significantly.

Unions add to the expense of everything, especially in the oil industry.

The SCI convention used to be open to the public, but a bunch of anti-hunters showed up to disrupt it one year.

SCI made it members-only after that.


I left SCI ten years ago, so although the show will be ten minutes from my house, I won't be there.

George

From the TSRA news letter. I haven’t heard final numbers yet.
“Based on day-pass sales, it looks like attendance will be up nearly 20 percent from last year. Our preliminary estimate is 38,000, which is well above our final count of 32,000 in 2011,” said Ben Carter, DSC executive director. Carter added that the show’s exhibition area grew by 25 percent over last year. With 338,000 square feet in 2011, and 425,000 square feet in 2012, DSC added approximately 1-1/2 football fields’ worth of space to this year’s show, shattering old records.
Hans Vermaak of Coenraad Vermaak Safaris said, “Each year, this is the best show we do. The atmosphere here, the show management, the volunteers of DSC and the way they look after us as exhibitors, sets this show apart from the rest by 10,000 miles. And our sales this year were similar to last year, which means I’m very happy.”
Erwin Katze of Thormahlen & Cochran Safaris said, “We had an excellent show when traffic picked up after the first day. We were so busy on Saturday that we were unable to keep up with tidying and organizing our booth, but still we booked several big safaris. In fact, our hunt calendar is almost full now, just from this one show!”
Just a little update.
Bill

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I have no doubt that the union adds to the expense significantly.

Last year I was looking into exhibiting at a trade show in Vegas. They wanted $50.00 to rent a metal folding chair.....EACH.

It was made abundantly clear that if I didn't hire union guys to do absolutely everything and rent all of my gear from them, or if I even so much as swept my booth during the show I shouldn't expect anything I have delivered to the hotel to ever arrive or for anything I set up myself in my booth to still be there the following morning.

In the end I decided it wasn't worth it to go at all

quote:

Originally posted by Supercracker:

It was made abundantly clear that if I didn't hire union guys to do absolutely everything and rent all of my gear from them, or if I even so much as swept my booth during the show I shouldn't expect anything I have delivered to the hotel to ever arrive or for anything I set up myself in my booth to still be there the following morning.

How dare you not share this thug mentality! You don't support the middle class!

quote:

How dare you not share this thug mentality! You don't support the middle class!

I expect that mostly he doesn't support the union kickbacks to the DNC.

Me neither.

I don't think Cazador meant that literally. lol

Guys and gals, I like both shows. If you can afford to go to SCI you should go at least once. It isnt cheap but it is worth the price of admission. DSC has its own charm and grace and is lot cheaper but it is very different. I like the show there as well as SCI. SCI is bigger, and flashier, but it is hard to say better. It is comparing apples and oranges. I get to see an awful lot of friends there both hunters and exhibitors that dont all go to Dallas. I wouldnt go every year but it is nice every other to catch up with folks. Unless something changes unfortunately this year will not be one of them.

you mean you don't want to spend $20 each way on a taxi from damn near any hotel that doesn't have free shuttle service to the convention site? sounds damn near un-American! several exhibitors i talked to at Dallas said they have been warned not to even plug in the televisions in their booths. it must be done by a union electrician at a minimum $75 fee-INCLUDING TRAVEL TIME!. they also said they are not allowed to set up booth panels that extend beyond waist high- must be done by union carpenters again at outrageous fees. EVERY SINGLE EXHIBITOR I TALKED TO SAID THE SAME THING- IF THEY WEREN'T FORCED TO BECAUSE OF BUSINESS REASONS( I.E.- EXPOSURE) THEY WOULD NOT GO. $6000-10,000 a booth ( plus the extortion in the form of forced "donations") really eats in to any profits they make.

So SCI noticed how the unions fleece every Tom Dick and Harry, and decided ti jump on the bandwagon.

If you cannot beat them, join them!

Dont you guys have anything better to do than shit-can a pro-hunting organisation??? Every year, the same people, just like clockwork.

Well, if the orgenization shit cans its members, then we have no problems giving it back some of its own medicine

I dont see how they shit-can their own members?? The high cost of admission is supported by the exhibitors!!!

I was referring more to the whole premise that there is an adversarial relationship between DSC and SCI - when no such relationship exists. If you want to go to the DSC convention then go - if you want to go to SCI, then go. I just dont see why members here seem to like to spoil the fun of others going to or wanting to go to SCI.... makes no sense to me at all. We should be supporting all hunting groups. The constant bitching about SCI from members here who do not attend the convention makes me sick.

Someone also mentioned that DSC does not extort from exhibitors... If you are talking about forcing to donate then that is incorrect, it is simply not as upfront as SCI's methods.

SCI has many faults, DSC has faults too... and differences.

Well said Matt. It is high time we all quit bitching and started doing something positive. As for me I like both shows. If you don't,that is your choice but no reason to continually slam the organizations. Matt you in for the show like usual?

I thoroughly enjoy the SCI show and I've never been to DSC so I have nothing to compare it to. I think SCI is top notch and the show is worth every penny. My wife and I both look forward to it every year.

It will be interesting to see how SCI, first for hunters, will react to the recent lion issue.

Anyone who believes what SCI keeps telling us, "First For Hunters" is living in a dream world.

How many times have we asked where does the money go, and no one is able to give us any figures that prove it has gone towards conservation in Africa?

where does the money go? well lets see- to support an office building/staff in Washington, another office/museum/staff in Arizona, and a ranch/staff in Wyoming( that the average member is not allowed to use). to attend the convention costs about $400 including membership dues and daily fees as opposed to less than $100 to attend the DSC convention(no membership required). guess that about sums it up. i suppose anything left after that goes to conservation

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Smith:
Matt you in for the show like usual?

Yessir

It doesn't cost any member $400.00 to attend the SCI Show. The Museum in Tucson is World Class and open to All members and the Public as well. The building in Washington is where all the important "lobby action" takes place and is open to members as well. Been there done that. I have been to the ranch in Wyoming and enjoyed my stay there. Our Chapter and most all the others have sent 100's of school teachers to the ranch for a week of intensive exposure and introduction to hunting, fishing, shooting and many other outdoor activities that they take back to their classrooms to counter the error filled, anti hunting bullshit coming from the Liberal teachers who make up so much of our classrooms in todays times. The "average" member can and does use ALL of the things you mentioned as not available to them. What a crock of BS.

So jdollar, the only thing you got right is that it might cost less than $100.00 to attend DSC!!! Wow, that's impressive.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:
where does the money go? well lets see- to support an office building/staff in Washington, another office/museum/staff in Arizona, and a ranch/staff in Wyoming( that the average member is not allowed to use). to attend the convention costs about $400 including membership dues and daily fees as opposed to less than $100 to attend the DSC convention(no membership required). guess that about sums it up. i suppose anything left after that goes to conservation

Now we are getting conflicting reports, so let us get the facts right.

Let us assume I am not a member of SCI, and I would like to go see the show with my family.

I arrive at the door, with my wife and two kids.

How much would it cost me to get in?

Saeed - If referring to my comment, and I suspect you are.
I stated that it does not cost any member ( as in 1 member, singular in English) $400.00 to gain entrance to the SCI Convention. Of course if you bring a spouse and 2 children it will cost more than $400.00. Not rocket science, pure math and common sense. If you and your wife and 2 kids will be coming to the SCI Convention in Las Vegas I am sure you can contact SCI direct and get the total from them.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Now we are getting conflicting reports, so let us get the facts right.

Let us assume I am not a member of SCI, and I would like to go see the show with my family.

I arrive at the door, with my wife and two kids.

How much would it cost me to get in?

If an individual wishes to attend the entire Convention (4 day pass) since it is after 12/19/11 it will cost $310.

Said individual will also need to join SCI. A one year Membership costs $65.

$375 Total

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Now we are getting conflicting reports, so let us get the facts right.

Let us assume I am not a member of SCI, and I would like to go see the show with my family.

I arrive at the door, with my wife and two kids.

How much would it cost me to get in?

According to FOsteology it looks like the price of the privilege to walk the SCI walk with your family will set you back $1500.

OK, let us put things in perspective then.

For a family to attend SCI.

(4x310) + (4x65) = $1,500

Can some one tell me what it would cost to attend DSC for the same family?

DSC Four Day Pass = $50.00 per person

No Membership required.

Total for family of Four = $200

quote:

Originally posted by FOsteology:
If an individual wishes to attend the entire Convention (4 day pass) since it is after 12/19/11 it will cost $310.

Said individual will also need to join SCI. A one year Membership costs $65.

$375 Total

$375 for ONE person ? (Stated above)

Total cost 4 persons = $375 x 4 = $1,500

Elementary mathematics and daylight robbery but for a good cause I suppose.

If Show entry "cost" is your only shallow concern, then by all means attend DSC. It's a good Show, go and have fun.

The total cost for me to attend DSC, airfare, hotel room, transportation to and from the Show and Show entry fee is $925.00.

To attend SCI in Las Vegas, airfare, hotel room, Membership fee and Show entry fee is $755.00. FWIW the hotel situation in Vegas is way better than Dallas. Dining spots are also better in LV and there are no Show transportation costs involved if you stay at Mandalay Bay, Excalibur or the Luxor hotels.

This cost is based on 4 nights lodging, 4 days at the Show and any Membership dues, departing from Albuquerque, NM and return for each destination.

Total cost would not be a consideration on attending either Show. I would simply attend the one that I was most interested in.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

"Someone also mentioned that DSC does not extort from exhibitors... If you are talking about forcing to donate then that is incorrect, it is simply not as upfront as SCI's methods."

Matt, I have refused to join in this discussion, for many of the reasons that you mentioned - there is no adversarial relationship between DSC and SCI. We have the same goals. I have many friends within SCI and have great respect for what the organization does.

I do take issue with your statement above - DSC, does not require donations from exhibitors. Period. Donations are one factor, way, of many, that are reviewed when booth location is to be determined. DSC doesn't extort anything from anybody, and frankly, I'm surprised that anyone would make such a claim, particularly in a post decrying attacks on a hunting organization.

Richard T. Cheatham
President
DSC

quote:

Originally posted by Ricardo:
"Someone also mentioned that DSC does not extort from exhibitors... If you are talking about forcing to donate then that is incorrect, it is simply not as upfront as SCI's methods."

Matt, I have refused to join in this discussion, for many of the reasons that you mentioned - there is no adversarial relationship between DSC and SCI. We have the same goals. I have many friends within SCI and have great respect for what the organization does.

I do take issue with your statement above - DSC, does not require donations from exhibitors. Period. Donations are one factor, way, of many, that are reviewed when booth location is to be determined. DSC doesn't extort anything from anybody, and frankly, I'm surprised that anyone would make such a claim, particularly in a post decrying attacks on a hunting organization.

Richard T. Cheatham
President
DSC

Hey Richard

Thanks for the clarification. I certainly wasnt suggesting that DSC extorts anything from exhibitors - no, no, no.... I was just saying that SCI has a much more formalised system - they do not extort either. I am not complaining at all about DSC, not in the least. It is is what it is - as you say in the USA - and all of the complaints I hear from exhibitors are actually with the SCI system and not with DSC!! That says a lot in my opinion. I apologise if I wasnt very clear.

DSC put on another great show... well done to your crew!!

Cheers!!
Matt

Thanks Matt and good luck in Las Vegas and Coffs Harbour. I hope your 2012 season is a good one and look forward to seeing you in January.

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Sellers:
If Show entry "cost" is your only shallow concern, then by all means attend DSC. It's a good Show, go and have fun.

The total cost for me to attend DSC, airfare, hotel room, transportation to and from the Show and Show entry fee is $925.00.

To attend SCI in Las Vegas, airfare, hotel room, Membership fee and Show entry fee is $755.00. FWIW the hotel situation in Vegas is way better than Dallas. Dining spots are also better in LV and there are no Show transportation costs involved if you stay at Mandalay Bay, Excalibur or the Luxor hotels.

This cost is based on 4 nights lodging, 4 days at the Show and any Membership dues, departing from Albuquerque, NM and return for each destination.

Total cost would not be a consideration on attending either Show. I would simply attend the one that I was most interested in.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

Larry,

Not being a smartass, but which hotel are you staying in for that cheap. I can fly from Lafayette on Allegiant for under $150.00 RT but the hotel cost are over $300 per night for Friday and Saturday.

Comparing SCI with DSC is just like comparing chalk and cheese.

I cannot remember hearing ANY of the exhibitors and visitors to DSC complaining about much.

Those exhibiting and visiting SCI have a lot to complain about.

Add to that the fact that shady characters - like Out of Africa and Mark Sullivan - have been banned from attending DSC for years, while SCI was more than happy not just to let them exhibit, but actively support them - as in the case of Out of Africa.

Hey Mike, no problem, glad to share where and how much. Flying Southwest Airlines and staying at the Excalibur hotel in Vegas. The Luxor was a few bucks more and Mandalay Bay was quite a bit more. I booked a Southwest Vacation package for airfare and hotel (4 nights) for a total of $425.00. Did this about two months ago but saw the same deal a week or so ago. I used the same criteria in comparing the DSC, Dallas trip and it was a lot more expensive. Hotels and airlines are very willing and able to promote Las Vegas with this type of deal.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by Mike70560:

quote:

Originally posted by Larry Sellers:
If Show entry "cost" is your only shallow concern, then by all means attend DSC. It's a good Show, go and have fun.

The total cost for me to attend DSC, airfare, hotel room, transportation to and from the Show and Show entry fee is $925.00.

To attend SCI in Las Vegas, airfare, hotel room, Membership fee and Show entry fee is $755.00. FWIW the hotel situation in Vegas is way better than Dallas. Dining spots are also better in LV and there are no Show transportation costs involved if you stay at Mandalay Bay, Excalibur or the Luxor hotels.

This cost is based on 4 nights lodging, 4 days at the Show and any Membership dues, departing from Albuquerque, NM and return for each destination.

Total cost would not be a consideration on attending either Show. I would simply attend the one that I was most interested in.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

Larry,

Not being a smartass, but which hotel are you staying in for that cheap. I can fly from Lafayette on Allegiant for under $150.00 RT but the hotel cost are over $300 per night for Friday and Saturday.

Kinda hard to compare the two when one has not been to either venue, huh? Relying on internet hearsay, long distance complaints and such without knowing the facts first hand must be a real gift?

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Comparing SCI with DSC is just like comparing chalk and cheese.

I cannot remember hearing ANY of the exhibitors and visitors to DSC complaining about much.

Those exhibiting and visiting SCI have a lot to complain about.

Add to that the fact that shady characters - like Out of Africa and Mark Sullivan - have been banned from attending DSC for years, while SCI was more than happy not just to let them exhibit, but actively support them - as in the case of Out of Africa.

Larry,

I get quite a few visitors here who are either on their way to the shows, or are on their way back.

And without exception, everyone complains about SCI and the unions.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Comparing SCI with DSC is just like comparing chalk and cheese.

I cannot remember hearing ANY of the exhibitors and visitors to DSC complaining about much.

Those exhibiting and visiting SCI have a lot to complain about.

Add to that the fact that shady characters - like Out of Africa and Mark Sullivan - have been banned from attending DSC for years, while SCI was more than happy not just to let them exhibit, but actively support them - as in the case of Out of Africa.

Sullivan is 'shady' and was 'banned' from attending DSC?? Really??

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Larry,

I get quite a few visitors here who are either on their way to the shows, or are on their way back.

And without exception, everyone complains about SCI and the unions.

Complains perhaps but the waiting list is long....

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Graham:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Larry,

I get quite a few visitors here who are either on their way to the shows, or are on their way back.

And without exception, everyone complains about SCI and the unions.

Complains perhaps but the waiting list is long....

EVERYONE complains, but there is still a LOOOONG waiting list, so it cant be that bad or that unprofitable for the exibitors.....