quote:

Originally posted by AB109:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:

Actually, there are many of us "more discerning hunters" trying to get the most out of their hunting bucks wanting the best hunting EXPERIENCE regardless of the animal's spread.

Yup. I agree.

I have killed a pile of buffalo including plenty over 40. My best experience was on a bull that was probably 37. I would not trade that experience for the world.

My widest was 46.5, taken 5 minutes out of camp the first day of a hunt. I much prefer the 37.

That sums it up ! Exactly. This inch crap must stop. Its not a competition its the hunting experience. Some people just don't get it.[/QUOTE]

careful!

SCI and their cheerleaders do not like to hear this!

SCI has single handedly turn hunting into a competition!

"MINE IS BIGGER THAN YOURS" has become their ultimate goal

I respectfully disagree on the issue that horn size is not important !

I all my years of hunting African game I have never come across a situation where a hunter simply takes a shot at "anything" in a herd and then pats himself on the back for shooting something and it being a "great hunt".

Maybe we can argue it was a " great shoot".

Hunting big game is not bird shooting.... it is the willful concerted targeting of a particular animal in a herd. Not just any animal !
Ie passing up on just any shot for a particular shot.

Perhaps it lies in what some would perceive the difference between hunting and shooting.

Its different when we shoot purely for meat, we would often refer to what we see as "meat bulls"

The issue at hand is that certain traits, in this case large horn size is lost in the process of hunting / shooting on enclosed herds.

Not only horn size but a selection for small sized bulls only or worse specimens that are not hardy. There is concern for instance on the effect the Hoof and mouth fences are having on the overall Brindled gnu populations and genetic quality in Botswana

Most of Africa's successful domestic herds are the result of breeding for a trait. This manipulation can be beneficial as for instance in the Bonsmara cattle breed or it can be negative.
The very same is applicable to Africa's wild herds !

It is not the case of "simply taking a shot at anything" - The bull must be OLD - that is the argument. It is often harder to find an old bull rather than a wide young heard bull.

Exactly !

In a herd of animals the age and sex distribution is finite and as maturity in terms of horn hardness is typically reached by 8 years shooting mature bulls from that herd very quickly depletes the pool of what was traditionally seen as shootable bulls. It does not take long before all the mature bulls are shot and all that left are the immature.

Looking at trophy pictures of bulls shot on some of these ranches or on some non ranch hunts its obvious that immature and lesser quality animals are being hunted.

This was both predicted and predictable and years before those who studied the viability of game ranches warned against this happening.

We should not lose sight of the fact that today all of Africa's wildlife occur within islands or sanctuaries surrounded human habitation. In most cases the human population density is very high

All of Africa's reserves are in fact "farms" albeit some very large. Buffalo are unique in that they have to be contained and physically separated from domestic animals because of the diseases they carry

I heard there were quite a few who returned home without getting their buff this year in Zim.Everyone got theirs where I was hunting but other outfitters or areas did not do so well.Leopard too.

Problem with bigger is better got out of hand, due solely to SCI!

We have seen so many young bulls that have wide spreads, which according to SCI are great trophies, but in reality they are not.

So many times I have shot very old animals which looked rather sick, or animals with broken horns.

Rather than shoot a young animal that according to SCI is a better trophy.

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
I heard there were quite a few who returned home without getting their buff this year in Zim.Everyone got theirs where I was hunting but other outfitters or areas did not do so well.Leopard too.

Didn‘t see a single buffalo in October.

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Originally posted by Sunshine:

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
I heard there were quite a few who returned home without getting their buff this year in Zim.Everyone got theirs where I was hunting but other outfitters or areas did not do so well.Leopard too.

Didn‘t see a single buffalo in October.

Very sad to hear this.

But I understand that some unscrupulous operators in Zimbabwe have been practicing a scorched earth policy on their concessions!