Hello is it safe to hunt there at the moment ,i have been told the border with RSA is chaotic at the moment ! any other info on conditions in Zim at the moment etc Thankyou

I just spoke recently with many of the Zim PHs and have no fear at all to go. I am actually going in April to hunt Jumbo around Matetsi.

I think the only issue are the apparant illegals attempting to get into SA. I am not sure I would ever drive to Zim anyway but if you do, be with someone that knows the ropes.

We drove into and out of Zim through Beitbridge last July. It is an experience in dealing with the masses of black humanity, but being with the PH coming and going, it wasn't too bad. He knew the right people and greased the right hands.

Driving through biet bridge is an experience I try to avoid as much as possible. Biet bridge in July is bearable...bietbridge in summer is hell!

As for the rest...yup Harare is alot safer than Jo'berg- you may get your pocket picked if you go alone into the markets and slum areas but at least they will not kill you for your wallet and cell phone.

Out of the cities? Isolated incidents in some of the more densly settled tribal areas (where there is no hunting anyway), but the violence is aimed at the local peasants not at visitors. I haven't heard of any hunters having a run in with the malitia since 2002.

Hi Tank. The Beitbridge Border post is always a bit chaotic, but if your PH knows the system it is easily navigated. Dont use the so called Runners as they are more hassle than its worth and normally cause you a headache.

With regards general safety, Ganyana got it spot on when he said Harare is very safe and your hunting areas will be even safer.

Liase with your PH or your agent. Good operators will keep their clients and agents appraised of the situation and any changes all the time

I would keep an eye on the situation, with elections scheduled for this year and North Africa in flames, there may be some "action" in Zim, which is in pretty much the same situation as Libya (two tribes, dictator, police state, starving people with nothing to lose etc.)

How can you relate the Libya issue ( far North of Zim ) to what we have going in our industry.....Zimbabwe s a non violent/ non confrontational country which you would know if you lived here.......... your comments are inflammatory!!

Martin

quote:

Originally posted by Russ Gould:
I would keep an eye on the situation, with elections scheduled for this year and North Africa in flames, there may be some "action" in Zim, which is in pretty much the same situation as Libya (two tribes, dictator, police state, starving people with nothing to lose etc.)

Martin,

I agree with you 100%. The post above is in the running for the most Moronic Statement of the Year award.

Totally agree with Martin and Jack!!

A surprisingly ignorant statement by Russ.

Tank,

To help answer your question, two friends of mine made the trip to Malapati late last week. They reported absolutely no problems.

The word came back from Nixon that big ivory hit the ground yesterday, on day 2 or day 3 of their hunt. Hopefully some details to follow.

So if you were thinking about going, I would not hesitate because of safety issues.

Good hunting!

I agree 150% with Martin and even more with Jack's comment.

In all my travels to Zimbabwe have I always felt safe and people are friendly and very accommodating. I feel more safe and at home in Zimbabwe than in South Africa. Martin is right, the people in Zimbabwe do not even argue. You cannot compare Libya, or any other country for that matter, with Zimbabwe.

Theo

Tank,
Put it this way- I feel safer walking at night in Harare than I do in many parts of London. It's a great place. You'll have a ball.

quote:

I would keep an eye on the situation, with elections scheduled for this year and North Africa in flames, there may be some "action" in Zim, which is in pretty much the same situation as Libya (two tribes, dictator, police state, starving people with nothing to lose etc.)

I disagree with the comparison to the situation in North Africa and the Mid East, chiefly because the vast majority of Zimbabweans (Shona, Matabele or whites) are Pacific people. Besides, ZBC is giving very little air time to the protests.....

I do think you have a point regarding the elections however. It's far from sure that they'll be held this year and at the moment the argument is over whether or not a new electoral roll should be created.
When the elections are held -this year or next- it will be tense. I was in Harare during the 08 elections and, although I never felt in danger, there was an undeniable tension.

Anyway, Tank, you won't regret going to Zimbabwe and if you do go through Beitbridge just enjoy the ride--and don't use the runners as someone else said.

In reference to Beitbridge, what are "the runners" people are refering to?

Haven't been near Beitbridge in 8 years....it was "chaotic" , whatever that means, then....soooo?
Rather walk the streets of downtown Bulawayo than downtown Atlanta but would not recommend either after dark!

quote:

In reference to Beitbridge, what are "the runners" people are refering to?

They hang round the border, primarily the S.A side, and offer to get people across for a fee (mainly targeting whites). They say they will make your journey hassle free but usually further complicate an already hectic situation.

Hey Guys

Dont be toooooo hard on Russ ..

IMHO what he is saying is not out of the realms of poossibilty .... If you care to analise the ZIM situation carefully it is ripe for a upheavel with the main theme to get BOB r'soled out of power ..

WE all know the majority want him gone so what is there to lose by getting a bit angry and see what eventuates, nothing wrong with a peoples revolution (TEA PARTY) to get a BIT MORE sanity back into ZIMS ..

Lets face reality, the economy needs a bit more investment from outside, and if BOB goes it will sure help.

Cheers, Peter

quote:

Originally posted by Russ Gould:
I would keep an eye on the situation, with elections scheduled for this year and North Africa in flames, there may be some "action" in Zim, which is in pretty much the same situation as Libya (two tribes, dictator, police state, starving people with nothing to lose etc.)

You were either drunk (which makes the post understandable) or ignorant making that statement. Your credibility:- deduct 50 credit points.

Runners will do all the paper work for you. The locals (whites) use them a lot and people we know in Bulawayo have never had any problems with runners. We self drove a borrowed van through Beitbridge from the south in Oct 2008. Yes it is chaotic and takes time. We did our own paperwork. We got some help from a local Aff and gave him R10. He naturally was very pleased.

Our borrowed van broke down on the northern side of the Zim post and we had to turn back. The Zim police came out and helped push it back through the border post towards the RSA side where some young missionaries got it started for us. Oportos for a feed at Messina was a welcome sight after a long day.

Edit: Doing God's work in No Mans Land.



We found the immigration people helpful and friendly and very proud to work for their country. As in any African country, the worst thing to do is get impatient and start jumping up and down and demanding this and that. It gets you nowhere and is just quite simply rude in someone elses country.

I will use a runner next time.

We eventually flew Air Zim to Bulawayo at half the price of the SAA ticket without problems. The kids thought it was high adventure.

quote:

Originally posted by Jack D Bold:

quote:

Originally posted by Russ Gould:
I would keep an eye on the situation, with elections scheduled for this year and North Africa in flames, there may be some "action" in Zim, which is in pretty much the same situation as Libya (two tribes, dictator, police state, starving people with nothing to lose etc.)

Martin,

I agree with you 100%. The post above is in the running for the most Moronic Statement of the Year award.

Also Agreed!!! 100% safe in Zim, as it always has been.

For when in 2011 are the Zim elections scheduled?

Let me partially answer my own question! A quick internet sweep indicates that an election date has not been set at this time. Additionally there seems to be some rumbling that the election may not be held in 2011 at all. Apparently an election was not to be held until a new constitution is in place, and that seems to be a long way off.

I know there are many here who are more knowledgeable than I, and probably more up to date than old internet reports, so I certainly would appreciate the info.

Folks, on the question of runners, be very very careful. If you pick a good one who is in with the customs officials you are fine, however there are a great many that have nothing to do with the customs guys and are merely fly by nites who are just after a quick buck. I know plenty of people who have been taken for a ride and lost a whole heap of money. Be careful when choosing if you insist on using a runner!!!!

Sorry to go off topic here- What are peoples thoughts on investing in Zimbabwe should the MDC win the election?

Tendai Biti (Finance Minister) believes foreign direct investment will jump to 45% of GDP in a more stable political environment and a lot of people have already done very well from investent in Zim, including British investment banks which made billions over the the last two years.

Thoughts?

Another thought, mainly for the guys living in Zim- If the MDC are elected to power, what are the chances of indigenization laws coming into effect?

Cheers,
Sam Wise

Living in Africa , there are always going to be laws pertaining to Indigenization and local developement etc. I think the crux of the matter is that no body takes exception to these laws as long as they are carefully thought out, practical and above all, can be implemented to IMPROVE lives rather than destroy business. The current bill is simply to allow Zanu PF to grab further assets in order to bestow riches on their cronies and supporters. In their eyes, Indigenization gives them the right to take 51% of any business that fits the crieria and bestow any partner they like upon that business, even though there is no provision for such action within the Act. Whilst MDC may promote Indigenization, their policies do not dictate majority percentages, nor do they enforce partner allocation.

I have used runner's a few time and Zim hit it right on the nose the right runner can save you time and aggravation the wrong one can ruin your day.

quote:

Originally posted by martin pieters:
How can you relate the Libya issue ( far North of Zim ) to what we have going in our industry.....Zimbabwe s a non violent/ non confrontational country which you would know if you lived here.......... your comments are inflammatory!!

Martin

"....non violent/non confrontational country", what a load of cocky shit!!

What about the eviction from their properties and farms and in many cases MURDER of so many whites, many of whom I know? Try making the above statement to them. I am sure they may have a contrary view.

No doubt your statement is, as you would put it, "inflammatory" to those poor folk.

Maybe you are a protected species, or conveniently choose to ignore the truth......for whatever reason.

Gee, the Mutal Admiration Society turns on one of its own.

So the genocide of the Matabele in the 80s ... was that "pacific" and "non-violent"? Don't think for a minute they have forgotten.

Not saying it's going to come apart in 2011, just saying that "revolution" is in the air in Africa, and when the strong man goes the lid comes off. Seen that too many times.

Hate to be "confrontational" myself, but don't take kindly to being called a "moron" by people who haven't spent a fraction of the time I have spent in Southern Africa.

Just returned from Zim. Crossing the bridge on the SA side is orderly and easy. The Zim side is an unorganized mess. Just take your time and ask questions patiently if you get confused. Expect about 2 hours to get your vehicle paperwork, customs, immigration, and rifle permits. Just keep smiling and be polite and respectful.

Dont worry Russ about being ridiculed ... you have my vote totally and I know Zims reasonably well having lived there for over 20+ years in the good days. Have visited often and have relatives still living there.

Those whom think they know how peaceful it is are proberbly those whom have hunted there and not lived for long periods and faced the reality of life in the zone. A hunting visit will NOT tell you about life in Zim's only a snapshot of a safari operation

There are also others with possibly some self interest whom think the new zimbabwe is a bed of roses. They IMHO are living either in a dream world or wearing blinkers. Talk to some of the ex; farmers whom are now living in Zambia about the regime and how it treats the people. They can only do so for a while and the tide will turn and it wont be that pretty for those whom have entrenced themselves and are subverting the economy

Cheers, Peter

Of course Zim is not a bed of roses, but it has to rank very high on the list of the SAFEST places in the world to live. Ja, I hear all of what those who used to live here or have been here have to say, but the fact of the matter is that Zimbos ARE generally non-violent. Ask me, I have always lived here and am now busy walking around the country, meeting all and sundry en route. I would not try that in ANY other African country, would you? Who are all these many white people who were murdered that you knew John Frederick? Yes, people have been murdered, but more are murdered in SA in a month than those murdered here in ten years.....Get real - you are the one full of cocky shit, as you put it. Somehow I think I'd rather go with Martin Pieter's view of present day Zim than yours....And somehow I think Martin Pieters knows many more displaced farmers and other victims than you.... Africa is topsy turvy, from Cape to Cairo, but there is nowhere on this continent I'd rather be than right here! Yeeha! I guess I must also be a protected species, along with all the other white folks who chose to remain and, all the issues we have aside, still enjoy a fantastic life.
David

quote:

Originally posted by Balla Balla:
Dont worry Russ about being ridiculed ... you have my vote totally and I know Zims reasonably well having lived there for over 20+ years in the good days. Have visited often and have relatives still living there.

I hate to burst your bubble balla, but you obviously don't know Zim very well, if you only lived here during the good days...

quote:

Originally posted by Balla Balla:


Those whom think they know how peaceful it is are proberbly those whom have hunted there and not lived for long periods and faced the reality of life in the zone.

Wrong. The vast majority of us still living here KNOW that Zim is generally peaceful. You should see how worked up Zimbos get about making a trip to SA, because of the danger involved!

quote:

Originally posted by Balla Balla:


There are also others with possibly some self interest whom think the new zimbabwe is a bed of roses. They IMHO are living either in a dream world or wearing blinkers.

How insulting to those who are still here trying to keep the ship afloat. For your information, I do have self interest here (this is my home - who doesn't have self interest in their homeland, duh!), but I (and every one else here) do not think it's a bed of roses....Where do you get this crap from? We know we have major problems, but we also don't like it when clueless outsiders blow it out of all proportion. Inform yourself, spend an extended time here right now and then trumpet your opinion, by all means. For now, I'll go with what the guys on the ground are saying...

David,

If you are tying to keep the ship afloat then there must be a bloody great hole in it. We across the border admire your tenacity but telling us that it is safe and generally peaceful is stretching it somewhat. For you maybe.

Many think that Zim is a simmering pot that could quickly boil over and therefore it is potentially hazardous.

Forgot one important distinction between Libya and Zim ... the latter has no oil. Perhaps that's why successive US governments, while "condemning" just about every other strong man leader in the world, say nothing about the mess they helped engineer in Zim. Carter was the architect and Andrew Young was the contractor.

Another salient point: Mugabe collected up all the AKs after Lancaster House. So the opposition has no arms, and no nearby country is sympathetic enough to help in that regard. The tone in Botswana is decidedly anti-Mugabe though.

The risk is that the army will revolt. That was dicey when there was no money in the country. Now, however, in a twist of fate, Zim has discovered substantial diamond fields. Now where else do you find diamonds in Africa .... oh right, Congo. This raises the stakes for the ruling party, they won't be going quietly.

As for the whites, you are not a political target per se unless you still have land or a juicy business. But there are high level people in the Zim gov't who refer to you as "cockroaches". Remember the Jews in Germany. (And this comment applies equally to RSA, where an unofficial genocide is already under way.)

Having said that, I hope that I am wrong. Best scenario is Mugabe vreks, MDC takes over and adopts sensible land and economic policies, foreign aid and investment pours in, and Zim rebounds. There are a lot of other plausible (and ugly) scenarios though.

Zimbos, don't take this personally. I have a lot of empathy for you guys, particularly the farmers that lost their farms. At one time I was also an optimist, almost bought a place in Zim. But guys, sometimes you can't see the bush for the trees.

David

Without getting too antaganistic ..

If it was that great for the (majority of the folks) there PRAY tell me why have hundreds of thousands gapped it over the border to RSA. We see them daily wondering around local border towns and even JNB as they are escaping the regime and the economy. How many millions in Zims dont have work, and how many are in the under 20 age bracket. Those figures are a sure recipie for pending doom I believe. Of course I would like to be proved wrong but i am a realist and the figures dont look good even to the most optimistic of us.

God you dont even have your own currency there, surly that tells you something !

The tourists also seem to be flocking a lot more to Zambia then Zim's when they visit the Vic Falls region.

Cheers, Peter

Let me weigh in on the side of the hard working, persevering Zimbos that continue to try and make a go of it despite the disaster that is their government. I have absolutely no reservations in traveling to Zim. I have gone there the last four years and will be going again in a couple of months. Several years ago we were there two weeks before the elections. Everyone was polite, courteous and hospitable. We drove from the far western part of the country to Harare and never felt threatened or endangered. My hat is off to the good people of Zim, black and white, that struggle to hold on to their country and make a living and do it with a sense of humor to boot.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Let me weigh in on the side of the hard working, persevering Zimbos that continue to try and make a go of it despite the disaster that is their government. I have absolutely no reservations in traveling to Zim. I have gone there the last four years and will be going again in a couple of months. Several years ago we were there two weeks before the elections. Everyone was polite, courteous and hospitable. We drove from the far western part of the country to Harare and never felt threatened or endangered. My hat is off to the good people of Zim, black and white, that struggle to hold on to their country and make a living and do it with a sense of humor to boot.

I'll be there too. Third time in three years with plans for a fourth time in 2012.

quote:

Originally posted by Balla Balla:
David

Without getting too antaganistic ..

If it was that great for the (majority of the folks) there PRAY tell me why have hundreds of thousands gapped it over the border to RSA. We see them daily wondering around local border towns and even JNB as they are escaping the regime and the economy. How many millions in Zims dont have work, and how many are in the under 20 age bracket. Those figures are a sure recipie for pending doom I believe. Of course I would like to be proved wrong but i am a realist and the figures dont look good even to the most optimistic of us.

God you dont even have your own currency there, surly that tells you something !

The tourists also seem to be flocking a lot more to Zambia then Zim's when they visit the Vic Falls region.

Cheers, Peter

Peter
With all due respect, it doesnt help that your very own government has openly welcomed black Zimbabweans in the lead up to the World Cup as a source of cheap labour. It also doesnt help that despite the very obvious and apparent human rights abuses in Zimbabwe, Mbeki and now Zuma stand steadfastly to one side and continue to support Mugabe. I dont expect you to ridicule your own country, but please dont stand by and ridicule people when they stand by the good points in their home land.
Zimbabwe has many many problems and issues that hopefully one day will be resolved for everyones good. It is still however our home and there is a great deal of good to be found across the whole country.

Personally I think your comments are an afront to any Zimbabwean. Why do you still live in South Africa. The answer is simple. Its your choice to do so. You dont however find Zimbabweans telling you that you live in a dream world or wear blinkers when you as a South African choose to ignore your soaring crime rates, escalating cost of living , impending land problems and above all the loss of thousands of white farmers lives with little or no reaction from Government.

I have been bringing clients to Zimbabwe for over 14 years and have never ever had a single problem in terms of violence or anti feelings toward them. Zimbabwe certainly isnt perfect, but what country is??. Certainly those in glass houses should not throw stones. Especially those who used to live here and now stand elsewhere and make public judgements on those that chose to stay. Us Zimbos refer to such people as When We's. I am sure you are familiar with the term.