I have decided that I need to work on a rifle to cover bigger animals up to Cape buffalo .As I own a 9.3x62 and 375 Ruger my intention is to use one of these .
My first question is which would you choose between ; 9.3x62 or 375 Ruger .

Second question is would you recommend 320gn projectiles in the 9.3x62 for Cape buffalo or stick to 286 gn . Similarly would you opt for 350gn in the 375 Ruger .

Mark

I can guarantee you will not see any difference in performance between these two.

And my suggestion is stick with standard bullets weights for that caliber.

286 and 300 grains.

Just make sure you pick a good bullet, and in my case it would have to be a HP copper of your choice.

Best of luck.

quote:

Originally posted by mark smith:
I have decided that I need to work on a rifle to cover bigger animals up to Cape buffalo .As I own a 9.3x62 and 375 Ruger my intention is to use one of these .
My first question is which would you choose between ; 9.3x62 or 375 Ruger .

Second question is would you recommend 320gn projectiles in the 9.3x62 for Cape buffalo or stick to 286 gn . Similarly would you opt for 350gn in the 375 Ruger .

Mark

I use a .375 Ruger for buffalo and plains game and I highly rate it. I reload myself and generally shoot 200 grain GS Custom rounds for plains game. With the lighter bullet it shoots around 3100 fs. I load 265 gr GS Custom for buffalo at 2800 fs and it’s deadly on buffalo. I agree with Saeed, not much difference in those calibers. I absolutely rate a 375 Ruger though.

Woodleigh hydrostatics.
Quality Oz made bullets.

Best projectiles for Cape buffalo? Those that goes through the heart!

Killed several cape buffalo and see others emphatically taken with 300grn 9.3 Swift A Frames

270 or 300gn TSX in the Ruger. They are a considerably smaller animal than Aussie water buffalo. Closer to banteng in size. Up to around 900kg. I used a 270gn Woodleigh PP on banteng and it made it through to the skin on the opposite side of the chest.

Northfork "Cup Point Solid"

Swift A-Frame, Trophy Bonded, TSX, CEB....take your pick, or whichever shoots best.

Depends on the twist of the barrels. Long-for-caliber bullets (over 300) require a faster twist.

9.3x62 is not a high vel caliber so you don't need super strong bullets. If you use those they will not expand as intended. However lots of buffalo have died at the business end of a 9.3, a testament to the effectiveness of the 286 grain bullet.

Note, some countries require a minimum 375 cal so the 9.3 does not qualify.

I've only killed 3 Cape buffs, but they all died pretty quickly (except for one who charged) when hit with a Swift A-frame.

This is my goto bullet for Cape Buff.

BH63

quote:

Note, some countries require a minimum 375 cal so the 9.3 does not qualify.

TZ has such a law whereby the 375 being minimum caliber required for all DG and Eland (body weight I guess) - the hunting authorities however accept the 9.3 as adequate and will issue the licenses for all the above.

first shot : barnes tsx, hornady dgx ou a-frame

other's: hornady dgs

Saeed has probably shot more buffalo than everyone else on this site combined. I would be inclined to take his advice.

Thank you for your replies . They have helped me decide which way I will jump .
I have decided to go with the 375 Ruger ,in part because my planned outfitter likes cartridges with the numbers 375 .
For convenience I will start with the 300gn Barnes TSX . If they don't shoot I will try other options .
Saeed your answer was succinct and answered my questions with minimum words .

Mark

375 Ruger w/CEB Raptors. They do a number of Buffalo and other large animals.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I can guarantee you will not see any difference in performance between these two.

And my suggestion is stick with standard bullets weights for that caliber.

286 and 300 grains.

Just make sure you pick a good bullet, and in my case it would have to be a HP copper of your choice.

Best of luck.

Have you used the Mono’s in 260 to 270 grain on many buffalo?

quote:

Originally posted by Double BC:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I can guarantee you will not see any difference in performance between these two.

And my suggestion is stick with standard bullets weights for that caliber.

286 and 300 grains.

Just make sure you pick a good bullet, and in my case it would have to be a HP copper of your choice.

Best of luck.

Have you used the Mono’s in 260 to 270 grain on many buffalo?

No.

I have only used 300 grain bullets.

They work great, and I am using them at relatively lower velocity than the rifle is capable of. 2750-2800 fps.

375 Ruger over the 9.3x62.

300gr Barnes TSX or the CEB 275gr TSG ( Thick Skin Game, 3 petals instead of 6 petals)

Either one will do the job quite well.

quote:

Originally posted by Head Trauma:
375 Ruger over the 9.3x62.

300gr Barnes TSX or the CEB 275gr TSG ( Thick Skin Game, 3 petals instead of 6 petals)

Either one will do the job quite well.

I am not sure the number of petal make any difference at all.

They all break off most of the time, and one is left with the solid shank.

Even that tends to change size and shape, depending on what it hits, and how far the animal is.

Our own Walterhog bullet have no petals.

I make them with a straight round hole made by a normal drill.

Sometimes they open up in the classic mushroom style, on other parts of the front break of in part or whole.

Exactly the same behavior as the Barnes X do.

I have been asked about using solids.

There is absolutely no reason for solids on buffalo when using copper bullets at all.

I keep solids for elephants only.

I have not shot buffalo but I did prepare for 2 years with my 9.3X62. I had to cancel the hunt.

The late Ganyana use the 9.3X62 with 286 gr bullets. He did not like the 320 Woodleighs as much.

I have seen a great bullet test report done in Australia that showed the 286 gr Woodleigh & Lapua Megas to be great. The Norma and Privi Partizan in same weight as well as TSX - all performed well at around 2450 fps. Even the 250 gr Accubond was a good performer in the tests.

Speer 270 gr is not meant for buffalo.

Norma 232 gr is meant for Roe deer & such light game.

PM me with your email for pdf copies of a few articles and load info collected from various publications.

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
Swift A-Frame, Trophy Bonded, TSX, CEB....take your pick, or whichever shoots best.

I would add to that list for a 375 H&H @ 2600 fps, the 300 gr Nosler partition! That is the only bullet I use in my 375 H&H bolt rifles, from buffalo down to caribou. and all African plains game.

………………………………………………………………………...

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
Swift A-Frame, Trophy Bonded, TSX, CEB....take your pick, or whichever shoots best.

I would add to that list for a 375 H&H @ 2900 fps, the 300 gr Nosler partition! That is the only bullet I use in my 375 H&H bolt rifles, from buffalo down to caribou. and all African plains game.

………………………………………………………………………...

You are getting 2900 fps with a 300 grain bullet in a 375 H&H??

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
Swift A-Frame, Trophy Bonded, TSX, CEB....take your pick, or whichever shoots best.

I would add to that list for a 375 H&H @ 2600 fps, the 300 gr Nosler partition! That is the only bullet I use in my 375 H&H bolt rifles, from buffalo down to caribou. and all African plains game.

………………………………………………………………………...

You are getting 2900 fps with a 300 grain bullet in a 375 H&H??

………………………….. sorry that was 2600 fps! Sorry, I will correct the post.
This is from a Whitworth African express loaded with 4831 sc, and magnum primers.

Well guys, I hate to be the one to put a wet blanket on the discussion but from what Sharki and I discussed on the two powder threads recently, it appears we actually are not allowed to carry hand loaded ammunition on planes. Yes, we’ve been doing it for years but so far, no one has been able to locate an exemption for carrying powder classified as Explosive 1.3 in loaded cartridges.

So until we figure that one out, it appears we are stuck with factory loaded ammo only. So what factory ammo is loaded with CEB, Northfork, etc?

I took an Australian with a .375 H&H with 350 grain Woodleighs. We recovered three from the far side.

I design and manufacture my own ammo!

It is not reloaded!

Even my rifle is designed and built right here in our custom factory!

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Well guys, I hate to be the one to put a wet blanket on the discussion but from what Sharki and I discussed on the two powder threads recently, it appears we actually are not allowed to carry hand loaded ammunition on planes. Yes, we’ve been doing it for years but so far, no one has been able to locate an exemption for carrying powder classified as Explosive 1.3 in loaded cartridges.

So until we figure that one out, it appears we are stuck with factory loaded ammo only. So what factory ammo is loaded with CEB, Northfork, etc?

Just put the cartridges in factory boxes with the same name as the case stamp and you are home free!

……………………………………………………………………...

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Well guys, I hate to be the one to put a wet blanket on the discussion but from what Sharki and I discussed on the two powder threads recently, it appears we actually are not allowed to carry hand loaded ammunition on planes. Yes, we’ve been doing it for years but so far, no one has been able to locate an exemption for carrying powder classified as Explosive 1.3 in loaded cartridges.

So until we figure that one out, it appears we are stuck with factory loaded ammo only. So what factory ammo is loaded with CEB, Northfork, etc?

Just put the cartridges in factory boxes with the same name as the case stamp and you are home free!

……………………………………………………………………...

Mac, it doesn't appear that you read the two recent threads on black and smokeless powder.

What you advocate in the above statement is skirting the law in the same manner as the guys who advocate loading black powder into regular appearing cartridges in order to pull the tips once in country for a BP Muzzle Loader powder supply. Not safe and highly illegal. The point of the entire discussion is that there may actually not be a way for us to legally take handloads aboard airplanes due to the classification of smokeless powder as Explosive 1.3. Not to rehash all of that but read the threads for more detail.

So my question stands, if we actually do not have legal authorization to transport handloaded ammo, and the only ammo allowed on planes is factory ammo designated as 1.4, how are we going to take advantage of these premium bullets unless companies like Federal, Norma, etc. start using CEB, Northfork, and the like. As it stands, unless we can find an exemption for handloaded ammo with 1.3 powder, which they all appear to be, we are stuck with TSX from Federal, A Square from Federal, Woodleigh from Norma, and the Hornady stuff. I'm sure I've missed some but you get the idea. These great bullets that aren't factory loaded are going to be difficult to use legally unless we figure out the legalities.

Mark,

I just shot two Australian buffalo with a 375 H&H loaded with 300 TSX. I got sufficient penetration from any angle so I can't see why a slower 350 would have any advantage.

Mark

What Biebs said.

Continue the argument publicly about transporting cartridges and the end result will be a ban. If some here believe there is a problem then contact the reloading component manufacturers privately and allow things to be sorted out quietly by their attorneys and professionals in the industry. Blathering pages of conjecture will just give the antis a new angle to work against us by insisting that all ammunition transport on passenger aircraft is illegal.

quote:

Originally posted by 86thecat:
Continue the argument publicly about transporting cartridges and the end result will be a ban. If some here believe there is a problem then contact the reloading component manufacturers privately and allow things to be sorted out quietly by their attorneys and professionals in the industry. Blathering pages of conjecture will just give the antis a new angle to work against us by insisting that all ammunition transport on passenger aircraft is illegal.

I hear what you're saying 86 but I respectfully disagree.

First from the standpoint of whether or not there is a valid safety concern and secondly from the standpoint of someone falling prey to being made an example of when trying to transport their ammo, whether it be here in the US or when presenting it abroad; rechecking to either come home or continuing from an extended layover.

If there is an issue that has gotten past us with all of our current experience, we are better off being aware of it so that it can be avoided.

I still believe, there must be an exemption buried somewhere in the regulations that allows handloaded ammo transport. Throughout my involvement now on several threads as to this matter, I've asked if anyone knows of such an exemption and if they do, would they please post a link so that we all have access to it.

Considering the experience level of the members of this forum, and the fact that there are folks from all walks of life, including attorneys and experts on HAZMAT shipments, the fact that no one has yet been able to post such an exemption leads me to believe that we really do have an issue. I for one, do not want to be the guy that gets pulled aside and locked up, either domestically in the USA or a foreign prison facility for unexpectedly presenting a forbidden item for transport ... my fondness of loading my own ammo notwithstanding.

I understand the exception for loads ammo - whether factory or in factory boxes, boils down to the fact that they are individually packed, and not liable to go off altogether.

This is from an individual who deals with dangerous goods - not only ammo.

He said powder is absolutely forbidden to be transported by air - the military do it thought.

Large quantities of sporting ammo is transported by cargo planes.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:

....This is from an individual who deals with dangerous goods - not only ammo.......

A quick google will give contact information of companies that specialize in shipping IATA Dangerous Goods. Maybe someone could make a polite inquiry to one of those shippers and post the response to put the question to rest.

Given that every airline I have travelled with has required me to declare the volume of ammunition I intend to fly with and subsequently grant their approval' subject to check in inspection of my adherence to their packing requirements ; I feel I rightly assume they have accepted and approved the carriage.
So what’s the beef ?
Let’s not create conjecture where none is required .
The airline operators decision is final.

Thank you for the further replies . I will use the 375 Ruger and try the Barnes 300gn TSX first. If they don't work out then I will experiment with other monolithics .

Mark

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Well guys, I hate to be the one to put a wet blanket on the discussion but from what Sharki and I discussed on the two powder threads recently, it appears we actually are not allowed to carry hand loaded ammunition on planes. Yes, we’ve been doing it for years but so far, no one has been able to locate an exemption for carrying powder classified as Explosive 1.3 in loaded cartridges.

So until we figure that one out, it appears we are stuck with factory loaded ammo only. So what factory ammo is loaded with CEB, Northfork, etc?

Just put the cartridges in factory boxes with the same name as the case stamp and you are home free!

……………………………………………………………………...

Mac, it doesn't appear that you read the two recent threads on black and smokeless powder.

What you advocate in the above statement is skirting the law in the same manner as the guys who advocate loading black powder into regular appearing cartridges in order to pull the tips once in country for a BP Muzzle Loader powder supply. Not safe and highly illegal. The point of the entire discussion is that there may actually not be a way for us to legally take handloads aboard airplanes due to the classification of smokeless powder as Explosive 1.3. Not to rehash all of that but read the threads for more detail.

So my question stands, if we actually do not have legal authorization to transport handloaded ammo, and the only ammo allowed on planes is factory ammo designated as 1.4, how are we going to take advantage of these premium bullets unless companies like Federal, Norma, etc. start using CEB, Northfork, and the like. As it stands, unless we can find an exemption for handloaded ammo with 1.3 powder, which they all appear to be, we are stuck with TSX from Federal, A Square from Federal, Woodleigh from Norma, and the Hornady stuff. I'm sure I've missed some but you get the idea. These great bullets that aren't factory loaded are going to be difficult to use legally unless we figure out the legalities.

Todd you are absolutely correct, that it is skirting the law! However I must aske how do you prove the factory ammo you are bringing is legit, if all you have to go on is the head stamp on the cartridges, and the box the ammo comes in?

With that criteria your factory ammo may be confiscated when it is legit, as easily as the handload with the same head stamp, and factory box is!
You are correct, as well, that the only way to get the bullet you want is with factory loaded ammo. However proof is a ghost in either situation.
Leave it to the officials to gum up the works with no more thought or rule that we must live by.
In the case of double rifles ,in particular, most do not shoot factory ammo well.


……………………………………………………….

What about Superior Ammunition? Won’t they load ammo to your specs and be considered factory ammo? For example, if you wanted CEB and a certain load, would that work?

I don’t think skirting the law would lead you to an African jail, but you never know. I would assume confiscation of ammo would be the likely outcome and you’re left with an expensive club.

I, for one, don’t want to be on a plane with potentially volatile BP. Wait, that’s the other thread...